Yes, Russia is insecure about NATO, because it would ruin their ability to control the territory themselves. But Russian imperialism and expansionism is the cause there, and secondarily EU expansion (imperialism?) was the secondary impetus, not NATO
***** OFFICIAL Russia v. Ukraine *****
1,094,834 Views |
10330 Replies |
Last: 2 yr ago by TRM
The fear of NATO expansion had far less to do with Putin's decision to invade Ukraine than did his lack of fear about who occupied the Oval Office. The signal changed from red to green.
Ulysses90 said:
The fear of NATO expansion had far less to do with Putin's decision to invade Ukraine than did his lack of fear about who occupied the Oval Office. The signal changed from red to green.
All of the above. He also wants the oil and gas too.
For anyone curious about the military implications, this is a pretty unbiased WSJ video, imho.
NATO is stronger and more united than ever! https://t.co/gKmZ3rqyG7
— Bonchie (@bonchieredstate) May 18, 2022
So the have-not's close to/touching Russia want more Nato troops in their country, and of course the French/Germans want nothing to do with it. More of this is going to follow.
The US still has all the leverage. We can restrict access to our markets. Germany is especially vulnerable to this.
They still want to free ride. NATO should be torn up and rewritten.
They still want to free ride. NATO should be torn up and rewritten.
No, America should leave. The europeans are perfectly fine defending themselves. They have the money and the nuclear weapons if they want to use them. They don't need America there.AlaskanAg99 said:
The US still has all the leverage. We can restrict access to our markets. Germany is especially vulnerable to this.
They still want to free ride. NATO should be torn up and rewritten.
Yes we should leave NATO, we are the world's piggy bank and everyone knows it. We are in huge debt but keep spending. On top of that we have almost spent what we did annually during the Afghanistan war in a few month in Ukraine. If these European countries really want to be free then do something about it, if not keep buying Russian oil and supporting a country happy to commit genocide.
I understand why the USA is supporting Ukraine but if the European countries really want to be free they need to step up their efforts, especially Germany. This isn't going to be a short war, Ukraine will need help through at least until next year.
I understand why the USA is supporting Ukraine but if the European countries really want to be free they need to step up their efforts, especially Germany. This isn't going to be a short war, Ukraine will need help through at least until next year.
I disagree. We do need bases there and throughout the world to project power.
However it should be on our terms and we tie defense to market access. We demand they open theirs to more of our goods, and we can restrict access to ours if we do not feel they are holding up their end of the deal.
A post WWII agreement is completely obsolete in today's world.
However it should be on our terms and we tie defense to market access. We demand they open theirs to more of our goods, and we can restrict access to ours if we do not feel they are holding up their end of the deal.
A post WWII agreement is completely obsolete in today's world.
You really think the US still projects power? We are a joke of a country. We are nothing more than a piggy bank giving free handouts.
Uhhhh, do you know who is in the White House? He's pretty much ****ed up everything so far in such a short period of time.
You think, or whoever runs the teleprompter, would ever be smart enough to use that leverage?
That's what Trump did and he was accused of wanting to "dismantle NATO" for pushing back about Euro countries from "paying their fair share"....ironic, no?
You think, or whoever runs the teleprompter, would ever be smart enough to use that leverage?
That's what Trump did and he was accused of wanting to "dismantle NATO" for pushing back about Euro countries from "paying their fair share"....ironic, no?
'projects power' from the whitehouse? NoJbob04 said:
You really think the US still projects power? We are a joke of a country. We are nothing more than a piggy bank giving free handouts.
'projects power' from all of the military bases around the world, and nearly guaranteeing safe passage of all ships all over the world? Yes.
What would be your thoughts if Russia and China had as many well established bases around the globe + friendly ports they could quickly ally with if **** really does hit the fan.
But wait, I thought Finland was flexing on twitter the last 2 months about how badass they were at killing Russians 70 years ago, why would they need to join NATO?
Oh, for the free money. I see now.
Oh, for the free money. I see now.
Our military is quickly becoming as much of a joke as **** for brains Biden. I don't think countries are afraid of us like they used to be.
Long term planning despite who's in the WH has to be taken into consideration. Joe won't be around long.
As the post WWII order ends we will need bases to project power from to insure our secure trade. Pragmatically speaking we will never fully with draw from world affairs. But we should restore as much critical manufacturing as possible. Or at least have it close by in the western hemisphere.
As the post WWII order ends we will need bases to project power from to insure our secure trade. Pragmatically speaking we will never fully with draw from world affairs. But we should restore as much critical manufacturing as possible. Or at least have it close by in the western hemisphere.
It's like they speak the same language as American progressives...Rossticus said:8 All Russia wants is "respect". It does not matter if this means treating our buffer states with disrespect. They have fewer rights.
— Darth Putin (@DarthPutinKGB) March 23, 2022
Again. See point 3 for details10.Threatening to defend yourself against Russia is aggressive so we must threaten to attack you in response.
— Darth Putin (@DarthPutinKGB) March 23, 2022
"Mostly peaceful protests" as fires burn in the background...
"Defund the police" to help the police...
We need to pass Obamacare to see what's in it...
Hiding transgender influence and encouraging your kids to carve up their bodies is NOT grooming.
As suspected, Turkey is looking for a political pound of flesh. The F-35 was among six Turkish demands in exchange for them dropping their objections to Finland & Sweden joining NATO.https://t.co/d4sNsmJYjA
— Patrick Fox (@RealCynicalFox) May 18, 2022
Yes, they appear to be serious. Turkey is now formally blocking the accession process from moving forward.https://t.co/EN7xMeUCmz
— Patrick Fox (@RealCynicalFox) May 18, 2022
That is a no go from the start, we removed Turkey from the F35 program 3 years ago since they started purchasing Russian S400 missile systems. As soon as Turkey gets the F35 they will give it to China or Russia. They know this and know we won't do it which is why they asked.
Why does Turkey need to be in NATO? GTFO.
Phat32 said:
Why does Turkey need to be in NATO? GTFO.
I'm no fan of the Turks, but kicking them out would be monumentally stupid. Not only do they control the Dardanelles and the Bosporus straits, who do you think would welcome a humiliated Turkey with open arms?
How about we give them six demands to allow them to stay in NATO? If they want to align themselves as a Russian client for defense systems that don't work and that Russia can no longer produce due to sanctions, knock yourselves out. I don't think Turkey is in nearly as strong of a negotiating position as they believe they are.Rossticus said:As suspected, Turkey is looking for a political pound of flesh. The F-35 was among six Turkish demands in exchange for them dropping their objections to Finland & Sweden joining NATO.https://t.co/d4sNsmJYjA
— Patrick Fox (@RealCynicalFox) May 18, 2022Yes, they appear to be serious. Turkey is now formally blocking the accession process from moving forward.https://t.co/EN7xMeUCmz
— Patrick Fox (@RealCynicalFox) May 18, 2022
P.U.T.U said:
That is a no go from the start, we removed Turkey from the F35 program 3 years ago since they started purchasing Russian S400 missile systems. As soon as Turkey gets the F35 they will give it to China or Russia. They know this and know we won't do it which is why they asked.
Not to mention insisting on being allowed to export US tech to whoever they want without restriction.
Rossticus said:P.U.T.U said:
That is a no go from the start, we removed Turkey from the F35 program 3 years ago since they started purchasing Russian S400 missile systems. As soon as Turkey gets the F35 they will give it to China or Russia. They know this and know we won't do it which is why they asked.
Not to mention insisting on being allowed to export US tech to whoever they want without restriction.
Yeah no. They're not getting that airframe.
**** the Ottomans.
We can give them F-35's
Just without paint, avionics, and engines.
Just without paint, avionics, and engines.
It may come down to whether you want NATO control of the Baltic or Black Sea. Candidly I don't like getting into close relationship with countries where we don't share similar values anyway. Turkey is effectively a dictatorship. I think you're better off with the Fins and Swedes.
This identification builds on excellent work from the NYT visual investigations team, which obtained video evidence captured by a security camera, a drone, and a witness filming in Bucha https://t.co/R9aAtLs9hZ
— Scott Rose (@rprose) May 21, 2022
Full Thread: https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1527670602252820480.html
The territory of modern Donbas was part of a vast ethno-contact zone known as part of the medieval Wild Steppe (or Wild Fields – Dyke Pole). That is, it was territory over which none of the macroregion's state formations had effective control.
— Yevhenii Monastyrskyi (@YMonastyrskyi) May 20, 2022
2/ pic.twitter.com/4EXZhcVE13
Ooops.
It is worth a note that this may be down to the famous Russian Journalist Sasha Kots, who published images less than a day ago of this mortar firing at Ukrainian forces at precisely the same location.https://t.co/62GjDIDl6d
— 🇺🇦 Ukraine Weapons Tracker (@UAWeapons) May 21, 2022
LinkQuote:
The smoking gun proving U.S. involvement in the 2014 coup in Kiev has been removed from YouTube after eight years.
It was one of the most watched versions of the intercepted and leaked conversation between then Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland and Geoffrey Pyatt, the then U.S. ambassador to Ukraine, in which the two discuss who will make up the new government weeks before democratically-elected Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych was overthrown in a violent coup on Feb. 21, 2014.
The two talk about "midwifing" the unconstitutional change of government and "gluing it together" and of the role then Vice President Joe Biden should play and what meetings to set up with Ukrainian politicians.
The U.S. State Department never denied the authenticity of the video, and even issued an apology to the European Union after Nuland is heard on the tape saying, "**** the E.U." Mainstream media at the time focused almost exclusively on that off-color remark, ignoring the greater significance of U.S. interference in Ukraine's internal affairs.
Because, of course.
Do we still support all this or not? Thats all I want to know. A couple months in and it seems like more of the same.
The guy was trying to retain power in violation of their constitution, for the purpose of pulling a Lukashenko, and turning Ukraine back into a complete Russian vassal state. He had already demonstrated a willingness to employ violence to ensure that he could successfully accomplish this. It was every bit the will of the Ukrainian people as it was US support that his efforts were halted.
Talk to Ukrainians. You won't find many that aren't adamantly , outspokenly proud of the fact that they prevented Russia's attempts at gaining full political control over Ukraine. The inability of Russian loyalists to succeed is what ultimately led to this point and it's why Ukrainians are so committed to continuing to fight for their freedom by and overwhelming majority.
We did for Ukraine, to a great extent, what the French, Dutch, etc did for the colonies and early USA. All that said, pulling it off the web is bussisht. BFD. Leave it up.
Talk to Ukrainians. You won't find many that aren't adamantly , outspokenly proud of the fact that they prevented Russia's attempts at gaining full political control over Ukraine. The inability of Russian loyalists to succeed is what ultimately led to this point and it's why Ukrainians are so committed to continuing to fight for their freedom by and overwhelming majority.
We did for Ukraine, to a great extent, what the French, Dutch, etc did for the colonies and early USA. All that said, pulling it off the web is bussisht. BFD. Leave it up.
Stat Monitor Repairman said:
Do we still support all this or not? Thats all I want to know. A couple months in and it seems like more of the same.
Yes. The majority of the US and Europe support assisting Ukraine in maintaining their sovereign existence.
Ok, just checking.
There is a flip side to that. The eff-the-EU remark was because of the difficult demands they were putting on Ukraine for loans that pushed Yanukovych towards Russia and Putin.Rossticus said:
The guy was trying to retain power in violation of their constitution, for the purpose of pulling a Lukashenko, and turning Ukraine back into a complete Russian vassal state. He had already demonstrated a willingness to employ violence to ensure that he could successfully accomplish this. It was every bit the will of the Ukrainian people as it was US support that his efforts were halted.
Talk to Ukrainians. You won't find many that aren't adamantly , outspokenly proud of the fact that they prevented Russia's attempts at gaining full political control over Ukraine. The inability of Russian loyalists to succeed is what ultimately led to this point and it's why Ukrainians are so committed to continuing to fight for their freedom by and overwhelming majority.
We did for Ukraine, to a great extent, what the French, Dutch, etc did for the colonies and early USA. All that said, pulling it off the web is bussisht. BFD. Leave it up.
But the point is that the Obama and now the Biden administration are vigorously denying the US had anything to do with the Maidan Revolution. That's a lie.
Completely agree. Trying to cover it up is a bad look which I'm completely against. Might as well own it. But we know that's not Brandon's style.
Featured Stories
See All
27:33
1d ago
11k
14:13
12h ago
1.9k
Efficiency, coaching experience trends point to A&M's true capabilities
by Luke Evangelist
9:44
15h ago
3.7k
El Mero Mero 14
Rich Get Richer - Dick Sports and Texas Athletics
in Billy Liucci's TexAgs Premium
5