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Bucher says Mavs now in lead for Dwight.

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I'm not sure there are any other realistic options, except possibly a Bynum trade.


What other championship contending teams are going to have the ability to sign Howard?


Teams have to have cap space and assets to deal to get Howard this year. For next year, it just needs cap space.

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from Orlando's perspective, NJN don't really have anything they'd want to acquire via trade, and they're not gonna take on a bunch of **** assets just to appease Dwight. I think NJN realized this and moved on

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Don't wanna make a new thread, but Bucher says Mavs now in lead for Dwight.

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Deron is definitely coming to Dallas. This move reeks of desperation and puts New Jersey as only the 5th or 6th best team in the East.

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Really?

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/8125453/orlando-magic-dwight-howard-go-brooklyn-nets-sources-say

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It comes down to whether DWill is more interested in money or championships. DWill, Dirk, & potentially D12 would dominate. DWill, Wallace, & Johnson AND D12 equals WAY BETTER THAN THE MAVS and more cash for DWill.

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FIFY

[This message has been edited by prepyag03 (edited 7/3/2012 8:10a).]

I'm just not sure what the Mavs have that anyone would want in a trade for a young superstar like Dwight Howard.

No one wants to build around RoddyB and a half dozen late first round draft picks.

D12 ****ed it up by opting in back in March.

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DWill, Wallace, & Johnson AND D12 equals WAY BETTER THAN THE MAVS and more cash for DWill.

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hah! The Knicks and Clippers have shown that it takes more than a couple all-stars to win a championship. Unless you have two MVP candidates and an all-star on the same team like Miami, you can't star-power people out of the building. Dallas has been to the playoffs for the last 10+ years, done major damage and won a championship. The Net's last glory days were 2001. A mavs team with D12, Dwill and Dirk crushes that Nets team.

As an aside, the Nets can offer 5 years and the Mavericks 4 years for Dwill. However, the new CBA limits older player's contract lengths to 3 years. Dwill will hit that threshold after a 5 year contract, but not after a 4 year contract. So the mavericks can offer a 4 year max contract followed by a 5 year max contract. The Nets could as well, but if Dwill takes a 5 year max contract, then afterwards he could only get a 3 year max contract. So the money side might not be so cut and dry.

The ESPN analysts really want D12/Deron on the BKN. Ric Bucher basically came in his pants talking about it on ESPN last night.

Woj seems to think the Magic aren't that enthused with BKN's offer.

Joe Johnson will never win a championship.

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hah! The Knicks and Clippers have shown that it takes more than a couple all-stars to win a championship. Unless you have two MVP candidates and an all-star on the same team like Miami, you can't star-power people out of the building. Dallas has been to the playoffs for the last 10+ years, done major damage and won a championship. The Net's last glory days were 2001. A mavs team with D12, Dwill and Dirk crushes that Nets team.

As an aside, the Nets can offer 5 years and the Mavericks 4 years for Dwill. However, the new CBA limits older player's contract lengths to 3 years. Dwill will hit that threshold after a 5 year contract, but not after a 4 year contract. So the mavericks can offer a 4 year max contract followed by a 5 year max contract. The Nets could as well, but if Dwill takes a 5 year max contract, then afterwards he could only get a 3 year max contract. So the money side might not be so cut and dry.

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The problem with using the Mavs past is that they can't operate that same say business-wise beause of the new CBA. The importance of draft has been magnified now, and the mavs have a horrible draft history...D-Will would be with an aging Dirk whose stats have decline the past 4 years, no center, no back court mate, and less money w/ a shorter contract.

While the mavs can point backwards at what they did as a D-Will recruting tool, the Nets can look forward. Rich owner, figure head rap mogul, brand new arena, a shooting forard averaging close to 16 and 7, an all-star shooting guard averaging close to 20 ppg, and the best center in basketball coming to town WHILE GETTING MORE MONEY.

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The ESPN analysts really want D12/Deron on the BKN. Ric Bucher basically came in his pants talking about it on ESPN last night.

Woj seems to think the Magic aren't that enthused with BKN's offer.

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Really? No now ESPN isn't just after Texas A&M they're manipulating The NBA too? It couldn't be that D-Williams just wants to stay in New York and get more money in his contract and endorsements?

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While the mavs can point backwards at what they did as a D-Will recruting tool, the Nets can look forward. Rich owner, figure head rap mogul, brand new arena, a shooting forard averaging close to 16 and 7, an all-star shooting guard averaging close to 20 ppg, and the best center in basketball coming to town WHILE GETTING MORE MONEY.

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Rasher, please point out which part of my post was false? Don't worry, I'll wait...

They can't afford all of that under the cap.

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PatAg12:21p, 06/29/12

So, lets all agree to just skip any prepyag posts as if they weren't even there?

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Judge, whether you ignore me or not, facts are facts...sorry, but D-will and howard won't be mavs...your owner and GM both screwed your team royally.

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They can't afford all of that under the cap.

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Actually, with the proposed trade to the magic on ESPN the Nets can in fact afford all of that under the cap.

[This message has been edited by prepyag03 (edited 7/3/2012 10:17a).]

By bringing in a championship?

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They can't afford all of that under the cap.

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Can't afford all what?

Russian Mark Cuban said he doesn't care about luxury tax.

He can sign and trade Lopez+Humphries for Howard+Turkeyglue.

Then he will still have the MLE, because he didn't use capspace, he used trades.
So
Howard
Wallace
Turkeyglue
Johnson
Williams
+MLE+vet FA mins+Anyone else he wants to resign that had bird rights to

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He can sign and trade Lopez+Humphries for Howard+Turkeyglue.

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If I'm the Magic, I think I'd rather let Howard walk than be obligated to pay Lopez/KHump $20 mil for the next 4 years.

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Russian Mark Cuban said he doesn't care about luxury tax.

He can sign and trade Lopez+Humphries for Howard+Turkeyglue.

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I am about 99% confident that Orlando does not want to pay Lopez + Humphries that kind of money. Howard and Turkey are on the books for ~30mm combined. Even with trade exceptions, that's a hilariously bad move for the Magic.

I imagine that any package BKN offers will have to include MarShon Brooks as well.

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PatAg12:21p, 06/29/12

So, lets all agree to just skip any prepyag posts as if they weren't even there?

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Howard isn't going to the Nets. Can't make it work. Book it. None of them are headed to Dallas either.

What's a fair price for Lopez? How many centers are 20/8 guys? 12mm?

If you give him 12mm, you give Humphries a 1yr/11mm with unguaranteed 2nd year (just to get rid of Turkeyglue's 2y24mm left) and take MarShon Brooks, then the deal is done. $12mm would be less than AlJeff/Okefor/Chandler/Bynum/Boozer/both Gasols/Love, so it is probably a pretty fair price for a 24 year old 20ppg center.

Now for next summer, you have:
Lopez
Big Baby
JRich
MarShon
Nets 1st pick
Your 1st pick

on the books for about 30mm.

Plus you save about 6mm this year.

[This message has been edited by Guitarsoup (edited 7/3/2012 10:48a).]

Where are you getting 20/8?

His career numbers are 17.4 and 7.5, he played in 5 games last year and has averaged 6 (full season) and 3.6 (5 games) rpg over the last two seasons, on a bad team where stats should be easier to come by. I don't know what's going on with his injury situation, and he's certainly shown signs of being a really good C. But a center who doesn't rebound and has injury issues (even worse, foot/ankle) isn't worth 12mm on potential alone. I think somewhere in the 6-8mm range is more reasonable.

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you give Humphries a 1yr/11mm with unguaranteed 2nd year

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Does Humphries sign this? He's not going to get $11m next season anywhere else, but I could see someone signing him for 3/$20

5 games is a completely worthless statistical grouping.

He averaged 20/6 one year and 18/8 the previous year. I think I looked at the lines wrong and added them together.

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I think somewhere in the 6-8mm range is more reasonable.

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You are going to be alone on that. Omar Asik just got 8mm/yr for 3/5.

Marc Gasol's new contrat started at 13mm this year after putting up 11.7/7 over 81 games in 2011 (14.6 and 9.3 in 2010 over 69 games.) And he is 3.5 years older than Lopez.

Bynum's extension started at 13mm after putting up 14/8 in 2009.

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Does Humphries sign this? He's not going to get $11m next season anywhere else, but I could see someone signing him for 3/$20

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Hard to say. Maybe he gets them to agree to more up front + opportunity to put up huge and completely hollow numbers on a team that will win 14 games.

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Howard isn't going to the Nets. Can't make it work. Book it. None of them are headed to Dallas either.

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I agree with this. Surely the Magic can get a better deal than Humphries/Lopez/Brooks.

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You are going to be alone on that. Omar Asik just got 8mm/yr for 3/5.

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Maybe, maybe not. Lopez will get overpaid by someone, because this is in the NBA and C's are hard to find. But there's some risk involved with Lopez. The 6 rebounds per game over a full season is cause for concern.

We'll see what he's offered.

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Ken Berger ?@KBergCBS
The Nets will use the non-taxpayer mid-level to sign Bosnian Mirza Teletovic: 3 years, $15.675M. Means no mid-level for Jason Kidd.

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Could still sign for the vet min.

[This message has been edited by Judge (edited 7/3/2012 11:24a).]

Does Howard have a no-trade clause? If not, does he have any leverage to get the Magic to trade him to the Nets as opposed to any other team?

If you think brook lopez is worth 6-8 million, you haven't been paying attention to brook lopez or the market for centers in the nba.

Howard has no leverage other than his unwillingness to sign an extension.

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C's are hard to find.

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Exactly why the ones that can score are worth good money.

Last year no center averaged 20ppg and only two topped 15.5ppg. Roy Hibbert, who just averaged 12.8/8.8 just got offered a max contract.

That's why the dumbest player in the NBA can ask for $14mm/year and he might even get it. He just happens to be really tall and athletic.

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Howard isn't going to the Nets. Can't make it work. Book it. None of them are headed to Dallas either.

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I agree too. However, if Williams was really putting winning over money, I don't see him, Joe Johnson and Wallace as a better trio than him, Dirk and Marion. I guess money talks.

Maybe the Mavs can toss around enough green to bring in Nash and Hibbert for the next three years. Cuban will have to blow up the roster after Dirk retires anyway.

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I agree too. However, if Williams was really putting winning over money, I don't see him, Joe Johnson and Wallace as a better trio than him, Dirk and Marion. I guess money talks.

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Age talks, too. Dirk and Marion are both 34. Is he going to still count on them in 5 years?

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Age talks, too. Dirk and Marion are both 34. Is he going to still count on them in 5 years?

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So does production...Dirk and Marion averaged 21.6 and 10.6 (32.2)ppg; Wallace and Joe Johnson averaged 15.2 and 18.8 ppg (34). There ppg are identical with the age factor going to the Nets (34 for both Dirk and Marion and 29 and 31 for wallace and Johnson).

So he has a better chance to win AND get more money in Brooklyn. Just saying.

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If you think brook lopez is worth 6-8 million

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Yeah, I'm probably coming in a bit low in terms of player market value. Personal bias. I don't think he's that good, but I agree he will get a better offer.

The original point of S&T Lopez + S&T Humphries + MarShon + exceptions = D12 + Turkey Glue still stands though. It would be a stupid trade for Orlando, especially considering they're not high on Lopez and Atlanta's package would be better.