aggiehawg said:

---

FYI, the Ukrainian Rada (parliamentary) elections were three days later on July 21, 2019.

There was no way of knowing whether Zelensky would gain a majority or have to form a coalition government with the standard (read that as "corrupt") Ukrainian politicians.

So taking a wait-and-see attitude was not that outlandish.

---

Ag with kids said:

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

90 minutes after the call the White House reminded the Pentagon the aid is to be held and to keep quiet about it.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/trump-impeachment-inquiry/newly-released-emails-provide-greater-details-white-house-pause-ukraine-n110620

---

If they're being "quiet about it", then how would Ukraine know about the evil "quid pro quo"?

---

Ag with kids said:

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

90 minutes after the call the White House reminded the Pentagon the aid is to be held and to keep quiet about it.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/trump-impeachment-inquiry/newly-released-emails-provide-greater-details-white-house-pause-ukraine-n1106201

---

If they're being "quiet about it", then how would Ukraine know about the evil "quid pro quo"?

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

90 minutes after the call the White House reminded the Pentagon the aid is to be held and to keep quiet about it.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/trump-impeachment-inquiry/newly-released-emails-provide-greater-details-white-house-pause-ukraine-n1106201

---

Quote:

---

Again, the president can withhold money if he chooses to

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

Quote:

---

Again, the president can withhold money if he chooses to

---

He actually cannot, the question is why he did it. The impoundment Act was violated here, at a minimum.

It took a literal act of Congress to restore the funds after they got caught.

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

Quote:

---

Again, the president can withhold money if he chooses to

---

He actually cannot, the question is why he did it. The impoundment Act was violated here, at a minimum.

It took a literal act of Congress to restore the funds after they got caught.

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

Quote:

---

Again, the president can withhold money if he chooses to

---

He actually cannot, the question is why he did it. The impoundment Act was violated here, at a minimum.

It took a literal act of Congress to restore the funds after they got caught.

---

Quote:

---

The Impoundment Control Act, as Van Hollen pointed out, sets out "narrow circumstances" under which the executive branch may withhold funds. Congress must be notified if funds are to be withheld, and no notification was given to Congress

---

Quote:

---

OMB might have had the ability to withhold this aid if the White House had provided Congress with a message meeting the ICA's requirements. But no message appears to have been sent. Furthermore, the aid from both Defense and State was held long past the mandated 45-day period and in apparent contravention of his powers defined by 31 U.S.C 1512.

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

........

https://www.lawfareblog.com/role-omb-withholding-ukrainian-aid

So. It's an incontrovertible legal fact that once spending bills are passed in to law, the White House cannot unilaterally hijack specific funding programs.

---

Quote:

---

"At present, it is unclear whether OMB withheld the money in a manner consistent with its legal obligations."

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

Funding is appropriated by Congress, Trump at least broke an administrative law by withholding without justification and failing to notify Congress.

Quote:

---

The Impoundment Control Act, as Van Hollen pointed out, sets out "narrow circumstances" under which the executive branch may withhold funds. Congress must be notified if funds are to be withheld, and no notification was given to Congress

---

https://www.newsweek.com/trump-violated-another-law-impoundment-control-act-withholding-ukraine-aid-democratic-senator-1478966

Quote:

---

OMB might have had the ability to withhold this aid if the White House had provided Congress with a message meeting the ICA's requirements. But no message appears to have been sent. Furthermore, the aid from both Defense and State was held long past the mandated 45-day period and in apparent contravention of his powers defined by 31 U.S.C 1512.

---

https://www.lawfareblog.com/role-omb-withholding-ukrainian-aid

So. It's an incontrovertible legal fact that once spending bills are passed in to law, the White House cannot unilaterally hijack specific funding programs.

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

Funding is appropriated by Congress, Trump at least broke an administrative law by withholding without justification and failing to notify Congress.

Quote:

---

The Impoundment Control Act, as Van Hollen pointed out, sets out "narrow circumstances" under which the executive branch may withhold funds. Congress must be notified if funds are to be withheld, and no notification was given to Congress

---

https://www.newsweek.com/trump-violated-another-law-impoundment-control-act-withholding-ukraine-aid-democratic-senator-1478966

Quote:

---

OMB might have had the ability to withhold this aid if the White House had provided Congress with a message meeting the ICA's requirements. But no message appears to have been sent. Furthermore, the aid from both Defense and State was held long past the mandated 45-day period and in apparent contravention of his powers defined by 31 U.S.C 1512.

---

https://www.lawfareblog.com/role-omb-withholding-ukrainian-aid

So. It's an incontrovertible legal fact that once spending bills are passed in to law, the White House cannot unilaterally hijack specific funding programs.

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

Quote:

---

Again, the president can withhold money if he chooses to

---

He actually cannot, the question is why he did it. The impoundment Act was violated here, at a minimum.

It took a literal act of Congress to restore the funds after they got caught.

---

captkirk said:

---

You're like a truffle pig for fake news. Your reliance on and addiction to it is staggering

---

Ulysses90 said:

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

Funding is appropriated by Congress, Trump at least broke an administrative law by withholding without justification and failing to notify Congress.

Quote:

---

The Impoundment Control Act, as Van Hollen pointed out, sets out "narrow circumstances" under which the executive branch may withhold funds. Congress must be notified if funds are to be withheld, and no notification was given to Congress

---

https://www.newsweek.com/trump-violated-another-law-impoundment-control-act-withholding-ukraine-aid-democratic-senator-1478966

Quote:

---

OMB might have had the ability to withhold this aid if the White House had provided Congress with a message meeting the ICA's requirements. But no message appears to have been sent. Furthermore, the aid from both Defense and State was held long past the mandated 45-day period and in apparent contravention of his powers defined by 31 U.S.C 1512.

---

https://www.lawfareblog.com/role-omb-withholding-ukrainian-aid

So. It's an incontrovertible legal fact that once spending bills are passed in to law, the White House cannot unilaterally hijack specific funding programs.

---

Apparently you have never worked within an executive branch agency that actually executes Congressional budget appropriations. The budget is a law signed by the President and it is executed over the course of a year (for O&M) and longer than a year ( 2 years for R&D, 3 years for procurement, and 5 years for construction or ship building). Contrary to what the idiots at Newsweek are trying to convince you, the executive branch does not need to report impoundment of appropriations unless they are withheld beyond the expiration date of the funds or beyond a date of obligation (transfer or contract) that was specified in the budget act itself.

The schedule for the disbursement of foreign aid funds, like almost every other appropriation, is not established by Congress in the legislation but by the executive branch agencies. The only schedule imposed on the in-year execution of funding by Congress is the aggregate obligation benchmark percentages for O&M, e.g. 80% is the obligation benchmark at the end of the third quarter (30 June) for O&M funds.

The irony of the accusation that the Trump administration withheld defense funds from Ukraine and should have reported impoundment of those funds to Congress is that it was the Trump administration that originally established the disbursement schedule for FY19 and the funds were delivered ahead of the original disbursement schedule. TDS can hardly get more absurd that to claim that the President failed to report impoundment of funding delivered ahead of the schedule HIS administration established.

---

Quote:

---

it was the Trump administration that originally established the disbursement schedule for FY19 and the funds were delivered ahead of the original disbursement schedule

---

aggiehawg said:

---

FYI, the Ukrainian Rada (parliamentary) elections were three days later on July 21, 2019.

There was no way of knowing whether Zelensky would gain a majority or have to form a coalition government with the standard (read that as "corrupt") Ukrainian politicians.

So taking a wait-and-see attitude was not that outlandish.

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

Ulysses90 said:

---

Chance Chase McMasters said:

---

Funding is appropriated by Congress, Trump at least broke an administrative law by withholding without justification and failing to notify Congress.

Quote:

---

The Impoundment Control Act, as Van Hollen pointed out, sets out "narrow circumstances" under which the executive branch may withhold funds. Congress must be notified if funds are to be withheld, and no notification was given to Congress

---

https://www.newsweek.com/trump-violated-another-law-impoundment-control-act-withholding-ukraine-aid-democratic-senator-1478966

Quote:

---

OMB might have had the ability to withhold this aid if the White House had provided Congress with a message meeting the ICA's requirements. But no message appears to have been sent. Furthermore, the aid from both Defense and State was held long past the mandated 45-day period and in apparent contravention of his powers defined by 31 U.S.C 1512.

---

https://www.lawfareblog.com/role-omb-withholding-ukrainian-aid

So. It's an incontrovertible legal fact that once spending bills are passed in to law, the White House cannot unilaterally hijack specific funding programs.

---

Apparently you have never worked within an executive branch agency that actually executes Congressional budget appropriations. The budget is a law signed by the President and it is executed over the course of a year (for O&M) and longer than a year ( 2 years for R&D, 3 years for procurement, and 5 years for construction or ship building). Contrary to what the idiots at Newsweek are trying to convince you, the executive branch does not need to report impoundment of appropriations unless they are withheld beyond the expiration date of the funds or beyond a date of obligation (transfer or contract) that was specified in the budget act itself.

The schedule for the disbursement of foreign aid funds, like almost every other appropriation, is not established by Congress in the legislation but by the executive branch agencies. The only schedule imposed on the in-year execution of funding by Congress is the aggregate obligation benchmark percentages for O&M, e.g. 80% is the obligation benchmark at the end of the third quarter (30 June) for O&M funds.

The irony of the accusation that the Trump administration withheld defense funds from Ukraine and should have reported impoundment of those funds to Congress is that it was the Trump administration that originally established the disbursement schedule for FY19 and the funds were delivered ahead of the original disbursement schedule. TDS can hardly get more absurd that to claim that the President failed to report impoundment of funding delivered ahead of the schedule HIS administration established.

---

Cool starry bra. Impoundment Act was still violated. OMB asked Pentagon to keep it quiet. This thing keeps getting worse, not better, the more that gets dumped Friday at midnight. 4 more document releases are scheduled for January, and the obviously absurd redactions are being challenged in courts.

This orange turd is getting flushed, the only question is how much the R party goes along and swirls down the drain too.

---