***Russian - Ukraine War Tactical and Strategic Updates*** [Warning on OP]

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10:05p, 4/18/22
AG
Really good deep dive into analyzing how the Moskva was attacked and sank.

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Rossticus
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10:06p, 4/18/22
Italy is in. Wow.

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GigEmRangers75455
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In reply to Rossticus • 10:08p, 4/18/22
Rossticus said:
Italy is in. Wow.



I guess better late than never but the onslaught that everyone knew was coming for weeks just started. I'm glad they're getting support but political delays from some of these countries is frustrating.
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Rossticus
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10:09p, 4/18/22
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lb3
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In reply to Waffledynamics • 10:13p, 4/18/22
AG
Waffledynamics said:
Imagine trying to sleep.

I would sleep like a baby. But then again I can sleep anywhere, including in the band hall with 400 BQs playing.
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Rossticus
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In reply to GigEmRangers75455 • 10:14p, 4/18/22
I agree. Lots of countries really thought that if they tried hard enough, Putin would accept a diplomatic path to a mutually agreeable solution.

Just like lots of Americans still think that it's "the west's" fault for not "peacing" hard enough or "negotiating better" with Putin. You can't negotiate with someone who doesn't want to compromise. His stance is "give me everything I want or I'll take it". Only response in the face of that is to decide whether you'd rather risk dying on your feet to maintain your freedom or if you'll accept living on your knees.

Most politicians are coming to that reality. Too many citizens still don't get it.
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Who?mikejones!
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In reply to Rossticus • 10:19p, 4/18/22
Rossticus said:
I agree. Lots of countries really thought that if they tried hard enough, Putin would accept a diplomatic path to a mutually agreeable solution.

Just like lots of Americans still think that it's "the west's" fault for not "peacing" hard enough or "negotiating better" with Putin. You can't negotiate with someone who doesn't want to compromise. His stance is "give me everything I want or I'll take it". Only response in the face of that is to decide whether you'd rather risk dying on your feet to maintain your freedom or if you'll accept living on your knees.

Most politicians are coming to that reality. Too many citizens still don't get it.


I'm currently studying the war in the Pacific. The way the US and UK handled the Japanese leading up to ww2 and the subsequent Japanese response is eerily similar to the west's handling of Russia and its response
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Fitch
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10:34p, 4/18/22
AG
Those video clips remind me of a line from the WWI memoir Storm of Steel that described artillery shelling as:

Quote:
It's an easier matter to describe these sounds than to endure them, because one cannot but associate every single sound of flying steel with the idea of death, and so I huddled in my hole in the ground with my hand in front of my face, imagining all the possible variants of being hit. I think I have found a comparison that captures the situation in which I and all the other soldiers who took part in this war so often found ourselves: you must imagine you are securely tied to a post, being menaced by a man swinging a heavy hammer. Now the hammer has been taken back over his head, ready to be swung, now it's cleaving the air towards you, on the point of touching your skull, then it's struck the post, and the splinters are flying that's what it's like to experience heavy shelling in an exposed position.


Then multiplied by hours and days of the same on repeat.

Helps having some walls, I guess. Till you don't.
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deddog
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In reply to MeatDr • 10:40p, 4/18/22
AG
MeatDr said:
FriscoKid said:


That's intense!


This vid is a recirculated video from an 8 year old training exercise in Saudi Arabia.


Ok that explains the flares and why the firing is all in one direction
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FriscoKid
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In reply to deddog • 10:50p, 4/18/22
AG
Yeah, that video isn't real. Sorry guys.
Hillary paid for warrant to spy on Trump.
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CondensedFogAggie
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In reply to Rossticus • 11:17p, 4/18/22
Rossticus said:


Quote:
"Let me say something to the president of the United States. Give them counter-battery long range artillery... Something that can out-range their artillery. If you do that, you stop the attacks on civilians," Malcom Nance says from Ukraine.
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Sea Speed
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In reply to JFABNRGR • 11:39p, 4/18/22
AG
JFABNRGR said:
aggiehawg said:
I am not sure about this guy. #1 he wasn't there. Doesn't mention this was hours later and the big explosions occurred in the dark. The fires have likely died down significantly at this photo, as a ship sinks it begins extinguishing its own fire. Nor does he say anything about the rate of water coming in versus pumps out.

I don't think we have seen any reports of the Captain still being alive either or have we? loss of leadership would have also been problematic.

He does mention potential of secondary explosions because of ordinance on board but I don't think he stresses enough the risk of staying on board. He also doesn't do a good job explaining the limitations of self rescue without main power.


The dude should know boats but is a major tool. Like cries on video streams tool. He was q captain on q drill ship or semi sub rig.

I would agree that of that is the condition of the ship, and not knowing anything else, there should be damage control efforts under way. There are obviously other factors at play, but if that was just a cargo ship I wouldn't have abandoned it in that condition.
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Ulrich
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11:51p, 4/18/22
I don't know the first thing about Nance but my BS meter is pegged.
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Not a Bot
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In reply to Sea Speed • 11:56p, 4/18/22
AG
The video I posted earlier kind of goes into that.

There's a guy who seems to know his stuff talking about how the Russians don't train all of their sailors to put out fires or in damage mitigation. They have some people onboard with training, but most of their sailors would not know what to do in the event of a hit like this.

After issues with some onboard fires in the Vietnam era, the US begin training all of their sailors in damage mitigation.

They also go into some as of yet unconfirmed rumors that a lot of Soviet naval vessels from that era were rushed into production and this one in particular may not have even been built with watertight sections.
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Dawg6
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In reply to deddog • 12:00a, 4/19/22
AG
deddog said:
MeatDr said:
FriscoKid said:


That's intense!


This vid is a recirculated video from an 8 year old training exercise in Saudi Arabia.


Ok that explains the flares and why the firing is all in one direction
Looks like a mad minute from the 70's.
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Jock 07
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In reply to ABATTBQ11 • 1:20a, 4/19/22
AG
ABATTBQ11 said:
If they target our GPS satellites, that should be considered an attack on the US and Europe directly and result in air strikes IMO.

They won't attack the satellites. PNT is disrupted via downlink jamming.
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CondensedFogAggie
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2:29a, 4/19/22

Please don't read if you currently can't handle some devastating and disgusting testimonies.

But posting here because we can't just turn our heads away from this. Every one of the rapists must be brought to justice... or shot in a ditch I don't care.
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CondensedFogAggie
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In reply to Ulrich • 2:46a, 4/19/22
Ulrich said:
I don't know the first thing about Nance but my BS meter is pegged.
Not sure why this guy pegs your BS meter, but here's a summary of his service record from wikipedia. Even if some is exaggerated, certainly seems qualified to help over there in some capacity.

Quote:
Nance served in the U.S. Navy for 20 years, from 1981 to 2001, receiving several military decorations.[2][9] As a U.S. Navy specialist in Naval Cryptology, Nance was involved in numerous counter-terrorism, intelligence, and combat operations.[10][11][12] He garnered expertise within the fields of intelligence and counterterrorism.[13][14][15] He was also an instructor in wartime and peacetime Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape (SERE), training Navy and Marine Corps pilots and aircrew how to survive as a prisoner of war.[16][17] There Nance helped to initiate the Advanced Terrorism, Abduction and Hostage Survival course of instruction.[2]

Nance took part in combat operations that occurred after the 1983 Beirut barracks bombings, was peripherally involved with the 1986 United States bombing of Libya, served on USS Wainwright during Operation Praying Mantis and was aboard during the sinking of the Iranian missile boat Joshan, served on USS Tripoli during the Gulf War, and assisted during a Banja Luka, Bosnia air strike.

Plenty of other stuff post military career including contractor work in Iraq, etc
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MeatDr
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3:15a, 4/19/22
AG


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MeatDr
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4:08a, 4/19/22
AG
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MeatDr
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7:23a, 4/19/22
AG
Vote in favor or forcibly be transported to Russia....
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Waffledynamics
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In reply to MeatDr • 7:26a, 4/19/22
AG
MeatDr said:


Hope the defenders have watched Home Alone.
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MeatDr
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8:32a, 4/19/22
AG
Advancing north of Mariupol.

And from the northeast. See map at https://m.dailykos.com/stories/2022/4/19/2092753/-Ukraine-update-What-we-learned-from-the-first-day-of-Russia-s-big-Donbas-offensive?pm_campaign=blog&pm_medium=rss&pm_source=
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MeatDr
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8:35a, 4/19/22
AG
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MeatDr
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8:45a, 4/19/22
AG
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aggiehawg
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8:52a, 4/19/22
AG
Quote:
Speaking to West Point cadets and faculty, Dr. Phillip Karber describes what he has learned about the Russian way of war from thirty trips he has made to Ukraine, including six months on the front lines of the war in the country's east. (In 2018)
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MeatDr
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8:54a, 4/19/22
AG
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benchmark
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In reply to MeatDr • 8:59a, 4/19/22
AG
If that graph of gov support for Ukraine is accurate ... it certainly speaks volumes about our European allies.
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MeatDr
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In reply to MeatDr • 9:00a, 4/19/22
AG
This graph might be a bit more fair. Adjusted for GDP.
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Waffledynamics
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In reply to MeatDr • 9:17a, 4/19/22
AG
MeatDr said:
Advancing north of Mariupol.

And from the northeast. See map at https://m.dailykos.com/stories/2022/4/19/2092753/-Ukraine-update-What-we-learned-from-the-first-day-of-Russia-s-big-Donbas-offensive?pm_campaign=blog&pm_medium=rss&pm_source=


You can currently see this advance very clearly on LiveUaMap.
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Bird Poo
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In reply to MeatDr • 9:18a, 4/19/22
AG
Estonia could be next. They SHOULD be sending anything they can into Ukraine.
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Robk
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9:20a, 4/19/22


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AgBQ-00
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In reply to aggiehawg • 9:50a, 4/19/22
AG
aggiehawg said:
Quote:
Speaking to West Point cadets and faculty, Dr. Phillip Karber describes what he has learned about the Russian way of war from thirty trips he has made to Ukraine, including six months on the front lines of the war in the country's east. (In 2018)
Listened to about 3/4ths of this presentation. Wondering if his assumptions have been proven shaky with the performance of Russian troops in the field.
You do not have a soul. You are a soul that has a body.

We sing Hallelujah! The Lamb has overcome!
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aggiehawg
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In reply to AgBQ-00 • 9:59a, 4/19/22
AG
Quote:
Listened to about 3/4ths of this presentation. Wondering if his assumptions have been proven shaky with the performance of Russian troops in the field.
Was wondering the same. He seemed to be of the opinion that the Russians had superior EW in terms of ability to jam but not be jammed or monitored. As we have seen, their capability was dependent on 4G communication towers that they inexplicably took out during the early portion of the war.

Thought it was interesting, though.
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AGS-R-TUFF
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In reply to MeatDr • 10:00a, 4/19/22
AG
MeatDr said:
Hoping for a way to buy these Mariupol fighters more time. The map doesn't look conducive to Uke ground troops getting in thru from East (Khereson) side expeditiously and not sure if they can afford to redirect some support from Donbas down to Mariupol.

My novice opinion is thinking if air strikes (drones, switchblades etc.) could create enough disruption to delay or fracture enemy advances, allowing for more effective guerilla counter strikes from Azof battalion.

Thoughts…
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