tjholley16 said:

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here is my solution. Use the old BCS system to determine the final 4 teams. That way you eliminate any personal bias, and you use simply statistics.

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But it seemed like these "statistics" were never disclosed and left people scratching their heads on an annual basis.

aTm2004 said:

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That's why, while no one will want to hear it, having auto bid for the 5 conference winners (or 4 since The big 12 sucks ass), and adding in a few choices by the committee is the right way to do it. It is, and always will be, a popularity contest. At least until it becomes more objective.

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The best way to do it, IMO, is to have the 5 P5 champions have an auto bid with the 6th spot going to the best G5 champion. Give #1 and 2 a bye and let 3/6 (#1 gets winner) & 4/5 (#2 gets winner) play. No more crying about a conference getting left out or another getting 2. You also shut up the G5 guys who just say "we want a shot." Well, you get a shot. Also, this will force teams like ND, BYU, etc to join a damn conference.

Or, you could only rank 1 & 2 and publish prior to the season starting every scenario of what the match ups would look like if say the SEC and B1G are #1 and 2, with ACC playing G5 and BDF playing Pac, with winner of ACC/G5 getting B1G. It takes rankings completely out of it, outside of 2 teams.

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I'm not a fan of auto-bids. There are some years where certain conferences are so weak they have no business being mentioned in top 4, 6 or even 8. Take this year, for example, it is difficult for me to imagine a scenario where OU/Baylor or Utah win a playoff game. Yes, that is why we play the games to see reality vs projections, but it diminishes excitement of the playoff for almost everyone except those connected to the four schools.

If we want to determine the best team in the country and it is moved to 6 or 8, I think we just have to accept that some conferences will have more contenders than others.

Look at who's on the committee. It's a complete **** show. An Army chief of staff? Some chick professor from the PAC? Ken ****ing Hatfield's spare ass? The AD for Arkansas ****ing State? An academic nerd president of Robert Morris? Only one (Florida AD) with any SEC ties at all.



Go that route with a room full of spares and this is what you get.

I stand corrected by both of you - completely forgot about Washington & Oregon.

I hate LSU and we are better off if someone else wins. So I say good. Make them go thru Clemson and Ohio State.

I don't think anyone can be too upset with tOSU at #1. They have dominated teams and handled their business. LSU could be #1, but that's a debatable point that both sides could make a genuine case for and I'd be fine with either one.

The rigged system (top 15 or so) has to do with Baylor, Wisconsin, PSU, Michigan, and Bama.

regarding BCS:

jonj101 said:

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I have to admit, I have not watched Utah enough to gauge how good they are.But I can imagine that no matter how terrible the PAC is, representatives from that conference will moan about never having a team in the playoff since its inception.

For me, in an ideal situation, Georgia pulls off a win against LSU and the playoff is set. Since that is highly unlikely without their best receiver and Swift, its comes down to OU, Baylor and Utah. If Utah loses the committee gets an out regardless. If they win, then once again we have a debate about expansion to 8, etc. etc.

Edit: As corrected by posters below, I forgot about UW & Oregon.

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Never? Oregon and Washington have made it and actually won a game.

OU is the school that people have fatigue with. They've go one and done and have only been competitive once.

Barring major blowouts and favorites winning this week I think Utah stays at 4. OU just hasn't been impressive enough and no one wants to watch them get killed in another playoff game. (Aside from those that enjoy watching them get killed..)

I'm glad that Bama is ranked so low because, you know, fk Bama.

aTm2004 said:

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LEJ said:

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DEMOCRATIC socialism!

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No, just making it like every other sport where there's a clear playoff path and bringing it in line with the NCAA Tournament.

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College FB is great bc it's NOT like every other sport!

mm42 said:

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I hate LSU and we are better off if someone else wins. So I say good. Make them go thru Clemson and Ohio State.

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My man!!!!

Bob Harris said:

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Everyone should get a trophy.

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Are you familiar with the current state of the bowl system?

Can we just let handicappers rank the teams? What is a purer system than one in which we let free money talk.

Clay Travis must not know how many TV sets and "journalists" there are in the Northeast and Midwest.......$$$$$$

TexasLeaguer said:

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Can we just let handicappers rank the teams? What is a purer system than one in which we let free money talk.

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So you'd want Alabama still ahead to Auburn?

jonj101 said:

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aTm2004 said:

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Quote:

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That's why, while no one will want to hear it, having auto bid for the 5 conference winners (or 4 since The big 12 sucks ass), and adding in a few choices by the committee is the right way to do it. It is, and always will be, a popularity contest. At least until it becomes more objective.

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The best way to do it, IMO, is to have the 5 P5 champions have an auto bid with the 6th spot going to the best G5 champion. Give #1 and 2 a bye and let 3/6 (#1 gets winner) & 4/5 (#2 gets winner) play. No more crying about a conference getting left out or another getting 2. You also shut up the G5 guys who just say "we want a shot." Well, you get a shot. Also, this will force teams like ND, BYU, etc to join a damn conference.

Or, you could only rank 1 & 2 and publish prior to the season starting every scenario of what the match ups would look like if say the SEC and B1G are #1 and 2, with ACC playing G5 and BDF playing Pac, with winner of ACC/G5 getting B1G. It takes rankings completely out of it, outside of 2 teams.

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I'm not a fan of auto-bids. There are some years where certain conferences are so weak they have no business being mentioned in top 4, 6 or even 8. Take this year, for example, it is difficult for me to imagine a scenario where OU/Baylor or Utah win a playoff game. Yes, that is why we play the games to see reality vs projections, but it diminishes excitement of the playoff for almost everyone except those connected to the four schools.

If we want to determine the best team in the country and it is moved to 6 or 8, I think we just have to accept that some conferences will have more contenders than others.

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I can understand why people don't like auto bids. But those are generally the same people saying "win your conference and it won't matter". Well, why don't we roll with that? It just makes sense. Sure there will be a team left out in the cold, but at least it's not because a committed of dumbasses "didn't think you were good enough". It's just so flawed.

Here's one thing as certain as the sun rising tomorrow:

Any expansion of playoff will include autobids for conference champions

Yes. The game was close, and I think Bama wins more times than they lose if they play 100 times.

Btw, PSU is ahead of Minnesota, and they have the same record. Bama only has two loses. Should South Carolina be ahead of UGA?

South Platte said:

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tjholley16 said:

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here is my solution. Use the old BCS system to determine the final 4 teams. That way you eliminate any personal bias, and you use simply statistics.

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But it seemed like these "statistics" were never disclosed and left people scratching their heads on an annual basis.

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Same as now but with people! Meet the new boss... same as the old boss.

TexasLeaguer said:

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Yes. The game was close, and I think Bama wins more times than they lose if they play 100 times.

?

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Then why even play the game?

Using gambling spreads to is terrible idea.

If Clemson is shocked this weekend, they'd still have a top 4 Vegas ranking but would have no business being in playoff.

LEJ said:

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aTm2004 said:

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LEJ said:

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DEMOCRATIC socialism!

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No, just making it like every other sport where there's a clear playoff path and bringing it in line with the NCAA Tournament.

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College FB is great bc it's NOT like every other sport!

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No, CFB is great because we have a vested interest in the team playing what is one of the most popular sports in the world (certainly the US in football). That's what makes it different than the NFL or any pro sport. Most of the fans are alumni and work with alumni of other schools their teams play. Yeah, there are exceptions with teams like Ohio State, LSU, and Alabama who have fans who smoke Kools in their single wides because they have an IQ that makes Forrest Gump look like a ****ing genius.

Scotty Appleton said:

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jonj101 said:

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I have to admit, I have not watched Utah enough to gauge how good they are.But I can imagine that no matter how terrible the PAC is, representatives from that conference will moan about never having a team in the playoff since its inception.

For me, in an ideal situation, Georgia pulls off a win against LSU and the playoff is set. Since that is highly unlikely without their best receiver and Swift, its comes down to OU, Baylor and Utah. If Utah loses the committee gets an out regardless. If they win, then once again we have a debate about expansion to 8, etc. etc.

Edit: As corrected by posters below, I forgot about UW & Oregon.

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Never? Oregon and Washington have made it and actually won a game.

OU is the school that people have fatigue with. They've go one and done and have only been competitive once.

Barring major blowouts and favorites winning this week I think Utah stays at 4. OU just hasn't been impressive enough and no one wants to watch them get killed in another playoff game. (Aside from those that enjoy watching them get killed..)

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You literally quoted me acknowledging the incorrect statement in my post. I also posted admitting it to the two previous posters who corrected me.

Yeah, I shouldn't have posted something so incorrect, but I was posting in between work tasks and emails and made a mistake.

So Clemson is a shoe in this week and absolutely not a top team next week, if they lose one game? I have always been a proponent of getting the best teams ranked in order.

Most of us can agree that with Clemson's schedule, A&M most likely goes 10-2, 11-1, or 12-0 this year. If that was the case, A&M would be a top 12 team. Are we a top 12 team, NO. Should our schedule dictate rankings or should the quality of the team dictate rankings? I say, quality of the team, which is determined and set by Vegas.

Look at baylol. Vegas doesn't buy into them as a team and has them as a 9 point underdog to OU. Yet, they are one place behind OU in the rankings. Makes zero sense.

TexasLeaguer said:

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So Clemson is a shoe in this week, and absolutely not a top team next week, if they lose one game? I have always been a proponent of getting the best teams ranked in order.

Most of us can agree that with Clemson's schedule, A&M most likely goes 10-2, 11-1, or 12-0 this year. If that was the case, A&M would be a top 12 team. Are we a top 12 team, NO. Should our schedule dictate rankings or should the quality of the team dictate rankings? I say, quality of the team, which is determined and set by Vegas.

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We would definitely beat ourselves

Aggiebrewer said:

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I know Ken Hatfield & he is a good man who really knows football. I think he is one of the few qualified people on that committee

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I think he would have a bias to the idea that strength of schedule shouldn't matter and "you can only play who's on yours" mentality.

I didn't even read the whole thread because well, you know, TLDR.

Has anyone just considered the possibility that OSU is better than LSU?

Quote:

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Has anyone just considered the possibility that OSU cheats better than LSU?

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FTFY

It doesn't matter how good a team Clemson is if they can't win their games.


If Clemson had lost to South Carolina and then lost Virginia date still be a top 4 team in Vegas.

Do you really think Alabama should be in the playoffs with two losses? Because if you go just based on Las Vegas they would be probably

The committee has been straight up ******ed the way they've ranked LSU, OSU, Clemson, and Bama. The committee argues that Ohio State is #1 based on mostly just eye test. They have wins over what, two ranked teams? Clemson has zero ranked wins. Pure eye test.

But then the eye test is completely thrown out for Bama. They've absolutely wrecked every team on their schedule outside of two losses to pretty damn good teams. But their argument is no good wins for Bama. Fine, then it must be about resume then. LSU has the best resume of the playoff era. And they've whipped just about everybody doing it. They have the resume AND the eye test.

I've watched a lot of LSU and a few OSU games this year. LSU would be favored if they played today. Bama would be favored over about three teams ranked ahead of them.

You win your conference, you should get a seat at the table, plain and simple. If you are good, you'll compete in the brackets. If you aren't and your conference was weak - you'll get bumped early and fast.

The point of the "playoff" was to get away from the human factor and let the best teams compete. In every other sport, there is a defined and well thought out bracket where teams have the chance to prove they are worthy or not. Except D1 football.

Sometimes the team with the best regular season record isn't the best team when it comes time to put up or shut up. Hell, look at our baseball team for proof - how many times have we gone through the season ranked at or near the top, only to fail in the regionals or supers to a team with a worse record or who wasn't as strong in the regular season? It happens, more often than not.

5 auto for the P5 conferences, 3 spots for the teams that maybe didn't win a conference but were damn good teams and should get a shot. Let the teams play on the field determine the champion, not cherry picking 4 teams with the possibility of a large margin of error and claiming one of them is champion. It's really not that hard, and I simply cannot grasp why D1 football is somehow so different than literally every other single sport.

And after the last 4 or whatever years of the 4 team playoff, anybody that doens't think the committee has a goal of bringing in teams not from the SEC or ACC is crazy. Guarantee you that part of their mandate is looking at more than just the tams - looking at TV markets, revenue, etc. is also part of it, whether explicit or not.

I simply don't think that the viewership will be as excited about another SEC/ACC matchup, and they are going to make sure that Alabama and Clemson don't get a shot at being in the championship game no matter what happens.

Ratings for the game peaked when Alabama and UGA played - because it was somebody other than Clemson/Alabama and it went into overtime. They dropped significantly last year (from 16.7 to 13.8). Remember - money talks, and money is the driving factor.

Keeping tOSU at #1, deserved or not, increases the chance that a midwest school will be in the championship game. I"m guessing that bets are being hedged that doing so will increase viewership by bringing in a completely different market (Midwest, north) versus the east coast versus gulf coast markets that have dominated because of the teams in the championship game.

tjholley16 said:

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here is my solution. Use the old BCS system to determine the final 4 teams. That way you eliminate any personal bias, and you use simply statistics.

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Not a bad idea, but the BCS formula still contained human input from the Coaches' Poll (aka the SID poll) and the Harris Poll, which was made up of former coaches and ADs, IIRC. I'm fine using that since the human element has less weight compared to the Playoff Committee

There's no question that those watching the numbers would love to have Ohio State in the game.

34 million people watched when they played Oregon in the championship.

South Platte said:

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I was in favor of keeping Ohio State above LSU until this past week. It's close, but LSU appears to be better at this point.

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LSU has always been better. Ohio State has beaten nobody.