The Dodgers

6,618 Views | 77 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by Macarthur
dermdoc
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Sapper Redux • 8:06a, 6/9/23
AG
Sapper Redux said:
dermdoc said:
Sapper Redux said:
dermdoc said:
Sapper Redux said:
dermdoc said:
ramblin_ag02 said:
Sapper Redux said:
ramblin_ag02 said:
Sapper Redux said:
That group did more good for LGBTQ people during the AIDS epidemic than the Catholic Church has ever done.
I'm not if you are aware, but there are more than 600 Catholic hospitals. There were even more in the 80s and 90s


I stand by what I said. The medical care provided to most AIDS patients in the 80s was hardly worth praising.
Wow! I don't think I've ever seen a more blatant and proud example of anti-religious bigotry.

Seriously? Some random activist group did more than hundreds of hospitals full of medical professionals all doing their absolute best to help people with a new and unknown illness? I don't even know what to say
Yep. It is sad. He really, really hates religion. Sad.


I don't hate religion. But I'm also not deferential to religious organizations and their pearl clutching while ignoring their own history.


And you and your side do not pearl clutch? And I am not deferential to political takes on health care.

You are a hypocrite.

How is my position hypocritical?
What is your position? It seems that you are claiming that a small activist group did more to help AIDS patients than the Catholic Church and hospitals and doctors.

And that you "have a pretty good idea" of what was going on during the AIDS deal and yet give no history of actually working in medicine or dealing with AIDS patients. Where do you get your supposed knowledge of what was going on?

Maybe it is more arrogance than hypocrisy.


I said the they did more than the Church. I didn't say anything about individual doctors and nurses at hospitals, many of whom are not Catholic. And the mistreatment and prejudice towards gay people during the AIDS epidemic in hospitals is very well documented. My anecdotal experience comes from knowing a few gay men impacted by the epidemic and the treatment they and their partners received at the hands of the medical system and churches. Yours comes from a different angle. You may think you were doing all you could. It didn't come across like that to many impacted patients, just so you know.

The group in question is part of the original AIDS quilt because of their tireless efforts and support for those suffering. The Catholic Church is not on the quilt for a reason. Regardless of how many hospitals they have founded.


Where is the mistreatment of AIDS patients in hospitals "well documented"?
Are there studies that you can link?

I was at the epicenter of the AIDS outbreak at the Houston med center and working community STD clinics.

I saw none of the stuff you claim to be ""well documented".
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Reply Quote
12
2 edits
Sapper Redux
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to dermdoc • 8:43a, 6/9/23
I'm glad you didn't see it. But can you consider that your perspective is skewed by your position in the system as it existed? AIDS care requires far more than just acute hospital treatment and was subject to extreme misinformation and resulting mistreatment of those suffering with it. Many doctors and nurses were heroes during the acute phase of the epidemic. It doesn't change the totality of the experience and the ways the organizations like the Catholic Church ignored the scope of the problem or spread the backlash towards victims that increased suffering.
Reply Quote
1
dermdoc
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Sapper Redux • 8:47a, 6/9/23
AG
Sapper Redux said:
I'm glad you didn't see it. But can you consider that your perspective is skewed by your position in the system as it existed? AIDS care requires far more than just acute hospital treatment and was subject to extreme misinformation and resulting mistreatment of those suffering with it. Many doctors and nurses were heroes during the acute phase of the epidemic. It doesn't change the totality of the experience and the ways the organizations like the Catholic Church ignored the scope of the problem or spread the backlash towards victims that increased suffering.
You posted that it was well documented that AIDS patients were mistreated in hospitals. That is a very serious allegation in my opinion.

This last post of yours does not address that.

You are crawfishing.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Reply Quote
15
1 edit
The Banned
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Sapper Redux • 8:50a, 6/9/23
Sapper Redux said:
I'm glad you didn't see it. But can you consider that your perspective is skewed by your position in the system as it existed? AIDS care requires far more than just acute hospital treatment and was subject to extreme misinformation and resulting mistreatment of those suffering with it. Many doctors and nurses were heroes during the acute phase of the epidemic. It doesn't change the totality of the experience and the ways the organizations like the Catholic Church ignored the scope of the problem or spread the backlash towards victims that increased suffering.


Can you be more specific? The gay man from New York who lived it basically said the Hospitals did the best they could.

This appears like yet another situation where the Catholic Church is expected to bend on their thousands of years of teaching because other people don't like it. Please correct me if I'm wrong

ETA: just realized I never pasted the link in my first post. I believe this is the definition of a facepalm moment

https://www.npr.org/2019/12/01/783932572/how-the-catholic-church-aided-both-the-sick-and-the-sickness-as-hiv-spread
Reply Quote
5
1 edit
Macarthur
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to dermdoc • 9:09a, 6/9/23
dermdoc said:
Sapper Redux said:
ramblin_ag02 said:
Sapper Redux said:
That group did more good for LGBTQ people during the AIDS epidemic than the Catholic Church has ever done.
I'm not if you are aware, but there are more than 600 Catholic hospitals. There were even more in the 80s and 90s


I stand by what I said. The medical care provided to most AIDS patients in the 80s was hardly worth praising.
Sorry but this makes me mad.

I was a resident at Baylor College of Medicine at the time. Did skin biopsies for some of Fauci's studies. Even got published on an article describing lymphocyte changes before we discovered the viruses. Every doc I know worked their asses off trying to figure it out and find a cure. And every AIDS patient we took care of was treated with compassion even though there wa little we could except palliative care.

And the gay population refused to listen to any docs or wear condoms. Instead they cried victimhood and oppression.

You have zero idea what you are talking about.

I respect your post here and your experience, but I think the bolded is a bridge too far.

Gay were subjected to victimhood and oppression (and to a lesser extent still today). I really don't think the gay community invented their victimhood status just so they could refuse to wear condoms. I think that is a bit insensitive.
Reply Quote
The Banned
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Macarthur • 9:14a, 6/9/23
Macarthur said:
dermdoc said:
Sapper Redux said:
ramblin_ag02 said:
Sapper Redux said:
That group did more good for LGBTQ people during the AIDS epidemic than the Catholic Church has ever done.
I'm not if you are aware, but there are more than 600 Catholic hospitals. There were even more in the 80s and 90s


I stand by what I said. The medical care provided to most AIDS patients in the 80s was hardly worth praising.
Sorry but this makes me mad.

I was a resident at Baylor College of Medicine at the time. Did skin biopsies for some of Fauci's studies. Even got published on an article describing lymphocyte changes before we discovered the viruses. Every doc I know worked their asses off trying to figure it out and find a cure. And every AIDS patient we took care of was treated with compassion even though there wa little we could except palliative care.

And the gay population refused to listen to any docs or wear condoms. Instead they cried victimhood and oppression.

You have zero idea what you are talking about.

I respect your post here and your experience, but I think the bolded is a bridge too far.

Gay were subjected to victimhood and oppression (and to a lesser extent still today). I really don't think the gay community invented their victimhood status just so they could refuse to wear condoms. I think that is a bit insensitive.


I think you're reading that wrong. As gays were victims and oppressed, they took the advice as another attempt to victimize and oppress them and pushed back against it to their own detriment
Reply Quote
dermdoc
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Macarthur • 9:15a, 6/9/23
AG
Macarthur said:
dermdoc said:
Sapper Redux said:
ramblin_ag02 said:
Sapper Redux said:
That group did more good for LGBTQ people during the AIDS epidemic than the Catholic Church has ever done.
I'm not if you are aware, but there are more than 600 Catholic hospitals. There were even more in the 80s and 90s


I stand by what I said. The medical care provided to most AIDS patients in the 80s was hardly worth praising.
Sorry but this makes me mad.

I was a resident at Baylor College of Medicine at the time. Did skin biopsies for some of Fauci's studies. Even got published on an article describing lymphocyte changes before we discovered the viruses. Every doc I know worked their asses off trying to figure it out and find a cure. And every AIDS patient we took care of was treated with compassion even though there wa little we could except palliative care.

And the gay population refused to listen to any docs or wear condoms. Instead they cried victimhood and oppression.

You have zero idea what you are talking about.

I respect your post here and your experience, but I think the bolded is a bridge too far.

Gay were subjected to victimhood and oppression (and to a lesser extent still today). I really don't think the gay community invented their victimhood status just so they could refuse to wear condoms. I think that is a bit insensitive.
Fair enough. On further thought, it was not the patients themselves but the activist groups, politicians, and media.

Read what sapper has posted on this thread. With no substantiation.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Reply Quote
2
Macarthur
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to The Banned • 9:23a, 6/9/23
I'm curious why you think this...

A quick google search shows that in June of 1984 The Advocate (which of course was the largest gay publication) was telling gay men to use condoms. Gay run health clinics like Whitman-Walker and Gay Men's Health Crisis in New York and San Francisco AIDS foundation were all developing guidelines which included condom use.

I think it's important to keep in mind that early on, the cause wasn't known so it seems obvious to us now that condom use was the key but that wasn't as clear in the mid-80s.
Reply Quote
2
The Banned
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Macarthur • 9:27a, 6/9/23
Macarthur said:
I'm curious why you think this...

A quick google search shows that in June of 1984 The Advocate (which of course was the largest gay publication) was telling gay men to use condoms. Gay run health clinics like Whitman-Walker and Gay Men's Health Crisis in New York and San Francisco AIDS foundation were all developing guidelines which included condom use.

I think it's important to keep in mind that early on, the cause wasn't known so it seems obvious to us now that condom use was the key but that wasn't as clear in the mid-80s.


I have no idea why that is. I was not a gay man in the 80s. What I understand of human nature is that change can be hard and many people can take insult over many things that are not insulting at all. It looks like the education eventually worked, which is a good thing.
Reply Quote
2
BluHorseShu
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Sapper Redux • 10:24a, 6/9/23
AG
Sapper Redux said:
That group did more good for LGBTQ people during the AIDS epidemic than the Catholic Church has ever done.
Weeellllll....not in the long run. The Church has a better track record for eternity
Reply Quote
10
Jabin
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Macarthur • 11:52a, 6/9/23
Quote:
I think that is a bit insensitive.
More than a bit ironic on this thread.
Reply Quote
5
1 edit
Macarthur
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Jabin • 11:54a, 6/9/23
lol...yeah, most likely the most powerful, influential and wealthiest institution in the history of the world should have their feelings hurt.

Yeah, I'm not biting.
Reply Quote
Jabin
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
11:56a, 6/9/23
Interesting how one justifies hypocrisy.
Reply Quote
7
Macarthur
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Jabin • 11:59a, 6/9/23
What is hypocrisy? Not necessarily the same thing as irony.

And don't confuse my post w some others. I have no issue w Catholics being "offended". I'm just not sympathetic.
Reply Quote
2
Sapper Redux
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to dermdoc • 12:13p, 6/9/23
dermdoc said:
Sapper Redux said:
I'm glad you didn't see it. But can you consider that your perspective is skewed by your position in the system as it existed? AIDS care requires far more than just acute hospital treatment and was subject to extreme misinformation and resulting mistreatment of those suffering with it. Many doctors and nurses were heroes during the acute phase of the epidemic. It doesn't change the totality of the experience and the ways the organizations like the Catholic Church ignored the scope of the problem or spread the backlash towards victims that increased suffering.
You posted that it was well documented that AIDS patients were mistreated in hospitals. That is a very serious allegation in my opinion.

This last post of yours does not address that.

You are crawfishing.


https://www.jstor.org/stable/44452237

https://medicine.yale.edu/diversity/paps/aids/

https://www.nytimes.com/1987/08/03/opinion/when-doctors-refuse-to-treat-aids.html

Yes, there are plenty of healthcare heroes in the AIDS crisis. Many of who's worked at Catholic hospitals. My early statement about Catholic hospitals was too broad.

But yes, the stigma and mistreatment of AIDS patients by the healthcare system is also very real, and the Catholic Church as an institution and its leaders did not help the stigma and poor treatment of those suffering. At all.
Reply Quote
The Banned
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Sapper Redux • 12:27p, 6/9/23
Yes, I know it's wiki, but yet another point to disprove your argument. This seems like unnecessary catholic bashing. Read the ministry section and tell us again how the Catholic Church was a bad guy here?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Church_and_HIV/AIDS#:~:text=United%20States%20bishops,-See%20also%3A%20HIV&text=In%20the%20document%20they%20said,the%20spread%20of%20the%20disease.
Reply Quote
2
dermdoc
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Sapper Redux • 12:42p, 6/9/23
AG
Sapper Redux said:
dermdoc said:
Sapper Redux said:
I'm glad you didn't see it. But can you consider that your perspective is skewed by your position in the system as it existed? AIDS care requires far more than just acute hospital treatment and was subject to extreme misinformation and resulting mistreatment of those suffering with it. Many doctors and nurses were heroes during the acute phase of the epidemic. It doesn't change the totality of the experience and the ways the organizations like the Catholic Church ignored the scope of the problem or spread the backlash towards victims that increased suffering.
You posted that it was well documented that AIDS patients were mistreated in hospitals. That is a very serious allegation in my opinion.

This last post of yours does not address that.

You are crawfishing.


https://www.jstor.org/stable/44452237

https://medicine.yale.edu/diversity/paps/aids/

https://www.nytimes.com/1987/08/03/opinion/when-doctors-refuse-to-treat-aids.html

Yes, there are plenty of healthcare heroes in the AIDS crisis. Many of who's worked at Catholic hospitals. My early statement about Catholic hospitals was too broad.

But yes, the stigma and mistreatment of AIDS patients by the healthcare system is also very real, and the Catholic Church as an institution and its leaders did not help the stigma and poor treatment of those suffering. At all.
I can not get behind the NYT paywall but I do not see evidence of mistreatment of AIDS patients in hospitals in the other 2 linked articles which was your assertion,

Are there homphobic docs? Sure
Are there racist and sexist docs? Sure
That does not mean they mistreated patients they did not like.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Reply Quote
11
2 edits
craigernaught
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
1:55p, 6/9/23
AG
How the hell is this thread more boring than baseball?

Kidding. Kidding. Baseball is great and the Dodgers are as awful as this thread.
Reply Quote
2
dermdoc
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to craigernaught • 3:13p, 6/9/23
AG
craigernaught said:
How the hell is this thread more boring than baseball?

Kidding. Kidding. Baseball is great and the Dodgers are as awful as this thread.
Now this is blasphemy.

Baseball, especiallyAggie baseball, is the greatest game ever played.

I mean, who is the book of Ruth about?
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Reply Quote
5
Sapper Redux
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to The Banned • 3:19p, 6/9/23
The Banned said:
Yes, I know it's wiki, but yet another point to disprove your argument. This seems like unnecessary catholic bashing. Read the ministry section and tell us again how the Catholic Church was a bad guy here?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Church_and_HIV/AIDS#:~:text=United%20States%20bishops,-See%20also%3A%20HIV&text=In%20the%20document%20they%20said,the%20spread%20of%20the%20disease.


You're right, it's Wikipedia. The approach of the Catholic Church to the epidemic was considered so bad that it was a locus of protest amongst activists across the US.
Reply Quote
Sapper Redux
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to dermdoc • 3:20p, 6/9/23
dermdoc said:
Sapper Redux said:
dermdoc said:
Sapper Redux said:
I'm glad you didn't see it. But can you consider that your perspective is skewed by your position in the system as it existed? AIDS care requires far more than just acute hospital treatment and was subject to extreme misinformation and resulting mistreatment of those suffering with it. Many doctors and nurses were heroes during the acute phase of the epidemic. It doesn't change the totality of the experience and the ways the organizations like the Catholic Church ignored the scope of the problem or spread the backlash towards victims that increased suffering.
You posted that it was well documented that AIDS patients were mistreated in hospitals. That is a very serious allegation in my opinion.

This last post of yours does not address that.

You are crawfishing.


https://www.jstor.org/stable/44452237

https://medicine.yale.edu/diversity/paps/aids/

https://www.nytimes.com/1987/08/03/opinion/when-doctors-refuse-to-treat-aids.html

Yes, there are plenty of healthcare heroes in the AIDS crisis. Many of who's worked at Catholic hospitals. My early statement about Catholic hospitals was too broad.

But yes, the stigma and mistreatment of AIDS patients by the healthcare system is also very real, and the Catholic Church as an institution and its leaders did not help the stigma and poor treatment of those suffering. At all.
I can not get behind the NYT paywall but I do not see evidence of mistreatment of AIDS patients in hospitals in the other 2 linked articles which was your assertion,

Are there homphobic docs? Sure
Are there racist and sexist docs? Sure
That does not mean they mistreated patients they did not like.


They all discuss how patients were denied care or refused care or provided substandard care in many instances. Oral histories of the treatment of early patients is incredibly damning.
Reply Quote
1 edit
dermdoc
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Sapper Redux • 3:27p, 6/9/23
AG
Sapper Redux said:
dermdoc said:
Sapper Redux said:
dermdoc said:
Sapper Redux said:
I'm glad you didn't see it. But can you consider that your perspective is skewed by your position in the system as it existed? AIDS care requires far more than just acute hospital treatment and was subject to extreme misinformation and resulting mistreatment of those suffering with it. Many doctors and nurses were heroes during the acute phase of the epidemic. It doesn't change the totality of the experience and the ways the organizations like the Catholic Church ignored the scope of the problem or spread the backlash towards victims that increased suffering.
You posted that it was well documented that AIDS patients were mistreated in hospitals. That is a very serious allegation in my opinion.

This last post of yours does not address that.

You are crawfishing.


https://www.jstor.org/stable/44452237

https://medicine.yale.edu/diversity/paps/aids/

https://www.nytimes.com/1987/08/03/opinion/when-doctors-refuse-to-treat-aids.html

Yes, there are plenty of healthcare heroes in the AIDS crisis. Many of who's worked at Catholic hospitals. My early statement about Catholic hospitals was too broad.

But yes, the stigma and mistreatment of AIDS patients by the healthcare system is also very real, and the Catholic Church as an institution and its leaders did not help the stigma and poor treatment of those suffering. At all.
I can not get behind the NYT paywall but I do not see evidence of mistreatment of AIDS patients in hospitals in the other 2 linked articles which was your assertion,

Are there homphobic docs? Sure
Are there racist and sexist docs? Sure
That does not mean they mistreated patients they did not like.


They all discuss how patients were denied care or refused care or provided substandard care in many instances. Oral histories of the treatment of early patients is incredibly damning.


The first two links? I did not get that.

Med school academicians are incredibly liberal and I would be shocked if that occurred at any major med center. I was looked upon as a redneck hick.

Certainly I did not see it.

The problem was there was nothing as docs we could do for a long time. Incredibly frustrating.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Reply Quote
1 edit
The Banned
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Sapper Redux • 4:09p, 6/9/23
Sapper Redux said:
The Banned said:
Yes, I know it's wiki, but yet another point to disprove your argument. This seems like unnecessary catholic bashing. Read the ministry section and tell us again how the Catholic Church was a bad guy here?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Church_and_HIV/AIDS#:~:text=United%20States%20bishops,-See%20also%3A%20HIV&text=In%20the%20document%20they%20said,the%20spread%20of%20the%20disease.


You're right, it's Wikipedia. The approach of the Catholic Church to the epidemic was considered so bad that it was a locus of protest amongst activists across the US.


You're still not offering any information. Literally the only negative I see is that the Catholic Church continues to denounce homosexuality. Same as they had done for roughly 1950 years before that. Do you care to offer any articles to read through? At least I'm trying here. And if the freaking pope himself is embracing AIDS victims, washing the feet of AIDS victims and saying it is the duty of catholic clergy and medical professionals to help gay people suffering with this disease, I don't exactly know what more you want. Until you offer information otherwise, I will consider this needless Catholic bashing. Similar to how derm is reading your papers and not coming to the same conclusions you are.

And if you think that offering examples of individual Catholics acting poorly, that won't move the needle much. You accused the institution and its charities, so you'll need to provide evidence on par with that claim. Im ready to check my biases with proper evidence, and I hope you are too
Reply Quote
16
1 edit
dermdoc
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to The Banned • 4:14p, 6/9/23
AG
The Banned said:
Sapper Redux said:
The Banned said:
Yes, I know it's wiki, but yet another point to disprove your argument. This seems like unnecessary catholic bashing. Read the ministry section and tell us again how the Catholic Church was a bad guy here?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Church_and_HIV/AIDS#:~:text=United%20States%20bishops,-See%20also%3A%20HIV&text=In%20the%20document%20they%20said,the%20spread%20of%20the%20disease.


You're right, it's Wikipedia. The approach of the Catholic Church to the epidemic was considered so bad that it was a locus of protest amongst activists across the US.


You're still not offering any information. Literally the only negative I see is that the Catholic Church continues to denounce homosexuality. Same as they had done for roughly 1950 years before that. Do you care to offer any articles to read through? At least I'm trying here. And if the freaking pope himself is embracing AIDS victims, washing the feet of AIDS victims and saying it is the duty of catholic clergy and medical professionals to help gay people suffering with this disease, I don't exactly know what more you want. Until you offer information otherwise, I will consider this needless Catholic bashing. Similar to how derm is reading your papers and not coming to the same conclusions you are.

And if you think that offering examples of individual Catholics acting poorly, that won't move the needle much. You accused the institution and its charities, so you'll need to provide evidence on par with that claim. Im ready to check my biases with proper evidence, and I hope you are too


I am not Catholic but completely agree. Christians are held to a totally different standard. And that is okay.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Reply Quote
3
1 edit
Logos Stick
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Sapper Redux • 12:24p, 6/12/23
Sapper Redux said:
That group did more good for LGBTQ people during the AIDS epidemic than the Catholic Church has ever done.


You mean degenerates helped other degenerates because they all wanted to have free perverted sex without consequence?

Do you have a newsletter?
Reply Quote
9
Monkeypoxfighter
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to dermdoc • 2:03p, 6/12/23
dermdoc said:
jrico2727 said:
Sapper Redux said:
jrico2727 said:
Sapper Redux said:
That group did more good for LGBTQ people during the AIDS epidemic than the Catholic Church has ever done.
Encouraging and promoting sodomy seems like a great way to stop AIDS


Yeah, this is the stuff that did so much to help those suffering. I will say there were a number of individual priests and nuns who did great things during the early years of the epidemic, but this is the stuff which did so much to help kill people.
How so? Speaking truth to the situation, if a certain activity, within a particular group, leads to predictable results. Why would telling them to not engage in that activity be killing them? Seems like the opposite would have happened had they listened.
Exactly. But as docs we were not allowed to do that because it was seen as prejudice towards the gay population. There was even backlash if we suggested condom use.

And these are the same folks who wanted people fined for not wearing masks during Covid.

The hypocrisy is surreal.
Sounds familiar. Guess where Monkeypox really took off, and yet we were told (once again) that everyone was at risk? Why? Because to point out the main area of spread would once again implicate the gay community for spreading a disease through the promiscuous sex that runs rampant through chunks of it.
It only took me a year to figure out this place is nuts!
Reply Quote
7
1 edit
SoulSlaveAG2005
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
6:05a, 6/14/23
AG
Bishop Strickland, leading into the valley.

Eucharistic procession, JP2 relics and prayer service in reparation.

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/us-bishops-issue-call-to-prayer-in-reparation-for-blasphemies-of-anti-catholic-drag-nuns/?utm_source=top_news&utm_campaign=usa
Reply Quote
4
Thaddeus73
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
6:31a, 6/14/23
AG
The Catholic Church, like God in the Bible, hates sodomy, but loves sodomites. This is a distinction lost on most people, who want us to love sodomy as though it doesn't offend God.
Reply Quote
4
RAB91
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to SoulSlaveAG2005 • 9:40a, 6/14/23
SoulSlaveAG2005 said:
Bishop Strickland, leading into the valley.

Eucharistic procession, JP2 relics and prayer service in reparation.

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/us-bishops-issue-call-to-prayer-in-reparation-for-blasphemies-of-anti-catholic-drag-nuns/?utm_source=top_news&utm_campaign=usa
We need more like him... but unfortunately the local bishops in the LA area don't have his type of courage.
Reply Quote
1
PabloSerna
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
10:01a, 6/15/23
AG
Diocese of Los Angeles issues a call to prayer for June 16th (Read Statement Here). The Archbishop has asked the faithful to pray the Litany to the Sacred Heart of Jesus:

Lord, have mercy
Lord, have mercy
Christ, have mercy
Christ, have mercy
Lord, have mercy
Lord, have mercy

God our Father in heaven
have mercy on us
God the Son, Redeemer of the world
have mercy on us
God the Holy Spirit
have mercy on us
Holy Trinity, one God
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, Son of the eternal Father
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, formed by the Holy Spirit in the womb of the Virgin Mother
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, one with the eternal Word
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, infinite in majesty
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, holy temple of God
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, tabernacle of the Most High
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, house of God and gate of heaven
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, aflame with love for us
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, source of justice and love
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, full of goodness and love
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, well-spring of all virtue
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, worthy of all praise
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, king and center of all hearts
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, treasure-house of wisdom and knowledge
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, in whom there dwells the fullness of God
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, in whom the Father is well pleased
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, from whose fullness we have all received
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, desire of the eternal hills
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, patient and full of mercy
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, generous to all who turn to you
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, fountain of life and holiness
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, atonement for our sins
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, overwhelmed with insults
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, broken for our sins
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, obedient even to death
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, pierced by a lance
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, source of all consolation
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, our life and resurrection
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, our peace and reconciliation
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, victim of our sins
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, salvation of all who trust in you
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, hope of all who die in you
have mercy on us
Heart of Jesus, delight of all the saints
have mercy on us


Lamb of God, you take away the sins of the world
have mercy on us
Lamb of God, you take away the sins of the world
have mercy on us
Lamb of God, you take away the sins of the world
have mercy on us

Jesus, gentle and humble of heart.
Touch our hearts and make them like your own.
Let us pray.

Grant, we pray, almighty God,
that we, who glory in the Heart of your beloved Son
and recall the wonders of his love for us,
may be made worthy to receive
an overflowing measure of grace
from that fount of heavenly gifts.
Through Christ our Lord.

R/. Amen.
Reply Quote
6
PabloSerna
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
6:57p, 6/15/23
AG
There is a planned prayer march around the stadium. See how God works!

ETA: This issue for me is not about the good SPI has done/will do- but rather their insistence to dress up in costumes that mock real women religious that have given their lives to Jesus. I don't understand why they (SPI) have chosen to use nuns and the RCC in this way other than to bring this level of attention. Well they got it and it is sad that others will likely follow suit.

To me this is no different that the Order of the Arrow (of which I was called out twice, and kindly said no twice) and their insistence in appropriating Native American regalia as part of their ceremonies. Many Native American groups have asked BSA to stop doing this precisely for the same reasons the RCC has asked SPI to stop- not cool, it is a mockery. Both SPI and OA have done many good things, just don't understand why the need to dress up like someone they are not?
Reply Quote
1 edit
PabloSerna
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
7:55a, 6/16/23
AG
This event is shaping up to be a flash point about how some LGBTQ Catholics don't support blindly what this group is doing by dressing up in drag as nuns. It's not an all or nothing scenario, I do think there are lines to be drawn and for me, this is crossing the line. I will be saying a prayer with the Bishop.

Reply Quote
Thaddeus73
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
8:02p, 6/17/23
AG
Reply Quote
6
Macarthur
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Thaddeus73 • 8:42p, 6/17/23
Their a average attendance is around 47k. They reported 49k for pride night.
Reply Quote
1
1 edit
jkag89
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
9:45p, 6/17/23
Both sides are being somewhat disingenuous here in portraying the crowd. Maybe 100 or so folks were in the stands when the "Sisters" were given their "Award" about an hour before the game but to be fair, Dodger fans tend to be notoriously late to games. On the other hand 49,000 fans might be considered to be slightly below average for a Friday night game against their archrival, the Giants.
Reply Quote
Page 2 of 3 ▼
 
×
subscribe Verify your student status
See Subscription Benefits
Trial only available to users who have never subscribed or participated in a previous trial.