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Sure you are.

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Bagwell > Beltre

Y'all keep beating your chest about how much of a HOF lock Beltre is. So by logic, if Bagwell > Beltre, then Bagwell is a for sure HOF lock too.

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Bagwell > Beltre

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And that's not just an opinion. All advanced stats say the same thing.

Nolan Ryan hit more home runs with the Astros... 2, and Had more post season wins ...2

All he beat as a Ranger was Robin.

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Nolan Ryan hit more home runs with the Astros... 2, and Had more post season wins ...2

All he beat as a Ranger was Robin.

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Yeah...well...I bet my dad could beat up your dad!

Lol ok?

You just really want to talk about anything and everything other than what actually happened on the field between these two teams this year.

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Bagwell > Beltre

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And that's not just an opinion. All advanced stats say the same thing.

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Beltre already has a higher career bWAR and he's still got a few good years left.

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Nolan Ryan hit more home runs with the Astros... 2, and Had more post season wins ...2

All he beat as a Ranger was Robin.

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Bagwell vs. Beltre is an interesting one. I'd take Bagwell's bat but Beltre's glove.

Does a World Series in which you don't show up still count?

This guy is a lock for Cooperstown.

I like how the engraver hid an H above the T

If you wanna talk advanced stats though...

Beltre: 83.8 career WAR/48.8 7yr-peak WAR/66.3 JAWS
Bagwell: 79.6 career WAR/48.2 7yr-peak WAR/63.9 JAWS

The best though is dWAR, where Bagwell only had one positive dWAR season in his entire career (0.1)

Beltre: 25.5 dWAR
Bagwell: -7.9 dWAR

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Does a World Series in which you don't show up still count?

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Keep telling yourself that. At least we weren't shutout twice in a series, and once by a 9-0 score.

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If you wanna talk advanced stats though...

Beltre: 83.8 career WAR/48.8 7yr-peak WAR/66.3 JAWS
Bagwell: 79.6 career WAR/48.2 7yr-peak WAR/63.9 JAWS

The best though is dWAR, where Bagwell only had one positive dWAR season in his entire career (0.1)

Beltre: 25.5 dWAR
Bagwell: -7.9 dWAR

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If I'm building a team from scratch, I'll take Beltre any day of the week. Yes, there's a slight drop with regards to offense, but defensively there's no comparison between the two.

That said, I'm not really a fan of comparing a 3B and a 1B to say one is better than the other, especially using offensive stats. The positions have different requirements, and 3B is far more physically demanding. It's not a knock on Bagwell. He'll be in the Hall, as will Beltre.

Compare Beltre w/ other HoF third basemen. Compare Bagwell w/ other HoF first basemen.

The Houston Astros "Franchise Four" sums up how insignificant that franchise has been.

A roidhead, a hall-of-famer-but-not-top-5 2nd baseman, a dufus and a guy who is in Cooperstown claiming another team.

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Bagwell > Beltre

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And that's not just an opinion. All advanced stats say the same thing.

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Beltre already has a higher career bWAR and he's still got a few good years left.

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It also took him 3 more years to beat Bagwell's. An arthritic shoulder will cut your career short.

As for defense, you realize a 1B is negatively impacted by the adjustment they factor in. So comparing a 1B to a 3B dWAR will give you varainces. A 1B who is near 0 is a plus 1B.

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A roidhead

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Which is why you compare the 7 year peak WAR. Beltre wins that one narrowly. Also obviously 1B gets dinged in dWAR but my point is that Beltre is currently the 2nd best defensive 3B in history while Bagwell was average at best defensively.

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The Houston Astros "Franchise Four" sums up how insignificant that franchise has been.

A roidhead, a hall-of-famer-but-not-top-5 2nd baseman, a dufus and a guy who is in Cooperstown claiming another team.

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Compared to your Roidhead catcher, your not a HOF SS or anywhere close, and guys who spent only 19% and 28% of their careers with the Rangers? There's a reason why Michael Young is your only "lifer".

Future Hall of Fame 3rd baseman.
Hall of Fame Catcher (one of the greatest of all time)
Hall of Fame Pitcher (one of the greatest of all time)
Michael Young


Pretty impressive if you ask me.

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Future Hall of Fame 3rd baseman.
Hall of Fame Catcher (one of the greatest of all time)
Hall of Fame Pitcher (one of the greatest of all time)
Michael Young


Pretty impressive if you ask me.

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Plus, Beltre and Pudge will both don Rangers caps in the Hall, and Nolan already does. But hey, they had a couple guys spend their entire career in Houston, so there's that.

You mean compared to:

Future HOF 1st Baseman (considered a Top 10 by many)
HOF 2nd Baseman (considered Top 10 by many)
HOF Pitcher (considered Top 10 by many)
And an OF who would be in the Hall of Very Good

Seems impressive to me

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Future Hall of Fame 3rd baseman.
Hall of Fame Catcher (one of the greatest of all time)
Hall of Fame Pitcher (one of the greatest of all time)
Michael Young


Pretty impressive if you ask me.

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Plus, Beltre and Pudge will both don Rangers caps in the Hall, and Nolan already does. But hey, they had a couple guys spend their entire career in Houston, so there's that.

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It's a good place for guys to put up numbers with no expectations.

5 of 18, and the longest he spent with any club was 7 yrs with the Dodgers. He's signed through '16 and I'd imagine that barring a major injury or drop in production Texas will bring him back. In another season and a half he will have played more games with the Rangers than any other team.

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considered top 10 by many .... delusional astros fans

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I have bolded a key word there

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5 of 18, and the longest he spent with any club was 7 yrs with the Dodgers. He's signed through '16 and I'd imagine that barring a major injury or drop in production Texas will bring him back. In another season and a half he will have played more games with the Rangers than any other team.

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Even if the Rangers don't bring him back, I believe that just like Nolan, he'll be remembered primarily for his days w/ the Rangers.

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considered top 10 by many .... delusional astros fans

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The only thing delusional here is y'all

http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/jaws_1B.shtml

He's ranked 6th ALL TIME among all 1b candidates.

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considered top 10 by many .... delusional astros fans

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The only thing delusional here is y'all

http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/jaws_1B.shtml

He's ranked 6th ALL TIME among all 1b candidates.

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Well hell, any ranking system that has Jeff Bagwell ahead of Hank Greenberg is tough to argue with.

We're totally ignoring Odor. He'll be a HOFer for sure.

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considered top 10 by many .... delusional astros fans

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The only thing delusional here is y'all

http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/jaws_1B.shtml

He's ranked 6th ALL TIME among all 1b candidates.

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Well hell, any ranking system that has Jeff Bagwell ahead of Hank Greenberg is tough to argue with.

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Yep, let stats that show no bias get in the way of your thinking