yea, this sounds super serial

I can sit here and tell you the pediatric hospitals are taking adults.

Franklin Delano Bluth said:

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Who cares? The virus is a nothingburger...

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500,000 people disagree

Double Diamond said:

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Can you assure everyone that a positive football player won't infect someone else?

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Can you assure yourself you won't get in a wreck everytime you get in your car? Could be mild like getting rear-ended or could be serious requiring a hospital stay. It's a risk that all drivers take. At some point it's going to be a risk all people have to take in terms of Covid.

Where's that?

In Houston, leaders of Houston's four biggest hospitals said capacity is just fine. And on the same day Hidalgo sent out a public service announcement warning stating the opposite. It's amazing to me am times the level of non leadership. If you are going to paint a story, at least don't do it the same day where those in the know state the exact opposite of what you are stating.

It's mind boggling. Arrogance, no integrity, no clue, not sure what makes it happen.

Booma94 said:

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TxAg76 said:

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Double Diamond said:

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Well here in the United States we are free. Interesting how 3,000 people dying on 9/11 scared Americans so bad we gave up endless amounts of freedom. And people hardly ever question this. But asking people to wear a mask after 120k of your countrymen die is a personal freedom too far.

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That's 120k in....4 months? Flu, my ass

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120k including a disproportionate number of LTC residents in northeastern states that were forced back into nursing homes to spread the virus to the most medically fragile. In Texas we have 2403 deaths as of 6/29, and we had 2650 deaths from the flu this past flu season in about the same amount of time. Even in Texas the overwhelming majority of the 2400 deaths are from people over the age of 70. The number of people under the age of 25 that have died from COVID in the entire country is 141 as of June 17. 141 out of over 100,000.000.

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Ok, expose everyone then. Tell everyone it's the flu, ditch all protections, everyone is free to roam about.
Do the stats change at that point?
The Covid numbers got constricted as soon as the country shut down and masks went rampant.
Remove em, and return to normal....and it'll get wild.

Double diamond is a troll. Either that, or a eunuch.

How am I trolling? Not one thing I have said isn't true. And we can all see I haven't had my arguments proven they aren't true.

Houston hospitals are not at capacity. But concern is there.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.khou.com/amp/article/news/health/coronavirus/texas-medical-center-changes-online-icu-occupancy-presentation/285-96e305b6-3d13-40a3-951e-3561e9eb84a9

Houston pediatric hospital now taking adults.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/US/texas-childrens-hospital-now-taking-adult-patients-coronavirus/story%3fid=71403248

Without reading this whole thread. What is your solution?

Are we 100% ok if everyone just wears a mask? If so, we can resume normal life once everyone has one on? Or, do we all need to hunker down for as many months as required until there is a fully distributed vaccine?

I am one of a few that have returned to my office. I wear a mask and take proper precautions. Trying to be as normal as possible. But if you think there is nothing to this you are crazy. EU is now blocking travels from US.

Someone said earlier something basically like "to each his own". Well, that is how we got into this mess.
CDC says virus now has spread out of control. They cannot trace which, is really the only hope you have of containing it.

The virus has mutated which greatly impacts herd immunity possibilities.

Basically we are waiting on a vaccine that may work.

All because, gosh darn It, we are Americans and we can't stay home a few months and wear masks. Really the number of people taking unnecessary risks is ridiculous.

several studies are saying that near 100% mask usage would crush this.... that 80% would flatten it to a point where life was basically normal...

The last one I read used Hong Kong as an example... but I think there is dispute over how strict their original lockdown was

merch said:

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Basically we are waiting on a vaccine that may work.

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What do we do if the vaccine doesnt work? Just blow up the world and start over?

So the plan is 100% masks. If everyone did that the panic would stop and we would just go about life as normal, correct?

spherical said:

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several studies are saying that near 100% mask usage would crush this.... that 80% would flatten it to a point where life was basically normal...

The last one I read used Hong Kong as an example... but I think there is dispute over how strict their original lockdown was

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It's a shame those "studies" and "experts" said for months that masks don't help and that we HAD to lock down. People may have been more willing to listen to "studies" now had they not been wrong so many times in the past, and conveniently used to justify their policies of lockdown.

My plan would've been a total shutdown in February March at the latest. Ride that till May. I understand the economic cost. New Zealand has people who need money. But they went hard lockdown.

My next idea would be go about it as we did. But go to state legislators and put teeth behind all masks in public buildings. No bars open, restaurants takeout or patio dinging only.

Plan 2 would've worked well when you remove the free for all the Governor allowed.

Now it's too late to think mandatory masks will work. I would suggest wearing a mask. But we are back to some sort of lockdown and retry mandatory masks in a few months.

If they had done this right we could've been through the virus. As it needs a host to continue. They've now run enough tests showing how there isn't much transfer risk from surface to human. It needs flesh to live in.

But we are shortsighted. Microwave on demand nation. Our government is shortsighted. And my guess Covid could be here to stay. Which could have a huge impact. As the rest of the world isn't trying to just live with the virus.

Where is all of these people every flu season when tens of thousands die every year?

The cause of these viruses are not folks wearing masks or social distancing, or warmly embracing the "new normal" - the cause of most of these viruses are pigs and chickens and people all living too close together in regions of china.

I mean... I get your frustration but that's sort of how research works right? You keep learning? I don't know what you do for a living, but my line of work is involves me being wrong right up until the moment I'm finally right...

That seems to be a huge problem these days... if anybody says something different today than yesterday, they automatically can't be trusted...

sleepybeagle said:

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Where is all of these people every flu season when tens of thousands die every year?

The cause of these viruses are not folks wearing masks or social distancing, or warmly embracing the "new normal" - the cause of most of these viruses are pigs and chickens and people all living too close together in regions of china.

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Sure but... cause and mitigation are different things aren't they?

The experts were saying this because there was a real fear healthcare workers wouldn't have enough masks. It's still a fear. And this whole thing has shown how insane our system is run. We do not produce enough medical equipment in the country.

Full lockdown would only work with full, worldwide lockdown mandated likely enforced by military. At that point too i am not sure how all our utilities, etc would have worked. Some people probably would have only had food for a few weeks and probably would need a month plus to "starve" this virus. Looks like New Zealand is seeing a surge in cases now so it didnt work.

For the fast masks approach, you would put out of business 100% of bars and probably 50%+ of restuarants as this would be your full year solution until a vaccine? Or do you give government bailout for a full year. Are you offering to increase your taxes to cover?

spherical said:

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I mean... I get your frustration but that's sort of how research works right? You keep learning? I don't know what you do for a living, but my line of work is involves me being wrong right up until the moment I'm finally right...

That seems to be a huge problem these days... if anybody says something different today than yesterday, they automatically can't be trusted...

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I would say that presenting the incorrect information as gospel is what led to this situation. And labeling anyone who had doubts originally as heretics.

When you marginalize people and then you turn out to be wrong yourself about what you have been saying, you shouldn't be surprised that people lost faith in you. Especially when your ideas have led to 30% of the nation being unemployed.

Ok then if the concern was hospital workers. Dont lie. Say "we think you should be wearing masks but we don't have enough". Instead, they said it would provide no real benefit and they talked about the whole touching the face issue.

Do you understand why its hard to trust these people? They are ok with lying to fit whatever narrative they want or need. Not saying all but at the top levels there is an obvious willingness to lie.

You do understand with the flu we have things they can do to help you? With Covid there is really nothing but give you enough drugs to knock you out.

The main point is we have the flu. The flu is bad. Now we have another really bad virus to go with the flu.

Why would you just learn to live with both?

They knew masks would help. They knew how this spread. They lied. Maybe to build up supplies for hospitals...but they lied.

It's working well in New Zealand.

Or we can put bars and restaurants out because nobody is going. That's happening to many. You need a well consuming force. I am not sure why people miss this.

They lied. They shouldn't have. But it's first grade science why masks work.

Who cares if they lied. This doesn't excuse you to not put a mask on. I bought a few from a lady who makes them.

What else are they lying about. I wear a mask but i sure as ____ don't trust much that comes from their mouths. Its whatever they want to have happen...

Who is wrong? This isn't a good situation. Never has been. Science is fluid nobody had ever seen this virus.

So people who don't understand first grade science are leading the US response?????

So fully close bars and partial opening of restaurants.

100% of bars will go out of business. Over 50% of restaurants too.

Good plan.