Hawg, et al, what do y'all in the law business think, or know, about Seklulow.

Personally, I've always liked him, but that makes little difference regarding professional duties and competance. As far as his on air delivery, he kind of seems like he shares a lot of frustrations of those keeping up with this fiasco.

Just an observation.

The Nunes lawsuit document against Fusion GPS is available:

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/6382462/9-4-19-Nunes-v-Fusion-GPS-Complaint.pdf

Here is an excerpt from the Conclusion:

Quote:

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CONCLUSION

Fusion GPS, Simpson and Steele fraudulently developed the "Steele Dossier" and disseminated it to U.S. Government officials and the press as if the salacious accusations were true. Plaintiff investigated this wrongdoing, causing Fusion GPS and Simpson to retaliate against him and to take action that was intended to harass, intimidate and influence Plaintiff in the performance of his congressional investigation. That retaliation and obstruction of justice consisted of a coordinated effort by the Defendants to manufacture "ethics" complaints against Plaintiff and to utilize the press (McClatchy) as a weapon to pressure Plaintiff to back off his investigation of Fusion GPS and Simpson. Defendants' corrupt acts of racketeering are part of their regular way of doing business. That way of doing business must end here and now......

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Here is a thread discussing the suit:

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1169389892469755904.html

If Nunes wins this, it will bankrupt Fusion GPS or at least put it out of business.

Okay, is the real reason Nunes is filing these lawsuits so we can get to discovery? So many here believe these suits have little, to no chance of success, so I've decided that Nunes' brain is operating properly, and he knows this.

Secondly, how does discovery work? What I mean is what documents can Nunes ask for, and are there legal fights to decide what is acceptable to be disclosed in discovery? I assume attorneys use this tactic regularly to get as much information as they can, unless it's the government, and they seem to be able to ignore being able to disclose whatever they want. Yeah, it's a little cynical, but there are very few judges and attorneys I trust these days.

All I know is I like the sound of RICO associated with fake news organizations and BS leaks used to harm white hats.

fasthorses05 said:

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Okay, is the real reason Nunes is filing these lawsuits so we can get to discovery? So many here believe these suits have little, to no chance of success, so I've decided that Nunes' brain is operating properly, and he knows this.

Secondly, how does discovery work? What I mean is what documents can Nunes ask for, and are there legal fights to decide what is acceptable to be disclosed in discovery? I assume attorneys use this tactic regularly to get as much information as they can, unless it's the government, and they seem to be able to ignore being able to disclose whatever they want. Yeah, it's a little cynical, but there are very few judges and attorneys I trust these days.

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Nunes has already made criminal referrals to the DOJ. We don't know what these were, but if you read Nunes' lawsuit, he states in there that during his (Congressional) investigations he discovered that Fusion GPS & Simpson committed multiple federal crimes, such as (there are more listed in the document):



We don't know if the DOJ is going to follow through & charge Fusion GPS & Simpson based upon Nunes' Committee referrals, but perhaps that is a goal of Nunes' suit...forcing the DOJ to act and charge Fusion GPS & Simpson. Perhaps he even knows that indictments are forthcoming. A double pronged attack might be more effective, & discovery could be more effective with the government involved.

Also, Nunes has seen many documents of which we are not privy or of which we have only seen redacted versions. Nunes has seen Fusion GPS's bank records though.

Good stuff, you guys keep this thread going with some very very good information .. summarizes it for us non legal types

Thanks

drcrinum said:

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Nunes nails it at the 5:20 mark .... Conspiracy to Defraud the United States .... and Hannity immediately jumps back into the weeds. Ugh...

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1169448705214287874.html

Short enjoyable thread about Flynn & Strzok, & how Sidney Powell should have a field day in court.

Where is Pientka and what is his story? There were two potential witnesses to Flynn's supposed "crime."

Bonus question: Were Flynn's attorneys apprised of the fact that one of the two witnesses against their client had been demoted and sequestered in the HR department before Flynn entered the guilty plea?

aggiehawg said:

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Where is Pientka and what is his story? There were two potential witnesses to Flynn's supposed "crime."

Bonus question: Were Flynn's attorneys apprised of the fact that one of the two witnesses against their client had been demoted and sequestered in the HR department before Flynn entered the guilty plea?

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It is widely believed that in Rosenstein's Third Scope Memo, dated October 20, 2017,



one of the redacted names (the last one) was Michael Flynn Jr. . Now combine the date of this memo, October 20, 2017, with the date of General Flynn's guilty plea, December 1, 2017 = Flynn pleaded guilty because they were going after his son. Now that Mueller is out of the way, the ball game has changed.

I've wondered several times why Flynn can't open up about Mueller threatening his family (son)? I understand it's hearsay, and Mueller would never tell the truth, and it's possible that it was Weissman anyway.

But, plaintiffs make claims all the time, and there should be SOME past evidence of Weissman's gawd-awful behavior to make a judge give the claim lip service!

Quote:

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one of the redacted names (the last one) was Michael Flynn Jr. . Now combine the date of this memo, October 20, 2017, with the date of General Flynn's guilty plea, December 1, 2017 = Flynn pleaded guilty because they were going after his son. Now that Mueller is out of the way, the ball game has changed.

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The revelations about Strzok and Page occurred the day after Flynn signed the guilty plea. My hunch is that Team Mueller did in fact hide that fact from Flynn's counsel, which would have been exculpatory material. The omission from August until December would not be a Brady violation since no order had been entered. Instead, it is prosecutorial misconduct.

Question for you (or any other legal beagles): That 'ex parte hearing' between Sidney Powell & Judge Sullivan...how does something like that happen where the defense can arrange a special surprise hearing with the judge? There has to be some behind-the-scenes communications going on. Does the prosecution even attend? I have a sneaky feeling that something big is about to happen on September 10 when the scheduled hearing on Brady material & security clearances is held.

https://thefederalist.com/2019/09/06/happened-flynn-lawyers-secret-meeting-judge-week/

Quote:

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.....A minute order soon followed, with the court stating that "in view of Defendant's Motion to Compel Production of Brady Material, the Court will set a briefing schedule and a motion hearing date at the September 10, 2019 Status Conference." That briefing schedule will set the timing for federal prosecutors to respond to Powell's motion and the 19-page memorandum filed in support of the motion to compel. On the tenth, the court will also set a deadline for Powell to reply to the government's counter and schedule a hearing for the parties to orally argue their positions.

Judge Sullivan's minute order also included another intriguing tidbit. In it, he noted that the court would "apply the standard set forth in United States v. Yunis, 867 F.2d 617 (D.C. Cir. 1989) to resolve the pending motion."

The Yunis case involved the government's prosecution of Lebanese citizen Fawaz Yunis for air piracy and hostage taking, related to the 1985 hijacking of Royal Jordanian Airlines' flight number 402. In that case, Yunis sought "copies of all tapes or documentation of conversations between" himself and an acquaintance, Jamal Hamdan, whom the FBI had recruited to serve as an informant. A lower court had ordered the government to produce that evidence, but on appeal, the D.C. Circuit held that Yunis was not entitled to access that material.

In so holding, the Yunis court laid out the governing law, starting with Section 4 of the Classified Information Procedures Act, or CIPA, which governs "Discovery of classified information by defendants." That Section provides that a court "may authorize the United States to delete specified items of classified information from documents to be made available to the defendant through discovery under the Federal Rules of Criminal Procedure . . . ."

The D.C. Circuit then explained in Yunis, that under CIPA, "first, a defendant must show that the statements sought crossed the low hurdle of relevance." The court then recognized "a defendant's access to his own statements in the possession of the government has generally been granted upon a minimal showing of relevance." Next, court must "determine if the assertion of privilege by the government is at least a colorable one." Then, the court must ask if the evidence is "helpful to the defense of an accused."

Applying these principles, the court in Yunis denied the defendant access to the material, concluding that "nothing in the classified documents in fact goes to the innocence of the defendant vel non, impeaches any evidence of guilt, or makes more or less probable any fact at issue in establishing any defense to the charges.".....

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So per the Yunis ruling, Powell's motion may not be a slam dunk. Seems to me this case is becoming weird.

drcrinum said:

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Question for you (or any other legal beagles): That 'ex parte hearing' between Sidney Powell & Judge Sullivan...how does something like that happen where the defense can arrange a special surprise hearing with the judge? There has to be some behind-the-scenes communications going on. Does the prosecution even attend? I have a sneaky feeling that something big is about to happen on September 10 when the scheduled hearing on Brady material & security clearances is held.

---

Ex parte hearings are rare but do occur when one side has some type of emergency or discovers malfeasance by the opposition, as has occurred here.

The prosecution here, which includes Brandon Van Grack, a Mueller toadie, has been all over the place with whether or not the material they have includes classified information. But classified or not, Brady material is still Brady material. And Judge Sullivan's order regarding such was after the guilty plea.

Procedurally speaking, Flynn's early guilty plea, in which he waived further discovery, would seem to foreclose Flynn having access to this discovery but in light of the prosecutorial misconduct in hiding the exculpatory evidence while steam rolling Flynn into a guilty plea, plus Judge Sullivan's standing order are mitigating factors.

Remember that early hearing when Judge Sullivan went off on Flynn as being treasonous? That was after an ex parte hearing with the prosecution (then still under Team Mueller's control). Clearly Team Mueller had lied to the Judge to get him so worked up, something he now realizes that he was played. How many other times has the prosecution deliberately misled, omitted or flat out lied during this entire matter?

Then remember what happened shortly before the recent trial of Flynn's associate, Rafekian, wherein Flynn had been scheduled to testify on behalf of the state but they pulled a fast one at the last second and declared Flynn was a co-conspirator? All because Flynn refused to lie for them? Flynn's sentencing had repeatedly been delayed just so Flynn would testify in that trial, at the request of the prosecution. Did they really not know what Flynn's testimony was going to be before the eve of trial? Doubtful.

But then discovery before the Rafekian trial produced documents from Flynn's former attorneys Covington, Burling revealing a distinct conflict of interest that was very harmful to Flynn and provided him with a new perspective. He was misled by his own counsel. IOW, what he thought he knew and would testify to, was a lie. So he wasn't going to testify as the prosecution wanted.

If I were Judge Sullivan, I would be tearing my hair out over this case which should have been just a routine sentencing but has become a multi-headed hydra.

and...

I can't help but think of Sidney Powell's book: License to Lie. I was glancing through some of the free-view pages on Amazon where she relates about all the lying on the part of the prosecutors in the Stevens Case, even while a US Deputy Assistant Attorney General was in the courtroom...and then AG Holder attempted to intervene...and how Judge Sullivan could no long trust the DOJ. Sullivan admitted he read parts of the book. I can't help but feel there's a transcendental bond between Sullivan & Powell.

https://libertyunyielding.com/2019/09/06/for-the-spygate-probe-its-not-necessarily-indictments-we-want-now-or-later/

Concluding remarks of the above article:

Quote:

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.......
In the same way, it is not just preferable but imperative to treat Spygate as a comprehensive disaster imperiling our existence and character as a nation. Limiting ourselves to what we will know if we prioritize indictments and convictions would be fatal. There will be long lists of things we can never indict anyone for, for a variety of reasons but that we must know about, formally, as a nation, even if that puts indictments or convictions at risk.

No prosecutorial consideration should be allowed to keep any portion of the truth a secret from the American people. The government's faith with the people has already been broken. That can't be overstressed. The restoration we need will not come from the ordinary routine of prosecuting some individuals and ignoring (even hiding) other things in order to be successful with the prosecutions.

Nor is that a sound basis for moving forward. The people need to understand that it's the conditions of government as it exists today that have set us up for this hour. Names aren't even necessarily the most important things for us to know (although we should know them, minus any figures legitimately engaged in covert espionage. It's not clear that any of those are even involved).

The people more urgently need a clear view of the policies, tools, and charters of agencies that made Spygate possible (indeed, made it inevitable). We need to understand not just who was talking to whom in our agencies and across national borders, but the agenda for their contacts, and what their purpose was in zeroing in on the 2016 election.

Indicting Andrew McCabe won't tell us those things. It might well hinder our efforts to find them out. If, after we know all we need to know to repair the foundations of our republic, we can then reasonably hope to indict some especially deserving people, so much the better. But the first priority has to be revealing the whole truth, and acting not through the courts or the executive agencies but through the house of the people, on Capitol Hill, to ponder the solutions to this greatest of quandaries: what to do to make sure this never happens again.

---

The above is a long serious read from a retired Naval Intelligence officer. Don't read it now -- you have football on your mind. Everyone who has been closely following SpyGate though needs to read this article. It looks at the big picture whereas most of us have been focusing on the individual trees. SpyGate was just a ripple on the surface of more serious malfeasance. If we don't comprehend the latter, we won't be able to cut off the head of the snake.

It does make sense, but it's hard to give up on the idea of "perp walks" and long prison sentences in favor of that bigger overall picture.

Perp walks-n-convictions or GO HOME!

If anyone's forgotten...we're a country of laws and a beacon of light to the rest of the world.

JUST DO IT...sooner than later!

Read all of cate's thoughts.

Secolobo said:

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Read all of cate's thoughts.

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This tweet is what many people fail to grasp. POTUS has a responsibility to protect ALL Americans, and, as much as it pains us to think, that includes the brainwashed liberals, socialists, and communists amongst us. It's going to take time to safely change the core beliefs of these people and it's going to take time to alter or remove the mechanisms driving them.

whatthehey78 said:

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Perp walks-n-convictions or GO HOME!

If anyone's forgotten...we're a country of laws and a beacon of light to the rest of the world.

JUST DO IT...sooner than later!

---

LOL. You say that like Trump can just stap his fingers and they all go to jail.

It don't work that way. And for the very reason you bolded.

MooreTrucker said:

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whatthehey78 said:

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Perp walks-n-convictions or GO HOME!

If anyone's forgotten...we're a country of laws and a beacon of light to the rest of the world.

JUST DO IT...sooner than later!

---

LOL. You say that like Trump can just stap his fingers and they all go to jail.

It don't work that way. And for the very reason you bolded.

---

But think of all the information Trump has. He just needs to use it. Blow the lid off this mother****er.

GreyhoundDad said:

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MooreTrucker said:

---

whatthehey78 said:

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Perp walks-n-convictions or GO HOME!

If anyone's forgotten...we're a country of laws and a beacon of light to the rest of the world.

JUST DO IT...sooner than later!

---

LOL. You say that like Trump can just stap his fingers and they all go to jail.

It don't work that way. And for the very reason you bolded.

---

But think of all the information Trump has. He just needs to use it. Blow the lid off this mother****er.

---

And he will, and he is, but it takes time and finesse.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/doj-emails-reveal-internal-response-to-wiretap-allegations-against-rosenstein_3073852.html

The Rosenstein 'wire the President' scenario = 'fake news' reporting by the NYTs...as usual.
Jeff Carlson provides the details in his typical, thorough fashion.

MooreTrucker said:

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GreyhoundDad said:

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MooreTrucker said:

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whatthehey78 said:

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Perp walks-n-convictions or GO HOME!

If anyone's forgotten...we're a country of laws and a beacon of light to the rest of the world.

JUST DO IT...sooner than later!

---

LOL. You say that like Trump can just stap his fingers and they all go to jail.

It don't work that way. And for the very reason you bolded.

---

But think of all the information Trump has. He just needs to use it. Blow the lid off this mother****er.

---

And he will, and he is, but it takes time and finesse.

---

Sorry, ain't buying it. Time/finesse? The entire story is being buried and the public has lost interest. Half a dozen persons lost their jobs MAX and it's pretty much 'business as usual' in the swamp! I expect them to exercise REAL justice or get off the pot. 'Timing' for max effect is for politicians (boo) and marketers...screw that. IF you got the goods...kick a$$ and take names or GO HOME.

whatthehey78 said:

---

MooreTrucker said:

---

GreyhoundDad said:

---

MooreTrucker said:

---

whatthehey78 said:

---

Perp walks-n-convictions or GO HOME!

If anyone's forgotten...we're a country of laws and a beacon of light to the rest of the world.

JUST DO IT...sooner than later!

---

LOL. You say that like Trump can just stap his fingers and they all go to jail.

It don't work that way. And for the very reason you bolded.

---

But think of all the information Trump has. He just needs to use it. Blow the lid off this mother****er.

---

And he will, and he is, but it takes time and finesse.

---

Sorry, ain't buying it. Time/finesse? The entire story is being buried and the public has lost interest. Half a dozen persons lost their jobs MAX and it's pretty much 'business as usual' in the swamp! I expect them to exercise REAL justice or get off the pot. 'Timing' for max effect is for politicians (boo) and marketers...screw that. IF you got the goods...kick a$$ and take names or GO HOME.

---

Good thing you're just a message board poster and not in charge of any of this.

MooreTrucker said:

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whatthehey78 said:

---

MooreTrucker said:

---

GreyhoundDad said:

---

MooreTrucker said:

---

whatthehey78 said:

---

Perp walks-n-convictions or GO HOME!

If anyone's forgotten...we're a country of laws and a beacon of light to the rest of the world.

JUST DO IT...sooner than later!

---

LOL. You say that like Trump can just stap his fingers and they all go to jail.

It don't work that way. And for the very reason you bolded.

---

But think of all the information Trump has. He just needs to use it. Blow the lid off this mother****er.

---

And he will, and he is, but it takes time and finesse.

---

Sorry, ain't buying it. Time/finesse? The entire story is being buried and the public has lost interest. Half a dozen persons lost their jobs MAX and it's pretty much 'business as usual' in the swamp! I expect them to exercise REAL justice or get off the pot. 'Timing' for max effect is for politicians (boo) and marketers...screw that. IF you got the goods...kick a$$ and take names or GO HOME.

---

Good thing you're just a message board poster and not in charge of any of this.

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Sad thing those that are in charge are obviously just sitting on their thumbs. It's what the swamp does. Even more sad, you assume somethings going to happen and it will get fixed. Good luck with that.