rootube said:

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How did those two playoffs work out for them? Did they look like the kind of team that needs their own network deal and special provisions to make sure they aren't left out of the playoffs?

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Half of the teams that make the playoffs lose in the first round.

TXAG 05 said:

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rootube said:

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How did those two playoffs work out for them? Did they look like the kind of team that needs their own network deal and special provisions to make sure they aren't left out of the playoffs?

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Half of the teams that make the playoffs lose in the first round.

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He makes a fair point, certainly 2 years ago we had the better team but they backed in and got smoked in the semis. All I'm saying is that the goal of any strong program should be

1. make playoff
2. win conference (if you're not ND)
3. win division

We do feel like we're moving in the right direction long term, and I'm optimistic about the future, I just don't feel the need to trash other programs that have had more recent success than us.

bryanw1995 said:

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TXAG 05 said:

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rootube said:

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How did those two playoffs work out for them? Did they look like the kind of team that needs their own network deal and special provisions to make sure they aren't left out of the playoffs?

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Half of the teams that make the playoffs lose in the first round.

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He makes a fair point, certainly 2 years ago we had the better team but they backed in and got smoked in the semis. All I'm saying is that the goal of any strong program should be

1. make playoff
2. win conference (if you're not ND)
3. win division

We do feel like we're moving in the right direction long term, and I'm optimistic about the future, I just don't feel the need to trash other programs that have had more recent success than us.

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That's just the way of Texags. Making the playoffs is great accomplishment, unless it happens to someone we don't like.

Oregon, Washington, Stanford, Notre Dame, Clemson, North Carolina and Duke and Miami will join the BIG first to get to 24. And with these additions, the BIG becomes the best conference in the country. I truly believe we need to be in firm talks with the BIG as we would be a HUGE get for them. They would rather have Texas A&M than any other school on this list other than ND. We are in a position of strength and in a fantastic position to test our value. What does it hurt to talk? It's business, nothing personal..

Can you explain to us how A&M will get out of its grant of rights to the SEC?

Panama Red said:

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Can you explain to us how A&M will get out of its grant of rights to the SEC?

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It's an excellent question and one that must be answered by all of the schools I listed(except Oregon, Washington, and Stanford). This is the reason I say we just need to be talking to test what we can negotiate. We being substantial ratings. Last year, our ratings were better than Texas' ratings head to head every week except two(when we were both playing Power 5 teams). I firmly believe FOX would be willing to pay A TON to help Texas A&M leave the SEC for the BIG. In addition to that, we are the second wealthiest athletic program in the country. Raising money is NOT a problem at Texas A&M. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE the SEC but looking into the future, Saban is 70 and has maybe another 3-5 years of good years ahead. What happens when Alabama is no longer the villain? The SEC will be a shell of itself. And if the BIG lands the schools I listed, what 8 schools will the SEC be able to add to compete with the BIG? There won't be much left. FSU, Va Tech and then mostly leftovers while the BIG operates coast to coast. In short, I do believe the combination of FOX money and our INSANE wealth could be enough to get out of our GOR and then I believe the money we would make in the BIG would be superior to the money we would make in the SEC.

That's a lot of words for "I have no clue".

Seems you don't understand the basic framework of the GoR, so you really have no basis to think A&M jumping to Big 10 is an option. No offense intended.

Panama Red said:

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That's a lot of words for "I have no clue".

Seems you don't understand the basic framework of the GoR, so you really have no basis to think A&M jumping to Big 10 is an option. No offense intended.

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None taken. It takes money to get out of a GOR right? Please educate me what else is necessary to get out of a GOR other than money?

Jimbo4win said:

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Panama Red said:

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That's a lot of words for "I have no clue".

Seems you don't understand the basic framework of the GoR, so you really have no basis to think A&M jumping to Big 10 is an option. No offense intended.

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None taken. It takes money to get out of a GOR right? Please educate me what else is necessary to get out of a GOR other than money?

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In addition, feel free to explain why Clemson, Virginia, FSU and Miami are all exploring their options despite a GoR that runs through 2036, but we should not even have ONE discussion with the BIG? What makes us different?

Jimbo4win said:

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In addition, feel free to explain why Clemson, Virginia, FSU and Miami are all exploring their options despite a GoR that runs through 2036, but we should not even have ONE discussion with the BIG? What makes us different?

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Clemson has the biggest reason to explore a jump to the SEC assuming the speculation of a B1G/SEC only national championship is indeed close at hand. They obviously don't want to be left out of the real playoffs even if the Big 12/Pac 12/ACC make up their own.

VA, FSU, and Miami have less reason IMO, because they are not anywhere near contending for a playoff spot. But maybe in the world of an 8 team playoff, they see themselves as in it.

It is not just a matter of money. The SEC would have to agree to any deal. If we leave, we owe SEC all the money we get from a Big 10 TV deal. What is there incentive to let us out with 10 years remaining? There is none.

Clemson, etc. likely have a choice to make: Big 10 or SEC. The ACC is likely finished in the next decade. A&M does not have to make any such decision. We are already in a great deal.

I have not seen any evidence that any of the ACC schools are having deep discussions to move any either conference in the quick future. Possibly they are, possible they aren't. You don't know either way, nor do I.

But if they are, they have something A&M does not. If Florida State and Clemson types leave the ACC to SEC,
ESPN will say they don't owe as much money anymore given the material change to the terms of their contract. So they would want to renegotiate. ESPN would do this to implode the ACC. IF that happens, there is no GoR to worry about any longer.

If A&M decides to leave the SEC, ESPN has no incentive to end its contract with the SEC. Talking with the Big 10 is not the issue, its figuring out how to deal with losing a decade of TV fees. Its not feasible. No matter how rich you think we are.

Had enough of the Golden Dome. DO NOT WANT.

We are only a few years removed from ESPN really tightening their financial belts at the order of Disney.

Now ESPN has the means to start money whipping programs and conferences? Even with Mother Ship Disney taking financial hits for being woke and inflation where a big cable or other bill is less a necessity of buying gas and food?

Panama Red said:

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It is not just a matter of money. The SEC would have to agree to any deal. If we leave, we owe SEC all the money we get from a Big 10 TV deal. What is there incentive to let us out with 10 years remaining? There is none.

Clemson, etc. likely have a choice to make: Big 10 or SEC. The ACC is likely finished in the next decade. A&M does not have to make any such decision. We are already in a great deal.

I have not seen any evidence that any of the ACC schools are having deep discussions to move any either conference in the quick future. Possibly they are, possible they aren't. You don't know either way, nor do I.

But if they are, they have something A&M does not. If Florida State and Clemson types leave the ACC to SEC,
ESPN will say they don't owe as much money anymore given the material change to the terms of their contract. So they would want to renegotiate. ESPN would do this to implode the ACC. IF that happens, there is no GoR to worry about any longer.

If A&M decides to leave the SEC, ESPN has no incentive to end its contract with the SEC. Talking with the Big 10 is not the issue, its figuring out how to deal with losing a decade of TV fees. Its not feasible. No matter how rich you think we are.

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It's not how rich I think we are. It's how rich we are. There will never be a year going forward in which we are not one of the top 3 wealthiest athletic programs in the country-FACT. In addition, you have failed to mention FOX. You explain the downside without explaining FOX's incentive to add an absolute massive power house in Texas A&M. What are they willing to do? In essence, you used a lot of words to tell me everything I already know. No offense.

Jimbo4win said:

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Panama Red said:

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It is not just a matter of money. The SEC would have to agree to any deal. If we leave, we owe SEC all the money we get from a Big 10 TV deal. What is there incentive to let us out with 10 years remaining? There is none.

Clemson, etc. likely have a choice to make: Big 10 or SEC. The ACC is likely finished in the next decade. A&M does not have to make any such decision. We are already in a great deal.

I have not seen any evidence that any of the ACC schools are having deep discussions to move any either conference in the quick future. Possibly they are, possible they aren't. You don't know either way, nor do I.

But if they are, they have something A&M does not. If Florida State and Clemson types leave the ACC to SEC,
ESPN will say they don't owe as much money anymore given the material change to the terms of their contract. So they would want to renegotiate. ESPN would do this to implode the ACC. IF that happens, there is no GoR to worry about any longer.

If A&M decides to leave the SEC, ESPN has no incentive to end its contract with the SEC. Talking with the Big 10 is not the issue, its figuring out how to deal with losing a decade of TV fees. Its not feasible. No matter how rich you think we are.

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It's not how rich I think we are. It's how rich we are. There will never be a year going forward in which we are not one of the top 3 wealthiest athletic programs in the country-FACT. In addition, you have failed to mention FOX. You explain the downside without explaining FOX's incentive to add an absolute massive power house in Texas A&M. What are they willing to do? In essence, you used a lot of words to tell me everything I already know. No offense.

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In other words, please explain the focus on the next 10 years regarding a half century of century long decision?

JBGoode said:

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Um Jimbo… Texans don't follow Big Ten football. You haul A&M off to that conference and you can flush the A&M wealth that you love to throw around.

Texans don't care, and non-gen Z Aggies will care less. You need to lay off this Big Ten crap because its a cultural no-go, about as "un" Texas A&M as you can get, and BMD's won't support it.

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^is this a transcript from 1990 when joining the SEC was considered? The purpose of an education is replacing an empty mind with an open mind. I am simply saying it is absolutely a worth while discussion to consider what the SEC will look like in 5, 10, 15, 20 years(especially after Alabama's demise) and also consider what the coast to coast BIG will look like especially IF they add Clemson, Miami, UNC, Duke, Virginia, VA Tech, Stanford and Notre Dame FOR EXAMPLE. In other words, what is if the schools the SEC wants choose the BIG. Then what? And if you seriously think the prospect of a substantially larger payout per school from FOX and a BETTER conference doesn't interest the BMAs LONGER TERM decision making process, then that is simply a close minded thought process. You act as if games against Ohio St, Michigan, Clemson, Notre Dame, USC, Miami, UCLA, Michigan St Stanford would be played in an empty stadium. I invite you to live in the present.

Every penny FOX would pay us belongs to the SEC. You don't understand the GoR. You already acknowledged that. Nothing wrong with that, just shows you are out of your element on this issue. Don't worry, there will be other threads you can contribute in a positive manner to. Just not this one.

While he's wrong about everything with his Big10 nonsense, the price to get out is $45M or less and 2 years notice.

https://businessofcollegesports.com/other/sec-quietly-adds-exit-fee-to-conference-bylaws/

That gets you out of the SEC's grant of rights. If you were dumb enough to want to.

20ag07 said:

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While he's wrong about everything with his Big10 nonsense, the price to get out is $45M or less and 2 years notice.

https://businessofcollegesports.com/other/sec-quietly-adds-exit-fee-to-conference-bylaws/

That gets you out of the SEC's grant of rights. If you were dumb enough to want to.

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Thanks! And of course your definition of wrong in this instance is "doesn't agree with me" but that's fine. You have every right to your opinion.

Panama Red said:

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Every penny FOX would pay us belongs to the SEC. You don't understand the GoR. You already acknowledged that. Nothing wrong with that, just shows you are out of your element on this issue. Don't worry, there will be other threads you can contribute in a positive manner to. Just not this one.

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I'll stand by while you debate 20ag07…..And thanks for the condescension…

Jimbo4win said:

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Panama Red said:

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Every penny FOX would pay us belongs to the SEC. You don't understand the GoR. You already acknowledged that. Nothing wrong with that, just shows you are out of your element on this issue. Don't worry, there will be other threads you can contribute in a positive manner to. Just not this one.

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I'll stand by while you debate 20ag07…..And thanks for the condescension…

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Should I stand to the left or right of the goal post? I can't figure out which way you plan to move it.

Quote:

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I'll stand by while you debate 20ag07…..And thanks for the condescension…

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Oh we have nothing to debate, he's right, that was just one technical piece.

We're both back to telling you all of the words you've used are nothing but drivel that show you're out of your element on this one.

20ag07 said:

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Quote:

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I'll stand by while you debate 20ag07…..And thanks for the condescension…

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Oh we have nothing to debate, he's right, that was just one technical piece.

We're both back to telling you all of the words you've used are nothing but drivel that show you're out of your element on this one.

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How so?

Quote:

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How so?

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Because it all stems from an assumption that Fox and the B1G are in some position of leverage. That FOX is going to pay more for college football than ESPN. And that the SEC isn't getting the absolute biggest package over the next 10 years. Because of the timing of the deals, theirs will be announced first. And the SECs one behind it will be bigger. A&Ms value is a substantial chunk of the SEC's next deal.

Panama Red said:

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Every penny FOX would pay us belongs to the SEC. You don't understand the GoR. You already acknowledged that. Nothing wrong with that, just shows you are out of your element on this issue. Don't worry, there will be other threads you can contribute in a positive manner to. Just not this one.

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Everything I have said pertains to our leadership simply having a long and hard discussion regarding:

A). What will the SEC look like in 5, 10, 15 years versus the BIG? Which of the two will be best long term, not just at this very moment in time.

B). What will FOX be willing to do? Notice I didn't ask what FOX would pay the SEC? I live in the real world where business entities are creative in finding ways to compensate organizations in which they value. THAT IS THE REAL WORLD. You remained focused on The SEC GoR with little regard for creative thinking leading me to believe you are either a mechanical or electrical engineer who is unable to think outside the box. I don't know, nor do I care.

C) Having a firm discussion with the BIG to test our value(which I may absolutely WILDLY overestimate) should not offend ANYONE. However, we will never know unless we are having firm discussions regarding BOTH A and B. It's unfortunate that you are unwilling to consider either. That is the sort of close minded thought process that left us in the SWC and eventually BIG 12 when we should have been in the SEC long ago.

20ag07 said:

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Quote:

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How so?

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Because it all stems from an assumption that Fox and the B1G are in some position of leverage. That FOX is going to pay more for college football than ESPN. And that the SEC isn't getting the absolute biggest package over the next 10 years. Because of the timing of the deals, theirs will be announced first. And the SECs one behind it will be bigger. A&Ms value is a substantial chunk of the SEC's next deal.

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We've been through this before. You operate under an assumption that the SEC's deal WILL be bigger. That is an assumption. It is not fact. How do you know that two weeks from now the BIG doesn't announce Texas, OU, Notre Dame, Oregon, Stanford, Clemson, Miami and Florida St? None of us know the answer to this. I am not trying to even answer this question. I am simply stating that WE NEED TO BE TESTING OUR VALUE to FOX because if we don't, others will gladly take our place. It's as simple as that. It doesn't mean the SEC is trash but it does mean that in a moments notice the BIG could become the coast to coast league with 3 powerful divisions that the SEC wish it would have become. And once it's done, it's done.

Why do you think that Alabama's demise will lead to the downfall of the SEC? One or multiple teams will fill the void. The stretch of states from Texas to South Carolina will continue to have the most high school talent in the country, and those guys will still want to play close to home, if the pay is good enough.

Quote:

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I am simply saying it is absolutely a worth while discussion to consider what the SEC will look like in 5, 10, 15, 20 years(especially after Alabama's demise).

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You understand that, in this economy, the SEC is worth more with a Bama demise? They're a valuable brand, that won't change. A TV network would sell more packages (directly to consumers) to the SEC fan buying customers, with 2 major conferences and a 12-16 team playoff than they would if Bama continued rarely losing.

In what is about to happen, Bama's demise actually brings more paying customers to the table.

And why do you keep talking about Stanford? Literally no one wants them. They have a ton of Director's Cups under their belt, but none of that matters. They have a football fan base of dozens.

Quote:

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You operate under an assumption that the SEC's deal WILL be bigger. That is an assumption. It is not fact. How do you know that two weeks from now the BIG doesn't announce Texas, OU, Notre Dame, Oregon, Stanford, Clemson, Miami and Florida St? None of us know the answer to this.

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I'll tell you exactly how I know this. The budget is only so big. FOX can only pay so much. They can't pay for all that. There is not enough money in one place for that happen.

And they'd have to outbid ESPN/SEC to do it. It just won't happen.

civilaggie2011 said:

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Why do you think that Alabama's demise will lead to the downfall of the SEC? One or multiple teams will fill the void. The stretch of states from Texas to South Carolina will continue to have the most high school talent in the country, and those guys will still want to play close to home, if the pay is good enough.

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The SEC will ALWAYS be an INCREDIBLE conference and you are correct, there will be many programs who will ebb and flow over the years. For the past 12 years, Alabama has been the SEC. The entire country has had one focus and one focus only and that was to topple Alabama. I am not saying that Saban retiring will lead to the SEC's demise but I am pondering the SEC with an Alabama that could potentially look like the Alabama under Shula and Fran. What if they go the way of Tenn and they suck for 25 years? You are right. There will be others to take their place but the RISK is that the SEC no longer has the NATIONAL villain. Without that national villain, recruits open their options especially if there is a coast to coast league that has more superior teams than the SEC. In other words, imagine if the best teams in the SEC are Texas A&M, Auburn, Georgia, Florida and Tennessee for example BUT the best teams in the BIG are Notre Dame, Michigan, Penn St, Clemson, USC, Miami, and Ohio St with Ohio St being the NEW national villain? Now imagine that strength tipping the scales for recruits who once thought the SEC was cool to switch their focus to the BIG the way people switched from Blockbuster to Netflix. In 2022 and beyond, where a player was raised relative to a college means NOTHING anymore. This is antiquated thinking. Look at OUR roster now. Hell, we have two players from outside the country. The days of kids being born in the Southeast playing for the Southeast conference will immediately die if the SEC loses its strength.

civilaggie2011 said:

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And why do you keep talking about Stanford? Literally no one wants them. They have a ton of Director's Cups under their belt, but none of that matters. They have a football fan base of dozens.

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I don't keep talking about Stanford. I mention Stanford as an example of a program that had a very good football program in the not so distant past. If you prefer I use another school, I will gladly do so.

Jimbo4win said:

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civilaggie2011 said:

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And why do you keep talking about Stanford? Literally no one wants them. They have a ton of Director's Cups under their belt, but none of that matters. They have a football fan base of dozens.

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I don't keep talking about Stanford. I mention Stanford as an example of a program that had a very good football program in the not so distant past. If you prefer I use another school, I will gladly do so.

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2011 11-2
2012 12-2
2013 11-3
2014 8-5
2015 12-2
2016 10-3

I'll be more than happy to never mention them again if you feel Stanford is an irrelevant program and doesn't deserve to enter in to any hypothetical scenario.

20ag07 said:

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Quote:

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You operate under an assumption that the SEC's deal WILL be bigger. That is an assumption. It is not fact. How do you know that two weeks from now the BIG doesn't announce Texas, OU, Notre Dame, Oregon, Stanford, Clemson, Miami and Florida St? None of us know the answer to this.

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I'll tell you exactly how I know this. The budget is only so big. FOX can only pay so much. They can't pay for all that. There is not enough money in one place for that happen.

And they'd have to outbid ESPN/SEC to do it. It just won't happen.

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All good points. We should NOT examine the SEC of the future over the course of a meaningful period of time NOR should we test our value with FOX. Let's do nothing. It's the right thing to do and you have proven it so.