Iran: best way to end for the USA

4,871 Views | 93 Replies | Last: 20 hrs ago by oldyeller
oldyeller
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Phatbob said:

We have barely done anything kinetic for months. We are playing the attrition game at this point and we have already done the heavy lifting. We obviously don't have the stomach to do what is required to win this outright militarily with boots on the ground, so the only way we can win is to stay the course and hope they bleed out, and the only way to lose is to stop now.


We would have to be willing to tolerate thousands of casualties resulting from putting the size force needed to fight through rings of mountains against a determined enemy who knows the ground better than we do.

If they were an imminent, existential threat, and that could be effectively communicated, we might have the stomach for that, but they are neither an imminent threat, nor an existential threat, and containment was working just fine before this major miscalculation.
CrackerJackAg
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Martin Q. Blank said:

BQ78 said:

We've wrecked their military to the point any semi-competent force could move in and take over. The problem is none of their neighbors are semi-competent and/or motivated to do that.

Hell, even we aren't motivated to win it.

Or maybe everyone knows to never get involved in a land war in Asia.


Alexander did fine.

Did everyone forget that it was one the most amazing campaigns ever and it took like 10 years.

Trump ain't Alexander
Burdizzo
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Phatbob said:

We have barely done anything kinetic for months. We are playing the attrition game at this point and we have already done the heavy lifting. We obviously don't have the stomach to do what is required to win this outright militarily with boots on the ground, so the only way we can win is to stay the course and hope they bleed out, and the only way to lose is to stop now.



Fighting a war of attrition with the Persians is a fool's errand. We think in terms of weeks. They think in terms of centuries
Daddy
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For you dummies

Everything is going to according to plan

A Iran has no Nuke
B we are making 100s of billions selling our oil
C no Americans are dying
D chiba gas station Iran is closed and so is Venezuela
E we control the energy of western hemisphere but more importantly the world
F Iran might be liberated after this election

Trump's destroying it

Issue #1,2,3,4,5 is enemies both foreign and domestic in our elections

Be prepared for martial law
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oldyeller
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Daddy said:

For you dummies

Everything is going to according to plan

A Iran has no Nuke
B we are making 100s of billions selling our oil
C no Americans are dying
D chiba gas station Iran is closed and so is Venezuela
E we control the energy of western hemisphere but more importantly the world
F Iran might be liberated after this election

Trump's destroying it

Issue #1,2,3,4,5 is enemies both foreign and domestic in our elections

Be prepared for martial law



Who is the "we" making all that oil money? It's not your average American, who is contributing to the insane profits the oil companies are making from the high cost of oil and gas.
5Amp
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oldyeller said:

Daddy said:

For you dummies

Everything is going to according to plan

A Iran has no Nuke
B we are making 100s of billions selling our oil
C no Americans are dying
D chiba gas station Iran is closed and so is Venezuela
E we control the energy of western hemisphere but more importantly the world
F Iran might be liberated after this election

Trump's destroying it

Issue #1,2,3,4,5 is enemies both foreign and domestic in our elections

Be prepared for martial law



Who is the "we" making all that oil money? It's not your average American, who is contributing to the insane profits the oil companies are making from the high cost of oil and gas.

Oil companies are publicly owned companies. You buy their stocks, you make money. You trade oil, you make money.

said oil companies pay billions in taxes. The biggest share holder in the sale of a gallon of gas is the government. Government build roads, upgrades airports, etc with these revenues.

Oil comes from drilling which democrats don't like, nor do they like refineries. They make it difficult and costly to drill and refine with regulations.

HTH
Ramdiesel
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txyaloo said:

Ag with kids said:

Dobro Turtlebane said:

Towns03 said:

Iran action was necessary. It wasn't a miscalculation, like it was optional.

Someone pointed out that in addition to the very real threat that they nearly had a functioning bomb, this, and Venezuela, are part of a dampening campaign against China.

Iran and Venezuela were primary fuel/oil sources for China. Taking control of them is a strategic play to reduce Chin's ability to move against Taiwan.

most people haven't heard that messaging, or don't care. Trump decided the move couldn't be delayed any more. And the enemy within took the opportunity to stir up domestic dissent for their gain.


US intelligence said Iran was nowhere near turning their not-enriched-enough uranium into a bomb. There is a huge gap between enriched uranium and a functional bomb. Why do you think they were %93nearly%94 there? Even Trump said their nuclear capabilities were destroyed permanently in Midnight Hammer. Other sycophantic posters have said this month that Iran was never about nukes, why are your facts better?

Aside from their ability to build a bomb, Iran had no vehicle capable of reaching Europe, much less the US. There was precisely zero evidence that Iran was anywhere close to being a strategic threat to the US, nuclear or conventional

They almost hit Diego Garcia. That's enough range to hit Europe.

How is that our problem? That's Europe's problem. They're the ones who have cut their defense budgets for years to fund social programs. They can reap what they have sewn. They don't care about the US, our culture, or our way of life. We've saved them twice in world wars that they didn't learn any lessons from.

They have all hindered the attacks on Iran. They haven't been part of a coalition. They just flipped us the bird. Why are we wasting our service member's lives and our treasure to protect them?



Who says we were protecting them? They are a lost cause. They will be mostly Islamic countries in 10 years israel might be our most powerful Allie in 10 years. Free Iran from Islamic rule, and they might have become a big Allie as well. Stop the Islamic takeover here first and foremost, though, that is where the Republicans have failed. Should have deported them in droves in the battleground states.. Should have been a priority..

I think as others have stated, Iran and Venezuela was as much about hurting China as it was about keeping Iran from getting a functional nuke. China was truly killing us economically, and mostly because they get way cheaper oil, basically seized oil because these countries are in debt to them. Plus China could have been planning a take over of Taiwan and all the chip manufacturing there. We cannot allow the dollar to fail and allow BRICS to become the world reserve currency. That would turn us into a third world country.. There's many reasons to try to stop China's progress. We need to bring some manufacturing back here, etc the list goes on and on. They are a huge and real threat.
Bucketrunner
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YouBet said:

I've had same Exit Plan for months:

1. Make Pickaxe Mountain uninhabitable for humans.
2. Bomb the other sites again one more time for good measure.
3. Destroy Kharg Island.

Leave.
Ag with kids
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txyaloo said:

Ag with kids said:

Dobro Turtlebane said:

Towns03 said:

Iran action was necessary. It wasn't a miscalculation, like it was optional.

Someone pointed out that in addition to the very real threat that they nearly had a functioning bomb, this, and Venezuela, are part of a dampening campaign against China.

Iran and Venezuela were primary fuel/oil sources for China. Taking control of them is a strategic play to reduce Chin's ability to move against Taiwan.

most people haven't heard that messaging, or don't care. Trump decided the move couldn't be delayed any more. And the enemy within took the opportunity to stir up domestic dissent for their gain.


US intelligence said Iran was nowhere near turning their not-enriched-enough uranium into a bomb. There is a huge gap between enriched uranium and a functional bomb. Why do you think they were %93nearly%94 there? Even Trump said their nuclear capabilities were destroyed permanently in Midnight Hammer. Other sycophantic posters have said this month that Iran was never about nukes, why are your facts better?

Aside from their ability to build a bomb, Iran had no vehicle capable of reaching Europe, much less the US. There was precisely zero evidence that Iran was anywhere close to being a strategic threat to the US, nuclear or conventional

They almost hit Diego Garcia. That's enough range to hit Europe.

How is that our problem? That's Europe's problem. They're the ones who have cut their defense budgets for years to fund social programs. They can reap what they have sewn. They don't care about the US, our culture, or our way of life. We've saved them twice in world wars that they didn't learn any lessons from.

They have all hindered the attacks on Iran. They haven't been part of a coalition. They just flipped us the bird. Why are we wasting our service member's lives and our treasure to protect them?


We're part of NATO. An attack on one is an attack on all.

Or are you supporting Trump's supposition that we should just let NATO suck it?

But, I was just responding to his point because he was 100% incorrect in his premise.
You can turn off signatures, btw
Danny Vermin
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Use Black Ops teams and start ending evey terrorist in the US with ties to Iran starting with Mamdami and El-Sayed. They know about most of them more than likely. Trump has nothing to lose at this point.
Republicans may not fix all your problems but you can be damn sure Democrats cause ALL of them.
TexAgs23
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You need to arm their people and let them fight the IRGC.
Funky Winkerbean
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It will never end. Islam will not stop in its quest to control the world.
ts5641
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Whatever it is it needs to be fast.
ts5641
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Funky Winkerbean said:

It will never end. Islam will not stop in its quest to control the world.

This is true. They will win and be completely aided to their power from the courtesy of the left. Then the lefties will be the first people they turn on. Submit or die.
Burpelson
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I do not see POTUS doing anything with Iran at this point, he will leave it for the next guy.
Funky Winkerbean
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Burpelson said:

I do not see POTUS doing anything with Iran at this point, he will leave it for the next guy.

That's been our strategy for 50 years. I believe Trump wants to finish it, but the American people can't stomach it as usual.
AGHouston11
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Everyone has their strong opinions based on what? Information received from the media and this administration. How does anyone even trust what they know about the actual situation?

For example we were told months ago that Iran would basically collapse any day economically.

Dobro Turtlebane
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Ag with kids said:

txyaloo said:

Ag with kids said:

Dobro Turtlebane said:

Towns03 said:

Iran action was necessary. It wasn't a miscalculation, like it was optional.

Someone pointed out that in addition to the very real threat that they nearly had a functioning bomb, this, and Venezuela, are part of a dampening campaign against China.

Iran and Venezuela were primary fuel/oil sources for China. Taking control of them is a strategic play to reduce Chin's ability to move against Taiwan.

most people haven't heard that messaging, or don't care. Trump decided the move couldn't be delayed any more. And the enemy within took the opportunity to stir up domestic dissent for their gain.


US intelligence said Iran was nowhere near turning their not-enriched-enough uranium into a bomb. There is a huge gap between enriched uranium and a functional bomb. Why do you think they were %93nearly%94 there? Even Trump said their nuclear capabilities were destroyed permanently in Midnight Hammer. Other sycophantic posters have said this month that Iran was never about nukes, why are your facts better?

Aside from their ability to build a bomb, Iran had no vehicle capable of reaching Europe, much less the US. There was precisely zero evidence that Iran was anywhere close to being a strategic threat to the US, nuclear or conventional

They almost hit Diego Garcia. That's enough range to hit Europe.

How is that our problem? That's Europe's problem. They're the ones who have cut their defense budgets for years to fund social programs. They can reap what they have sewn. They don't care about the US, our culture, or our way of life. We've saved them twice in world wars that they didn't learn any lessons from.

They have all hindered the attacks on Iran. They haven't been part of a coalition. They just flipped us the bird. Why are we wasting our service member's lives and our treasure to protect them?


We're part of NATO. An attack on one is an attack on all.

Or are you supporting Trump's supposition that we should just let NATO suck it?

But, I was just responding to his point because he was 100% incorrect in his premise.


Unsurprisingly, in your rush to defend the honor of Glorious Leader you've overestimated your military knowledge. One, "almost hit" is not hitting. Two, I said Iran didn't have a nuclear capable delivery system. I'm sure you're aware, given your deep expertise, that there is a huge difference between conventional capable and nuclear capable
Funky Winkerbean
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AGHouston11 said:

Everyone has their strong opinions based on what? Information received from the media and this administration. How does anyone even trust what they know about the actual situation?

For example we were told months ago that Iran would basically collapse any day economically.



Look at the value of the currency..
neil88
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txyaloo said:

Ag with kids said:

Dobro Turtlebane said:

Towns03 said:

Iran action was necessary. It wasn't a miscalculation, like it was optional.

Someone pointed out that in addition to the very real threat that they nearly had a functioning bomb, this, and Venezuela, are part of a dampening campaign against China.

Iran and Venezuela were primary fuel/oil sources for China. Taking control of them is a strategic play to reduce Chin's ability to move against Taiwan.

most people haven't heard that messaging, or don't care. Trump decided the move couldn't be delayed any more. And the enemy within took the opportunity to stir up domestic dissent for their gain.


US intelligence said Iran was nowhere near turning their not-enriched-enough uranium into a bomb. There is a huge gap between enriched uranium and a functional bomb. Why do you think they were %93nearly%94 there? Even Trump said their nuclear capabilities were destroyed permanently in Midnight Hammer. Other sycophantic posters have said this month that Iran was never about nukes, why are your facts better?

Aside from their ability to build a bomb, Iran had no vehicle capable of reaching Europe, much less the US. There was precisely zero evidence that Iran was anywhere close to being a strategic threat to the US, nuclear or conventional

They almost hit Diego Garcia. That's enough range to hit Europe.

How is that our problem? That's Europe's problem. They're the ones who have cut their defense budgets for years to fund social programs. They can reap what they have sewn. They don't care about the US, our culture, or our way of life. We've saved them twice in world wars that they didn't learn any lessons from.

They have all hindered the attacks on Iran. They haven't been part of a coalition. They just flipped us the bird. Why are we wasting our service member's lives and our treasure to protect them?



We position forces via Diego Garcia. That's why it's our problem.
MouthBQ98
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If we maintain the blockade and do nothing else, they will eventally will submit to a favorable negotiation or fall into counter revolution at some point. I am not opposed to that solution, but it does require patience.
benchmark
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YouBet said:

I've had same Exit Plan for months:

1. Make Pickaxe Mountain uninhabitable for humans.
2. Bomb the other sites again one more time for good measure.
3. Destroy Kharg Island.

Leave.

One important detail. If we leave, who protects the southern Omani shipping passage? The entire sucess of the southern route is almost entirely dependant on carrier-based aircraft.
YouBet
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benchmark said:

YouBet said:

I've had same Exit Plan for months:

1. Make Pickaxe Mountain uninhabitable for humans.
2. Bomb the other sites again one more time for good measure.
3. Destroy Kharg Island.

Leave.

One important detail. If we leave, who protects the southern Omani shipping passage? The entire sucess of the southern route is almost entirely dependant on carrier-based aircraft.


If you take out Kharg Island, they are going to devolve into a failed state and won't have the energy or resources to mess with the strait other than some pirate level action. Keep an eye in the sky over it and a couple of boats and move on.
oldyeller
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5Amp said:

oldyeller said:

Daddy said:

For you dummies

Everything is going to according to plan

A Iran has no Nuke
B we are making 100s of billions selling our oil
C no Americans are dying
D chiba gas station Iran is closed and so is Venezuela
E we control the energy of western hemisphere but more importantly the world
F Iran might be liberated after this election

Trump's destroying it

Issue #1,2,3,4,5 is enemies both foreign and domestic in our elections

Be prepared for martial law



Who is the "we" making all that oil money? It's not your average American, who is contributing to the insane profits the oil companies are making from the high cost of oil and gas.

Oil companies are publicly owned companies. You buy their stocks, you make money. You trade oil, you make money.

said oil companies pay billions in taxes. The biggest share holder in the sale of a gallon of gas is the government. Government build roads, upgrades airports, etc with these revenues.

Oil comes from drilling which democrats don't like, nor do they like refineries. They make it difficult and costly to drill and refine with regulations.

HTH


Fair enough, but the vast majority of voters don't see that impact on their daily concerns, and when there is talk of suspending taxes to ease prices at the pump you negate the positive general impact, shifting the bulk of the benefit to those with are raking in record profits because of the war's impact on oil flow and refining capacity that is pushing up the prices.

The wars impact on fuel prices may be seen as simply another Trump tariff that may be generating more government revenue, but comes at making life more challenging for everyday consumers.
 
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