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Gator Pit update (*I'm not the OP)

23,842 Views | 128 Replies | Last: 6 yr ago by gwellis
BigPuma
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We haven't used an offset in forever. That pit is a rotisserie style that was pulled out of my FIL's old restaurant.

I've seen offsets used but we aren't regularly competing right now so I couldn't give a great answer.
wadd96
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Unfortunately yes.
All the God's, all the Heavens, all the Hells are within you.
CanyonAg77
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reddog90 said:

You guys saying GP should have just refunded OP and sold the pit to someone else waiting might be missing the point that these are custom pits. Someone paying $5-10k for their custom pit might not want to pay $5-10k for someone else's idea of a custom pit.
The question I have yet to see answered is "How customized?" When I went on their web site, the "customization" appeared to be handles, thermometers, and other bolt-on stuff. It looks like there are a few base models that you choose from, it doesn't appear like anything is 100% custom.
aad03
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Ritch doesn't ask for the pit to be paid in full up front, I think he wants 50%. He also has a markerboard with a list of customers' orders and the particular welder assigned to that job. Your pit is built in the order it was received, he doesn't let anybody cut in line. And for that reason, he won't guarantee a finish date. I waited almost a year and a half for mine, but I wasn't in a hurry; just figured I'd go ahead and get my name on the board.

I'm guessing the OP paid in full hoping that Gator Pit would make it a priority to hit his deadline. For better or worse, Ritch doesn't work that way.

But look how quickly someone else was willing to jump in and buy the pit without having to wait in line. He's going to be extremely happy with that pit. Hope the transaction goes well.
Class of '03
CanyonAg77
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Quote:

I'm guessing the OP paid in full hoping that Gator Pit would make it a priority to hit his deadline. For better or worse, Ritch doesn't work that way.
This whole thread is over the fact that Ritch asked for 100% before completion.
CashinOut
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Today is pick-up day!!!!
CanyonAg77
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Quote:

Ritch doesn't ask for the pit to be paid in full up front,
http://www.gatorpit.net/order-policy.html
Quote:

Terms and Conditions of Sale: 50 percent minimum Non-Refundable Payment is due at time of order....

All orders require final order confirmation just prior to actual build. Gator Pit will contact you to review your order description and/or drawings. Final payment or balance due In Full is required at time of build. Not after build completion or at pick up.

aTm2004
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CanyonAg77 said:

Quote:

Ritch doesn't ask for the pit to be paid in full up front,
http://www.gatorpit.net/order-policy.html
Quote:

Terms and Conditions of Sale: 50 percent minimum Non-Refundable Payment is due at time of order....

All orders require final order confirmation just prior to actual build. Gator Pit will contact you to review your order description and/or drawings. Final payment or balance due In Full is required at time of build. Not after build completion or at pick up.


aad03
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This is correct. Maybe instead of "up front" I should have said "at time order is placed," that's what I meant. But the OP clearly paid 100% before he had to, right? When they call and ask for final payment, that means they are beginning work on your pit. That gives you a chance to make any last-minute modifications to your design. It takes less than a week to build the pit, maybe a little more if it's on a trailer. Either way, seems like it was clear they would not hit the deadline long before the original buyer was actually required to pay. Right?
Class of '03
Ag_07
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aad03 said:

It takes less than a week to build the pit, maybe a little more if it's on a trailer.



A) I'm no welder but I imagine it takes more than that to build a pit
B) If that is indeed the case then why an 8 month wait time?
aTm2004
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aad03 said:

This is correct. Maybe instead of "up front" I should have said "at time order is placed," that's what I meant. But the OP clearly paid 100% before he had to, right? When they call and ask for final payment, that means they are beginning work on your pit. That gives you a chance to make any last-minute modifications to your design. It takes less than a week to build the pit, maybe a little more if it's on a trailer. Either way, seems like it was clear they would not hit the deadline long before the original buyer was actually required to pay. Right?
100% at the time of order or 50% at order and 50% before it's started. When the other 50% is provided between order and project start is irrelevant. He was still giving them 100% the money before they even picked up a torch. You can try to back track and talk your way out of it, but at the end of the day you stated something that was incorrect and called out on it with facts.
CanyonAg77
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I have no idea at what point the original buyer paid the other 50%.

I will say he was in a really bad place at that point, assuming it was after the event he wanted it for. He could either eat the 50%, or pay the additional 50%, and hope he can resell at a price point that loses him less money than letting the entire 50% deposit evaporate.

IMO, the deposits are insane, but I guess GP can get away with it. A non-refundable deposit of 10% seems more reasonable to get a place in line. Then another 40% to continue, once they are ready to build, seems more reasonable, then the final 50% at pickup.

Again, I guess "reasonable" is whatever you can get away with.

But you were wrong, or at minimum, misspoke. Paying before it's built is the definition of "up front".
WC87
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They should change their name to Later Pits as you will get your pit much much much later than you originally hoped.

I'll show myself out, thank you.
BrazosDog02
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CanyonAg77 said:

Quote:

Ritch doesn't ask for the pit to be paid in full up front,
http://www.gatorpit.net/order-policy.html
Quote:

Terms and Conditions of Sale: 50 percent minimum Non-Refundable Payment is due at time of order....

All orders require final order confirmation just prior to actual build. Gator Pit will contact you to review your order description and/or drawings. Final payment or balance due In Full is required at time of build. Not after build completion or at pick up.


This policy here is enough for me not to do business with them.

You get 50% now, but you ain't getting **** until after I see the product I ordered at pickup. That's MY policy.
schmellba99
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DannyDuberstein said:

I don't think anyone has an issue with a long waitlist. I don't. But I do think you start to venture into questionable territory if you aren't able to provide an estimated timeframe and at least somewhat live up to it when you have taken payment in full upfront, even if it isn't contractual. It's just good, ethical business.

But being a ;pain in the balls on allowing a different person to pick it up, being uncooperative with it being picked up, and then having the gall to want to charge for storage after presenting both of the previous difficulties starts to venture beyond questionable territory and into jackass territory.
This.

I build big ass 100% custom projects for a living - and we have to give schedules and deadlines.

I would not enter into an agreement that this outfit wants. I can understand the 50% up front to purchase materials (though I would question that percentage right off the bat because it's high). But no way in hell would I enter into an agreement where I have paid for a welded item 100% before a single rod was burned, and absolutely not without a defined production schedule.

If this guy is as good as he says and thinks he is, he should know what the time frame for fabrication is for each individual welder and should be able to give you at minimum a completion date that is equivalent to scheduling a cable installer - he knows that once production starts it takes on average 12 weeks to finish, you should be able to expect your product in that 12 weeks plus or minus 2 weeks (or something along those lines).

I'll likely never be in a need for a $5k custom bbq pit - but if I am, this guy won't get my business based on his business model alone. The other stuff is just good reinforcement backing up that already made decision.
CanyonAg77
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WC87 said:

They should change their name to Later Pits as you will get your pit much much much later than you originally hoped.

I'll show myself out, thank you.
Let's start a competing company called Crocodile Pits, with delivery dates promised to be... "After a while".
aad03
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CanyonAg77 said:

I will say he was in a really bad place at that point, assuming it was after the event he wanted it for. He could either eat the 50%, or pay the additional 50%, and hope he can resell at a price point that loses him less money than letting the entire 50% deposit evaporate.

IMO, the deposits are insane, but I guess GP can get away with it. A non-refundable deposit of 10% seems more reasonable to get a place in line. Then another 40% to continue, once they are ready to build, seems more reasonable, then the final 50% at pickup.

Agree with all this. I guess only the OP knows if he paid when they called and asked for final payment, or if he volunteered to pay in full before it was required. Either way, a 50% non-refundable deposit puts you in a tricky spot.
Class of '03
ellebee
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Seems like when he paid the final 50% is irrelevant in this case since it wouldve been before the work started. The pit is done.
Burdizzo
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Schmelba gets it. Something like this ought to have a contract, and successful contracts have a scope of work, payment terms, and delivery schedule. Really good contracts have terms on what happens if one of the parties fails to meet the conditions of the contract.

Gator Pits may be great, but their sales and delivery terms put the customers at a severe disadvantage. Buyer beware.
aad03
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Whether the final balance was paid before or after the deadline is somewhat relevant.
Class of '03
tamusc
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aad03 said:

Whether the final balance was paid before or after the deadline is somewhat relevant.
If you have to pay 100% before they start work, it is not.
CanyonAg77
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Burdizzo said:

Schmelba gets it. Something like this ought to have a contract, and successful contracts have a scope of work, payment terms, and delivery schedule. Really good contracts have terms on what happens if one of the parties fails to meet the conditions of the contract.

Terms and Conditions of Sale: 50 percent minimum Non-Refundable Payment is due at time of order unless prior arrangements have been made. Payments may be made by VISA / MasterCard / Discover or Wire Transfer. Gator Pit incurs considerable time and money once an order transaction has been received and placed in production planning. The receipt of the deposit or written Purchase Order/Invoice constitutes the agreement and acknowledgement of this non-refundable policy. Please understand that Gator Pit will invoice and pursue all costs incurred in the collection of cancellation/charge back fees. All lead-times quoted at the time purchase are subject to change without prior notice after the sales transaction has taken place. We strongly urge that you do not plan events until you are physically in possession of the product. In the event Gator Pit must enact collection proceedings, or litigation relating to the subject matter of this Purchase Order Agreement, the below signing party shall reimburse Gator Pit for all reasonable attorney fees and costs resulting there from. By signing the below you are giving Gator Pit full authorization to bill your credit or charge account for any resulting charges resulting in the Cancellation/Charge Back of your order. All orders are non-refundable. Gator Pit cannot be held liable for delays in shipping, backordered items, or a substitution of a similar product if the original item has become unavailable. All orders require final order confirmation just prior to actual build. Gator Pit will contact you to review your order description and/or drawings. Final payment or balance due In Full is required at time of build. Not after build completion or at pick up. All sales final on all temperature gauges. Improper customer installation/transport can result in damage to seals, glass face, resulting in moisture inside the gauges. Gator Pit is not responsible. All gauges are calibrated at the manufacturer. Gator Pit does not guarantee accurate calibration. Certain models can be recalibrated by the customer. No exchanges. No refunds. No exceptions on all temperature gauges. ALL trailers will incur a $150.00 processing fee for registration/temporary tags with DMV.

Change Orders: Limited to the options lists that pertain to the specific model ordered. Due to the extreme custom nature of our products, any features added, modified, changed, etc. by the customer after initial order must be verified/confirmed in writing by the customer to Gator Pit of Texas, LP. This can be in a received signed letter by the customer or via email with your name attached notifying and agreeing to the change. You may call our office to discuss the changes to your order, however, we will still require written documentation of the changes and agreement to price. "Change Orders" WILL DELAY your original estimated completion time and may incur a $50.00 Administrative Fee. If drawings, full written descriptions and specifications have to be revised there will be a $75.00 fee assessed each time this is required. We suggest making a lists of your possible changes to your original order. When we contact you to finalize the order for build, we can then make those change orders. Again, that WILL delay the order. A one-time fee will be assessed. Otherwise, you may incur the Change Order fee over the lead time when calling and making repeated changes. This is not to discourage you from calling and asking questions. Feel free to contact us for that. Additional payment WILL be required on the changes to meet the minimum 50 percent deposit. Customers will not be able to make "change orders/modifications/additions" once your order has been finalized for build and no changes once it hits the shop floor for fulfillment. Our goal is to build to the original order and within the suggested lead time based on what we know is on order. Customers change that order and that customer's lead time is extended and will have to be reconsidered in our production.

Final balance WILL be due at Final Approval for build. NOT after build, due to the order is built specifically for you. This policy is to ensure that both parties understand the changes made by the customer and the customer agrees to additional costs.


powerbelly
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FishingAggie
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Ok. Final post guys.

Pit is picked up. Pulls great. Idk much about these things but it seems awesome.

Listen to me please.

As one Aggie to another please let this die.

Rich wasn't there when I picked it up a 9am. I wanted to talk to him to work out the title. No big deal. A fed ex or two and it'll be fine.

His employees are hard working men trying to make a living. Like all of us.

Read before you commit to anything. What you sign is what you get.

I don't agree with his policies, but there's no reason to hurt his business. He's trying hard to make a good product the best he knows how.

Please let this die and don't post anything on social media to hurt him. The woman I dealt with today was very polite. The welders were very kind. Hooked it up, torqued the wheels before I left and checked my lights.

Guys this is a man working hard and doing the best he can to make a living. Let's not screw with that.

Again. Please kill it and understand that if you don't like his policies, go somewhere else. I'm not defending anything, just don't want to hurt anyone.

He doesn't need that and we are better than that.

[And with that -- it is concluded. Thanks for the update. - Moderator]
gwellis
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Gil '91
 
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