Israel/Hamas going at it

1,908,190 Views | 10729 Replies | Last: 21 hrs ago by txags92
deddog
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XXXVII said:

captkirk said:

Didn't go well for the terrorist




Perfect.
Abu Hajjar Part II.
Didn't get to roll though
deddog
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HumpitPuryear said:

Stlkofta said:

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/blinken-slated-to-make-late-night-statement-after-meeting-with-netanyahu-for-eight-hours/


Quote:

US Secretary of State Antony Blinken is slated to make a late-night statement from the US Embassy's branch office in Tel Aviv after meeting with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his war cabinet for nearly eight hours at the IDF's Kirya military headquarters nearby.

Say one thing in public. Ask for something else in private.

I don't know how you can possibly ask the Israelis to deal with a ridiculous concept of "proportionality" after what happened on October 7.

But here we are, trying to tell Israel to treat Hamas and Gaza with kid gloves.


Israel dithered and Hamas and Iran will benefit as will Jordan, Syria, and Egypt because the Gazans will stay where they are. If the offensive is called off Iran is going to crow about it. Hamas will be seen by Palestinians as having stared down the IDF. Imagine how China will interpret this weakness as they look across the straight towards Taiwan. Weakness put the world in this situation and weakness will make it worse.
Israel will not dither.
Not going to happen.
CDUB98
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JobSecurity said:






What are the odds the Russians actually helped those nutters make a nuke?

OR

What are the odds they have a dirty bomb ready to go off in Tel Aviv?
HumpitPuryear
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deddog said:

HumpitPuryear said:

Stlkofta said:

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/blinken-slated-to-make-late-night-statement-after-meeting-with-netanyahu-for-eight-hours/


Quote:

US Secretary of State Antony Blinken is slated to make a late-night statement from the US Embassy's branch office in Tel Aviv after meeting with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his war cabinet for nearly eight hours at the IDF's Kirya military headquarters nearby.

Say one thing in public. Ask for something else in private.

I don't know how you can possibly ask the Israelis to deal with a ridiculous concept of "proportionality" after what happened on October 7.

But here we are, trying to tell Israel to treat Hamas and Gaza with kid gloves.


Israel dithered and Hamas and Iran will benefit as will Jordan, Syria, and Egypt because the Gazans will stay where they are. If the offensive is called off Iran is going to crow about it. Hamas will be seen by Palestinians as having stared down the IDF. Imagine how China will interpret this weakness as they look across the straight towards Taiwan. Weakness put the world in this situation and weakness will make it worse.
Israel will not dither.
Not going to happen.
They already have. They've given deadlines and did nothing. World press is against them and is putting Palestinian suffering front and center. The US president is making a personal trip to dissuade them. We know nothing is kicking off before Thursday because IDF isn't going to start an invasion while the president is visiting. And it's absolutely foolish to announce the trip ahead of time.
TommyBrady
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For the people asking about finding tunnels you no longer have to have aircraft to find tunnels. We have an extensive and accurate set of assets to help locate tunnels and more importantly finding the entrances and exhaust pipes. Israel will use special algorithms manipulating Lidar and hyper-spectral imagery to help map and locate possible AOI's.
DTP02
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HumpitPuryear said:

Stlkofta said:

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/blinken-slated-to-make-late-night-statement-after-meeting-with-netanyahu-for-eight-hours/


Quote:

US Secretary of State Antony Blinken is slated to make a late-night statement from the US Embassy's branch office in Tel Aviv after meeting with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his war cabinet for nearly eight hours at the IDF's Kirya military headquarters nearby.

Say one thing in public. Ask for something else in private.

I don't know how you can possibly ask the Israelis to deal with a ridiculous concept of "proportionality" after what happened on October 7.

But here we are, trying to tell Israel to treat Hamas and Gaza with kid gloves.


Israel dithered and Hamas and Iran will benefit as will Jordan, Syria, and Egypt because the Gazans will stay where they are. If the offensive is called off Iran is going to crow about it. Hamas will be seen by Palestinians as having stared down the IDF. Imagine how China will interpret this weakness as they look across the straight towards Taiwan. Weakness put the world in this situation and weakness will make it worse.


You underestimate Israel's resolve. They aren't going to stop at air strikes. The "delay" will prove inconsequential in terms of Hamas' fate.
Claverack
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Statement came out...

https://www.state.gov/secretary-antony-j-blinken-remarks-to-the-press-on-president-bidens-upcoming-trip-to-israel-and-agreement-with-israel-to-develop-a-humanitarian-aid-plan-for-gaza/

So what is Oldfinger out to accomplish with this visit to Israel...


Quote:

First, the President will reaffirm the United States' solidarity with Israel and our ironclad commitment to its security.
Like he did with the Afghan government back in 2021.


Quote:

Second, President Biden will underscore our crystal-clear message to any actor, state or non-state, trying to take advantage of this crisis to attack Israel: Don't.
All full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.


Quote:

Third, the President will continue to coordinate closely with our Israeli partners to secure the release of hostages taken by Hamas including men, women, small children, Holocaust survivors, and American citizens as an indispensable humanitarian effort.
So does this mean we are going to pay Hamas to release hostages, as we did with Iran recently? That will really work wonders in this situation.


Quote:

Fourth, President Biden will receive a comprehensive brief on Israel's war aims and strategy.
And will no doubt understand none of it. Israel would be better served putting on an old episode of Captain Kangaroo and let this mumbling fool suck on his thumb per his usual practice.


Quote:

Fifth, the President will hear from Israel how it will conduct its operations in a way that minimizes civilian casualties and enables humanitarian assistance to flow to civilians in Gaza in a way that does not benefit Hamas.
In other words, Hamas will be getting a slice of HA through the Biden Administration and their UN partners.

Hope this isn't true and Israel ends up telling these idiots where they can take their so-called support. The Biden Administration screws up everything it is allowed to be involved in. The ultimate result will be to allow Hamas off the hook and back in power in Gaza.


HowdyTAMU
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Is the four-screen live video now down?
CDUB98
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That last one proves, once again, how stupid these people are.

ANYTHING they send in as aid is going straight to Hamas. Hell, the people will starve themselves for the cause and give their terrorists food and water.
DCPD158
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Israel should kick off the ground war the second Biden lands in Tel Aviv.
Company I-1, Ord-Ords '85 -12thFan and Websider-
Robert L. Peters
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Take over the surface and wait the out. Pretty damned simple.
What you say, Paper Champion? I'm gonna beat you like a dog, a dog, you hear me!
fullback44
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HowdyTAMU said:

Is the four-screen live video now down?
It's up but only 1 view of Gaza now, 3 Israel views it looks like
P.H. Dexippus
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I initially thought Israel was taking its time to avoid mistakes/traps of rushing in. Now I'm starting to think it's the US exerting pressure that's holding them back. "So you like those aircraft carrier groups on standby? You like that resupply of Iron Dome missiles? You like that Iranian $6B to remain frozen? Then you'll follow our 'proportionality' agenda."
Hubert J. Farnsworth
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P.H. Dexippus said:

I initially thought Israel was taking its time to avoid mistakes/traps of rushing in. Now I'm starting to think it's the US exerting pressure that's holding them back. "So you like those aircraft carrier groups on standby? You like that resupply if Iron Dome missiles? You like that Iranian $6B to remain frozen? Then you'll follow our 'proportionality' agenda."


Yep. The US is probably going to screw this up and Hamas won't get wiped out.
JobSecurity
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I think it's actually relatively important for Biden to go there even though it's symbolic. Iran used Hamas as bait, likely with the promise that when Israel responded (which they must) the other Iranian proxies would attack and collectively they could defeat Israel. This is the only way I can make sense of Hamas actions - they had an intricately planned attack but with no real military goal.

We can talk out of one side about humanitarian stuff but his presence is really a message to Iran, not Hamas or Gaza or Palestinians. Israel will take Gaza and subsequently be attacked from the north. We'll be there to provide supplies and support from a distance and keep Iran in check when Israel ultimately defeats both fronts simultaneously. What will Iran do when their proxies fail?
GAC06
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His presence is to delay Israel
File5
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Agreed - they already worked the deal with Blinken. Just to delay and give Biden a photo opp IMO. Wish him well in not starting WWIII.
BBRex
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You can call it revenge, but Israeli leaders know that the country won't stand for less than the complete dismantling of Hamas. I don't think the public will stand for the standard response from the Israeli government when Hamas is raping kids and killing grandparents, especially Holocaust survivors. They might be ramping up slower than we like, but they will pound the hell out of Hamas.
fooz
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I've posted the link earlier. It's gopro videos from dead hamas. Viewer discretion is advised.

Ps. I was in ERs for 8 years, and it made me cringe.

https://t.me/southfirstresponders

Eta: all of these hamas fighters met their maker
FCBlitz
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nortex97 said:



I have zero trust/confidence in any of our political leadership getting the Israeli's to rely on the US or 'our word' in how they handle Hamas or any other damn thing.


That is my concern. This show of force may also a way for the US to control airspace and throttle back Israel then it is a show of force to Iran and others.

What we do know about the men behind the curtain is they are usually doing the exact opposite of their claims In Bidens remarks about Israel defending themselves wasn't a speech condoning all out offensive attack on Gaza. It sounded that way……but under the scrutiny of what is…..is! It was more of a ……sure Israel has the right to defend itself.

This administration has a partnership with Iran. It doesn't want to be Irans adversary, but it does has to look like it is threatening Iran on the worlds stage. I do not trust the men behind the curtain to 100% behind Israel.

Remember these are the same masterminds of the Afghanistan pullout and called the Taliban partners.

Pumpkinhead
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Trying to kill Hamas while keeping this war from expanding into Hezbollah and the Arab street. Half the people in Gaza are under the age of 18 so there are a ton of children in there that Hamas is hiding behind, not to mention the hostages. Awful situation.
LostInLA07
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We'll find out if it's going to work but the US is at a minimum trying to create the optics that other Arab countries were able to gain some humanitarian concessions from Israel in exchange for staying out of the conflict, and the US was the broker of the deal. I suspect it will work with more US friendly middle eastern countries who also have it in their own interest to not let an Iranian proxy stir up a regional conflict. The Saudis, Jordanians, Egyptians, etc need some sort of win so they can tell their people they "opposed the Zionists" or whatever phrasing they like to use.

Israel is saying they are taking more time to reinforce their border with Lebanon so they don't get caught with their pants down right after they start the ground invasion of Gaza. That is probably also a valid reason for the delay.

I doubt any of this surprised Israel. They were probably smart enough to shut off water/power and implement a full blockade so they had something they could negotiate with, knowing Biden and team would show up asking for some sort of appeasement. This isn't Netanyahu's first rodeo and Israel also doesn't want to be stuck holding the bag of a humanitarian crisis with 2MM people who hate them - so "agreeing" to let other countries foot the bill for humanitarian aid is probably not a terrible outcome for Israel.

Iran will still try to be the turd in the punch bowl. It's too bad we are fighting a proxy war with Russia because, absent that, they would probably have been able to help keep Iran on the sideline. But, given the current fact set, it's in Russia's best interest for Iran to stir up trouble and distract the US with a conflict in Israel at the exact moment opposition to Ukraine support is building within the US. It definitely provides the military industrial complex an alternative location to spend money.
2000AgPhD
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I am usually not much of an optimist, but I see nothing wrong with Israel letting Hamas and the Gazans starve and live without water and electricity for a few more days while they continue to pound infrastructure before going in. How long did the alliance pound Iraq in Gulf I before going in - a month?
Pumpkinhead
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2000AgPhD said:

I am usually not much of an optimist, but I see nothing wrong with Israel letting Hamas and the Gazans starve and live without water and electricity for a few more days while they continue to pound infrastructure before going in. How long did the alliance pound Iraq in Gulf I before going in - a month?


I doubt the Hamas fighters are any where close to starving yet. They had a long time to plan for this attack, knew and intended for Israel to react, and are sitting in their tunnels stockpiled with food, water, and weapons. Ready for the Jews to come in so they can die for Allah in glorious battle while hoping their own people suffer as much as possible so that the rest of the Arab world joins in and the world burns.

As someone else posted, I see shutting off something like the water more a negotiating tactic than intended to degrade Hamas' ability to fight. Took away something that can then give back. But a delicate balancing act because the civilians are taking the brunt of it which is what Hamas wants hoping the violence then spreads to the rest of the Arab world.
samurai_science
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Pumpkinhead said:

Trying to kill Hamas while keeping this war from expanding into Hezbollah and the Arab street. Half the people in Gaza are under the age of 18 so there are a ton of children in there that Hamas is hiding behind, not to mention the hostages. Awful situation.
Good, those kids will just grow to kill more Jews
CDUB98
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One of the Audionix feeds is now Hamas propaganda. No audio, but showing all the devastation and displaced people.
JW
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anything less than total defeat and we will be doing this again in 5-10 years.
CDUB98
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JW said:

anything less than total defeat and we will be doing this again in 5-10 years.
POTD just before 0800
CDUB98
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Thankfully, that one Audionix stream is back to watching the Gaza skyline rather than propaganda.
Phat32
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Iran does not have working nuclear weapons. If they do, it is a very small number.

They are provoking a nation with somewhere between 200-400 weapons and both first/second-strike capabilities. On top of that, the Samson doctrine.

Are they really that insane?
CDUB98
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Phat32 said:

Are they really that insane?
yes
Joes
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JW said:

anything less than total defeat and we will be doing this again in 5-10 years.
It'll definitely happen again. People who think there's going to be some kind of complete extermination, even of just Hamas, aren't being realistic I don't think. The emperor in Star Wars can say "Wipe them out, all of them.." but in the modern western world, including Israel, this will diminish quickly for practicality's sake. Hostage negotiations, outside pressure and interference from the UN and the US, promises of this and that to deescalate, concerns over a wider war, etc. will end this way before it should in my opinion. It just seems like in the modern world the attitude is always to do the least you can to put things off a little longer instead of really fixing anything. I will be shocked if at some point before they're done we don't hear "They've reached an agreement.."
MJ20/20
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Iran is hedging that Israel doesn't have the balls to act unilaterally and without the direct consent of USA / Biden Admin. We are seeing the slow play by Biden Admin, and Israel, at least at the moment, entertaining the U.S.'s requests for pause. I hope Israel does not let this opportunity to defend itself slip by. The Arab World is watching and deterrence and strength is the only posture they respect. Listening to Biden / US will only emasculate the Israeli's position politically.
CDUB98
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I'm thinking that Israel wants to hit them so hard that it will take multiple generations to rebuild to what Hamas is today in strength. Not only just in people numbers, but also infrastructure.

In this way, it will take more than 10-15 years for it to happen again, but in general, yes, I agree, it will happen again. Has been for millennia.
G Martin 87
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Phat32 said:

Iran does not have working nuclear weapons. If they do, it is a very small number.

They are provoking a nation with somewhere between 200-400 weapons and both first/second-strike capabilities. On top of that, the Samson doctrine.

Are they really that insane?
Yes. There are some similarities with the kamikaze mindset of late WWII Japan, but with the additional religious belief that suicide to bring about global armed jihad is what Allah wants. There isn't any way to negotiate with people who are brought up from birth to believe that suicide is an honorable alternative to surrender.
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