Their program doesn't resemble this right now:

Richard -

Did you see one defensive player, offensive lineman or running back from TT who could start for LSU? LSU has pretty good WRs too. So the QB may be the only guy from TT who could start on LSUs very average offense, but their offense can be 2nd in the Nation in scoring playing in the Big 12.

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Their program doesn't resemble this right now:

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Neither does ours

We're missing the point. We are doing what losers do. The point is how do we do in our own conference. Since we dont do well we find teams we don't play and say we could beat them. That makes us feel better and we don't have to prove anything. If we want to beat TT and Baylor so bad we should have stayed with them.

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We're missing the point. We are doing what losers do. The point is how do we do in our own conference. Since we dont do well we find teams we don't play and say we could beat them. That makes us feel better and we don't have to prove anything. If we want to beat TT and Baylor so bad we should have stayed with them.

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What are you talking about? Nobody is begging for the truth/bu game. Not that I've seen. Am I wrong or did you go on a worthless rant?

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Richard - Just to help you understand - Did you watch TT and LSU last night? Leading total offense leader in the nation, #2 scoring team in the Nation, Big 12 offensive juggernault offense was made to look very average by LSU defense. A very average to below average LSU offense scored 56 on TT. So what I am saying is SEC defenses are good and Big 12 offensive stats are over-inflated because their defenses are bad. Hope that clears it up for you.

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So one game. Thats what you are using to support your argument?

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This feels repetitive, but I'll lend you a hand. His example was of one game in which it was supposed to be NO Offense LSU vs All Offense Tech. Well, the LSU Defense was too good for the #2 ranked O, and LSU put up 50+. Showing the discrepancy in Defense & Offense for both conferences.

If you think any of the big 12 teams would have a top 10 offense in the SEC, you don't understand football. Too much size and depth in the SEC. It shows on signing day as well. And draft day. And I pray Oklahoma gets to play Alabama. It will be bad. And then you'll have another game as an example.

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My point is you can't blanket an entire conference because of a single game. That super awesome defense of LSU gave up 38 pts to Ole Miss, whose super awesome defense gave up 37 pts to ****ing Memphis. And before people here reference how many SEC teams are in the top 50 in scoring offense, go take a look at where those points came from. When you are hanging 70pts a game against the Sisters-of-the-Poor University, it helps inflate your stats greatly. Texas Tech is not a fair comparison to Baylor. Texas Tech's offense is comprised of midgets when compared to Baylor's offense.

I would argue most conferences, including the SEC, are pretty similar in make up- a couple elite teams at the top of the conference, followed by some average and poor teams. I agree that the SEC West is daunting, but its top heavy. There is no disputing the fact that Alabama and LSU are loaded with talent, just like Ohio State and Michigan are loaded with talent, and Stanford and USC are loaded with talent, and Baylor/Oklahoma, etc.

The difference is for some reason the non-elite SEC fanbases have a distorted view of their own reality because they are in a conference with those couple teams at the top loaded with elite talent. Texas A&M is an average SEC team. Texas A&M would also be average in pretty much any other conference, just like they were in the Big12 a few years ago.

No here is my point. From talking around I have learned Sumlin told 2 QBs that have both played very poorly for most of the year, that the job was going to be opened up in the spring. Instead of staying and competing they LEFT. You cannot win with those type of guys anyway. Every job should be open in the spring. If kids don't want to compete for a starting job, don't expect them to compete in a game! I really cannot make a case for Kyler or Kyle being the starting QB for A&M. Maybe Jake can be that guy.

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Richard -

Did you see one defensive player, offensive lineman or running back from TT who could start for LSU? LSU has pretty good WRs too. So the QB may be the only guy from TT who could start on LSUs very average offense, but their offense can be 2nd in the Nation in scoring playing in the Big 12.

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No, because TT is an average-at-best Big 12 team that played an elite SEC team. I also don't see any TT players that could start for Ohio State, USC, or Florida State.

TT's mediocre team means nothing when grading a team like Baylor, who has several players I believe could start at LSU, (mostly OL and QB-when healthy).

Richard - Now I believe you are a troll after that last post. A&M has competed against a lot better teams in the SEC. They have also have gotten tougher and better players because of the SEC. A&M would be a contender for the Big 12 title every year now. A&M is not the same team they were before they left. Except they make have fallen into the trap of not hiring Chief and trying to out-score everyone like most Big 12 schools. Richard, if you would just say you are basing your opinion on the fact that you just don't like Sumlin, or want a change at A&M or you are a Baylor, Big 12 fan then I will say that is OK. But I am trying to give an honest opinion on what I see on the field based on my football experiences.

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Richard - Now I believe you are a troll after that last post. A&M has competed against a lot better teams in the SEC. They have also have gotten tougher and better players because of the SEC. A&M would be a contender for the Big 12 title every year now. A&M is not the same team they were before they left. Except they make have fallen into the trap of not hiring Chief and trying to out-score everyone like most Big 12 schools.

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Well you can try and argue in hypotheticals, but I will stick to what can be proven: A&M was an average football program before in the Big 12, and they are an average football program now in the SEC. In fact, if you look at A&M's last four years in the Big 12 compared to their last four in the SEC; A&M's best season came during their first year in the SEC. So an average Big 12 team was able to step right into the SEC and beat #1 ranked Bama, finish 11-2, and go on to win the Cotton bowl. Seems like A&M is proof that the SEC is overhyped.

So now you are using one game. LOL Read my post just above yours again. I think you are just a Big 12 fan!

OK, I am out of here. Good fun, but you cannot argue football with a fan! I have learned that years ago.

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A lot of big targets for us are waiting until after our bowl game. Let's wait and see how this finishes. Plus all the talk of firing Summon hurts recruiting. If we win and conviencingly it will help our recruiting.

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True, however, I say go ahead and can him, he will never be any better that he is right now.

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Briles is out-recruiting Sumlin

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Yea, well, who isn't?

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Richard - Now I believe you are a troll after that last post. A&M has competed against a lot better teams in the SEC. They have also have gotten tougher and better players because of the SEC. A&M would be a contender for the Big 12 title every year now. A&M is not the same team they were before they left. Except they make have fallen into the trap of not hiring Chief and trying to out-score everyone like most Big 12 schools.

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Well you can try and argue in hypotheticals, but I will stick to what can be proven: A&M was an average football program before in the Big 12, and they are an average football program now in the SEC. In fact, if you look at A&M's last four years in the Big 12 compared to their last four in the SEC; A&M's best season came during their first year in the SEC. So an average Big 12 team was able to step right into the SEC and beat #1 ranked Bama, finish 11-2, and go on to win the Cotton bowl. Seems like A&M is proof that the SEC is overhyped.

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Seems like Double-**** the Second just outed himself as a Big12 troll. Congrats on using the standard Big12 line that's supposed to prove the Big12 is better than the SEC.

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Richard - Now I believe you are a troll after that last post. A&M has competed against a lot better teams in the SEC. They have also have gotten tougher and better players because of the SEC. A&M would be a contender for the Big 12 title every year now. A&M is not the same team they were before they left. Except they make have fallen into the trap of not hiring Chief and trying to out-score everyone like most Big 12 schools.

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Well you can try and argue in hypotheticals, but I will stick to what can be proven: A&M was an average football program before in the Big 12, and they are an average football program now in the SEC. In fact, if you look at A&M's last four years in the Big 12 compared to their last four in the SEC; A&M's best season came during their first year in the SEC. So an average Big 12 team was able to step right into the SEC and beat #1 ranked Bama, finish 11-2, and go on to win the Cotton bowl. Seems like A&M is proof that the SEC is overhyped.

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Poor Big12 troll with no options

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The Dumb is strong with this one.

It's like you have forgotten what Baylor did as soon as their schedule got "real" (and that Oklahoma/ok st/TCU/tu "murderers row" is nothing like they would face in a real conference with legit resources).

We get it, you're a beat sympathizer.

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It's relative. Obviously that's something your tiny mind cannot comprehend.

Briles has proven he can coach at each stop he has made. Had Sumlin not gotten Johnny as a gift, this would have been his last year. He has all the resources to recruit and compete and has failed.

Not sure why Tech is being held up as some sort of standard-bearer of the Big 12. They do have an entertaining, dangerous offense and Mahomes is incredible, but they still went 4-5 in conference play, losing big to Baylor, Oklahoma, and Oklahoma State and losing close ones to TCU and West Virginia. Barely beat UT. Their best wins were over Arkansas and a mediocre Kansas State.

Need Divinity and Jones....

Why are people surprised Baylor is out recruiting us now? They are better and have been better than us for the past 3 years.

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Briles has won 4 games this season and 3 last season over teams with winning records. You saw a high scoring Big 12 offense (TT) , 2nd in the nation in scoring and the nations total offense leader at QB against a SEC caliber defense last night. Briles freaking straight snapped the ball to RBs all night. How well do you think that would work against good SEC defenses? Briles is a great coach. But I would like to see how he would have done against A&Ms schedule. I get it if you don't like Sumlin, but crowning Briles is a little silly too. By the way, always bet against a team who lost their conference championship game. NC just like Bama a few years ago just didn't show up. One more thing. Big 12 defenses for the most part suck big time. LSU scored 56 against TT. And LSU had no offense all year!

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He also just rolled up 650 yards with his 3rd team QB

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He also out-coaches Sumlin.

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Briles would have been a better hire. Though he's not well regarded here.

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We have a bunch of full ****** idiots if anyone thinks Art Briles isn't a fantastic coach. What has done to fix BAYLOR is nothing short of miraculous...

This is BAYLOR for God's sake... and the dude has them in the top 15 each year

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He also out-coaches Sumlin.

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this.

no surprise.

sumlin is literally worthless at this point.

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+1

Bets on who ends up with the highest ranked class?

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He also out-coaches Sumlin.

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So true and yet I still throw up a bit in my mouth every time I realize that. Sadly he does it for a lot less money and with a lot less resources too.

um, are folks praising the coach who lost at home to the worst longhorn team of the last 50 years? Good grief. That was a beyond awful loss.

and don't post any garbage about the 4th string QB. Baylor was down 17-0 in that game before the QB/WR ever took a snap. Briles didn't have his team ready to play. End of story

I'm not impressed with Briles.

He beat a NCState team that had absolutely no DL.

He has loaded up on cupcake OOC opponents and a BigXII that is mediocre, when the Sips and OU have been down.

Has he turned Baylor around? Sure... he was 4-8 his 1st two seasons and has improved. And he consistently takes players that have criminal behavior and defends them until they are imprisoned.

He is 39-30 in the Big XII and 3-3 in Bowls, while at Baylor. Most of that record has been since A&M and Mizzou were replaced by TCU and WV.


Since 2008
Kansas: 6-0 ( 8-61 in BXII)
K-State: 5-1 (31-29)
ISU: 5-2 (16-53)
TT: 5-3 (31-38)

He is 21-6 against conference teams that went 86-181 in conference. And do note, KU, K-State and ISU have a W/L that will equate to .500 against each other, as well as they were in the North, which was very, very weak, so even their Ws are suspect.

OU: 3-5
OSU: 3-5
TCU: 4-2
tu: 4-4
WV: 2-2

A&M: 1-3

Add 4 Gimme wins against Kansas, K-State, Iowa State, Texas Tech... 2 OOC FBS opponents and 1 OOC FCS opponent and you are really looking at a 7 Win Baylor team. Win 3 of the other 5 and you have a 10 win season. Add in the Big East teams of TCU and WV... even if you split those games, you are at 8-1, with 3 games to play, along with a Bowl.

He is 14-16 against the 4 teams that are considered at the Top of the BigXII - OU, OSU, TCU & Sips.

The reason he had to use his 3rd string QB in his Bowl, is because all of the stronger teams on their schedule were at the end of the season, and when you play better teams, you get banged up. When you start the season with SMU, Lamar, Rice, TT, KU, WV, ISU & K-State... you've played 8 teams that barely have enough talent to compete, let alone lay the lumber.

What Dallas Said. +1

Some of us have fallen for the 'ol statistics thing.

Baylor has an offense that is fun to watch against lower echelon opponents.

There is a lot going on in Waco that hasn't come to light yet, and they aren't going to look good if they do get exposed.

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You opinions on Aggie football are even more ridiculous than your opinions on the amount of money Star Wars is going to bring in at the box office.

Also, you don't know what the word literally means.

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So I underestimated the nerd/virgin movie going power. I got over it. You should as well.

Enjoy our continued mediocrity. I expect better from our program,. Sad you do not.

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Neither you are the other poster can do anything about it so both of you will accept whatever is decided... for you.

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Unfortunately this has always been true. Dumb decisions that we have no control over.

Baylor wins more games so they are going to recruit well. As long as Sumlin is here, we just have to be happy with 8 wins until the next JFF arrives.

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Why are people surprised Baylor is out recruiting us now? They are better and have been better than us for the past 3 years.

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.... and they do a good job of covering up sexual assault on female athletes. What was the payday for the Civil lawyer who handled the case? Must have been tobacco case like in order for it to go silently in the night. Also nice timing by the school to leak the settlement story during CFPs.

All this "ranking" talk is nonsense.
It makes no difference where a school is ranked.
Can we develop new talent to help make the team a winner?
That's what really counts.

Dumb. Chavis is here NOW thanks to Sumlin and defense will be even better next season. Some SEC teams will be WORSE next season due to roster and coaching turnover. Spav is GONE which everyone was screaming for and Sumlin brought in Mazzone which is a blow to UCLA who we happen to play this season. 24 PPG probably wins 10-11 games next season if team stays healthy

Even with an upgrade at oc I am not sure we win 10 or 11. Hope I'm wrong but o line and qb are going to have to show alot of improvement with not alot of experience. Could happen and I hope we scheme better to cover faults. Agree, not worried as much about defense, they should keep other teams under 24 or so.