Bill Clinternet said:

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Who?mikejones! said:

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Chatgpt response for chatgpt op


When everything is "literally Kristallnacht," nothing is.

Apparently, we've reached the point where enforcing existing immigration and criminal laws, based on months of investigation, is indistinguishable from the systematic annihilation of an entire people.
Amazing.

No, seriously imagine thinking that serving warrants at a gang-linked nightclub is the harbinger of fascism, while somehow missing the part where the accused have access to attorneys, trials, and appeal rights.
(You know, all those pesky features absent from actual authoritarian regimes.)

In Kristallnacht, Jews were targeted for being Jewish.
In Colorado Springs, people were targeted for allegedly trafficking drugs, weapons, and humans.

If you genuinely can't tell the difference, I don't know what to tell you except that comparing everything you don't like to Nazi Germany doesn't make you sound principled.
It makes you sound historically illiterate and emotionally unserious.

Freedom doesn't die when the government enforces laws against criminal enterprises.
Freedom dies when citizens are too busy hysterically grandstanding to remember what tyranny actually looks like.

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I don't give the time of day to someone cosplaying as a free thinker while outsourcing their arguments to ChatGPT. Come back when you've got an original thought.

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ChatGPT has a pretty good take. Worth responding to if you actually had a response.

I doubt there are a lot of Jewish Americans on this board but it would be interesting to hear their take on numbskulls that compare basic norms of law and order to Nazi Fascism and rounding up felonious criminals as "Kristalnacht". OP should take a tour of the Holocaust Museum. This comparison is shameful.

Bill Clinternet said:

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Who?mikejones! said:

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Chatgpt response for chatgpt op


When everything is "literally Kristallnacht," nothing is.

Apparently, we've reached the point where enforcing existing immigration and criminal laws, based on months of investigation, is indistinguishable from the systematic annihilation of an entire people.
Amazing.

No, seriously imagine thinking that serving warrants at a gang-linked nightclub is the harbinger of fascism, while somehow missing the part where the accused have access to attorneys, trials, and appeal rights.
(You know, all those pesky features absent from actual authoritarian regimes.)

In Kristallnacht, Jews were targeted for being Jewish.
In Colorado Springs, people were targeted for allegedly trafficking drugs, weapons, and humans.

If you genuinely can't tell the difference, I don't know what to tell you except that comparing everything you don't like to Nazi Germany doesn't make you sound principled.
It makes you sound historically illiterate and emotionally unserious.

Freedom doesn't die when the government enforces laws against criminal enterprises.
Freedom dies when citizens are too busy hysterically grandstanding to remember what tyranny actually looks like.

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I don't give the time of day to someone cosplaying as a free thinker while outsourcing their arguments to ChatGPT. Come back when you've got an original thought.

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Just thought I'd respond like for like

Bill Clinternet said:

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If quoting a 90s centrist speech about bureaucratic enforcement justifies modern militarized raids on nightclubs, mass detentions without due process, and ICE targeting vulnerable communities, you've missed the point and the plot.
Enforcing laws isn't inherently evil but how you do it, who you target, and whether you weaponize it to terrorize marginalized groups is the difference between a republic and a regime.

You're not defending law and order. You're sanitizing state cruelty by laundering it through bipartisan nostalgia.

But hey, I'm just Bill Clinternet. I know a deflection when I see one.

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Modern militarized raids. I mean, did you miss the part where security was provided for by ARMED, active-duty US military personnel? Not the raid, the "club"'s security consisted of this.

Also, if you get caught doing illegal **** with a bunch of other people doing illegal ****, then there is a "mass detention".

There is due process. And in fact, the reporting confirms those not committing crimes and here legally were NOT detained.

The vulnerable communities nonsense is just that and just adds to the factual errors pointed out above.

Bill Clinternet said:

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richardag said:

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Bill Clinternet said:

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If your only response is sarcasm, you're basically admitting you don't have a real argument. No one said enforcing laws is automatically tyranny…the concern is when enforcement turns into public intimidation campaigns against vulnerable groups. That's not hyperbole; it's how authoritarian systems historically consolidate power, slowly and selectively.
If you think mocking history lessons is a substitute for critical thinking, that's your choice.
Otherwise, if you have anything substantive to add, an actual defense of mass roundups with minimal due process…I'm listening.

---

quotes from the article:

• The DEA and other agencies had been monitoring the nightclub for "a number of months," according to Pullen.
• During the surveillance, investigators documented drug trafficking, prostitution and the presence of people suspected to be members of the Venezuelan gang Tren de Aragua, the international gang MS-13, and the Hells Angels,
• Authorities found drugs at the club, including cocaine and pink cocaine, also known as "tusi,"
• I had agents out there two weeks ago, and these idiots showing up at this club were driving around shooting our guns off out of the car windows.
• Those believed to be in the US illegally were taken into custody by Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Pullen said. "200 people were inside at least 114 in the US illegally,"
• The active-duty service members were handed over to the US Army Criminal Investigation Division

This is not what you are describing and has no similarities with Kristallnacht or the Night of Broken Glass.

I can only believe you did not read the article nor have any knowledge of what Kristallnacht or the Night of Broken Glas entailed.

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You clearly didn't read the article or grasp the point.

Kristallnacht wasn't about broken windows; it was about state power being used to round up a targeted group under the pretense of public safety.

This raid involved over a dozen agencies, mass detentions, and vague claims of gangs and drugs but no due process, no names, just 114 people grabbed for being "here illegally." That's collective punishment, not justice.
The logic is the same: criminalize the vulnerable, justify the crackdown, and pretend it's law and order. It always starts this way.
So don't lecture me on history you clearly don't understand.

---

I cannot believe you are doubling-down on this.

The "targeted group" at the nightclub in Colorado were criminals engaged in criminal activity that had been established before the raid ever took place by law enforcement who obtained a legally-issued warrant to conduct the raid legally.

Your equating it to what happened to innocent Jews in Nazi Germany is dishonest and a disgusting perversion of history.

You forget that we all watched leftist mobs burn cities not too long ago and for law-abiding citizens, the signal sent was that criminals will not be punished and you are on your own as a citizen.

Nothing says "vulnerable" like gang neck tats, Glock switches, and coke, while operating an illegal nightclub in plain sight, guarded by armed US military personnel, and freely discharging firearms in the street.

So vulnerable.


Vulnerable community, 1930's


Vulnerable community, 2020's

Tramp96 said:

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Bill Clinternet said:

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richardag said:

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Bill Clinternet said:

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If your only response is sarcasm, you're basically admitting you don't have a real argument. No one said enforcing laws is automatically tyranny…the concern is when enforcement turns into public intimidation campaigns against vulnerable groups. That's not hyperbole; it's how authoritarian systems historically consolidate power, slowly and selectively.
If you think mocking history lessons is a substitute for critical thinking, that's your choice.
Otherwise, if you have anything substantive to add, an actual defense of mass roundups with minimal due process…I'm listening.

---

quotes from the article:

• The DEA and other agencies had been monitoring the nightclub for "a number of months," according to Pullen.
• During the surveillance, investigators documented drug trafficking, prostitution and the presence of people suspected to be members of the Venezuelan gang Tren de Aragua, the international gang MS-13, and the Hells Angels,
• Authorities found drugs at the club, including cocaine and pink cocaine, also known as "tusi,"
• I had agents out there two weeks ago, and these idiots showing up at this club were driving around shooting our guns off out of the car windows.
• Those believed to be in the US illegally were taken into custody by Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Pullen said. "200 people were inside at least 114 in the US illegally,"
• The active-duty service members were handed over to the US Army Criminal Investigation Division

This is not what you are describing and has no similarities with Kristallnacht or the Night of Broken Glass.

I can only believe you did not read the article nor have any knowledge of what Kristallnacht or the Night of Broken Glas entailed.

---

You clearly didn't read the article or grasp the point.

Kristallnacht wasn't about broken windows; it was about state power being used to round up a targeted group under the pretense of public safety.

This raid involved over a dozen agencies, mass detentions, and vague claims of gangs and drugs but no due process, no names, just 114 people grabbed for being "here illegally." That's collective punishment, not justice.
The logic is the same: criminalize the vulnerable, justify the crackdown, and pretend it's law and order. It always starts this way.
So don't lecture me on history you clearly don't understand.

---

I cannot believe you are doubling-down on this.

The "targeted group" at the nightclub in Colorado were criminals engaged in criminal activity that had been established before the raid ever took place by law enforcement who obtained a legally-issued warrant to conduct the raid legally.

Your equating it to what happened to innocent Jews in Nazi Germany is dishonest and a disgusting perversion of history.

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And the OP conveniently neglects the fact that this nightclub was targeted due to ongoing felony offenses. ICE was brought in only because there were known illegal allies participating in these felonies.

Quote:

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In 1938, Kristallnacht wasn't just about broken windows….it was about the government using law enforcement and mobs to signal that an entire group of people no longer had protection under the law. It was the moment the Nazis moved from harassment to state-sanctioned terror.

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Illegals are rounded up in mass and deported because they are illegal by the laws our citizens put in place.


Nazis rounded up and murdered Jews in mass because of their faith.

I can see how the two can be confused.

Good Lord, OP can't be serious.

Urban Ag said:

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Nothing says "vulnerable" like gang neck tats, Glock switches, and coke, while operating an illegal nightclub in plain sight, guarded by armed US military personnel, and freely discharging firearms in the street.

So vulnerable.


Vulnerable community, 1930's


Vulnerable community, 2020's

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It's amazing how throwing a gang sign immediately makes one look 40 IQ points dumber

4 said:

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It's amazing how throwing a gang sign immediately makes one look 40 IQ points dumber

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Gang signs, facial tats, post like this.......https://texags.com/forums/16/topics/3540359/1

Every raid targets a group of people and law enforcement has been doing this forever. This has to be the most desperate OP of the year and reeks of misplaced concern at best and flat out dishonesty at worst.

Watching people completely exaggerate and outright fabricate BS about what trump is doing calls into question the narratives surrounding "muh nazis".

Bill Clinternet said:

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richardag said:

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Bill Clinternet said:

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If your only response is sarcasm, you're basically admitting you don't have a real argument. No one said enforcing laws is automatically tyranny…the concern is when enforcement turns into public intimidation campaigns against vulnerable groups. That's not hyperbole; it's how authoritarian systems historically consolidate power, slowly and selectively.
If you think mocking history lessons is a substitute for critical thinking, that's your choice.
Otherwise, if you have anything substantive to add, an actual defense of mass roundups with minimal due process…I'm listening.

---

quotes from the article:

• The DEA and other agencies had been monitoring the nightclub for "a number of months," according to Pullen.
• During the surveillance, investigators documented drug trafficking, prostitution and the presence of people suspected to be members of the Venezuelan gang Tren de Aragua, the international gang MS-13, and the Hells Angels,
• Authorities found drugs at the club, including cocaine and pink cocaine, also known as "tusi,"
• I had agents out there two weeks ago, and these idiots showing up at this club were driving around shooting our guns off out of the car windows.
• Those believed to be in the US illegally were taken into custody by Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Pullen said. "200 people were inside at least 114 in the US illegally,"
• The active-duty service members were handed over to the US Army Criminal Investigation Division

This is not what you are describing and has no similarities with Kristallnacht or the Night of Broken Glass.

I can only believe you did not read the article nor have any knowledge of what Kristallnacht or the Night of Broken Glas entailed.

---

You clearly didn't read the article or grasp the point.

Kristallnacht wasn't about broken windows; it was about state power being used to round up a targeted group under the pretense of public safety.

This raid involved over a dozen agencies, mass detentions, and vague claims of gangs and drugs but no due process, no names, just 114 people grabbed for being "here illegally." That's collective punishment, not justice.
The logic is the same: criminalize the vulnerable, justify the crackdown, and pretend it's law and order. It always starts this way.
So don't lecture me on history you clearly don't understand.

---

For fear of piling on, I don't think you understand how law enforcement works. Did you miss the part of the article where it is stated they've been observing illegal activities at this underground bar for months? Also, I don't think due process works before you get arrested. I think that comes into play after arrest. How would that even work? Hey, we're gonna arrest you but you can get a lawyer and appeal before we do. That's about as dumb as your OP.

You got your ass handed to you today. Take your lumps and think it through more thoroughly next time. I could say say alot more but it's mostly been said already.

Cristal nacht?




Oh and Bill, your argument is inane, people aren't terrorizing illegals. But nice gaslight trying equate law enforcement into brown shirts. That will bring the temperature down and help generate productive conversations.

it's great that obvious trolls get 6+ pages of responses to their outrageously ritaarded takes. A+

Bill Clinternet said:

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richardag said:

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Prosperdick said:

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Bill Clinternet said:

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BadMoonRisin said:

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Bill Clinternet said:

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Ag87H2O said:

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Bill Clinternet said:

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No one disputes that laws can be enforced. The concern is how enforcement is used and when raids become public spectacles designed to intimidate rather than uphold due process, it stops being about justice and starts being about control. History shows us that once enforcement becomes selective and theatrical, the rule of law itself starts to erode…quietly, and often with popular approval at first

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How else would you have them enforce the law? Send them a nice letter and let them know what time law enforcement was going to show up so they could be ready for it? Good grief.

It becomes public when the press finds out and reports it. It happens thousands of times a day in practically every big city in the country.

Part of the reason laws are enforced is precisely to send a signal and strike fear that a particular activity or behavior is unacceptable and will not be tolerated. Nothing wrong with that.

The premise of this thread is one of the most idiotic takes I've ever seen on F16, and that's saying something.

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Ah yes, because historically, nothing bad has ever happened when governments use fear to "send signals" to targeted groups. That's why Kristallnacht started exactly the same way using legal pretexts to publicly terrorize a minority group and "enforce the law."
It wasn't about letters. It was about public humiliation, mass intimidation, and making sure everyone else got the message.

You're not defending law enforcement. You're defending the weaponization of fear and that's exactly the tactic every authoritarian regime has used to erode rights under the banner of "order."

You're arguing like someone who learned their civics from a pamphlet, not from history.

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So exactly like COVID and the BLM riots ,fully endorsed by the democrat party?

Look in the mirror.

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I'm not a Democrat, and I'm definitely not a Republican either. I was a Clinton-era centrist when that actually meant something. I'm not playing team sports here. I'm pointing out patterns of government overreach no matter who's in charge.
If your only answer to criticism is "look in the mirror," you're not defending principles. You're just picking a side and hoping nobody notices.

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Go watch one of Bill Clinton's SOU addresses...say 1995 and imagine Trump is speaking the words because you'll find a TON of similarities, especially when it comes to immigration. How does this sound:

Quote:

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Our administration has moved aggressively to secure our borders more by hiring a record number of new border guards, by deporting twice as many criminal aliens as ever before, by cracking down on illegal hiring, by barring welfare benefits to illegal aliens… We are a nation of immigrants. But we are also a nation of laws. It is wrong and ultimately self-defeating for a nation of immigrants to permit the kind of abuse of our immigration laws we have seen in recent years, and we must do more to stop it

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This should have ended this thread

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If quoting a 90s centrist speech about bureaucratic enforcement justifies modern militarized raids on nightclubs, mass detentions without due process, and ICE targeting vulnerable communities, you've missed the point and the plot.
Enforcing laws isn't inherently evil but how you do it, who you target, and whether you weaponize it to terrorize marginalized groups is the difference between a republic and a regime.

You're not defending law and order. You're sanitizing state cruelty by laundering it through bipartisan nostalgia.

But hey, I'm just Bill Clinternet. I know a deflection when I see one.

---

That post is weapons grade word salad idiocy. Good grief!

richardag said:

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Tramp96 said:

---

Bill Clinternet said:

---

richardag said:

---

Bill Clinternet said:

---

If your only response is sarcasm, you're basically admitting you don't have a real argument. No one said enforcing laws is automatically tyranny…the concern is when enforcement turns into public intimidation campaigns against vulnerable groups. That's not hyperbole; it's how authoritarian systems historically consolidate power, slowly and selectively.
If you think mocking history lessons is a substitute for critical thinking, that's your choice.
Otherwise, if you have anything substantive to add, an actual defense of mass roundups with minimal due process…I'm listening.

---

quotes from the article:

• The DEA and other agencies had been monitoring the nightclub for "a number of months," according to Pullen.
• During the surveillance, investigators documented drug trafficking, prostitution and the presence of people suspected to be members of the Venezuelan gang Tren de Aragua, the international gang MS-13, and the Hells Angels,
• Authorities found drugs at the club, including cocaine and pink cocaine, also known as "tusi,"
• I had agents out there two weeks ago, and these idiots showing up at this club were driving around shooting our guns off out of the car windows.
• Those believed to be in the US illegally were taken into custody by Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Pullen said. "200 people were inside at least 114 in the US illegally,"
• The active-duty service members were handed over to the US Army Criminal Investigation Division

This is not what you are describing and has no similarities with Kristallnacht or the Night of Broken Glass.

I can only believe you did not read the article nor have any knowledge of what Kristallnacht or the Night of Broken Glas entailed.

---

You clearly didn't read the article or grasp the point.

Kristallnacht wasn't about broken windows; it was about state power being used to round up a targeted group under the pretense of public safety.

This raid involved over a dozen agencies, mass detentions, and vague claims of gangs and drugs but no due process, no names, just 114 people grabbed for being "here illegally." That's collective punishment, not justice.
The logic is the same: criminalize the vulnerable, justify the crackdown, and pretend it's law and order. It always starts this way.
So don't lecture me on history you clearly don't understand.

---

I cannot believe you are doubling-down on this.

The "targeted group" at the nightclub in Colorado were criminals engaged in criminal activity that had been established before the raid ever took place by law enforcement who obtained a legally-issued warrant to conduct the raid legally.

Your equating it to what happened to innocent Jews in Nazi Germany is dishonest and a disgusting perversion of history.

---

And the OP conveniently neglects the fact that this nightclub was targeted due to ongoing felony offenses. ICE was brought in only because there were known illegal allies participating in these felonies.

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Well, to be fair, the OP conveniently neglects A LOT of facts.

It's not about race...it is about citizenship. What part of illegal alien is hard for you to understand?

The eternal refuge of the regime apologist… "they deserved it."

Thank you for bravely stepping forward to remind us that due process and basic human dignity are apparently conditional rights now, selectively handed out based on whatever charges the state feels like whispering that day. How convenient: the presumption of innocence vanishes the moment it becomes politically useful for you.

You clutch at the excuse that some people may have committed crimes, so naturally the proper response is mass raids, indiscriminate targeting, and rounding up anyone "associated" like we're reenacting the worst chapters of authoritarian history, but with more hashtags. You aren't defending justice; you're defending collective punishment under the flimsiest of justifications.

ICE wasn't storming a fortified cartel bunker. They raided a nightclub, terrorized civilians, and treated vulnerability as guilt. But you, proud defender of whatever the badge commands, call it noble because someone somewhere might have deserved it. Congratulations? You're the ideological heir to every petty tyrant who ever excused brutality by claiming the wrong people were standing too close.

You aren't arguing for law and order. You're arguing for a society where fear replaces law and suspicion replaces rights and you're too intellectually lazy to even realize it.

Bill Clinternet said:

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Before some of you dismiss concerns about the Colorado Springs nightclub raid, you should understand the deeper issue here.

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2025/04/28/us/colorado-springs-raid-monday


In 1938, Kristallnacht wasn't just about broken windows….it was about the government using law enforcement and mobs to signal that an entire group of people no longer had protection under the law. It was the moment the Nazis moved from harassment to state-sanctioned terror.

The victims weren't arrested for committing crimes that day…they were targeted for who they were.

That's the critical parallel.

Now look at Colorado Springs:

Over 100 people detained at once, based heavily on immigration status, in a highly publicized, militarized raid.
Justified broadly under the banner of "gang activity" and "drug trafficking," but not everyone arrested was even charged with any crime.
The spectacle of it…mass roundups tied to a specific group…is designed to intimidate, not just enforce laws.

Yes, governments have the right to enforce immigration laws.
But when enforcement becomes a public show of force against a vulnerable population, without transparent due process, it shifts from upholding the law to using fear as policy.

That's not just dangerous; it's textbook authoritarianism.

You don't have to believe today is 1938 Germany to recognize patterns when they emerge.

Freedom doesn't disappear all at once…it's eroded when the government decides some people no longer deserve full legal protections, and others cheer it on because they think it will never reach them.

If you really believe in the Constitution, in liberty, and in America, you stay vigilant…even when the people targeted aren't your tribe.

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Not. Even. Close.
Now try one likening the massive wave of illegal immigrants to an invasion.

Bill Clinternet said:

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The eternal refuge of the regime apologist… "they deserved it."

Thank you for bravely stepping forward to remind us that due process and basic human dignity are apparently conditional rights now, selectively handed out based on whatever charges the state feels like whispering that day. How convenient: the presumption of innocence vanishes the moment it becomes politically useful for you.

You clutch at the excuse that some people may have committed crimes, so naturally the proper response is mass raids, indiscriminate targeting, and rounding up anyone "associated" like we're reenacting the worst chapters of authoritarian history, but with more hashtags. You aren't defending justice; you're defending collective punishment under the flimsiest of justifications.

ICE wasn't storming a fortified cartel bunker. They raided a nightclub, terrorized civilians, and treated vulnerability as guilt. But you, proud defender of whatever the badge commands, call it noble because someone somewhere might have deserved it. Congratulations? You're the ideological heir to every petty tyrant who ever excused brutality by claiming the wrong people were standing too close.

You aren't arguing for law and order. You're arguing for a society where fear replaces law and suspicion replaces rights and you're too intellectually lazy to even realize it.

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Staff- there are numerous ad homs in the post I responded to.

This guy is nothing but a troll.

Bill Clinternet said:

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Before some of you dismiss concerns about the Colorado Springs nightclub raid, you should understand the deeper issue here.

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2025/04/28/us/colorado-springs-raid-monday


In 1938, Kristallnacht wasn't just about broken windows….it was about the government using law enforcement and mobs to signal that an entire group of people no longer had protection under the law. It was the moment the Nazis moved from harassment to state-sanctioned terror.

The victims weren't arrested for committing crimes that day…they were targeted for who they were.

That's the critical parallel.

Now look at Colorado Springs:

Over 100 people detained at once, based heavily on immigration status, in a highly publicized, militarized raid.
Justified broadly under the banner of "gang activity" and "drug trafficking," but not everyone arrested was even charged with any crime.
The spectacle of it…mass roundups tied to a specific group…is designed to intimidate, not just enforce laws.

Yes, governments have the right to enforce immigration laws.
But when enforcement becomes a public show of force against a vulnerable population, without transparent due process, it shifts from upholding the law to using fear as policy.

That's not just dangerous; it's textbook authoritarianism.

You don't have to believe today is 1938 Germany to recognize patterns when they emerge.

Freedom doesn't disappear all at once…it's eroded when the government decides some people no longer deserve full legal protections, and others cheer it on because they think it will never reach them.

If you really believe in the Constitution, in liberty, and in America, you stay vigilant…even when the people targeted aren't your tribe.

---

Huh. Interesting.

Really reminds me of about 4-5 years ago when a certain group of people openly campaigned for another group of people to be rounded up, put in concentration camps, have their children taken away from them, have their jobs taken away from them, etc. because they didn't want a shot.

Also, illegals aren't my tribe and I want them targeted. HTH.