*** COWBOYS 2016 Season ***

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Reginald Cousins
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In reply to ramblin_ag02 • 3:09p, 1/10/17
S
ramblin_ag02 said:
Quote:

He should. But at the same time if we're doing what we should be doing on offense (running the ball, letting the o-line take over), then dak shouldn't even be in a position to have a terrible first half. He should be operating just like he has all season

Exactly. If we get down quick early, then likely Rodgers is just carving up our defense. At that point who's playing QB for us won't make a whole lot of difference. Now if Dak goes out and throws picks on 4 straight drives, then they should think about it. But considering he's only thrown 4 picks all year, it would be surprising to say the least.


Think about it? Three straight picks he's out bud.
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jr15aggie
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In reply to MooreTrucker • 3:45p, 1/10/17
AG
MooreTrucker said:
jr15aggie said:
Just read that Mo will be ready to go. That's awesome!

Unless in forgetting somebody, all of our starters and major contributors are ready to go. About as healthy as you can be this time of year.

Crawford? Durant? Lawrence?

I was on my phone during lunch and didn't want to type all the names, but yes, all those guys are back. Well, I'm not 100% on Durant, but Crawford, D-Law, and McClain are all back on the D-line. Some of those guys could have gone Week 17, but they were sat down for obvious reasons.
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Confucius
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4:35p, 1/10/17
Food for thought the next month...


- With a win in the divisional round, does Dak move pass Romo in perception in the Cowboys hierarchy of QBs?


- With two wins, does Dak move pass Romo, Danny White, and Dandy Don in that hierarchy?


- How bout three wins?
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MooreTrucker
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In reply to Confucius • 4:44p, 1/10/17
AG
Two wins move him passed Romo, who's only won two playoff games ever. Probably passed White and Meredith, too, because no one ever talks about them anymore.

Three wins moves him just under Aikman and Staubach as Super Bowl winners.

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Reginald Cousins
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5:02p, 1/10/17
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Good God. Let him play five years before we talk about him overtaking any hierarchy.
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BassCowboy33
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In reply to MooreTrucker • 5:26p, 1/10/17
MooreTrucker said:
Two wins move him passed Romo, who's only won two playoff games ever. Probably passed White and Meredith, too, because no one ever talks about them anymore.

Three wins moves him just under Aikman and Staubach as Super Bowl winners.



Flawed.
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FTAggies
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5:54p, 1/10/17
It's a team sport, romos never had this kinda team talent before
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Reginald Cousins
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In reply to FTAggies • 5:55p, 1/10/17
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FTAggies said:
It's a team sport, romos never had this kinda team talent before
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Azariah
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In reply to FTAggies • 6:21p, 1/10/17
AG
FTAggies said:
It's a team sport, romos never had this kinda team talent before
He had it last year.
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CSWendt
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In reply to Reginald Cousins • 6:23p, 1/10/17
AG
Disagree. I think the 2007 team had as much talent as well as the team 2 seasons ago.

Looking at the team two seasons ago, nearly identical offensive players (substitute Murray for Zeke, which I think Murray at that point is better than Zeke at this point IMO) with the same level defense played.

Looking at the 2007 team you had a run game that was one of the tops in the league with an elite TO and Witten. Also, the defense had a lot more talent than now. Best I can remember, the offensive line pass protection wasn't a liability except the last game versus the Giants.
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CSWendt
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6:26p, 1/10/17
AG
To switch it from Dak vs. Romo:

If you had to choose one side to play great and one to play terrible would you rather the offense play great and defense terrible, or defense play great and offense terrible?
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Gigem Trevas
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In reply to CSWendt • 6:46p, 1/10/17
CSWendt said:
Disagree. I think the 2007 team had as much talent as well as the team 2 seasons ago.

Looking at the team two seasons ago, nearly identical offensive players (substitute Murray for Zeke, which I think Murray at that point is better than Zeke at this point IMO) with the same level defense played.

Looking at the 2007 team you had a run game that was one of the tops in the league with an elite TO and Witten. Also, the defense had a lot more talent than now. Best I can remember, the offensive line pass protection wasn't a liability except the last game versus the Giants.

2007 was a stout defense.
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Reginald Cousins
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In reply to CSWendt • 7:09p, 1/10/17
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CSWendt said:
Disagree. I think the 2007 team had as much talent as well as the team 2 seasons ago.

Looking at the team two seasons ago, nearly identical offensive players (substitute Murray for Zeke, which I think Murray at that point is better than Zeke at this point IMO) with the same level defense played.

Looking at the 2007 team you had a run game that was one of the tops in the league with an elite TO and Witten. Also, the defense had a lot more talent than now. Best I can remember, the offensive line pass protection wasn't a liability except the last game versus the Giants.


07 Yup. You had a Fasano drop for a TD that swung to a TD for the other side. Crayton drop on a wide open 50+ yarder. Loss.

14 Then a Murray fumble / Dez no catch. But you're right. Romo's Didn't get it done.

Oh. And on the bold part... yeah. That's your opinion. One that may be as wild as I've ever heard. Crucial fumbles. Caught from behind regularly, etc.
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Gigem Trevas
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In reply to Reginald Cousins • 7:19p, 1/10/17
Zeke is already better than Murray ever was and will be.
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MooreTrucker
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In reply to BassCowboy33 • 7:27p, 1/10/17
AG
BassCowboy33 said:
MooreTrucker said:
Two wins move him passed Romo, who's only won two playoff games ever. Probably passed White and Meredith, too, because no one ever talks about them anymore.

Three wins moves him just under Aikman and Staubach as Super Bowl winners.



Flawed.
OK.
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MooreTrucker
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In reply to CSWendt • 7:29p, 1/10/17
AG
CSWendt said:
To switch it from Dak vs. Romo:

If you had to choose one side to play great and one to play terrible would you rather the offense play great and defense terrible, or defense play great and offense terrible?
Defense. Always defense.
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Reginald Cousins
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7:30p, 1/10/17
S
Another Zeke vs. Murray argument. Murray had ~70 more carries. Just based on Zekes average he would have come in at 1,988 yards. Not counting had he broke a long one or two.
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CSWendt
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In reply to Reginald Cousins • 7:34p, 1/10/17
AG
Murray ran for 1,845 yards and 13 TD's that season. Also had over 400 yards receiving. Compare that to Zeke who had 1,631 rushing yards, 15 rushing TD's and less than 400 receiving yards. Yeah, i'm sure a guy who runs for over 1800 yards is slow. Oh and fumbles you say? Murray fumbles 3. Zeke fumbles 5. Anything else?
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Reginald Cousins
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In reply to CSWendt • 7:39p, 1/10/17
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CSWendt said:
Murray ran for 1,845 yards and 13 TD's that season. Also had over 400 yards receiving. Compare that to Zeke who had 1,631 rushing yards, 15 rushing TD's and less than 400 receiving yards. Yeah, i'm sure a guy who runs for over 1800 yards is slow. Oh and fumbles you say? Murray fumbles 3. Zeke fumbles 5. Anything else?


Do you have any effing idea how many carries 70 is? SEVENTY? That's another 357 for Zeke at his average. Finishing at 1,988/18 as a gosh damn rookie. If you're gonna do this even the playing field. The numbers are what they are. Zeke outrushes Murray with equal load and both injury free. I watched every game that season. Murray got caught. A lot. As far as fumbles, let's look at his post season. When it really mattered. Cough cough Green Bay. He's a good runner. He is not Ezekiel Elliot.
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CSWendt
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7:45p, 1/10/17
AG
Granted it is with 70 more carries, but Murray also had 15 carries of 20+ yards with Zeke having 14. So, you could reasonably assume zeke with 70 more carries probably grabs several more chunk carries to beat 15, but not by a lot. And the production we got out of Murray as a pass catcher was huge. Murray wasn't just some decent running back. He was the best running back in the league.


Topic being discussed wasn't that the Cowboys players came up clutch in the post season. The topic is that the 2014 cowboys were as good as this years surrounding Tony. I believe they were very similar teams.
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Reginald Cousins
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In reply to CSWendt • 7:48p, 1/10/17
S
CSWendt said:
Granted it is with 70 more carries, but Murray also had 15 carries of 20+ yards with Zeke having 14. So, you could reasonably assume zeke with 70 more carries probably grabs several more chunk carries to beat 15, but not by a lot. And the production we got out of Murray as a pass catcher was huge. Murray wasn't just some decent running back. He was the best running back in the league.


So you're admitting then with equal loads he beats him in yards, TD's, and probably 20 yard gains... you're helping me here.
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CSWendt
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In reply to Reginald Cousins • 7:53p, 1/10/17
AG
You're assuming a player stays healthy all season and continues to produce late in the year at the same level. BIG IF. I'll take the known over the unknown. Extrapolate all you want, but I too watched every game that season and saw how dominate Murray and that run game was. Zeke is a heck of a player. I just feel what Murray brought in the pass game made the weapons Romo have elite.
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BassCowboy33
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In reply to MooreTrucker • 8:57p, 1/10/17
MooreTrucker said:
BassCowboy33 said:
MooreTrucker said:
Two wins move him passed Romo, who's only won two playoff games ever. Probably passed White and Meredith, too, because no one ever talks about them anymore.

Three wins moves him just under Aikman and Staubach as Super Bowl winners.



Flawed.
OK.


Judging QBs based solely on playoff performance necessitates that Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino. It's a sports fallacy that is only applicable in a vacuum where one player is responsible for wins and losses. In reality, there are numerous variables that contribute to wins and losses such as team, SOS, strength of competition, health, experience, clutch, etc.

Your argument is a common one, especially among Cowboys fans, but it isnt logical.
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PatAg
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In reply to Reginald Cousins • 9:03p, 1/10/17
AG
Reginald Cousins said:
ramblin_ag02 said:
Quote:

He should. But at the same time if we're doing what we should be doing on offense (running the ball, letting the o-line take over), then dak shouldn't even be in a position to have a terrible first half. He should be operating just like he has all season

Exactly. If we get down quick early, then likely Rodgers is just carving up our defense. At that point who's playing QB for us won't make a whole lot of difference. Now if Dak goes out and throws picks on 4 straight drives, then they should think about it. But considering he's only thrown 4 picks all year, it would be surprising to say the least.


Think about it? Three straight picks he's out bud.
I despise you.
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Reginald Cousins
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In reply to PatAg • 9:07p, 1/10/17
S
If a QB throw picks on four consecutive drives in the playoffs against a high octane O, you don't 'think about' pulling him.

Edit: after looking at your post history I just saw where you said the same thing about three bad picks a couple pages back. Was NOT mocking you. Did not remember you saying the same at all. I can see how it would look on your end.

Apologies if we got crossed up.
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option short side
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In reply to Confucius • 10:14p, 1/10/17
AG
Confucius said:
Food for thought the next month...


- With a win in the divisional round, does Dak move pass Romo in perception in the Cowboys hierarchy of QBs?


- With two wins, does Dak move pass Romo, Danny White, and Dandy Don in that hierarchy?


- How bout three wins?
with 3 wins he is in the same conversation with romo but anything other then that it's not even close. Romo has played with great offensive lines before but not like this. And how many years has the cowboys defense been a liability and romo has been in comeback mode throwing 40+ times. I love Dak but let's see what he does over the next 5 years before putting him up there with the all time greats, that is unless he wins a Super Bowl.
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Bullmoose
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10:40p, 1/10/17
AG
romo as a QB is ranked 97th in playoff wins....a drunk cockroach should be able to pass him up....and soon.
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jteagle
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10:42p, 1/10/17
AG
Man I can't wait for this weekend to get here. This thread with a bye week is brutal.
Dak vs Romo
Zeke vs Murray
Dak vs every worthwhile QB Dallas ever had
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Bullmoose
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In reply to Reginald Cousins • 10:45p, 1/10/17
AG
Reginald Cousins said:
Unthought Known said:
CSWendt said:
You are correct, Romo did have a 13-3 record one season. I was thinking he went 12-4. You want to know what Romo did with a 13-3 record in his playoff start? He lost. Not a Romo hater by any stretch, I just think it's an awful idea to pull the hot guy for the injury prone player who hasn't played a meaningful play in 2 years.


He lost. Not the Cowboys. Romo lost.



Romo lost every game on his own. In a vacuum. Like the 52-48 Denver game that he ended with a pick. All his fault. Um. What? He scored 48 and lost.

Most people forget that those 8-8 type seasons would have been 4 or less wins with 90% of other quarterbacks in the league. We stunk for a while.
The Cowboys would have been better off losing those 4 games in the long run and drafting better players. Romo just wasted everyones time until the Cowboys went 4-12 last year and bingo...
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Reginald Cousins
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In reply to jteagle • 11:07p, 1/10/17
S
jteagle said:
Man I can't wait for this weekend to get here. This thread with a bye week is brutal.
Dak vs Romo
Zeke vs Murray
Dak vs every worthwhile QB Dallas ever had
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Reginald Cousins
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In reply to Bullmoose • 11:10p, 1/10/17
S
Bullmoose said:
Reginald Cousins said:
Unthought Known said:
CSWendt said:
You are correct, Romo did have a 13-3 record one season. I was thinking he went 12-4. You want to know what Romo did with a 13-3 record in his playoff start? He lost. Not a Romo hater by any stretch, I just think it's an awful idea to pull the hot guy for the injury prone player who hasn't played a meaningful play in 2 years.


He lost. Not the Cowboys. Romo lost.



Romo lost every game on his own. In a vacuum. Like the 52-48 Denver game that he ended with a pick. All his fault. Um. What? He scored 48 and lost.

Most people forget that those 8-8 type seasons would have been 4 or less wins with 90% of other quarterbacks in the league. We stunk for a while.
The Cowboys would have been better off losing those 4 games in the long run and drafting better players. Romo just wasted everyones time until the Cowboys went 4-12 last year and bingo...


Based on your last two posts I can't tell if you want playoff wins or to lose for draft picks.

All I want is Super Bowl.

Please advise.
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PooDoo
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In reply to Azariah • 1:43a, 1/11/17
AG
Azariah said:
FTAggies said:
It's a team sport, romos never had this kinda team talent before
He had it last year.
How so?
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MooreTrucker
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In reply to BassCowboy33 • 6:55a, 1/11/17
AG
BassCowboy33 said:
MooreTrucker said:
BassCowboy33 said:
MooreTrucker said:
Two wins move him passed Romo, who's only won two playoff games ever. Probably passed White and Meredith, too, because no one ever talks about them anymore.

Three wins moves him just under Aikman and Staubach as Super Bowl winners.



Flawed.
OK.


Judging QBs based solely on playoff performance necessitates that Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino. It's a sports fallacy that is only applicable in a vacuum where one player is responsible for wins and losses. In reality, there are numerous variables that contribute to wins and losses such as team, SOS, strength of competition, health, experience, clutch, etc.

Your argument is a common one, especially among Cowboys fans, but it isnt logical.
Thanks for the explanation. It makes sense, but the question was about perception, and we all know that perception and reality aren't necessarily correlated, especially with sports fans.
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MooreTrucker
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In reply to PooDoo • 6:56a, 1/11/17
AG
PooDoo said:
Azariah said:
FTAggies said:
It's a team sport, romos never had this kinda team talent before
He had it last year.
How so?
Same oline, same WRs, equally good RB, Witten
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BassCowboy33
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In reply to MooreTrucker • 6:57a, 1/11/17
MooreTrucker said:
BassCowboy33 said:
MooreTrucker said:
BassCowboy33 said:
MooreTrucker said:
Two wins move him passed Romo, who's only won two playoff games ever. Probably passed White and Meredith, too, because no one ever talks about them anymore.

Three wins moves him just under Aikman and Staubach as Super Bowl winners.



Flawed.
OK.


Judging QBs based solely on playoff performance necessitates that Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino. It's a sports fallacy that is only applicable in a vacuum where one player is responsible for wins and losses. In reality, there are numerous variables that contribute to wins and losses such as team, SOS, strength of competition, health, experience, clutch, etc.

Your argument is a common one, especially among Cowboys fans, but it isnt logical.
Thanks for the explanation. It makes sense, but the question was about perception, and we all know that perception and reality aren't necessarily correlated, especially with sports fans.


Fair enough.
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