jabberwalkie09 said:

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TRM said:

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TRM said:

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jabberwalkie09 said:

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Rossticus said:

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TRM said:

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Rumors of a Turkish warship hit by Russia.

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That would be an escalation

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Pretty significant if true.

TRM, where are you seeing this?

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OSIC's Live Space

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https://nationalpost.com/pmn/news-pmn/turkish-owned-ship-hit-by-bomb-off-coast-of-odessa-no-casualties-turkish-authority

Quote:

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ANKARA A Turkish-owned ship was hit by a bomb off the coast of Ukraine's port city Odessa on Thursday, Turkey's Maritime General Directorate said, adding there were no casualties and the ship was safely en route into Romanian waters.

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You're missing an important piece:

Quote:

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Russia on Thursday launched a ground and air offensive into Ukraine.

"Upon information that the Marshall Islands-flagged Turkish-owned Yasa Jupiter ship was struck by a bomb off the coast of Odessa, it was learned that the ship has no request for help, is en route to Romanian waters, has no casualties and is safe," the authority said on Twitter.

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Turkish owned, not Turkish flagged. If it was Turkish flagged, that would be an entirely different kettle of fish.

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Why? Isn't a Turkish owned ship still manned by (possibly) Turkish citizens?

LMCane said:

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Agthatbuilds said:

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Radio News report says there are thousands in line to enlist into Ukrainian army

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that's useless

by the time they find a uniform and a helmet, the battles will be over.

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The only way they have a chance is by fighting a guerrilla war, directly confronting the russian army would be suicide. They need to absorb these initial blows and have as many fighting men as possible for hit and run when russia stops moving so fast.

Assuming that video is actually an attack into a Ukrainian neighborhood...have the Russians gone completely insane?

something seems off about the last video

Zelensky confirms military reports Russia trying to seize Chernobyl. https://t.co/Jtsu7C0KuN

— Christopher Miller (@ChristopherJM) February 24, 2022

Robert C. Christian said:

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Absolutely shocking footage of a Russian warplanes firing missiles into a residential area in #Ukraine 🇺🇦.

A child screams in terror. pic.twitter.com/CqYg4qIUqf

— Thomas van Linge (@ThomasVLinge) February 24, 2022

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Oh that second video will make your butt hole pucker.

Yeah it does.

Unless the Russians are still strapping unguided rockets to all their 4th gen fighters like it's Vietnam still

jabberwalkie09 said:

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MAP: Estimate of areas of Ukraine captured by Russia since fighting began this morning. https://t.co/SGy0ME3cwo

— Conflict News (@Conflicts) February 24, 2022

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So was the amphibious assault at Odesa wrong? I recall that being reported pretty early on.

Depends on the ROE. When both sides are using the same types of aircraft bin a confined airspace, they might not have the luxury of BVR engagement.

redline248 said:

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Assuming that video is actually an attack into a Ukrainian neighborhood...have the Russians gone completely insane?

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The Russian don't have the same calculations on civilian life as the west. Never have.

buzzardb267 said:

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jabberwalkie09 said:

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MAP: Estimate of areas of Ukraine captured by Russia since fighting began this morning. https://t.co/SGy0ME3cwo

— Conflict News (@Conflicts) February 24, 2022

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So was the amphibious assault at Odesa wrong? I recall that being reported pretty early on.

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Purposeful Russian disinfo. Probably to drag forces away from Crimea. Same with Mariupol.

redline248 said:

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Assuming that video is actually an attack into a Ukrainian neighborhood...have the Russians gone completely insane?

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Firing over a neighborhood isn't the same as firing on it.

Also, war gets much uglier than that and we are not innocent of similar acts to what is actually depicted in the video.

Clob94 said:

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jabberwalkie09 said:

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TRM said:

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TRM said:

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jabberwalkie09 said:

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Rossticus said:

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TRM said:

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Rumors of a Turkish warship hit by Russia.

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That would be an escalation

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Pretty significant if true.

TRM, where are you seeing this?

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OSIC's Live Space

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https://nationalpost.com/pmn/news-pmn/turkish-owned-ship-hit-by-bomb-off-coast-of-odessa-no-casualties-turkish-authority

Quote:

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ANKARA A Turkish-owned ship was hit by a bomb off the coast of Ukraine's port city Odessa on Thursday, Turkey's Maritime General Directorate said, adding there were no casualties and the ship was safely en route into Romanian waters.

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You're missing an important piece:

Quote:

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Russia on Thursday launched a ground and air offensive into Ukraine.

"Upon information that the Marshall Islands-flagged Turkish-owned Yasa Jupiter ship was struck by a bomb off the coast of Odessa, it was learned that the ship has no request for help, is en route to Romanian waters, has no casualties and is safe," the authority said on Twitter.

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Turkish owned, not Turkish flagged. If it was Turkish flagged, that would be an entirely different kettle of fish.

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Why? Isn't a Turkish owned ship still manned by (possibly) Turkish citizens?

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A vessel flagged out of Mexico but owned by owned by someone or a corporation out of the US carries a different weight from it being flagged out of the US. The flaggging of a vessel deems the nationality for that vessel.

CharlieBrown17 said:

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Yeah it does.

Unless the Russians are still strapping unguided rockets to all their 4th gen fighters like it's Vietnam still

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you gotta admit fog of war propaganda is still amazing (for an ancient tactic)

Canada is really ramping up the rhetoric. Guess they're about to try and distract from Ottawa.

CharlieBrown17 said:

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Yeah it does.

Unless the Russians are still strapping unguided rockets to all their 4th gen fighters like it's Vietnam still

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I mean, they probably do but it still seems off.

You have to remember that Russia does not have the idea of zero casualties like the US has, they are not afraid to sacrifice their own troops or civilians to win. Remember what Stalin said

"Quantity has a quality all its own"

"A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths are a statistic"

MouthBQ98 said:

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Depends on the ROE. When both sides are using the same types of aircraft bin a confined airspace, they might not have the luxury of BVR engagement.

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Well, the SU-35 is not in its element at low altitude and low speeds. It is, first and foremost, an air superiority fighter and I doubt there is any Russian doctrine where they want to get into a close range dog fight with a smaller, more agile mig. TBH, not sure what EITHER aircraft was doing at those altitudes and speeds if they were engaging each other. Either way, I dont think either aircraft was in a particularly good position to do anything to each other.

Now, if the Flanker was armed with R-73s and the Mig had no short range/IR missiles, then it would be a REALLY bad day for the mig.

This is the correct approach. Insurgency with things like IEDs and urban warfare. Make it a meat grinder for the Russians. The United States needs to be flooding Ukraine with weapons especially anti-tank and anti-aircraft fire and forget type weapons. We can also put advisors and possibly drones into Ukraine to really pack a punch.

The end result is wave after wave of body bags for the Russians and finally economic collapse. This could, under the right circumstances, turn into a major military blunder and spell the end of Russia as a viable military power. It doesn't require a major troop footprint by the United States to achieve these ends but it does require a substantial commitment.

I was joking my friend. I saw the swamp already pushing the we are all in this together and we need to support our President and Troops Bs. They are trying to distract

jabberwalkie09 said:

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CharlieBrown17 said:

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Yeah it does.

Unless the Russians are still strapping unguided rockets to all their 4th gen fighters like it's Vietnam still

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I mean, they probably do but it still seems off.

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From a military tactic standpoint... it's really not a terrible idea if you have a bunch laying around.

Putin can't be entirely sure where this will go... If it gets much bigger, then he will want to maintain the better equipment for more worthy opponents. Especially if you don't care too much about collateral damage.

TommyBrady said:

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I was joking my friend. I saw the swamp already pushing the we are all in this together and we need to support our President and Troops Bs. They are trying to distract

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My bad. Sarcasm detection is hard on the web

TRM said:

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jabberwalkie09 said:

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P.U.T.U said:

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I highly doubt they are in Canadian uniform, likely in civilian gear or Ukraine military.

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OK then: why would a NATO country's forces be in a position to possibly be waging war against Russia with the potential to trigger article 5 of NATO?

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Probably a military advisor helping Ukrainian military.

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Ok but my question remains though. Even if they didn't evac when we pulled our assets out, that still has potential to draw the entirety of NATO into this conflict. Something NATO has explicitly said they do not want and Putin has threatened to punish if other countries get involved.

I'm somewhat dubious of that report.

https://www.instagram.com/tv/CaW7g2GD3b7/?utm_medium=share_sheet

P.U.T.U said:

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You have to remember that Russia does not have the idea of zero casualties like the US has, they are not afraid to sacrifice their own troops or civilians to win. Remember what Stalin said

"Quantity has a quality all its own"

"A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths are a statistic"

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Maybe, but the US also made its fair share of mistakes during the Iraq war and Afghanistan.

When the fighting turns into urban warfare fairly soon, especially in Kiev, it will be hard for the Russians to not kill thousands of civilians. The amount of gut-wrenching videos when that happens is going to be horrific.

Ukrainian president says Russian forces trying to seize Chernobyl nuclear plant - @AP

— Apex (@Apex_WW) February 24, 2022

CharlieBrown17 said:

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Holy **** guys

There's like 69 other threads to go ***** about American politics on

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Exactly, flag it for the mods and don't engage here. Plenty of other threads for verbal sparring.

aginresearch said:

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This is the correct approach. Insurgency with things like IEDs and urban warfare. Make it a meat grinder for the Russians. The United States needs to be flooding Ukraine with weapons especially anti-tank and anti-aircraft fire and forget type weapons. We can also put advisors and possibly drones into Ukraine to really pack a punch.

The end result is wave after wave of body bags for the Russians and finally economic collapse. This could, under the right circumstances, turn into a major military blunder and spell the end of Russia as a viable military power. It doesn't require a major troop footprint by the United States to achieve these ends but it does require a substantial commitment.

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I would love for that last paragraph to happen, but I think Russia is in the "use it or lose it" state of mind when it comes to their nukes.

Some actual well equipped Uke troops

only two of them but at least they look like well equipped modern soldiers.

not the hodge podge most of the Ukrainian forces on the news have appeared.

aeroag14 said:

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MouthBQ98 said:

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Depends on the ROE. When both sides are using the same types of aircraft bin a confined airspace, they might not have the luxury of BVR engagement.

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Well, the SU-35 is not in its element at low altitude and low speeds. It is, first and foremost, an air superiority fighter and I doubt there is any Russian doctrine where they want to get into a close range dog fight with a smaller, more agile mig. TBH, not sure what EITHER aircraft was doing at those altitudes and speeds if they were engaging each other. Either way, I dont think either aircraft was in a particularly good position to do anything to each other.

Now, if the Flanker was armed with R-73s and the Mig had no short range/IR missiles, then it would be a REALLY bad day for the mig.

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this ties into my observation, which is to my untrained eye looking at grainy twitter footage, those both look more like migs to me. its tough to be sure from the footage quality, but i don't see the tail boom sticking out behind the elevators on either plane that would be characteristic of a su-35

They are going to need a resupply if a **** ton of stingers, javelins, Karl gustavs, etc ASAP on their western border.