***Russian - Ukraine War Tactical and Strategic Updates*** [Warning on OP]

7,563,167 Views | 47754 Replies | Last: 17 hrs ago by 74OA
sclaff
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74OA said:

China says it will be "impartial" about Ukraine, peace talks in Saudi a slap to Putin and other miscellaneous notes.

Waffledynamics
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Quote:

Ukraine defense forces have tactical success at Mala Tokmachka - Robotyne direction


https://liveuamap.com/en/2023/7-august-ukraine-defense-forces-have-tactical-success-at
74OA
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Chinese "impartiality" is a joke, but there's been myriad reporting of western--including US--parts similarly being found in Russian weapons. Unfortunately, sanctions are notoriously porous in that particular regard.
Waffledynamics
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Interesting note from a Uke soldier on the Zaporizhzhia front:

https://t.me/altfa_galraich/1196

Quote:

The administrator got out of the landing in one piece and (relatively) healthy, but not everyone was so lucky, of course.

The situation on the frontline where yours truly had the good fortune to visit leaves much to be desired, despite the victorious statements of the Ukrainian Armed Forces press service.

The Katsaps have mastered the skill of unmanned aerial reconnaissance quite well.

While our "birds" are forced to interrupt their work by returning to recharge their batteries, the Katsaps fly in pairs and replace not the battery but the entire drone, rotating the unmanned pair in the air.

"For 90% of the time I was in the combat zone, I heard enemy drones flying overhead, and they saw our every move, our positions, our vehicles. A group of three or more people can be hit by artillery as quickly and accurately as possible, which is why we have to stretch ourselves to unrealistic distances.

In addition to reconnaissance, the Katsaps have mastered "drops" and FPV kamikaze no worse than we have.

And at this point I remember people who argued that drone drops were an ineffective means of destruction.
In the conditions of constant counter-battery fighting on both sides, no one wants to spend shells and expose their positions to destroy, for example, the advanced dug-in SPK, and the dug-in positions need to be worked out for quite a long time to ensure 100% destruction.

In this situation, a drone with a grenade on a hanger is the perfect solution.

Drones can hover over positions indefinitely, changing positions on the fly and dropping grenades at any movement.

The situation when a group goes to change the "watchmen" at the observation post and finds only a full trench of the 200th - has become commonplace, and all because they were quietly, without any haste (as is the case with the deployment and retraction of a mortar), thrown several boxes of "efok" during the day, which rolled into all corners of the position.

And there are no effective and widespread means of countering enemy birds.

One interesting thing to mention is Kadyrov's Akhmat unit. Kadyrov did find his niche, their aerial reconnaissance works very well and the horrors described above are, in many cases, their merit. So they are doing a great job of filming tik-toks directly from the drone and doing something useful for their ****** army.

In other aspects, nothing has changed, Akhmat did not put up a good fight and fled much faster than the Katsaps who held positions in front of them.

Finally, before the admin continues to sour from shell shock, it's worth saying that, as unfortunate as it may sound, it seems we have lost our advantage in drones.
Nevertheless, we are slowly moving forward, no matter how hard it is.

Glory to the Heroes who paid for it with their lives.
#Altfa_Oratio
bonfarr
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May be a dumb question but could drones be countered with small hot-air balloons and netting? How high can RC drones fly? Like the old barrage balloons in WWII.
V8Aggie
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Consumer drones can go thousands of feet in altitude.
ABATTBQ11
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You gotta define drone first.

Some are small quadcopters that are only like 5 lbs. Others are on the scale of large RC planes or big octocopters like 3' in diameter. Then you have the bayraktars and reapers that are the size of a manned aircraft. Even for the small quadcopters you're looking at several hundred feet max altitude. I used to use some of the early DJI drones for work, and they'd get up past 1200'-1500' with ease.
bonfarr
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V8Aggie said:

Consumer drones can go thousands of feet in altitude.


The Brits used barrage balloons to force German bombers above 5000 ft where they were in Range of AAA, seems like it can work. They could at least protect large civilian Metro areas from drone attack
docb
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Going to need to develop one hell of a shotgun to deal with those drones. I don't think it would take much to knock them out but you have to be able to hit it. Or maybe some sort of air burst ammo that releases a lot of strings to get tangled in the propellers?
V8Aggie
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Max service ceiling for a DJI Mavic 3 is listed as 6000 meters. There's also a video of if flying successfully over Mount Everest 30k feet.

Don't think there's anything that can be done regarding the net idea.


Cool info on the Germans though.

ABATTBQ11
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Not really. The small commercial ones on the front lines are way too maneuverable to be bothered by that. Barrage balloons present a hazard to large, fixed wing aircraft that can't easily maneuver through or around their cables, but something like a small quad or even smallish RC sized drone is not going to be big enough or flying fast enough to not be able to avoid them. The larger suicide drones like shahed can easily go over. Or you just fly the first one into a balloon and then fly through the gap.
74OA
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Next-gen self-propelled gun?

lb3
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74OA said:

Chinese "impartiality" is a joke, but there's been myriad reporting of western--including US--parts similarly being found in Russian weapons. Unfortunately, sanctions are notoriously porous in that particular regard.
Impartiality to China means they will sell to both sides so you can't tell how heavy their thumb is on the scales.
The Fife
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V8Aggie said:

Max service ceiling for a DJI Mavic 3 is listed as 6000 meters. There's also a video of if flying successfully over Mount Everest 30k feet.

Don't think there's anything that can be done regarding the net idea.


Cool info on the Germans though.
Drones carrying string, fishing line, wires, netting, whatever that could easily be detached once it's reached its target so that drone doesn't get knocked down too.
MouthBQ98
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I guess they don't come standard with safety chains. But who are we kidding: former Warsaw pact? Safety?
MouthBQ98
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Yep, drones trailing a webbing of fine heavy duty thread or wire would take out any other drone with bladed propulsion.

Detection could be done with IR cameras or other optical means looking against the sky and then you guide it in close and assuming most targets are slow or sometimes stationary and caught unawares, using a killer drone to entangle or even capture (if it is big enough and the target light enough) opposing drones could work.

Even better would be a small integrated area denial system with a small ground based radar trailer and director that can vector anti drone drones into opposing targets.
B-1 83
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How big of a "blast radius" and what size shrapnel/buckshot would be needed for an "anti drone round" of some sort? We're not trying to knock an A-10 out of the sky here……….just thinking out of the box.

Staff - if not relevant, please delete.
Being in TexAgs jail changes a man……..no, not really
Waffledynamics
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Quote:

5 dead and 18 wounded as result of Russian missile strike in Pokrovsk


https://liveuamap.com/en/2023/7-august-5-dead-and-18-wounded-as-result-of-russian-missile

This town looks to be a supply hub for Ukraine on the Donetsk front.
74OA
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B-1 83 said:

How big of a "blast radius" and what size shrapnel/buckshot would be needed for an "anti drone round" of some sort? We're not trying to knock an A-10 out of the sky here……….just thinking out of the box.

Staff - if not relevant, please delete.
Not sure what Gepard/Skyshield/Skyguard's 35mm AHEAD air-burst round's radius is, but it can produce hundreds of fragments and has proven very useful vs drones in Ukraine. The US Army is going with the new 30mm XM1211 HEP for its SHORAD cannons and it's a true proximity round specifically built to take out drones.
Gordo14
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If you've got 20 minutes this is a good watch. Pure evil.
B-1 83
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Something man portable would be cool, but the system to shoot such a round and the size of the rounds would make that pretty much impossible.
Being in TexAgs jail changes a man……..no, not really
AGS-R-TUFF
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In thinking out of the box…

What about developing a drone that could fire (or spray) a paint-like projectile, creating a huge mist or gaseous cloud that could target the camera system. It could be named PGD aka Paintball Gun Drone.

Funny as it may sound, but blind drone equals useless drone.
Gilligan
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I've seen snippets of that, but not all 20 minutes.

That woman and those who help her need to be on an international wanted list.

She should never sleep soundly for the rest of her life.
AgLA06
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Gilligan said:

I've seen snippets of that, but not all 20 minutes.

That woman and those who help her need to be on an international wanted list.

She should never sleep soundly for the rest of her life.
The exact type of target the Mossad was built for. Hopefully the Ukes bring them in to set up a similar unit with similar capabilities.
Blackbeard94
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AGS-R-TUFF said:

In thinking out of the box…

What about developing a drone that could fire (or spray) a paint-like projectile, creating a huge mist or gaseous cloud that could target the camera system. It could be named PGD aka Paintball Gun Drone.

Funny as it may sound, but blind drone equals useless drone.


If you fire a paint like projectile, you can fire a projectile and blow it up. Dead drones tell no tales.
lb3
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AGS-R-TUFF said:

In thinking out of the box…

What about developing a drone that could fire (or spray) a paint-like projectile, creating a huge mist or gaseous cloud that could target the camera system. It could be named PGD aka Paintball Gun Drone.

Funny as it may sound, but blind drone equals useless drone.
They can return to their launch locations autonomously so this would only disable them for a short period of time.

As noted above if you can target them with paint you can target them with more destructive systems.

I suspect that there will eventually be anti-drone drones.
ABATTBQ11
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I think a better idea might be lasers to blind or damage the optics. You don't need to necessarily take down the drone by melting it, you just need to overload and burn out the optical sensors. All these cheap kamikaze drones and modified prosumer drones are using cheap, unprotected camera sensors, so how hard could it be?
docb
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Whatever the method to take them out I am quite sure there is a lot of effort going on to find a means to do it with consistency.
Gilligan
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They already have drone hunters that shoot what looks like a cast net.
P.U.T.U
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They also already have paint drones
JFABNRGR
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Gilligan said:

They already have drone hunters that shoot what looks like a cast net.


And there are Falcons and Pigeons which are very efficient drone hunter killers. Met with a group 3 months back who was working to get DOD funding to go over and work the problem. I will see if I can find out if they are making any progress.
sclaff
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Waffledynamics
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Who else manufactures it? It can't just be the US alone, right? Might not be the best way to meet the needs on the front.
chickencoupe16
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Waffledynamics said:

Who else manufactures it? It can't just be the US alone, right? Might not be the best way to meet the needs on the front.


The comments on Twitter indicate that there are several European companies that produce shells.

Edit to add: somewhere above, it was posted that Ukraine is using 8K per day. At 2.5 million produced per year, Ukraine would fall 53 days short of a full year's use.

P.U.T.U
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With this it looks like this will be a long, drawn out, artillery war. Russia is too ingrained for Ukraine to make a ground push right now
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