Maybe they communicated to local law enforcement to have it covered and that's where the screw up lies. They though the local police had it covered (they were actually near the building) but they just failed at their job.agent-maroon said:Agree. Even the dumbest homeowner knows to put a lock on every door leading into their home if they want to secure it. This is the freaking Secret Service protecting one of the most important people in the world. They've done this hundreds if not thousands of times. There's no way you're ever going to convince me that they inadvertently forgot to secure a roof 150 yards away. They put their own freaking counter-snipers on the roofs for crying out loud. No way that someone wouldn't have had the thought that a shooter would do the same.AgBQ-00 said:
Access to that roof should have been denied by personnel in place on it. Or line of sight to the stage should have been taken away by a barrier being in place between it and the stage, or both should have happened. The sheer simplicity of the required actions is so elementary it screams to me that it was intentional by someone in the chain somewhere.
Shots fired at Trump [Keep it factual -- Staff]
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VP at Pierce and Pierce said:
Is it known that this kid was some low IQ dunce with "no training"? He could have been shooting his whole life. I thought it came out that he was pretty smart in school. I want to know what medications he was on, if the FBI had him on his radar (which they always do when there is a mass shooter) and what "chatrooms" he frequented.
The kid was enrolled in the GT program classes in high school he wasn't low IQ. Both his parents being licensed counselors is concerning that they never picked up on any emotional or behavioral problems or if they did were they being addressed. Dad bought the DMPS AR15 legally. The kid bought a box of .223 that morning from a local vendor. Kid didn't have as much as a traffic ticket on his record.
Lots of questions still unanswered.
Bottom line USSS was complacent and unprepared
“Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience" - Mark Twain
J. Walter Weatherman said:nortex97 said:Calling out the critical thinking of others while dismissing a 20 year old climbing a roof 135 meters from Trump speaking at a rural location and then taking 2 minutes with the crowd pointing at him, to get off 8 shots, before he was terminated by the snipers (after hitting Trump) with a clear line of site to him is…amusing.Quote:
Critical thinking is a thing of the past for most people in this country.
Biden loses it in debate with 'it's over polling.'
Trump wins POTUS immunity ruling
USSS:
"The best technology."
"The finest people."
"Oops, we weren't using the same frequency."
"Didn't think the 'unknown' guy with the scoped rifle on the roof posed a reason to protect Trump/evacuate."
"Couldn't see him until after he shot…and didn't move."
"Can't get into his phone, darn it." (But FBI's on it, trust us).
"No social media"
"Donated to act blue...but was a conservative."
'-You crazy conspiracy theorists, no way this was a coordinated operation.'
C'mon, man.
Or:
- This was not their best team.
- Clearly there were communication issues between the police and SS. More will come out on that I'm sure.
- No evidence anyone on SS was aware or saw the guy before he fired.
- Not rare for them to not be able to hack a phone in 48 hours.
But to follow your logic you'd have to believe the "cabal" or whatever hinged their entire giant conspiracy plot on a 20 year old loser using his dad's rifle.
Dude was a lunatic and crazy people do crazy things, especially when the dems and media spend 4 years talking about how Trump is a threat to democracy, hitler etc. Going to need to see some actual evidence before I'd believe anything else.
for decades those who have never lived and worked in DC claim vast conspiracies
when the reality is simply the enormous number of idiots and incompetents and lazy people and getting used to normalcy
nearly every disaster can be explained away by human stupidity, laziness, and downplaying potential outcomes
No, the SS most likely did not employ the shooter. But you sure do sound like you know a lot about a situation that just happened. How are you the all knowing wise one regarding what the motives, levels of incompetence, or how much help was given? Especially after everything we've seen our government do to the detriment of the people and American way.Rapier108 said:As I keep saying, QAnon broke the brains of many on the right.aTmAg said:
The notion of that the SS employed a 20 year old loner who lived with his parents to shoot Trump is ridiculous.
I'm sure other sites are linking to these threads to mock us.
Nothing will convince them it wasn't a conspiracy against Trump by the government.
A manifesto the kid mailed to a bunch of people could turn up, and they'd claim it was planted by the FBI. They always have a pivot when information comes out which doesn't fit their long ago preconceived beliefs.
Critical thinking is a thing of the past for most people in this country.
Your post reeks of the pot calling the kettle black.
Learn about the Texas Nationalist Movement
https://tnm.me
https://tnm.me
I would put the main focus of blame on DEI hiring over the hiring of competent individuals. I don't think there is any bigger conspiracy here beyond Biden's DOJ not giving adequate resources to DJT team. Additionally, I suspect that team was formed not around being the brightest and most competent, but rather a "diverse and inclusive team". IMO, this was a lone gunman; Those are the hardest to stop.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Read Vincent Bugliosi's book and put that conspiracy stuff in the garbage.Quote:
Read the book "Chaos" about the feds, MK Ultra, Jolly West and LSD then come back to this post.
Off topic: I used to see Oswald's nephew every year...at a sporting clay shoot. He was a mediocre shot.
Rapier & the Ag in Alaska are God's gift to discussion forums, especially sniper/marksmanship/Secret Service Protocol topics; didn't you get the memo?!?! You should be humble & grateful for their opinions that they offer as undisputed fact, OK?!?!
they just notify that he's on the roof. I don't hear anyone say anything about a rifle.Foreverconservative said:
Here's a great sync up of all videos
At the 38 sec mark is when the first local cop is notified that the perp is on the roofwith a rifleThis is an incredible breakdown of almost everything that happened before, during and after the attempted assassination of Donald Trump, from multiple camera angles and footage currently available. pic.twitter.com/DcOObI2bGb
— Ian Miles Cheong (@stillgray) July 15, 2024
They have now. They said "wasn't me" and threw the local PD under the bus.aginlakeway said:
Agree. It was that incompetent. But the idea that this kid was recruited to kill Trump is even crazier.
There's a reason the SS hasn't said anything. They ****ed up. Big time.
🤡 🤡 🤡
How long was this rally location known before the event?
I think they did. In looking at the one visable on stage, it was a leather loafer that was low at the arch and heel. My first thought was they popped off when he went down. I know I can just "kick" mine off that are similar style.LMCane said:
so did the shoes come off when he was dogpiled by the secret service? so random that Trump would say "wait wait wait I need my shoes"
but bad@ss“Let me get my shoes” is the new “Hold my beer.”
— Nicole Saphier, MD (@NBSaphierMD) July 15, 2024
And yes, he's a BOSS!
Not sure if this has been pointed out.
There is no way that kid hauled a ladder and the long rifle to the building, across a field. The ladder had to have been there already, or very close by. Or there was another way onto the roof.
My bet is that there was supposed to be someone in LE or SS posted on that roof, or near that access point. And that person(s) was not there at the time necessary to prevent this from happening.
There is no way that kid hauled a ladder and the long rifle to the building, across a field. The ladder had to have been there already, or very close by. Or there was another way onto the roof.
My bet is that there was supposed to be someone in LE or SS posted on that roof, or near that access point. And that person(s) was not there at the time necessary to prevent this from happening.
Now we find out that both of the kids parents were licensed counselors.Stat Monitor Repairman said:
We'll find out this kid was on a host of psychotropic drugs.
SSRI / SNRI and others.
Does this make it more likely or less likely that he was on psychotropic drugs?
at least four days publiclyJobSecurity said:
How long was this rally location known before the event?
but Trump has been to Butler County many times over the years
correctTheCurl84 said:
Not sure if this has been pointed out.
There is no way that kid hauled a ladder and the long rifle to the building, across a field. The ladder had to have been there already, or very close by. Or there was another way onto the roof.
My bet is that there was supposed to be someone in LE or SS posted on that roof, or near that access point. And that person(s) was not there at the time necessary to prevent this from happening.
I think the ladder was kept in place for LE to use, obviously they didn't.
or the kid brought it there in the days prior. the public knew about the rally beginning on July 9/10
This is FALSE. Team #1 has :42 of video of them trained on the location of the shooter. Both of them having had changed their set ups from minutes earlier such as rifle on tripod to rifle off tripod etc. Team #2 at the time of the shooting is also trained on the position of the shooter but we have yet to see vid/photo evidence of how long in that position. Regardless, there are 4 snipers trained on a threat and the President is still exposed and has yet to been covered by his Personal Protection Team.J. Walter Weatherman said:nortex97 said:Calling out the critical thinking of others while dismissing a 20 year old climbing a roof 135 meters from Trump speaking at a rural location and then taking 2 minutes with the crowd pointing at him, to get off 8 shots, before he was terminated by the snipers (after hitting Trump) with a clear line of site to him is…amusing.Quote:
Critical thinking is a thing of the past for most people in this country.
Biden loses it in debate with 'it's over polling.'
Trump wins POTUS immunity ruling
USSS:
"The best technology."
"The finest people."
"Oops, we weren't using the same frequency."
"Didn't think the 'unknown' guy with the scoped rifle on the roof posed a reason to protect Trump/evacuate."
"Couldn't see him until after he shot…and didn't move."
"Can't get into his phone, darn it." (But FBI's on it, trust us).
"No social media"
"Donated to act blue...but was a conservative."
'-You crazy conspiracy theorists, no way this was a coordinated operation.'
C'mon, man.
Or:
- This was not their best team.
- Clearly there were communication issues between the police and SS. More will come out on that I'm sure.
- No evidence anyone on SS was aware or saw the guy before he fired.
- Not rare for them to not be able to hack a phone in 48 hours.
But to follow your logic you'd have to believe the "cabal" or whatever hinged their entire giant conspiracy plot on a 20 year old loser using his dad's rifle.
Dude was a lunatic and crazy people do crazy things, especially when the dems and media spend 4 years talking about how Trump is a threat to democracy, hitler etc. Going to need to see some actual evidence before I'd believe anything else.
What has not been discussed yet is the the position of both of these teams cannot see portions of the stage and or bleachers. There has to be another team or two out to the front looking back towards the stage and or barns for overlapping fields of fire.
Here is the problem I have with all of the "this wasn't the USSS A Team" type comments excusing the incompetence. There is no way anybody could be good enough to make it into the USSS, even as a DEI hire, and not realize that building was a glaring security threat and needed to be secured. Rank amateurs looking at that map would have put an asset on top of the building with a gun and a radio. That it didn't happen just completely strains the bounds of believable incompetence to a level that has people looking for other possible explanations.
It doesn't take a giant deep state conspiracy for somebody from the USSS who dislikes Trump to come into contact with somebody from the local PD or state PD who also hates Trump and put them in charge of "securing the building". If that local PD then put the bug in the ear of a troubled and bullied teen they know who hates Trump, and then looks the other way while he climbs onto the building with a rifle, that is all it takes. No grand conspiracy, no deep state involvement. Just 2-3 bad apples and a troubled teen who wants to make a splash.
I am not saying that is what happened. Just pointing out there are possible explanations other than incompetence on a grand scale that don't involve a huge "deep state" government conspiracy.
It doesn't take a giant deep state conspiracy for somebody from the USSS who dislikes Trump to come into contact with somebody from the local PD or state PD who also hates Trump and put them in charge of "securing the building". If that local PD then put the bug in the ear of a troubled and bullied teen they know who hates Trump, and then looks the other way while he climbs onto the building with a rifle, that is all it takes. No grand conspiracy, no deep state involvement. Just 2-3 bad apples and a troubled teen who wants to make a splash.
I am not saying that is what happened. Just pointing out there are possible explanations other than incompetence on a grand scale that don't involve a huge "deep state" government conspiracy.
More, especially if one or both are Psychiatrists.Stat Monitor Repairman said:Now we find out that both of the kids parents were licensed counselors.Stat Monitor Repairman said:
We'll find out this kid was on a host of psychotropic drugs.
SSRI / SNRI and others.
Does this make it more likely or less likely that he was on psychotropic drugs?
With a location that important, you can't assume it was done just because you delegated it to somebody else. You have your own spotters or snipers watching it too to make sure they do their job.agracer said:Maybe they communicated to local law enforcement to have it covered and that's where the screw up lies. They though the local police had it covered (they were actually near the building) but they just failed at their job.agent-maroon said:Agree. Even the dumbest homeowner knows to put a lock on every door leading into their home if they want to secure it. This is the freaking Secret Service protecting one of the most important people in the world. They've done this hundreds if not thousands of times. There's no way you're ever going to convince me that they inadvertently forgot to secure a roof 150 yards away. They put their own freaking counter-snipers on the roofs for crying out loud. No way that someone wouldn't have had the thought that a shooter would do the same.AgBQ-00 said:
Access to that roof should have been denied by personnel in place on it. Or line of sight to the stage should have been taken away by a barrier being in place between it and the stage, or both should have happened. The sheer simplicity of the required actions is so elementary it screams to me that it was intentional by someone in the chain somewhere.
He did hit his spot on the first shot. It was a good shot that Trump just happened to turn even further right and slightly forward at the precise moment. After that it was panicked shooting trying to inflict as much damage as he could and hope he hit. He wasn't a trained sniper but was proficient enough for the first shot. And for those saying, they know this wasn't planned or cultivated by one of our agencies, I'm not saying it was, but do you even pay attention to the numerous incidences that have unraveled under scrutiny to be cultivated operation of some deranged individual. They can cultivate and hope! Any trained sniper would be obvious and throw up huge red flags. Our agencies have proven to be this corrupt and politicized. It's not some wild stretch.LMCane said:Madman said:Gig em G said:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C9aU1CsOR9i/?igsh=MjV0OXpxZDZpYzlw
Dallas Alexander, ex-military sniper's take on the situation.
1. No way the shooter didn't have help or was allowed to get that close.
2. If you were skilled enough to get into that position to make an assassination attempt, there's no way you wouldn't be skilled enough to make the shot in the first round.
The two points together are still very strange to me. If he was allowed to get into shooting position, or had help, there's no way whoever helped him wouldn't have someone so incredibly skilled at shooting that it would be a done deal.
Stress is difficult to train for.
it sounds insane to me that on a 100 degree day, on a hot roof, with a police officer poking his head up behind the shooter, knowing you are about to die, you were not in the military but a dork:
why didn't he hit a 1 foot target from 400 feet away!!
this is a really great interview. probably the only decent guy who works for the NY Times
A must watch interview: @dougmillsnyt on the moment he captured that unforgettable photograph of a bullet near Donald Trump’s head, while only feet away from the attempted assassination. pic.twitter.com/RD01HiTR2r
— Dana Perino (@DanaPerino) July 15, 2024
I don't think anyone disputes that. The question becomes, how do you secure that area? Some folks suggest that there should have been officers on those rooftops. My hunch is that the SS didn't want anyone on those rooftops, so that the SS snipers could assume anyone on those roofs meant Trump harm, and the plan was for local LEO to take care of that. Otherwise, you could end up with a more sophisticated assassin coming dressed as law enforcement and have difficulty distinguishing friend from foe.txags92 said:
Here is the problem I have with all of the "this wasn't the USSS A Team" type comments excusing the incompetence. There is no way anybody could be good enough to make it into the USSS, even as a DEI hire, and not realize that building was a glaring security threat and needed to be secured. Rank amateurs looking at that map would have put an asset on top of the building with a gun and a radio. That it didn't happen just completely strains the bounds of believable incompetence to a level that has people looking for other possible explanations.
It doesn't take a giant deep state conspiracy for somebody from the USSS who dislikes Trump to come into contact with somebody from the local PD or state PD who also hates Trump and put them in charge of "securing the building". If that local PD then put the bug in the ear of a troubled and bullied teen they know who hates Trump, and then looks the other way while he climbs onto the building with a rifle, that is all it takes. No grand conspiracy, no deep state involvement. Just 2-3 bad apples and a troubled teen who wants to make a splash.
I am not saying that is what happened. Just pointing out there are possible explanations other than incompetence on a grand scale that don't involve a huge "deep state" government conspiracy.
One of the big questions here is going to be the ladder that was used to get on the roof, and how it got there.
I think everyone is overcomplicating this. PD was probably in charge of that building because they sent someone up to check. The service counter snipers mustve been aware given their focus. A head pops up over the ridge and they take a few seconds to determine whether it's PD or a shooter. Shooter fires and is killed within 3 seconds.
That's not a grand conspiracy. It's a lack of communication coupled with understandable hesitance to make a mistake by the counter snipers
That's not a grand conspiracy. It's a lack of communication coupled with understandable hesitance to make a mistake by the counter snipers
I don't think you understand what I wrote
OF COURSE this could have been a 20 year old non-military veteran taking the shot- and he was 2 inches from a "perfect" shot.
if anything, the case is opposite from what most of the dummies are saying. instead of claiming "that is such an easy shot how could he miss"
the reality is that is a tough condition shot to make, and he still nearly pulled it off.
literally millimeters away. it's ridiculous to claim the shooter sucked and was trying to miss or something like that
OF COURSE this could have been a 20 year old non-military veteran taking the shot- and he was 2 inches from a "perfect" shot.
if anything, the case is opposite from what most of the dummies are saying. instead of claiming "that is such an easy shot how could he miss"
the reality is that is a tough condition shot to make, and he still nearly pulled it off.
literally millimeters away. it's ridiculous to claim the shooter sucked and was trying to miss or something like that
JFABNRGR said:This is FALSE. Team #1 has :42 of video of them trained on the location of the shooter. Both of them having had changed their set ups from minutes earlier such as rifle on tripod to rifle off tripod etc. Team #2 at the time of the shooting is also trained on the position of the shooter but we have yet to see vid/photo evidence of how long in that position. Regardless, there are 4 snipers trained on a threat and the President is still exposed and has yet to been covered by his Personal Protection Team.J. Walter Weatherman said:nortex97 said:Calling out the critical thinking of others while dismissing a 20 year old climbing a roof 135 meters from Trump speaking at a rural location and then taking 2 minutes with the crowd pointing at him, to get off 8 shots, before he was terminated by the snipers (after hitting Trump) with a clear line of site to him is…amusing.Quote:
Critical thinking is a thing of the past for most people in this country.
Biden loses it in debate with 'it's over polling.'
Trump wins POTUS immunity ruling
USSS:
"The best technology."
"The finest people."
"Oops, we weren't using the same frequency."
"Didn't think the 'unknown' guy with the scoped rifle on the roof posed a reason to protect Trump/evacuate."
"Couldn't see him until after he shot…and didn't move."
"Can't get into his phone, darn it." (But FBI's on it, trust us).
"No social media"
"Donated to act blue...but was a conservative."
'-You crazy conspiracy theorists, no way this was a coordinated operation.'
C'mon, man.
Or:
- This was not their best team.
- Clearly there were communication issues between the police and SS. More will come out on that I'm sure.
- No evidence anyone on SS was aware or saw the guy before he fired.
- Not rare for them to not be able to hack a phone in 48 hours.
But to follow your logic you'd have to believe the "cabal" or whatever hinged their entire giant conspiracy plot on a 20 year old loser using his dad's rifle.
Dude was a lunatic and crazy people do crazy things, especially when the dems and media spend 4 years talking about how Trump is a threat to democracy, hitler etc. Going to need to see some actual evidence before I'd believe anything else.
What has not been discussed yet is the the position of both of these teams cannot see portions of the stage and or bleachers. There has to be another team or two out to the front looking back towards the stage and or barns for overlapping fields of fire.
Zero evidence of this. From this graphic on the other thread, seems likely team 1 was somewhat blocked by trees and possibly the slope of the roof, and team 2 took the shot once they heard the firing and zeroed on the target.
I am confident its the second shot. Bullet arrival is about 1/3 the time of the report from the rifle.RGLAG85 said:He did hit his spot on the first shot. It was a good shot that Trump just happened to turn even further right and slightly forward at the precise moment. After that it was panicked shooting trying to inflict as much damage as he could and hope he hit. He wasn't a trained sniper but was proficient enough for the first shot. And for those saying, they know this wasn't planned or cultivated by one of our agencies, I'm not saying it was, but do you even pay attention to the numerous incidences that have unraveled under scrutiny to be cultivated operation of some deranged individual. They can cultivate and hope! Any trained sniper would be obvious and throw up huge red flags. Our agencies have proven to be this corrupt and politicized. It's not some wild stretch.LMCane said:Madman said:Gig em G said:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C9aU1CsOR9i/?igsh=MjV0OXpxZDZpYzlw
Dallas Alexander, ex-military sniper's take on the situation.
1. No way the shooter didn't have help or was allowed to get that close.
2. If you were skilled enough to get into that position to make an assassination attempt, there's no way you wouldn't be skilled enough to make the shot in the first round.
The two points together are still very strange to me. If he was allowed to get into shooting position, or had help, there's no way whoever helped him wouldn't have someone so incredibly skilled at shooting that it would be a done deal.
Stress is difficult to train for.
it sounds insane to me that on a 100 degree day, on a hot roof, with a police officer poking his head up behind the shooter, knowing you are about to die, you were not in the military but a dork:
why didn't he hit a 1 foot target from 400 feet away!!
J. Walter Weatherman said:JFABNRGR said:This is FALSE. Team #1 has :42 of video of them trained on the location of the shooter. Both of them having had changed their set ups from minutes earlier such as rifle on tripod to rifle off tripod etc. Team #2 at the time of the shooting is also trained on the position of the shooter but we have yet to see vid/photo evidence of how long in that position. Regardless, there are 4 snipers trained on a threat and the President is still exposed and has yet to been covered by his Personal Protection Team.J. Walter Weatherman said:nortex97 said:Calling out the critical thinking of others while dismissing a 20 year old climbing a roof 135 meters from Trump speaking at a rural location and then taking 2 minutes with the crowd pointing at him, to get off 8 shots, before he was terminated by the snipers (after hitting Trump) with a clear line of site to him is…amusing.Quote:
Critical thinking is a thing of the past for most people in this country.
Biden loses it in debate with 'it's over polling.'
Trump wins POTUS immunity ruling
USSS:
"The best technology."
"The finest people."
"Oops, we weren't using the same frequency."
"Didn't think the 'unknown' guy with the scoped rifle on the roof posed a reason to protect Trump/evacuate."
"Couldn't see him until after he shot…and didn't move."
"Can't get into his phone, darn it." (But FBI's on it, trust us).
"No social media"
"Donated to act blue...but was a conservative."
'-You crazy conspiracy theorists, no way this was a coordinated operation.'
C'mon, man.
Or:
- This was not their best team.
- Clearly there were communication issues between the police and SS. More will come out on that I'm sure.
- No evidence anyone on SS was aware or saw the guy before he fired.
- Not rare for them to not be able to hack a phone in 48 hours.
But to follow your logic you'd have to believe the "cabal" or whatever hinged their entire giant conspiracy plot on a 20 year old loser using his dad's rifle.
Dude was a lunatic and crazy people do crazy things, especially when the dems and media spend 4 years talking about how Trump is a threat to democracy, hitler etc. Going to need to see some actual evidence before I'd believe anything else.
What has not been discussed yet is the the position of both of these teams cannot see portions of the stage and or bleachers. There has to be another team or two out to the front looking back towards the stage and or barns for overlapping fields of fire.
Zero evidence of this. From this graphic on the other thread, seems likely team 1 was somewhat blocked by trees and possibly the slope of the roof, and team 2 took the shot once they heard the firing and zeroed on the target.
Graphic is a bit dated. Plenty of videos and photos showing the counter sniper team #2 location to confirm that placement. And there's also photos of one of the counter snipers there holding brass after the shooting. That's where the counter shot came from.
SIAP:
BlackRock pulls ad that featured Trump shooter Thomas Matthew Crooks https://t.co/24ViyLsLGj pic.twitter.com/y6xCpp2wGk
— New York Post (@nypost) July 15, 2024
This thread has ran its course I believe.
There is so much useless debate on here now.
Was it incompetence yes
Could it have been an intention oversight sure.
Could he have been groomed online probably
Was it a spy novel step by step plan for this exact scenario, come on man.
There is so much useless debate on here now.
Was it incompetence yes
Could it have been an intention oversight sure.
Could he have been groomed online probably
Was it a spy novel step by step plan for this exact scenario, come on man.
1) The SS is so incompetent that they left a roof unsecured 150 yds away
2) The roof just happened to have a position blind to the SS counter-snipers
3) A 20yo old nursing home kitchen employee was able to figure out that position
4) A 20yo old nursing home kitchen employee was able to sneak a ladder and AR style rifle through security and up on the roof
5) The gathered crowd could clearly see him, pointed him out & shouted out his presence, and multiple persons filmed him positioning himself on the roof, but the SS & other LEO couldn't do the same
6) He was able to escape SS attention for minutes rather than seconds
7) He was able to make that shot on a hot metal roof wearing shorts knowing that he would be dead in seconds, but couldn't qualify for a HS JV rifle team.
It only takes picking 6 randomly selected numbers from a pool of 70 choices to win the lottery. The shooting had at least 7 improbable events all happen at the same time just this one time (unless they're covering up multiple previous assassination attempts in the past that we don't know about). Statistically improbable/impossible IMO.
-OR-
He had help from someone on the inside who was exploiting the intentional security negligence and/or incompetence.
Which is Occam's Razor here?
2) The roof just happened to have a position blind to the SS counter-snipers
3) A 20yo old nursing home kitchen employee was able to figure out that position
4) A 20yo old nursing home kitchen employee was able to sneak a ladder and AR style rifle through security and up on the roof
5) The gathered crowd could clearly see him, pointed him out & shouted out his presence, and multiple persons filmed him positioning himself on the roof, but the SS & other LEO couldn't do the same
6) He was able to escape SS attention for minutes rather than seconds
7) He was able to make that shot on a hot metal roof wearing shorts knowing that he would be dead in seconds, but couldn't qualify for a HS JV rifle team.
It only takes picking 6 randomly selected numbers from a pool of 70 choices to win the lottery. The shooting had at least 7 improbable events all happen at the same time just this one time (unless they're covering up multiple previous assassination attempts in the past that we don't know about). Statistically improbable/impossible IMO.
-OR-
He had help from someone on the inside who was exploiting the intentional security negligence and/or incompetence.
Which is Occam's Razor here?
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Quote:
The problem is there are so many people who have been completely programmed to think that everything is now a "deep state" conspiracy against Trump.
So when this happens; they are simply incapable of believing that a crazy person did this of his own accord. They start from the position that it HAS to be a massive, nefarious plot against Trump, where hundreds if not thousands of people plotted it for months or years, but ****ed it up by hiring a 20 year old who couldn't get it done.
QAnon broke the brains of so many people on the right that they will never recover.
I too, roll my eyes, and get a bit annoyed at the constant conspiracy talk. It makes it hard to have a productive discussion.
But to be fair...think of all the things that seemed conspiratorial, that have proven to be true, in recent years.
The Fake Russian hoax
The fake dossier and spying
The staged photos of Top Secret documents
Lies about his actions on Jan 6, only to find out it's true that his requests for additional security were denied
Covid Lab Leak
Safe and effective (does not promote variants, cannot contract/spread the virus, etc etc)
Twitter files, proving coordination and censorship of the truth.
Voting irregularities/illegalities
Hunters' laptop being Russian disinformation
That's off the top of my head, though I know I'm forgetting a bunch.
I dont think there is a conspiracy here. But I also don't necessarily blame those who do. I wouldn't say it has anything to do with QAnon, or brainwashing. It's almost become the norm to question the initial narrative, because recently, it's often proven to be lies.
Mike Glover is a retired Green Beret sergeant major that was sniper qualified and CIA contractor that goes over everything that went wrong during the failed Trump assassination. In short...a lot. I have seen people post another retired Green Beret sniper and they both have the same thoughts, someone didn't do their job.
- Failure on the SS to secure site ahead of time. That was the only elevated structure in the area
- Building was biggest risk, sniper should have had it sighted in ahead of time. Had to adjust dope
- Counter sniper team did their job, one shot one kill. Likely .338 lapua
- Why were no air assets utilized?
- Politics played big part, from rhetoric to not punishing rioters for years
- Watching the woman trying to reholster her pistol was a joke, why was she reholstering it in the first place?
So four counter snipers all assigned to the same sector of fire?J. Walter Weatherman said:JFABNRGR said:This is FALSE. Team #1 has :42 of video of them trained on the location of the shooter. Both of them having had changed their set ups from minutes earlier such as rifle on tripod to rifle off tripod etc. Team #2 at the time of the shooting is also trained on the position of the shooter but we have yet to see vid/photo evidence of how long in that position. Regardless, there are 4 snipers trained on a threat and the President is still exposed and has yet to been covered by his Personal Protection Team.J. Walter Weatherman said:nortex97 said:Calling out the critical thinking of others while dismissing a 20 year old climbing a roof 135 meters from Trump speaking at a rural location and then taking 2 minutes with the crowd pointing at him, to get off 8 shots, before he was terminated by the snipers (after hitting Trump) with a clear line of site to him is…amusing.Quote:
Critical thinking is a thing of the past for most people in this country.
Biden loses it in debate with 'it's over polling.'
Trump wins POTUS immunity ruling
USSS:
"The best technology."
"The finest people."
"Oops, we weren't using the same frequency."
"Didn't think the 'unknown' guy with the scoped rifle on the roof posed a reason to protect Trump/evacuate."
"Couldn't see him until after he shot…and didn't move."
"Can't get into his phone, darn it." (But FBI's on it, trust us).
"No social media"
"Donated to act blue...but was a conservative."
'-You crazy conspiracy theorists, no way this was a coordinated operation.'
C'mon, man.
Or:
- This was not their best team.
- Clearly there were communication issues between the police and SS. More will come out on that I'm sure.
- No evidence anyone on SS was aware or saw the guy before he fired.
- Not rare for them to not be able to hack a phone in 48 hours.
But to follow your logic you'd have to believe the "cabal" or whatever hinged their entire giant conspiracy plot on a 20 year old loser using his dad's rifle.
Dude was a lunatic and crazy people do crazy things, especially when the dems and media spend 4 years talking about how Trump is a threat to democracy, hitler etc. Going to need to see some actual evidence before I'd believe anything else.
What has not been discussed yet is the the position of both of these teams cannot see portions of the stage and or bleachers. There has to be another team or two out to the front looking back towards the stage and or barns for overlapping fields of fire.
Zero evidence of this. From this graphic on the other thread, seems likely team 1 was somewhat blocked by trees and possibly the slope of the roof, and team 2 took the shot once they heard the firing and zeroed on the target.
Roof pitch...do the damn math to include prone versus standing/kneeling on a taller building and note he was eventually shot reportedly from team 2 which is further away with a tougher elevation angle. I will grant you the tree may have obstructed team #1 but again when 4 snipers are trained on the same 10 degree location (2 of them for at least :42) leaving open the other 350 degrees; Hawkeye should have been covered and removed.
Also look at the bullet trajectory behind his head it is damn near parallel to the stage only a slight downward inclination while the snipers are all well above this.
Quote:
The Secret Service will make no changes to security at the Republican National Convention in the aftermath of an assassination attempt against former President Donald Trump, the agency said Sunday.
"We are confident in the plans that we have and are moving forward with those plans," Audrey Gibson-Cicchino, the Secret Service's RNC convention coordinator, told reporters.
Trump, 78, will arrive in Milwaukee on Sunday ahead of the four-day convention during which he will be formally named the Republican nominee for president.
Earlier in the day, President Biden announced that he had directed the Secret Service Director Kimberly Cheatle to "review all security measures" for the GOP convention.
Via Hot Air.Quote:
The Secret Service has set up what they are calling a "soft perimeter" around the convention site. No protests of any sort will be allowed inside of that perimeter and nobody will be allowed through without appropriate ID and their name appearing on the list of designated invitees and speakers. That all sounds good, but they need to ensure that the have the manpower and the appropriate barriers to maintain that zone. We've seen protesters rushing and even attacking the police in recent months. There's no reason to assume that those lunatics might not try the same thing against the Secret Service.
Still, the fact remains that someone tried to fire a bullet into Donald Trump's skull less than two days ago. You would think that further increasing these security measures would be justified and timely. Yet the head of the Service insists there is no need for that.
yeah its pretty much just reading the same arguing for the last 20 or so pages.
i wish we could keep it clear for any new information that comes out.
but, will there be? Or is it "oh well, nevermind" attitude. Secret Service is pointing fingers, so i dont think the really care enough to get the bottom of it. we know FBI lie about stuff all the time, so i assume this will all be covered up, just like all of the other BS they have covered up over the last 10 years.
Any other incident and we would know how the ladder got there and the actions of the shooter prior to the shots being taken or him climbing on the wall. Also, is it confirmed that a local PD climbed up on the roof and saw him...why hasnt he been interviewed?
i wish we could keep it clear for any new information that comes out.
but, will there be? Or is it "oh well, nevermind" attitude. Secret Service is pointing fingers, so i dont think the really care enough to get the bottom of it. we know FBI lie about stuff all the time, so i assume this will all be covered up, just like all of the other BS they have covered up over the last 10 years.
Any other incident and we would know how the ladder got there and the actions of the shooter prior to the shots being taken or him climbing on the wall. Also, is it confirmed that a local PD climbed up on the roof and saw him...why hasnt he been interviewed?
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