I think the only two worth debating would be Aguirre and JET.

Aguirre -> Upside- best player on those 80s teams. Downside - ornery dude which, other than Lakers dominance and Tarpley's nose candy issues, may have played a role in that team never achieving a championship level. It also led to him parting ways earlier, which helped kickstart a decade of suckitude.

JET -> Upside - good player and a key player on both the Finals teams. Downside - as an overall NBA player, a fairly underwhelming one to have hanging from your rafters.

I think you would give serious consideration to Terry and Marion. They were actually both here for quite a long time, and on our championship winning team as very important players.
Aguirre for reasons mentioned I would also consider, I don't personally care that he left.

Only reason I would say no on Kidd is that he just wasn't really here for that long the 2nd time, even if he was very important to the title.

Gotta figure out a way to honor Carlisle when he is done coaching as well. I assume it's just a jersey with his name on it, since coaches dont have numbers.

Marion was a quality component to that championship, but big picture, he was only here 5 years. I don't think anyone that is with a franchise for only 5 years should be retired. Same argument for Kidd (2nd stay was 5 years, first stay of 2-3 years was a dysfunctional clusterF which if anything counts against him in my book).

I think the ship has sailed on Aguirre. I think JET is 50/50. Carlisle should definitely be honored in some similar way.

Agree with y'all on most points- Aguirre was another that easily came to mind, but as you laid out, the way he left the team was pretty sour. I don't know what his relationship is with the team currently- I was actually surprised that he wasn't at Harper's retirement ceremony considering how big a part of that era he was.

JET is definitely my choice- numbers wise or not, he's the only other player that was on both Finals teams.

I could very well see them doing Kidd, as his entire career was remarkable. His drafting here was huge even if his time was short, and he was definitely key to the 2011 championship

To be clear, I think Jet should be in. I'm just saying 50/50 because it took this long for Harper to go in and sunce Aguirre isnt in at all.

If the Spurs can retire Avery Johnson's number, the Mavs can retire Kidd's. They both spent a lot of time playing for other teams, but were important members of each team's first championship.

Quick standings check shows the Mavs square in the middle of these possible tank teams:

Utah Jazz (3 games ahead of the Mavs)
Charlotte Hornets
Phoenix Suns
Brooklyn Nets
Chicago Bulls
Dallas Mavericks
Sacramento Kings
Los Angeles Lakers
Memphis Grizzlies
Orlando Magic
Atlanta Hawks (3 games behind the Mavs)

Seems incredibly unlikely that the Mavs could drop below Atlanta or Orlando. Doubt they catch Utah or Charlotte either, which puts them in the likely 3-9 range. Hopefully they can stick in the top 6. https://www.si.com/nba/2018/01/10/nba-draft-2018-prospect-rankings-big-board-deandre-ayton-trae-young

Has grim realization set in yet with you guys that Dirk and Carlisle are too good to tank?

To be honest, it doesn't upset me that they have a coach and leadership in the lockerroom that essentially refuses to let losing set in and ingrain. I am a believer that once that kind of thing sets in, it can be hard to root out. All those high picks in the early and mid 90s did nothing toward helping them dig their way out of being one of the worst teams in the league. Finally took a guy taken #9 overall after nearly a full decade of sucking.

Finley deserves more consideration than Shawn Marion. That should tell you as much as you need to know about Marion's chances of being honored by the Mavs.

Marion got a ring, that's as much credit as he deserves for the championship. That's a lot of credit, but he doesn't deserve to have his jersey number retired.

94chem said:

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Has grim realization set in yet with you guys that Dirk and Carlisle are too good to tank?

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I've thought that all along. If Cuban ever wants to tank, which I don't believe he ever will, then he needs to change coaches, because Carlisle is too good to lose consistently.

In addition, with a few of their young building blocks in place between Barnes and DSJ, I think it would be a really bad sign to be racking up the worst record in the league. The time to be the worst in the league has passed. That was before you had Barnes and DSJ. You want to get a good pick this year, but you also want to see signs of hope. If you've already added a few key pieces to your future but are still a complete bottom feeder, that is a bad sign

I love Finley, and I would consider him too. I'm just saying, for a franchise that has only won one title, you should consider the key players of that era.

What a shame that Nerlens hasn't worked out (putting it lightly).
A good Nerlens, DSJ, Barnes + hit on next summer's draft and that could be a good core 4.
Alas.

Any chance we could get anything quality for Nerlens+ Devin at the deadline? Devin could help a playoff team that needs guard help

I'd absolutely be working the phones.

Just to weigh in on jersey retirements:

Aguire - a little before my time, so I can't say.
JET - yes
Marion - no
Kidd - tough one. I'd say no, but wouldn't bother me if he did.
Finley - no
JJ Barea - don't laugh, but had he not left for 2 seasons, he'd be on a nice 12 year run w/ the same team. Was pretty key in the championship. I'd lean yes.
Dennis Smith Jr. - hopefully

In no world does Barea deserve to have his jersey retired before Finley. Players are given a ring for winning a championship. You don't get your jersey retired for being a role player and having a long career, you get it retired for being exceptional in the history of the franchise.

Finley and Barea have so far spent the same number of years with the Mavs (9, Barea spent 3 seasons in Milwaukee, not 2) and Finley's worst season was better than Barea's best on an individual production basis.

If you are going to retire Brad Davis, you pretty much have to retire anyone that played more than 5 years.

hph6203 said:

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In no world does Barea deserve to have his jersey retired before Finley. Players are given a ring for winning a championship. You don't get your jersey retired for being a role player and having a long career, you get it retired for being exceptional in the history of the franchise.

Finley and Barea have so far spent the same number of years with the Mavs (9, Barea spent 3 seasons in Milwaukee, not 2) and Finley's worst season was better than Barea's best on an individual production basis.

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Yea, if you are voting no on Fin but yes on JJ, then you only started following the Mavs in like 2008

So on board with this

It should probably just be assumed that everyone but Dirk and Dennis are on the block.

Guitarsoup said:

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It should probably just be assumed that everyone but Dirk and Dennis are on the block.

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And HB. For better or worse, I think he'll be a Maverick for a few more years.

I think Dallas would move HB in a heartbeat if they got something decent for him. But 2y50mm is hard to move for a 18/7 guy.

The Mavs only have 2 good assets. DSJ and their upcoming top 10 pick. Neither should be touchable.

Barnes is a good player but isn't very movable with his contract. Guys like Yogi, Finney-Smith, Motley have nice contracts but project as back-ups. Dirk is a legend and won't be traded. Barrea, Harris or Salah might be trade-able but that is just a minor transaction. Seth Curry and Noel are expiring but they are also injured. I just don't see any moves available for this roster.

I also don't know what planet the Mavs are living on if they think they can get a 1st round pick for Wes Mathews. His contract makes him a liability, not an asset. He isn't terrible but he doesn't get you 17M worth of production in 2019. The Mavs would have to take back some really terrible contracts in order to generate a first round pick from Mathews.

The Mavs just need to tank on. They will have a ton of cap space opening up in the next two seasons and some good young player to pair with it (DSJ + 2018/2019 pick). There is a path for the Mavs to be good again by 2020, just need to stay the course.

Could just be posturing by setting the discussion at if he's worth a 1st, and then maybe adjusting what you are able to get for him instead.

hph6203 said:

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In no world does Barea deserve to have his jersey retired before Finley. Players are given a ring for winning a championship. You don't get your jersey retired for being a role player and having a long career, you get it retired for being exceptional in the history of the franchise.

Finley and Barea have so far spent the same number of years with the Mavs (9, Barea spent 3 seasons in Milwaukee, not 2) and Finley's worst season was better than Barea's best on an individual production basis.

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Agreed. I guess I was so bitter about Finley leaving and riding the Spurs' coattails to a championship. I'd forgotten how good he really was.

It's not like Finley up and decided to leave the Mavericks, the Mavericks dumped Finley so they didn't have to pay his salary twice (once to him, once in luxury tax). The Mavs felt like they had a reasonable replacement for his production in Josh Howard at a much cheaper price and they moved on and so did Finley. Did you expect him to chase the money instead of a championship?

Hope DeAndre is loving his time with the clippers. If they trade him, I hope he goes to the Cavs and is miserable playing with Lebron and getting blamed for everything under the sun.

mavsfan4ever said:

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Hope DeAndre is loving his time with the clippers. If they trade him, I hope he goes to the Cavs and is miserable playing with Lebron and getting blamed for everything under the sun.

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I'm totally over the DeAndre thing, but his situation right now is too ****ing funny

Now watch the Mavs trade for him

Quote:

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I'm totally over the DeAndre thing, but his situation right now is too ****ing funny

Now watch the Mavs trade for him

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Nah, still a little early. They'll wait until he's 33-34, and coming off micro fracture surgery.

True Anomaly said:

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mavsfan4ever said:

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Hope DeAndre is loving his time with the clippers. If they trade him, I hope he goes to the Cavs and is miserable playing with Lebron and getting blamed for everything under the sun.

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I'm totally over the DeAndre thing, but his situation right now is too ****ing funny

Now watch the Mavs trade for him

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I'm glad we didn't end up getting him because I like DSJ and am hoping we tank as much as possible this year and maybe next. But I still lost all respect for him and find the situation he's in hilarious.

Isaiah Canaan injury just now, wow!! That one was tough to watch live. Hope he recovers from it. Stretcher out immediately on the floor.

Tough to watch. Reminded me of the Derrick Roland injury for the Ags.

Don't look now, but Mavs are tied for last in the west and tied for most losses in league.