DeSantis calls for abolition of all property taxes

7,005 Views | 164 Replies | Last: 4 mo ago by shiftyandquick
SociallyConditionedAg
How long do you want to ignore this user?
twk said:

Three pages in, and none of the people claiming that we can easily abolish property taxes and replace them with consumption taxes have even touched on the largest problem with this concept, and that is the sales tax is collected at the point of sale, not the residence of the purchaser. If you live in a district outside an urban center, your sales tax for purchasing cars, appliances, and basically anything of value goes to a jurisdiction other than the one where you live. Even if you live in a urban area, retail activity tends to be higher in some suburbs than others.

If we went with a consumption tax, we'd have to have the state collect the tax, and parcel the money out based on population rather than where the sales occur, or else we would be replacing a system which pretty effectively spreads tax out over the entire state with one which concentrates it in a few jurisdictions.

An income tax would be slightly better than a consumption tax at handling this, but who knows how that would play out. We do, however, know exactly how that would play out with an increased sales tax, and it would require an end to local control over local government, because if the state collects it and doles it out, then the state will control exactly how it is spent.

That doesn't bother me at all. My local officials are just as corrupt as state officials. Property tax is unjust; it's time to end it.
HalifaxAg
How long do you want to ignore this user?
shiftyandquick said:

rgag12 said:

Sounds great on paper. Just know there will be big trade-offs. Either a big increase in other taxes, or cutting of services that've always been taken for granted.

Plus, there will always be significant unintended consequences nobody thinks about.

the existence of property taxes helps drive the actual use of property, towards its highest/best financial use.

However if people can just sit on properties, there can be much more in the way of unused property, unmaintained empty buildings. It will cost much less to speculate on properties and hold onto them.

Oh well, I guess eventually we will be in the "find out" stage about that.

Although who among us doesn't in theory like the idea of not having to pay rent to the state for our primary house that we own?

I very much support the idea of more undeveloped property in our state...pass some laws that require unused buildings to be razed and returned to a natural state after what 10 years of being unoccupied?

I think we could all get behind that
El Gallo Blanco
How long do you want to ignore this user?
txwxman said:

El Gallo Blanco said:

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

They'll just end up paying a different tax.

Give me consumption tax over someone NEVER being able to own the home that they broke their backs to be able to buy.

Seriously...everyone on this forum with a mortgage is technically a renter. NONE OF US OWN OUR HOMES. That is effed up and highly immoral.

If someone chose to break their back to own a home, that sounds like maybe they could have made a better life choice.


My point is that many people sacrifice immensely and work their asses off to afford a decent quality of life for their families. You sound like a nit picky little liberal Karen busybody. Go play games on the degen board with the other liberal male feminists.
Deerdude
How long do you want to ignore this user?
twk said:

one safe place said:

twk said:

Who?mikejones! said:

Funding things like schools would have to change, but that doesn't mean itd be impossible.

Not impossible, but not as simple as "make localities compete for business and the resulting sales taxes." Again, the only way to do sales tax as a substitute is to make it a statewide tax, distributed by the state, on some basis other than where it was collected.

Correct. A statewide sales tax rate higher than we currently have (I wish it would apply to all purchases, no exemptions) and then remitted to cities, towns, etc.

The ironic thing about this is that the state would have to assume local bond debt if they are going to eliminate the revenue stream pledged to secure those bonds which means that those who live in fiscally responsible school districts would now be saddled with debt issue by other districts for gold plated facilities, and would the have to go hat in hand to Austin begging for money for their necessary facilities.


Kinda sounds like the current Robin Hood plan.
ts5641
How long do you want to ignore this user?
The dude gets it.
ts5641
How long do you want to ignore this user?
rgag12 said:

Sounds great on paper. Just know there will be big trade-offs. Either a big increase in other taxes, or cutting of services that've always been taken for granted.

Plus, there will always be significant unintended consequences nobody thinks about.

And people will have significantly more money in their pocket to spend and invest and stimulate the economy.
JJxvi
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Property taxes pay for things that are local. What mechanism are yall proposing to decide who pays and how much money those local services get budgeted? Does Greg Abbott now decide how much money from taxes in Dallas in Houston get sent to pay for county services in Fayette County TX? Does the legislature have to appropriate a budget for every entity in the state directly? Does tax remain local, but the only WalMart in a county has to have a 30% sales tax rate to fund the whole county, before it inevitably shuts down? How does it work?
stallion6
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Tea Party said:

Less taxes is almost always the right way to go.

Government spending is out of control and reducing it is logical, as long as our populace can go back to personal responsibility and quit relying on the nanny state to take care of them.

Including your local school districts. Most have little effort at all to be efficient. Then they turn and ask for an additional bond because they cannot manage their budgets.
stallion6
How long do you want to ignore this user?
caleblyn said:

I am 1000% for...

  • Paying property taxes. Too may people think that being free means that you shouldn't pay anything!
  • Paying property taxes allows you to vote on local taxes. Remove Homestead! If you own a home the USA, you pay taxes. If you do not pay taxes, you do not have a vote to increase or decrease taxes!


Everyone gets to vote. Not just those paying taxes. Not following your logic.
YouBet
How long do you want to ignore this user?
stallion6 said:

caleblyn said:

I am 1000% for...

  • Paying property taxes. Too may people think that being free means that you shouldn't pay anything!
  • Paying property taxes allows you to vote on local taxes. Remove Homestead! If you own a home the USA, you pay taxes. If you do not pay taxes, you do not have a vote to increase or decrease taxes!


Everyone gets to vote. Not just those paying taxes. Not following your logic.


He's saying that everyone should not get to vote and they shouldn't. If you don't have any skin in the game, then you shouldn't get to vote.

It's one of the main reasons we are $37T in debt and why democracies ultimately fail.
shiftyandquick
How long do you want to ignore this user?
If there are no property taxes in Texas, investments in rental homes will skyrocket. As the rate of return of such an investment becomes much better.

Yes, we will "Find Out." In such a case.
YouBet
How long do you want to ignore this user?
JJxvi said:

Property taxes pay for things that are local. What mechanism are yall proposing to decide who pays and how much money those local services get budgeted? Does Greg Abbott now decide how much money from taxes in Dallas in Houston get sent to pay for county services in Fayette County TX? Does the legislature have to appropriate a budget for every entity in the state directly? Does tax remain local, but the only WalMart in a county has to have a 30% sales tax rate to fund the whole county, before it inevitably shuts down? How does it work?


This is the crux of the matter and why dissolving property taxes won't happen in Texas. 50% of property taxes fund public schools. Think about the absolute drama and gnashing of teeth that vouchers caused with both parties and now go tell everyone we are going to do away with property taxes that 100% fund schools with some other method.

lol at that. Never happen.
Science Denier
How long do you want to ignore this user?
twk said:

VKingofHazor said:

twk said:

KingofHazor said:

Or, that might make localities compete for business and the resulting sales taxes. It would be a free market system for government.

Really? That's your response? How exactly does some rural school district "compete" to get car dealerships to set up shop in their area?

The amount of wishcasting necessary to support the claim that we can effortlessly substitute sales tax for property tax is staggering.

I'm not making that claim at all. My claim is that government can do a more than adequate job without property taxes. It would force them to be more efficient, and would keep school districts from building new Taj Majals every ten years.

Property taxes are the only taxes collected by school districts. Saying schools can get by without that revenue stream is just moronic, unless you are going to come up with some other revenue stream to replace it. Everyone wants something for nothing, but that doesn't exist

A state funding for schools over local funding would be a solution. Probably would not be favored by local districts that love to push crap thru bond voting where they can control the vote very well. Getting that stadium "approved" by the state vs "approved" by local bond votes would put a severe hamper on their kingdom building.

That said, I remember what Jackie had to go thru to get "coordinating board" approval for his projects. For damn near 30 years, I had to cram my fat ass into very narrow seats because they would not approve his stadium expansion, that had exactly $0.00 funds from the state.
LOL OLD
SociallyConditionedAg
How long do you want to ignore this user?
JJxvi said:

Property taxes pay for things that are local. What mechanism are yall proposing to decide who pays and how much money those local services get budgeted? Does Greg Abbott now decide how much money from taxes in Dallas in Houston get sent to pay for county services in Fayette County TX? Does the legislature have to appropriate a budget for every entity in the state directly? Does tax remain local, but the only WalMart in a county has to have a 30% sales tax rate to fund the whole county, before it inevitably shuts down? How does it work?

Sales taxes will replace it. Property taxes are immoral and local politicians use them to control us. They need to be taken down a notch.
Who?mikejones!
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Id love nothing more than to force cities like Austin to cut all the bull**** and only fund the things thay cities should.

If they were got their 2% of the sales tax receipts and then we alloted some population based percentage of the total, it would force them and every other tyrannical city govt to cut the superfluous crap outta their budgets. Things like painting blm on the streets, or the lavish ****ijg parties they throw for themselves, or a bunch of other stupid, divisive things.

Deerdude
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Who?mikejones! said:

Id love nothing more than to force cities like Austin to cut all the bull**** and only fund the things thay cities should.

If they were got their 2% of the sales tax receipts and then we alloted some population based percentage of the total, it would force them and every other tyrannical city govt to cut the superfluous crap outta their budgets. Things like painting blm on the streets, or the lavish ****ijg parties they throw for themselves, or a bunch of other stupid, divisive things.




But then how would you entertain the minions?
Hagen95
How long do you want to ignore this user?
But they won't cut those things. They're paltry in the budget world. They'll cut things like all parks/rec services, scale back trash collection, and street maintenance budgets. The state has nixed cutting police budgets so the other departments will get the axe.
Burpelson
How long do you want to ignore this user?
People would support a property tax system IF you did not have lazy ass politicians that do not want to do the real job governing, battling waste, battling abuse, battling a bloated budget. What we have are lazy ass politicians/ school admi that only see the solution: RAISE PROPERTY TAX
twk
How long do you want to ignore this user?
SociallyConditionedAg said:

JJxvi said:

Property taxes pay for things that are local. What mechanism are yall proposing to decide who pays and how much money those local services get budgeted? Does Greg Abbott now decide how much money from taxes in Dallas in Houston get sent to pay for county services in Fayette County TX? Does the legislature have to appropriate a budget for every entity in the state directly? Does tax remain local, but the only WalMart in a county has to have a 30% sales tax rate to fund the whole county, before it inevitably shuts down? How does it work?

Sales taxes will replace it. Property taxes are immoral and local politicians use them to control us. They need to be taken down a notch.

Go ahead and ignore it if you want, but this has been discussed many times. There are many school districts that would collect virtually zero sales taxes because their residents have nowhere to shop in the district. Having a local sales tax will not adequately replace property taxes anywhere but fantasyland. Your choice is between local property taxes, and having the state collect sales taxes, then parcel out 100% of school funding (and basically taking over running schools).
Ag_SGT
How long do you want to ignore this user?
KingofHazor said:



All states should do the same. The RHINO excuses in Austin are thin and weak.

Good to hear, part of the reason I left Florida was the property taxes
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." Ben Franklin
Rossticus
How long do you want to ignore this user?
shiftyandquick said:

If there are no property taxes in Texas, investments in rental homes will skyrocket. As the rate of return of such an investment becomes much better.

Yes, we will "Find Out." In such a case.


No. Step 1: Eliminate homestead property taxes and augment that loss of revenue with increased sales/consumption taxes. As a result you encourage home ownership vs rental and avoid the scenario you've highlighted. Investment and corporate real estate remains taxed. After implementation of Step 1 we can see if it makes sense to consider reducing certain other property taxes or not (but not wholly eliminating them).
Martin Cash
How long do you want to ignore this user?
SociallyConditionedAg said:

JJxvi said:

Property taxes pay for things that are local. What mechanism are yall proposing to decide who pays and how much money those local services get budgeted? Does Greg Abbott now decide how much money from taxes in Dallas in Houston get sent to pay for county services in Fayette County TX? Does the legislature have to appropriate a budget for every entity in the state directly? Does tax remain local, but the only WalMart in a county has to have a 30% sales tax rate to fund the whole county, before it inevitably shuts down? How does it work?

Sales taxes will replace it. Property taxes are immoral and local politicians use them to control us. They need to be taken down a notch.

A tax cannot be 'immoral.' That's is a ridiculous assertion. You may not like it, but it isn't immoral.

Suddenly, the people who usually scream in support of local control now want to turn over the financing of all our local government to the legislature in Austin? BRILLIANT!
Science Denier
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Rossticus said:

shiftyandquick said:

If there are no property taxes in Texas, investments in rental homes will skyrocket. As the rate of return of such an investment becomes much better.

Yes, we will "Find Out." In such a case.


No. Step 1: Eliminate homestead property taxes and augment that loss of revenue with increased sales/consumption taxes. As a result you encourage home ownership vs rental and avoid the scenario you've highlighted. Investment and corporate real estate remains taxed. After implementation of Step 1 we can see if it makes sense to consider reducing certain other property taxes or not (but not wholly eliminating them).

LMAO.

Media:
REEEEEEEEEEEEEE THAT IS RACIST!!! MAKING THE POOR MINORITIES PAY PROPERTY TAX WHEN RICH WHITY THAT OWNS HIS OWN HOME DOESN'T HAVE TO PAY!!!!

REEEEEEEEEEE RACISM!!!!!
LOL OLD
Science Denier
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Martin Cash said:

SociallyConditionedAg said:

JJxvi said:

Property taxes pay for things that are local. What mechanism are yall proposing to decide who pays and how much money those local services get budgeted? Does Greg Abbott now decide how much money from taxes in Dallas in Houston get sent to pay for county services in Fayette County TX? Does the legislature have to appropriate a budget for every entity in the state directly? Does tax remain local, but the only WalMart in a county has to have a 30% sales tax rate to fund the whole county, before it inevitably shuts down? How does it work?

Sales taxes will replace it. Property taxes are immoral and local politicians use them to control us. They need to be taken down a notch.

A tax cannot be 'immoral.' That's is a ridiculous assertion. You may not like it, but it isn't immoral.

Suddenly, the people who usually scream in support of local control now want to turn over the financing of all our local government to the legislature in Austin? BRILLIANT!

Actually, having the state collect taxes and partial out on a $/student would not be horrible.

You could break the spread of money into different categories: Very small districts get 20% more than the very large districts as overhead has fewer students to spread the cost over.

I would continue to collect local taxes based on businesses, but exempt rent property. This would give incentives for local jurisdictions to attract businesses.

But, just think how many people that would put out of work. Lots of money is spent collecting local taxes.
LOL OLD
shiftyandquick
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Rossticus said:

shiftyandquick said:

If there are no property taxes in Texas, investments in rental homes will skyrocket. As the rate of return of such an investment becomes much better.

Yes, we will "Find Out." In such a case.


No. Step 1: Eliminate homestead property taxes and augment that loss of revenue with increased sales/consumption taxes. As a result you encourage home ownership vs rental and avoid the scenario you've highlighted. Investment and corporate real estate remains taxed. After implementation of Step 1 we can see if it makes sense to consider reducing certain other property taxes or not (but not wholly eliminating them).

yes, obviously if only a certain segment of the property taxes are rescinded, then that will have much less impact. Already property taxes are reduced on homesteads, with some people I think basically paying nothing.
 
×
subscribe Verify your student status
See Subscription Benefits
Trial only available to users who have never subscribed or participated in a previous trial.