agz win said:

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aggie93 said:

---

Personally I am treating this as a shock moment and a mourning period to follow but Trump's chances of winning the General were officially killed yesterday with the announcement of that Judge.

---

Donald's chances of winning 2024 were killed long before yesterday and mostly due to his own failings and ineptitude. Much of the Aggie Cult45 should inner reflect on continued devotion to this false god and the Aggie Honor Code.

---

There it is the petty name calling "Cult45"

LarryElder said:

---

agz win said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Personally I am treating this as a shock moment and a mourning period to follow but Trump's chances of winning the General were officially killed yesterday with the announcement of that Judge.

---

Donald's chances of winning 2024 were killed long before yesterday and mostly due to his own failings and ineptitude. Much of the Aggie Cult45 should inner reflect on continued devotion to this false god and the Aggie Honor Code.

---

There it is the petty name calling "Cult45"

---

But it be hilarious if it was intentionally misspelled, right?

"Kuuullllt45Forty-Five"

J. Walter Weatherman said:

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FireAg said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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texagbeliever said:

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Since your edit really changed your post. The second part you added is meh.

It is out of our hands. I think Trumps unfitness will likely lead dems to want to take him out. But you can't argue that Trump as president will be at worst a hold of serve for our republic and setup DeSantis for success in 2028.

---

Trump will never be president. Even if he wins the primary he has a 0.0 percent chance of winning the election. Not sure how many more ways we can put that but that's the number one reason most on here are so adamant about him not being the nominee.

And I'll avoid posting about the "stolen election" anymore so we can stop derailing the thread, but if Trump's own handpicked people are admitting under oath that it's bs and every case has been thrown out of court, and that doesn't count as evidence to you that this is all a grift (what happened to the $250MM in Stop the Steal money?) then there's apparently nothing that will ever convince you.

---

If that's true, then why continue to pursue fabricated "crimes" against him? Either he's a threat and you pursue him, or he isn't and you ignore him...

---

My opinion - 2 items that can both be true to varying degrees:

1. Every time they charge him his polling and fundraising numbers go up, increasing the likelihood he wins the primary.

2. They think they can convict him because they are convinced he broke the law.

---

Why "boost" him if your plan is to have D SoS's remove him from some states' general ballots in some 2024 which would be seen as a bigger steal of an election than what some truly believe happened in 2020?

I am 100% confident they aren't chasing him to make him more popular...they are chasing him to disqualify him so he isn't the R nominee...

FireAg said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

FireAg said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Since your edit really changed your post. The second part you added is meh.

It is out of our hands. I think Trumps unfitness will likely lead dems to want to take him out. But you can't argue that Trump as president will be at worst a hold of serve for our republic and setup DeSantis for success in 2028.

---

Trump will never be president. Even if he wins the primary he has a 0.0 percent chance of winning the election. Not sure how many more ways we can put that but that's the number one reason most on here are so adamant about him not being the nominee.

And I'll avoid posting about the "stolen election" anymore so we can stop derailing the thread, but if Trump's own handpicked people are admitting under oath that it's bs and every case has been thrown out of court, and that doesn't count as evidence to you that this is all a grift (what happened to the $250MM in Stop the Steal money?) then there's apparently nothing that will ever convince you.

---

If that's true, then why continue to pursue fabricated "crimes" against him? Either he's a threat and you pursue him, or he isn't and you ignore him...

---

My opinion - 2 items that can both be true to varying degrees:

1. Every time they charge him his polling and fundraising numbers go up, increasing the likelihood he wins the primary.

2. They think they can convict him because they are convinced he broke the law.

---

Why "boost" him if your plan is to have D SoS's remove him from some states' general ballots in some 2024 which would be seen as a bigger steal of an election than what some truly believe happened in 2020?

I am 100% confident they aren't chasing him to make him more popular...they are chasing him to disqualify him so he isn't the R nominee...

---

Sorry, I may have not been following the earlier discussions and was responding to your point in isolation. I don't think there's any chance dem SoS remove him from the ballots. 1. They don't need to because he's going to lose, especially in a state that already has a Dem gov/SoS and 2. I don't think that passes the inevitable Constitutional test that would go with it, assuming it goes all the way to a conservative Supreme Court, and they know that.

LarryElder said:

---

agz win said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Personally I am treating this as a shock moment and a mourning period to follow but Trump's chances of winning the General were officially killed yesterday with the announcement of that Judge.

---

Donald's chances of winning 2024 were killed long before yesterday and mostly due to his own failings and ineptitude. Much of the Aggie Cult45 should inner reflect on continued devotion to this false god and the Aggie Honor Code.

---

There it is the petty name calling "Cult45"

---

I was surprised when I saw a woman at a Trump rally say she heard Trump supporters were in a cult and that she was proud to be in that cult.

It seemed like a badge of honor for her. It reminded me of when Hillary called them a basket of deplorables and then a few weeks later you would see maga proudly wearing "I'm a deplorable" at Trump's rallies back in '16.

I wouldn't be surprised if we start seeing maga wearing shirts with the word "cult" on it in future rallies if there's enough people like that woman who wear the term with honor.

No Spin Ag said:

---

LarryElder said:

---

agz win said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Personally I am treating this as a shock moment and a mourning period to follow but Trump's chances of winning the General were officially killed yesterday with the announcement of that Judge.

---

Donald's chances of winning 2024 were killed long before yesterday and mostly due to his own failings and ineptitude. Much of the Aggie Cult45 should inner reflect on continued devotion to this false god and the Aggie Honor Code.

---

There it is the petty name calling "Cult45"

---

I was surprised when I saw a woman at a Trump rally say she heard Trump supporters were in a cult and that she was proud to be in that cult.

It seemed like a badge of honor for her. It reminded me of when Hillary called them a basket of deplorables and then a few weeks later you would see maga proudly wearing "I'm a deplorable" at Trump's rallies back in '16.

I wouldn't be surprised if we start seeing maga wearing shirts with the word "cult" on it in future rallies if there's enough people like that woman who wear the term with honor.

---

Sounds like the woman at the SC rally who said she came to "bask in the presence of Trump".

And its funny that Larry is miffed about the Cult45 name when it is Trump and his followers who started tossing out infantile nicknames, but can't take it when someone throws it back at them.

Rapier108 said:

---

No Spin Ag said:

---

LarryElder said:

---

agz win said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Personally I am treating this as a shock moment and a mourning period to follow but Trump's chances of winning the General were officially killed yesterday with the announcement of that Judge.

---

Donald's chances of winning 2024 were killed long before yesterday and mostly due to his own failings and ineptitude. Much of the Aggie Cult45 should inner reflect on continued devotion to this false god and the Aggie Honor Code.

---

There it is the petty name calling "Cult45"

---

I was surprised when I saw a woman at a Trump rally say she heard Trump supporters were in a cult and that she was proud to be in that cult.

It seemed like a badge of honor for her. It reminded me of when Hillary called them a basket of deplorables and then a few weeks later you would see maga proudly wearing "I'm a deplorable" at Trump's rallies back in '16.

I wouldn't be surprised if we start seeing maga wearing shirts with the word "cult" on it in future rallies if there's enough people like that woman who wear the term with honor.

---

Sounds like the woman at the SC rally who said she came to "bask in the presence of Trump".

And its funny that Larry is miffed about the Cult45 name when it is Trump and his followers who started tossing out infantile nicknames, but can't take it when someone throws it back at them.

---

"Bask in the presence?"

That's second coming of Jesus talk right there.

aggie93 said:

---

The Democrats have a far more coordinated plan than Republicans and that is their big advantage. They have Biden but can pull him and replace him and no one will really raise a fuss either way. They have a massive vote gathering operation in place and legal teams already working to make favorable election laws for them. They have the media fully in their court pushing whatever narrative they want. Then they are doing all they can to divide and conquer Republicans and are doing their best to either get the opponent they want or to severely damage whomever they are up against. In short all of their focus is on the end goal.

Republicans OTOH couldn't be more divided and it is more than just DeSantis vs Trump. You have about 10% that really don't like either because they don't like MAGA policies, they want the old school Neocon/Compassionate Conservative crap. In the end I think this war has to happen to figure out who wins but make no mistake it is going to be ugly as hell and it could also cost us the bigger war if we aren't careful. I just don't see how it gets avoided with the different sides so dug in.

er

---

I don't think the D's think Biden can win...and I don't think this is just a "D" operation...

I think this is an "establishment" operation with Ds and Rs, and they don't think Biden can win (or that they can cheat him to a win) this time around...

I do agree with you though...they have absolutely divided the Rs...but I think many were hoping DeSantis could win it on his own merits and (whether you agree with their thoughts on this or not), I do believe that they perceive DeSantis to be less dangerous to their cause than Trump...and I am not talking dangerous to D's...I am talking dangerous to the overall establishment...

Now, folks can throw out all of this "evidence" as to why folks shouldn't make that assumption about DeSantis...and they should assume that DeSantis is even more dangerous to the establishment, but for whatever reason, I think the establishment disagrees...

FireAg said:

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aggie93 said:

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texagbeliever said:

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Guy makes good points then his bias shows.

I believe I posted months ago how DeSantis is the Republican safety net if the Democrats take down Trump. The more success DeSantis has is actually protection for Trump. The more success Trump has is protection for DeSantis. Really just Trump being in it is protection for DeSantis.

The RNC gave themselves 2 avenues for victory. They are now just waiting for the Democrats to pick the winning strategy. That is why Fire and I are trying to help yall realize you are not helping the cause.

If Trump holds off and wins the indictment he will be vindicated and will be bolstered to huge success. If he loses and DeSantis rises then it will be a huge rally to DeSantis and he will win. That is the future. Conservatives are in a good spot.

---

Ah but you miss the real point. Trump is going to be convicted on this indictment, that's really not in question. This judge is the worst imaginable and she is going to have the trial in DC which is 90% Blue. That's essentially like saying you are unsure of the outcome of a case being tried on MSNBC with Joy Reed as the Judge. That's actually not even the worst part. The worst part is Judge will manipulate the timing of the proceedings to favor Democrats as much as possible. She will do everything she can to keep up the outrage at what she is doing and will give Trump some ridiculous sentence afterward.

Let's also not forget about the other 3 legal cases in flux (FL, GA, and NY).

The point of the Democrats is not to worry about the facts at all, it is to distract and win. I completely understand this is a lot to absorb and is deeply unfair but this has been the Democrat plan all along and we can either be proactive or reactive to it. Any way you slice it they have Trump checkmated here and they have backup plans. Now you can get angry that DeSantis can benefit from that but DeSantis didn't do this and his supporters pointing out facts instead of either sitting back quietly or worse buying into the madness that Trump isn't screwed isn't productive.

---

Believe it or not, I agree with you here as well...the chasing of Trump with false crimes that yes, I fully expect him to be convicted of given the heavily unfavorable jurisdictions (no matter how outlandish and dumb the supposed crimes are). is not to fire up his base so he is the nominee... It is to keep him from being on the ticket in 2024 because they don't think they can pull off the same tricks twice...

And if I accept that, then I must also accept that the polling showing Trump pulling away from DeSantis is actually valid, and not some liberal scheme to put an easy candidate at the top of the R ballot in 2024 who can be easily beat without having to scheme and cheat again because he is so "looney" that he can be beat on the up-and-up...

I think there is a very real fear by the establishment (and that includes both sides of the aisle) that if Trump is the R nominee, they won't be able to stop him this time, so the ONLY way to prevent Trump from taking control again is to ensure he is disqualified from being on the 2024 general ballot...

In my opinion, and as misguided as some here might think it is (because the argument from some is DeSantis is more "anti-establishment" than Trump), I believe that the establishment fears Trump more than anyone else who could run...

And as I mentioned previously...the clock is ticking...and they know it...

---

I mean obviously we disagree on the latter point. I just don't know of anyone that didn't vote for Trump last time who will vote for him this time. I know a lot of people that did vote Trump who won't and I even know more who have zero enthusiasm to vote for him but will anyway (I am in that camp).

The problem is the Democrats already have their plan and machinery in place. They will get their votes because of that machinery and having Trump makes it even easier to do so. He's the perfect foil for them with a solid majority of the country that either hates him with a passion or is just really, really tired of him. If you take out Biden and replace him then it becomes an even easier case because Trump will be another 80 year old President vs someone young and new to the scene (even if it is someone disgusting like Newsom or Granholm). People in the middle tend to vote against the person they dislike more vs voting for the person they like better. Trump is only marginally less popular (but still less popular) than Biden but anyone else (outside of maybe Kamala) just needs to come out and point to Trump and say "I'm not him" and win.

I don't know how you think there is this groundswell of people outside of the GOP that is going to put Trump on their shoulders to vote for him. That doesn't exist and isn't going to. This is all before the media REALLY goes both barrels on him and ignores the fact that Trump has no money. I also don't see large numbers of folks going out in the streets to raise hell after Jan 6 or how that would be successful. That would be if Trump were actually running a smart and disciplined campaign and not saying crazy stuff constantly to get himself in more trouble.

I know you aren't there yet and that's fine. Just study the chessboard more closely and you can see the moves, all of this is talking about 8 or 9 moves down the line, that's the hard thing to see. I think you are looking about 5 moves. The key is to remember that to the Democrats this is about winning in November of '24 by any means necessary and they have zero concern for their own voters other than to know they will get in line so long as they can win.

J. Walter Weatherman said:

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FireAg said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

FireAg said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Since your edit really changed your post. The second part you added is meh.

It is out of our hands. I think Trumps unfitness will likely lead dems to want to take him out. But you can't argue that Trump as president will be at worst a hold of serve for our republic and setup DeSantis for success in 2028.

---

Trump will never be president. Even if he wins the primary he has a 0.0 percent chance of winning the election. Not sure how many more ways we can put that but that's the number one reason most on here are so adamant about him not being the nominee.

And I'll avoid posting about the "stolen election" anymore so we can stop derailing the thread, but if Trump's own handpicked people are admitting under oath that it's bs and every case has been thrown out of court, and that doesn't count as evidence to you that this is all a grift (what happened to the $250MM in Stop the Steal money?) then there's apparently nothing that will ever convince you.

---

If that's true, then why continue to pursue fabricated "crimes" against him? Either he's a threat and you pursue him, or he isn't and you ignore him...

---

My opinion - 2 items that can both be true to varying degrees:

1. Every time they charge him his polling and fundraising numbers go up, increasing the likelihood he wins the primary.

2. They think they can convict him because they are convinced he broke the law.

---

Why "boost" him if your plan is to have D SoS's remove him from some states' general ballots in some 2024 which would be seen as a bigger steal of an election than what some truly believe happened in 2020?

I am 100% confident they aren't chasing him to make him more popular...they are chasing him to disqualify him so he isn't the R nominee...

---

Sorry, I may have not been following the earlier discussions and was responding to your point in isolation. I don't think there's any chance dem SoS remove him from the ballots. 1. They don't need to because he's going to lose, especially in a state that already has a Dem gov/SoS and 2. I don't think that passes the inevitable Constitutional test that would go with it, assuming it goes all the way to a conservative Supreme Court, and they know that.

---

I agree with you...but some very vocal, pro-DeSantis types this morning made those exact claims...that this was all a scheme to get Trump on the general ballots and then have D SoS's remove his name so the D would win...

That is absolutely not what is going to happen, in my opinion...

No Spin Ag said:

---

Rapier108 said:

---

No Spin Ag said:

---

LarryElder said:

---

agz win said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Personally I am treating this as a shock moment and a mourning period to follow but Trump's chances of winning the General were officially killed yesterday with the announcement of that Judge.

---

Donald's chances of winning 2024 were killed long before yesterday and mostly due to his own failings and ineptitude. Much of the Aggie Cult45 should inner reflect on continued devotion to this false god and the Aggie Honor Code.

---

There it is the petty name calling "Cult45"

---

I was surprised when I saw a woman at a Trump rally say she heard Trump supporters were in a cult and that she was proud to be in that cult.

It seemed like a badge of honor for her. It reminded me of when Hillary called them a basket of deplorables and then a few weeks later you would see maga proudly wearing "I'm a deplorable" at Trump's rallies back in '16.

I wouldn't be surprised if we start seeing maga wearing shirts with the word "cult" on it in future rallies if there's enough people like that woman who wear the term with honor.

---

Sounds like the woman at the SC rally who said she came to "bask in the presence of Trump".

And its funny that Larry is miffed about the Cult45 name when it is Trump and his followers who started tossing out infantile nicknames, but can't take it when someone throws it back at them.

---

"Bask in the presence?"

That's second coming of Jesus talk right there.

---

Like this woman.

FireAg said:

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Phatbob said:

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texagbeliever said:

---

That's fine, it is out of our hands. I think Trumps unfitness will likely lead dems to want to take him out. But you can't argue that Trump as president will be at worst a hold of serve for our republic and setup DeSantis for success in 2028.

---

I used to think that, but the way he has behaved since even before the election has made me not think that anymore. I truly believe we will be in a worse place in 4 years if he is president. Not as bad as with Biden, but still worse than now.

---

I'm not proud of the way Trump acts...but to be fair, how would any one of us act if we were in his shoes and constantly battling completely fabricated crimes? I fully admit that I think I would be quite petulant myself...

---

If I were a billionaire with a banging hot wife?

LOL I wouldn't even be here, I'd be on a yacht of mine enjoying my F you money and said wife.

aggie93 said:

---

The key is to remember that to the Democrats this is about winning in November of '24 by any means necessary and they have zero concern for their own voters other than to know they will get in line so long as they can win.

---

And there, in a nutshell, is the problem I see, and why I think this R infighting is futile and precisely the wrong approach...

I agree with you...they will try to win with any means necessary...

Therefore, it should be assumed (again, in my opinion) that if they can do it to Trump, they can do it to anyone...even DeSantis...

And THAT is what we should be protecting against...I'm just not sure how...especially with everyone worried about cutesy labels and zingers...

FireAg said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

FireAg said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

FireAg said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Since your edit really changed your post. The second part you added is meh.

It is out of our hands. I think Trumps unfitness will likely lead dems to want to take him out. But you can't argue that Trump as president will be at worst a hold of serve for our republic and setup DeSantis for success in 2028.

---

Trump will never be president. Even if he wins the primary he has a 0.0 percent chance of winning the election. Not sure how many more ways we can put that but that's the number one reason most on here are so adamant about him not being the nominee.

And I'll avoid posting about the "stolen election" anymore so we can stop derailing the thread, but if Trump's own handpicked people are admitting under oath that it's bs and every case has been thrown out of court, and that doesn't count as evidence to you that this is all a grift (what happened to the $250MM in Stop the Steal money?) then there's apparently nothing that will ever convince you.

---

If that's true, then why continue to pursue fabricated "crimes" against him? Either he's a threat and you pursue him, or he isn't and you ignore him...

---

My opinion - 2 items that can both be true to varying degrees:

1. Every time they charge him his polling and fundraising numbers go up, increasing the likelihood he wins the primary.

2. They think they can convict him because they are convinced he broke the law.

---

Why "boost" him if your plan is to have D SoS's remove him from some states' general ballots in some 2024 which would be seen as a bigger steal of an election than what some truly believe happened in 2020?

I am 100% confident they aren't chasing him to make him more popular...they are chasing him to disqualify him so he isn't the R nominee...

---

Sorry, I may have not been following the earlier discussions and was responding to your point in isolation. I don't think there's any chance dem SoS remove him from the ballots. 1. They don't need to because he's going to lose, especially in a state that already has a Dem gov/SoS and 2. I don't think that passes the inevitable Constitutional test that would go with it, assuming it goes all the way to a conservative Supreme Court, and they know that.

---

I agree with you...but some very vocal, pro-DeSantis types this morning made those exact claims...that this was all a scheme to get Trump on the general ballots and then have D SoS's remove his name so the D would win...

That is absolutely not what is going to happen, in my opinion...

---

I think the point on the SoS is that is an option not a certainty. Democrats have no guardrails and that would be a raw power move but honestly it is less of a move than what is going on with Trump in DC with Smith and this new Judge. I would not count on them holding up because of backlash nor would I count on an effective backlash. We just don't know.

I see this as essentially one more card in the deck though and not one they want to play unless they feel they need to.

Like I said it's a possibility. This Hunter thing goes sideways over the next 6 months, you don't think they'd play that card?

TRM said:

---

Like I said it's a possibility. This Hunter thing goes sideways over the next 6 months, you don't think they'd play that card?

---

No, I don't...because if they did...you will have blood running in the streets...

I am hopeful that no American, even the liberalist of the libs, would want to see that...

But if that is the "nuclear" plan...GOD HELP US ALL...

Blood in the streets? Doubtful. Maybe a few protests, but nothing like BLM protests. We conservatives actually have to work. I know I wouldn't sacrifice my life for Trump. Would you?

TRM said:

---

No Spin Ag said:

---

Rapier108 said:

---

No Spin Ag said:

---

LarryElder said:

---

agz win said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Personally I am treating this as a shock moment and a mourning period to follow but Trump's chances of winning the General were officially killed yesterday with the announcement of that Judge.

---

Donald's chances of winning 2024 were killed long before yesterday and mostly due to his own failings and ineptitude. Much of the Aggie Cult45 should inner reflect on continued devotion to this false god and the Aggie Honor Code.

---

There it is the petty name calling "Cult45"

---

I was surprised when I saw a woman at a Trump rally say she heard Trump supporters were in a cult and that she was proud to be in that cult.

It seemed like a badge of honor for her. It reminded me of when Hillary called them a basket of deplorables and then a few weeks later you would see maga proudly wearing "I'm a deplorable" at Trump's rallies back in '16.

I wouldn't be surprised if we start seeing maga wearing shirts with the word "cult" on it in future rallies if there's enough people like that woman who wear the term with honor.

---

Sounds like the woman at the SC rally who said she came to "bask in the presence of Trump".

And its funny that Larry is miffed about the Cult45 name when it is Trump and his followers who started tossing out infantile nicknames, but can't take it when someone throws it back at them.

---

"Bask in the presence?"

That's second coming of Jesus talk right there.

---

Like this woman.

---

Yep

FireAg said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

The key is to remember that to the Democrats this is about winning in November of '24 by any means necessary and they have zero concern for their own voters other than to know they will get in line so long as they can win.

---

And there, in a nutshell, is the problem I see, and why I think this R infighting is futile and precisely the wrong approach...

I agree with you...they will try to win with any means necessary...

Therefore, it should be assumed (again, in my opinion) that if they can do it to Trump, they can do it to anyone...even DeSantis...

And THAT is what we should be protecting against...I'm just not sure how...especially with everyone worried about cutesy labels and zingers...

---

I agree they will try and go after DeSantis but I don't agree that DeSantis is in the same zipcode of vulnerability as Trump is. Beyond the fact they have multiple active cases in process right now on Trump and even among his supporters most people don't think he is a good human, Trump is an expert at handing his opponents the rope to hang him. He wants them to like him. He wants to be proven right and for them to admit it. He is insanely undisciplined and surrounded by some of the biggest idiots in politics, I mean Roger Stone still has a serious seat at the table with Trump.

DeSantis is a much, much tougher target. He's a Harvard lawyer who runs a super tight ship. He surrounds himself with serious intellectuals and tolerates no leaks. He has no personal scandals and has by all accounts lived about as ideal of a life as any person you can find. He also has a personality that is serious and is a good looking guy with a great wife and family that he can show off. In short he is a really hard guy to hate and he has a stack of bodies for people that have tried to take him down because he always does his homework before making a move (Disney being one example but his Covid response is filled with them. He also took down a Dem ballot harvesting scheme in Florida and a Soros DA). They tried to nail him on all of them but discovered he was already 3 steps ahead of them and he was the one who nailed them to the wall.

Now does that mean DeSantis is invincible? Nope, they will keep trying. It just means he is a much, much tougher mark and he has an actual chance to turn this thing on its head.

TRM said:

---

Like I said it's a possibility. This Hunter thing goes sideways over the next 6 months, you don't think they'd play that card?

---

Eh, if the Hunter thing goes sideways they just put Newsome on the ballot. Trump has a zero percent chance at winning the general, but even less of a chance at winning a state that has a Democrat administration who would be willing to do this. There's just no point in taking the risk.

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

TRM said:

---

Like I said it's a possibility. This Hunter thing goes sideways over the next 6 months, you don't think they'd play that card?

---

Eh, if the Hunter thing goes sideways they just put Newsome on the ballot. Trump has a zero percent chance at winning the general, but even less of a chance at winning a state that has a Democrat administration who would be willing to do this. There's just no point in taking the risk.

---

After a certain of point time they won't have that option to replace him with Newsom.

FireAg said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

FireAg said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

FireAg said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Since your edit really changed your post. The second part you added is meh.

It is out of our hands. I think Trumps unfitness will likely lead dems to want to take him out. But you can't argue that Trump as president will be at worst a hold of serve for our republic and setup DeSantis for success in 2028.

---

Trump will never be president. Even if he wins the primary he has a 0.0 percent chance of winning the election. Not sure how many more ways we can put that but that's the number one reason most on here are so adamant about him not being the nominee.

And I'll avoid posting about the "stolen election" anymore so we can stop derailing the thread, but if Trump's own handpicked people are admitting under oath that it's bs and every case has been thrown out of court, and that doesn't count as evidence to you that this is all a grift (what happened to the $250MM in Stop the Steal money?) then there's apparently nothing that will ever convince you.

---

If that's true, then why continue to pursue fabricated "crimes" against him? Either he's a threat and you pursue him, or he isn't and you ignore him...

---

My opinion - 2 items that can both be true to varying degrees:

1. Every time they charge him his polling and fundraising numbers go up, increasing the likelihood he wins the primary.

2. They think they can convict him because they are convinced he broke the law.

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Why "boost" him if your plan is to have D SoS's remove him from some states' general ballots in some 2024 which would be seen as a bigger steal of an election than what some truly believe happened in 2020?

I am 100% confident they aren't chasing him to make him more popular...they are chasing him to disqualify him so he isn't the R nominee...

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Sorry, I may have not been following the earlier discussions and was responding to your point in isolation. I don't think there's any chance dem SoS remove him from the ballots. 1. They don't need to because he's going to lose, especially in a state that already has a Dem gov/SoS and 2. I don't think that passes the inevitable Constitutional test that would go with it, assuming it goes all the way to a conservative Supreme Court, and they know that.

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I agree with you...but some very vocal, pro-DeSantis types this morning made those exact claims...that this was all a scheme to get Trump on the general ballots and then have D SoS's remove his name so the D would win...

That is absolutely not what is going to happen, in my opinion...

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Why does everything have to be an overarching scheme to reach this exact point? It's just pivoting to the best options you have given the circumstances and what is working. It's adjusting at halftime. They can do a shotgun approach and see what sticks. I don't see why they wouldn't give it a go and see if they can get a W out of it, just like with these indictments. They lose nothing in the attempt.

Phatbob said:

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FireAg said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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FireAg said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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FireAg said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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texagbeliever said:

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Since your edit really changed your post. The second part you added is meh.

It is out of our hands. I think Trumps unfitness will likely lead dems to want to take him out. But you can't argue that Trump as president will be at worst a hold of serve for our republic and setup DeSantis for success in 2028.

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Trump will never be president. Even if he wins the primary he has a 0.0 percent chance of winning the election. Not sure how many more ways we can put that but that's the number one reason most on here are so adamant about him not being the nominee.

And I'll avoid posting about the "stolen election" anymore so we can stop derailing the thread, but if Trump's own handpicked people are admitting under oath that it's bs and every case has been thrown out of court, and that doesn't count as evidence to you that this is all a grift (what happened to the $250MM in Stop the Steal money?) then there's apparently nothing that will ever convince you.

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If that's true, then why continue to pursue fabricated "crimes" against him? Either he's a threat and you pursue him, or he isn't and you ignore him...

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My opinion - 2 items that can both be true to varying degrees:

1. Every time they charge him his polling and fundraising numbers go up, increasing the likelihood he wins the primary.

2. They think they can convict him because they are convinced he broke the law.

---

Why "boost" him if your plan is to have D SoS's remove him from some states' general ballots in some 2024 which would be seen as a bigger steal of an election than what some truly believe happened in 2020?

I am 100% confident they aren't chasing him to make him more popular...they are chasing him to disqualify him so he isn't the R nominee...

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Sorry, I may have not been following the earlier discussions and was responding to your point in isolation. I don't think there's any chance dem SoS remove him from the ballots. 1. They don't need to because he's going to lose, especially in a state that already has a Dem gov/SoS and 2. I don't think that passes the inevitable Constitutional test that would go with it, assuming it goes all the way to a conservative Supreme Court, and they know that.

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I agree with you...but some very vocal, pro-DeSantis types this morning made those exact claims...that this was all a scheme to get Trump on the general ballots and then have D SoS's remove his name so the D would win...

That is absolutely not what is going to happen, in my opinion...

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Why does everything have to be an overarching scheme to reach this exact point? It's just pivoting to the best options you have given the circumstances and what is working. It's adjusting at halftime. They can do a shotgun approach and see what sticks. I don't see why they wouldn't give it a go and see if they can get a W out of it, just like with these indictments. They lose nothing in the attempt.

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Exactly, I've said this numerous times. Its stupid and oblivious of recent events to assume the Dems have one set of plays they're running. They're running an option offense. The end goal is the same...disrupt the election....but how they make in down the field isn't set in stone.

Phatbob said:

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Why does everything have to be an overarching scheme to reach this exact point? It's just pivoting to the best options you have given the circumstances and what is working. It's adjusting at halftime. They can do a shotgun approach and see what sticks. I don't see why they wouldn't give it a go and see if they can get a W out of it, just like with these indictments. They lose nothing in the attempt.

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I don't disagree with you...but that also goes toward my point...

Contrary to what some think is true, it is my opinion that this, as you phrased it..."shotgun approach to see what they can get to stick" is proof that they are actually worried about him being the nominee...anything the establishment can do to prevent him being the nominee, they will try to do...it's easier than having to rig another election...

“Spending is out of control … The reason why it’s gotten to this point is because Republicans are so worried of 'a government shutdown.’ First of all, the government doesn't actually shut down, they take non-essential workers and then they don't work. But why do we have… pic.twitter.com/ASTfLwHfRJ

— DeSantis War Room 🐊 (@DeSantisWarRoom) August 2, 2023

TRM said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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TRM said:

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Like I said it's a possibility. This Hunter thing goes sideways over the next 6 months, you don't think they'd play that card?

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Eh, if the Hunter thing goes sideways they just put Newsome on the ballot. Trump has a zero percent chance at winning the general, but even less of a chance at winning a state that has a Democrat administration who would be willing to do this. There's just no point in taking the risk.

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After a certain of point time they won't have that option to replace him with Newsom.

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They can do it anytime up until the DNC Convention next Summer, it's an easy sell that Biden had to withdraw for health or family reasons. Personally I think they are basically having a mini primary with the elite Dems as the only ones who count deciding between Newsom, Harris, and maybe Granholm. They will keep raising the profiles of all of them and see who is getting traction.

Democrats are used to getting in line and their Party is already owned by a small group of Billionaires that fund the voting operations. 99% of them are just lemmings that do what they are told.

FireAg said:

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Phatbob said:

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Why does everything have to be an overarching scheme to reach this exact point? It's just pivoting to the best options you have given the circumstances and what is working. It's adjusting at halftime. They can do a shotgun approach and see what sticks. I don't see why they wouldn't give it a go and see if they can get a W out of it, just like with these indictments. They lose nothing in the attempt.

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I don't disagree with you...but that also goes toward my point...

Contrary to what some think is true, it is my opinion that this, as you phrased it..."shotgun approach to see what they can get to stick" is proof that they are actually worried about him being the nominee...anything the establishment can do to prevent him being the nominee, they will try to do...it's easier than having to rig another election...

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I don't think they are worried about Trump running as much as they are covering all their bases. Thus the shotgun approach. They aren't using a crystal ball either and it would be better for them to do everything they can, just in case Trump somehow becomes a viable candidate again.

Eager for new leadership, New Hampshire Republicans welcome Ron DeSantis’ visit to Concord

“I think DeSantis is the future.”https://t.co/SaLeo74jts

— DeSantis War Room 🐊 (@DeSantisWarRoom) August 2, 2023

TRM said:

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Eager for new leadership, New Hampshire Republicans welcome Ron DeSantis’ visit to Concord

“I think DeSantis is the future.”https://t.co/SaLeo74jts

— DeSantis War Room 🐊 (@DeSantisWarRoom) August 2, 2023

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I loved the "Get **** Done" mug he was using last week. I feel like that should be his campaign slogan.

NEW: @RonDeSantis scheduled to speak at Fall @CAGOP convention — snagging the Friday dinner keynote slot.

Trump got the Friday lunchtime keynote. pic.twitter.com/hXkYB5UjDO

— Lara Korte (@lara_korte) August 2, 2023

FireAg said:

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Phatbob said:

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Why does everything have to be an overarching scheme to reach this exact point? It's just pivoting to the best options you have given the circumstances and what is working. It's adjusting at halftime. They can do a shotgun approach and see what sticks. I don't see why they wouldn't give it a go and see if they can get a W out of it, just like with these indictments. They lose nothing in the attempt.

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I don't disagree with you...but that also goes toward my point...

Contrary to what some think is true, it is my opinion that this, as you phrased it..."shotgun approach to see what they can get to stick" is proof that they are actually worried about him being the nominee...anything the establishment can do to prevent him being the nominee, they will try to do...it's easier than having to rig another election...

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And I think there is a wrinkle in the "if they do it to Trump, they will do it to anyone" thought. I'm pretty sure they are already trying that.

All. The. Time.

They have just only been able to get it off the ground with Trump. Just the consequences of how he operates.

TRM said:

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NEW: @RonDeSantis scheduled to speak at Fall @CAGOP convention — snagging the Friday dinner keynote slot.

Trump got the Friday lunchtime keynote. pic.twitter.com/hXkYB5UjDO

— Lara Korte (@lara_korte) August 2, 2023

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Well sure, that's because Trump has way more energy at noon than he has in the evening. If you want an example just go look at his lackluster recital during the Iowa Lincoln dinner the other week. Folks this is Biden 2020 version 2.0.

Phatbob said:

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FireAg said:

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Phatbob said:

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Why does everything have to be an overarching scheme to reach this exact point? It's just pivoting to the best options you have given the circumstances and what is working. It's adjusting at halftime. They can do a shotgun approach and see what sticks. I don't see why they wouldn't give it a go and see if they can get a W out of it, just like with these indictments. They lose nothing in the attempt.

---

I don't disagree with you...but that also goes toward my point...

Contrary to what some think is true, it is my opinion that this, as you phrased it..."shotgun approach to see what they can get to stick" is proof that they are actually worried about him being the nominee...anything the establishment can do to prevent him being the nominee, they will try to do...it's easier than having to rig another election...

---

And I think there is a wrinkle in the "if they do it to Trump, they will do it to anyone" thought. I'm pretty sure they are already trying that.

All. The. Time.

They have just only been able to get it off the ground with Trump. Just the consequences of how he operates.

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I don't disagree with you nor do I think Trump does himself any favors with how he reacts...

BUT...

That doesn't mean he actually committed any crimes...

I'm reading today about these hand written notes from Pence about conversations he allegedly had with Trump leading up to the election certification, and I'm sorry, but there is simply no way you can convict someone on a felony over someone else's hand written notes, with no chain of custody, etc...

Besides the fact, he didn't order Pence to do anything as per Pence's own notes...he allegedly chastised him, but he didn't actually order him to commit a crime...

It won't matter due to the courts which will be trying these cases...Trump quite literally can't win in those courtrooms... But if this was you or I, a criminal court would laugh at his "evidence"...

FireAg said:

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Phatbob said:

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FireAg said:

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Phatbob said:

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Why does everything have to be an overarching scheme to reach this exact point? It's just pivoting to the best options you have given the circumstances and what is working. It's adjusting at halftime. They can do a shotgun approach and see what sticks. I don't see why they wouldn't give it a go and see if they can get a W out of it, just like with these indictments. They lose nothing in the attempt.

---

I don't disagree with you...but that also goes toward my point...

Contrary to what some think is true, it is my opinion that this, as you phrased it..."shotgun approach to see what they can get to stick" is proof that they are actually worried about him being the nominee...anything the establishment can do to prevent him being the nominee, they will try to do...it's easier than having to rig another election...

---

And I think there is a wrinkle in the "if they do it to Trump, they will do it to anyone" thought. I'm pretty sure they are already trying that.

All. The. Time.

They have just only been able to get it off the ground with Trump. Just the consequences of how he operates.

---

I don't disagree with you nor do I think Trump does himself any favors with how he reacts...

BUT...

That doesn't mean he actually committed any crimes...

I'm reading today about these hand written notes from Pence about conversations he allegedly had with Trump leading up to the election certification, and I'm sorry, but there is simply no way you can convict someone on a felony over someone else's hand written notes, with no chain of custody, etc...

Besides the fact, he didn't order Pence to do anything as per Pence's own notes...he allegedly chastised him, but he didn't actually order him to commit a crime...

It won't matter due to the courts which will be trying these cases...Trump quite literally can't win in those courtrooms... But if this was you or I, a criminal court would laugh at his "evidence"...

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I agree, but legally they just need to get some jury to interpret what he was doing as nefarious. It's not going to be too hard to convince a group of liberals on a jury that it was. They already think he is "dangerous to democracy". That is an unfortunate side effect of Trump the a-hole. This is how "mean tweets" finally comes back to bite him in the ass.

Phatbob said:

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FireAg said:

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Phatbob said:

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FireAg said:

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Phatbob said:

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Why does everything have to be an overarching scheme to reach this exact point? It's just pivoting to the best options you have given the circumstances and what is working. It's adjusting at halftime. They can do a shotgun approach and see what sticks. I don't see why they wouldn't give it a go and see if they can get a W out of it, just like with these indictments. They lose nothing in the attempt.

---

I don't disagree with you...but that also goes toward my point...

Contrary to what some think is true, it is my opinion that this, as you phrased it..."shotgun approach to see what they can get to stick" is proof that they are actually worried about him being the nominee...anything the establishment can do to prevent him being the nominee, they will try to do...it's easier than having to rig another election...

---

And I think there is a wrinkle in the "if they do it to Trump, they will do it to anyone" thought. I'm pretty sure they are already trying that.

All. The. Time.

They have just only been able to get it off the ground with Trump. Just the consequences of how he operates.

---

I don't disagree with you nor do I think Trump does himself any favors with how he reacts...

BUT...

That doesn't mean he actually committed any crimes...

I'm reading today about these hand written notes from Pence about conversations he allegedly had with Trump leading up to the election certification, and I'm sorry, but there is simply no way you can convict someone on a felony over someone else's hand written notes, with no chain of custody, etc...

Besides the fact, he didn't order Pence to do anything as per Pence's own notes...he allegedly chastised him, but he didn't actually order him to commit a crime...

It won't matter due to the courts which will be trying these cases...Trump quite literally can't win in those courtrooms... But if this was you or I, a criminal court would laugh at his "evidence"...

---

I agree, but legally they just need to get some jury to interpret what he was doing as nefarious. It's not going to be too hard to convince a group of liberals on a jury that it was. They already think he is "dangerous to democracy". That is an unfortunate side effect of Trump the a-hole. This is how "mean tweets" finally comes back to bite him in the ass.

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I don't disagree with you, but as red-blooded American, I am categorically against throwing someone in prison just because he's a jerk on social media...

If you're going to prison for a felony, there needs to be an actual crime committed...

Thing is, in the end, Trump probably gets these eventual "convictions" overturned on appeal...but the end goal isn't to put him in prison...the end goal is to keep him from getting elected, and in that vein, they hope to do so by making it illegal for him to run (as a convicted felon)...

If Trump was "so terribly unelectable in a truly fair election", then why the need to go through all of this if they weren't actually afraid of him getting re-elected in an election that was fair?

People have been throwing around "kangaroo court" and "banana republic"...that exactly what this is...

They truly don't think they have what it takes to steal it twice (or, at the very least, they know it will be infinitely harder to pull it off a second time)...

People think the media, D's, and establishment "want Trump to be the nominee because he will be easy to defeat in a [fair] election"... I disagree... I think they know defeating him in a [fair] election will be astronomically difficult, and THAT is why they are hammering him now...so that he can't continue running...