Exsurge Domine said:

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Shanked Punt said:

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Not exactly sure how many people would actually want to collect on this offer by the Chinese government

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I guess this is progress. The commies used to charge your family for the cost of the bullet they put in your head, now they give you 500 rmb

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Ha! Now they give you 500 rmb, a bullet to the head, and take the 500 rmb

I'm still waiting for the wildcard - Africa - to come into play.

No idea if this is true. I assume it's not but interesting nonetheless.

I think that bottom row is fist fed.

I like how these cases are differentiated. The Diamond Princess has more cases than the rest of the world (outside of China) combined.

Looking at those numbers, most people shake it off, but people with respiratory conditions, or very old or young, or compromised immune systems better be much more careful.

B-1 83 said:

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I'm still waiting for the wildcard - Africa - to come into play.

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They are actually dealing with another Ebola outbreak but apparently media is bored with these stories. Ebola is so 2015.

Agreed. If this were true, in today's political climate this would be fuel for blaming trump for something new.

It's not Africa per se but favelas in general. High population densities with poor sanitary conditions. Fortunately many of those are in hotter climates.

NYC would be bad news. Extreme pop density, essentially all using mass transit, colder climate.

JJMt said:

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Good point. I'd never considered that before.

Japan handled the cruise ship horribly - as bad as you could possibly imagine other than simply shooting everyone or sinking the ship with all hands aboard.

The Johns Hopkins website has also been treating the cruise ship as a "separate" country. That site also has google sheets that are updated daily if you want hard data.

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Separating the passengers was a good idea. Letting the crew mingle, share living space, cook together, contact the passengers, etc. meant they would be able to constantly spread the germs. It was a huge petri dish for seeing how the passengers and crew could handle being infected since most everyone was going to get exposed.

If you look at Nancy's twitter feed and the heat she took and the ammount of times it was reposted it looks more legit.

Brother in law works at University hospital in San Antonio and he is saying 150 people from the cruise ship are on their way to SA. The sick are going to be divided between all the SA hospitals. SAMMC doesn't have room for them so they plan on splitting the patients up round robin between Baptist, Methodist and University.

Great.

VaultingChemist said:

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I like how these cases are differentiated. The Diamond Princess has more cases than the rest of the world (outside of China) combined.

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This virus must have been engineered specifically to flourish in a cruise ship environment.

Though, that really doesn't make it much different than any other virus out there.

cle96 said:

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Brother in law works at University hospital in San Antonio and he is saying 150 people from the cruise ship are on their way to SA. The sick are going to be divided between all the SA hospitals. SAMMC doesn't have room for them so they plan on splitting the patients up round robin between Baptist, Methodist and University.

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They don't have room for 14 (Actually should be 7) people who have tested positive? They're asymptomatic.

Shanked Punt said:

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VaultingChemist said:

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I like how these cases are differentiated. The Diamond Princess has more cases than the rest of the world (outside of China) combined.

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This virus must have been engineered specifically to flourish in a cruise ship environment.

Though, that really doesn't make it much different than any other virus out there.

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Imagine how fast it would spread in a school environment.

Ya pretty sure these folks are being quarantined at the base hospital, not public ones.

OnlyForNow said:

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Ya pretty sure these folks are being quarantined at the base hospital, not public ones.

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I know he got called in for 4 hours last night to prepare, they have 8 isolation rooms prepped. If any arrive there I'm sure he will let us know. Saying the base hospitals don't have the capacity to take all the sick. May be just precautions. It doesn't seem smart to spread them all over the city.

Civil.Savage said:

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If you look at Nancy's twitter feed and the heat she took and the ammount of times it was reposted it looks more legit.

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The texts read as very fake. However, she seems to just be blocking anyone who asks her. She could easily clear things up by putting out a statement on her feed saying it's fake and be done with it.

The fact she's spending time blocking folks, but not clearing up the situation with a post, is concerning.

OnlyForNow said:

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Ya pretty sure these folks are being quarantined at the base hospital, not public ones.

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Your right, quarantine is at the base. Once they show symptoms and need to be hospitalized then they go to the hospital. Shocker I know.

OnlyForNow said:

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Ya pretty sure these folks are being quarantined at the base hospital, not public ones.

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Only if they are military or military dependents.

All others are being routed to civilian hospitals.

San Antonio Methodist has already announced they are caring for a positive patient, this was last week. Sounds like more to come. I have a sister who works at Methodist Children's, different building I believe, hope she is able to stay safe.

https://www.ksat.com/news/local/2020/02/13/coronavirus-case-confirmed-in-san-antonio-cdc-says/

The one patient in the hospital in SA is at Methodist Texsan in their isolation room. My wife worked in their ICU for a few years and have a buddy (an Aggie) who's father is there now for some heart issues.

SchizoAg said:

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KidDoc said:

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SchizoAg said:

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KidDoc said:

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Clearing up some bad info over the weekend:

Vitamin C and cold medication will do nothing to prevent pneumonia from any source.

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That's not what I said.

Taking vitamin C daily has been shown to reduce the duration and severity (but not the incidence) of the common cold. Assuming the mechanism is by "boosting the immune system" (as advertised in non-FDA-approved wording on the bottle), it is logical to infer that it would help with other viruses, too.

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Nothing is really proven to prevent pneumonia but malnutrition and immobility are significant risk factors as is smoking and asthma.

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Being in a weakened state due to having been sick recently is surely a risk factor. So minimizing your sickness before you get the coronavirus actually will improve your odds of not getting pneumonia.

I don't know the difference between pneumonia, pneumonitis, bronchitis, etc. But I know that allowing yourself to cough incessantly, without treating the symptom, can lead to inflammation (some sort of -itis).

And based on personal experience, I believe that aggressively medicating the early symptoms of a cold (e.g. runny nose with pseudoephedrine) can slow its spread, giving the immune system time to work before it spreads to other body systems (throat, lungs).

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Did you read the study you linked?
<snip>
The failure of vitamin C supplementation to reduce the incidence of colds in the general population indicates that routine vitamin C supplementation is not justified, yet vitamin C may be useful for people exposed to brief periods of severe physical exercise. Regular supplementation trials have shown that vitamin C reduces the duration of colds, but this was not replicated in the few therapeutic trials that have been carried out. Nevertheless, given the consistent effect of vitamin C on the duration and severity of colds in the regular supplementation studies, and the low cost and safety, it may be worthwhile for common cold patients to test on an individual basis whether therapeutic vitamin C is beneficial for them. Further therapeutic RCTs are warranted.
<snip>

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Did you read the second half of your excerpt, the part that you didn't boldface? The part where it says regular vitamin C supplementation consistently reduces the duration and severity (but not the incidence) of the common cold, just like I said above?

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Also your personal experience does not equate to medical evidence or fact. Feel free to medicate yourself out the wazoo but all the cough & cold medications have been shown to briefly improve symptoms in patients over 4 years or age but they have never been shown to decrease the risk of series morbidity like pneumonia with any viral infection.

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Since you're apparently well-versed in all research on the topic, it shouldn't be hard for you to link, for example, a study in which the question was investigated with negative results. For my part, I can't find anything, at least not using the key phrase "series morbidity". Either that is an extremely under-studied topic (in which case my personal experience actually is the best medical evidence available), or there is a more common term for it.

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The treatment of shock with vitamin C + steroids is interesting but that is totally different from what is being discussed which is prevention or mitigation of common URI with OTC vitamin C. The evidence just isn't there and experts do not routinely recommend it with the caveat that it is not dangerous or expensive so if patients want to use placebo go ahead.

For OTC cough & cold there is no evidence that it prevents pneumonia. There are likely unpublished studies sponsored by the manufacturers that were shredded because they did not like the results. This is one of the major problems with all drug research in the USA, the people running the study can just publish favorable studies and shred the ones that do not support their product. If mucinex or nyquil had a study proving their drug could prevent the march from URI to pneumonia you know it would be ALL over their advertising!

Like I said feel free to do what you want to your body but putting out statements like yours as accepted medical "fact" is just not a good idea to the casual reader!

The Summary from uptodate:
Vitamin C Vitamin C is often touted as a natural remedy for the common cold. A 2013 meta-analysis of 29 trials (n = 11,306) showed a small but significant 8 percent reduction in the duration of cold symptoms in adults regularly taking vitamin C supplements (at least 200 mg/day) [30]. This reduction was of uncertain clinical relevance. The meta-analysis also showed that vitamin C given therapeutically after symptom onset did not reduce symptom duration or severity.

JJMt said:

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A few thoughts and comments:

• Everybody should expect the US numbers to rise pretty dramatically today since the Diamond Princess Cruise passengers have arrived in the CONUS. I assume that they will now be "credited" to the US rather than being counted on a separate line for the Diamond Princess Cruise as many of the reports have been doing.

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I doubt it. The WHO tallies are according to the location of first diagnosis, not the present location of patients.

VaultingChemist said:

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I like how these cases are differentiated. The Diamond Princess has more cases than the rest of the world (outside of China) combined.

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The big difference is that all of the Cruise ship passengers were tested? Is it possible that this thing is widespread outside of China but is so mild that nobody is getting tested??

KidDoc said:

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Like I said feel free to do what you want to your body but putting out statements like yours as accepted medical "fact" is just not a good idea to the casual reader!

The Summary from uptodate:
Vitamin C Vitamin C is often touted as a natural remedy for the common cold. A 2013 meta-analysis of 29 trials (n = 11,306) showed a small but significant 8 percent reduction in the duration of cold symptoms in adults regularly taking vitamin C supplements (at least 200 mg/day) [30]. This reduction was of uncertain clinical relevance. The meta-analysis also showed that vitamin C given therapeutically after symptom onset did not reduce symptom duration or severity.

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Thanks for confirming as "accepted medical fact" that "vitamin C daily has been shown to reduce the duration and severity (but not the incidence) of the common cold".

Nuclear Scramjet said:

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No idea if this is true. I assume it's not but interesting nonetheless.

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I find it hard to believe that such a highly-educated person would write "Even near by distances." Aside from "nearby" being a single word, conceptually there is no such thing as a "nearby distance".

It also doesn't make any sense that whoever she sent this to, obviously a close friend, after assuring Nancy that "I'll keep this between us", would betray her trust and post it on the internet, thus ending their friendship.

In short: You have to be pretty dumb to believe this.

SchizoAg said:

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Nuclear Scramjet said:

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No idea if this is true. I assume it's not but interesting nonetheless.

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I find it hard to believe that such a highly-educated person would write "Even near by distances." Aside from "nearby" being a single word, conceptually there is no such thing as a "nearby distance".

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I see you don't work with highly educated people