I tried going back through the show archives to find it, and it wasn't on Bishop Barron's (that I could find at least), so it may well have been another show I caught.

Anyways, that's largely irrelevant. Dermdoc, you seem to be missing the point. It wasn't coming from a judgmental position. It was more so prompting the listener to self reflect on their relationship with Christ and whether their life serves as a reflection of their belief or if they believe in word only.

I can confidently state that for most of my life I identified as a Christian, yet had virtually no relationship with God and did nothing to try and strengthen that relationship with Him until I was in my late twenties. I'm not sure why acknowledging there are people out there that claim to be Christian yet fundamentally live like they have no belief triggers you so. From lurking on this board long enough, I understand we differ in parts of our understanding of theology. I wasn't trying to derail the thread or accuse those that are Christian, but give another viewpoint to the above mentioned descriptions of atheists/theists that I recently heard and found interesting.

No problem at all and did not mean to sound triggered. Nothing wrong with a priest or preacher encouraging their flock to get closer to God. I have a problem when clergy start saying there are other things necessary for salvation besides the finished work of Christ.

dermdoc said:

---

No problem at all and did not mean to sound triggered. Nothing wrong with a priest or preacher encouraging their flock to get closer to God. I have a problem when clergy start saying there are other things necessary for salvation besides the finished work of Christ.

---

I think as always this is a question of perspective. Christ's work is finished; Christ's work in me is not. Christ's work was unilateral; Christ's work in me is not. As far as God is concerned, all men are saved. So when we say "necessary" who has the deficiency? God, or men? There IS an answer to "what must I do to be saved?" And the answer is not "nothing Christ's work is finished."

k2aggie07 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

No problem at all and did not mean to sound triggered. Nothing wrong with a priest or preacher encouraging their flock to get closer to God. I have a problem when clergy start saying there are other things necessary for salvation besides the finished work of Christ.

---

I think as always this is a question of perspective. Christ's work is finished; Christ's work in me is not. Christ's work was unilateral; Christ's work in me is not. As far as God is concerned, all men are saved. So when we say "necessary" who has the deficiency? God, or men? There IS an answer to "what must I do to be saved?" And the answer is not "nothing Christ's work is finished."

---

So just curious, what must we do to be saved? I believe by grace we are saved. What can I, a lowly creature, do to be saved except by God's grace and have faith?

Quote:

---

So just curious, what must we do to be saved? I believe by grace we are saved. What can I, a lowly creature, do to be saved except by God's grace and have faith?

---

Follow His Commandments.

That said, I think the question is headed in the wrong direction. Standing before the Almighty God, "what must I do to be saved" implies that we only care about him insofar as saving ourselves. Otherwise, we would have no need for him or no care for Him.

diehard03 said:

---

Quote:

---

So just curious, what must we do to be saved? I believe by grace we are saved. What can I, a lowly creature, do to be saved except by God's grace and have faith?

---

Follow His Commandments.

That said, I think the question is headed in the wrong direction. Standing before the Almighty God, "what must I do to be saved" implies that we only care about him insofar as saving ourselves. Otherwise, we would have no need for him or no care for Him.

---

I mean, it's a pretty big carrot/stick to pretend isn't there.

Quote:

---

I mean, it's a pretty big carrot/stick to pretend isn't there.

---

To me, it feels more like empathy towards God's situation.

Acts 2:38
Acts 8:37
Acts 16:31
Acts 18:8
Luke 14:26
1 Cor 15:2

Etc etc

Did we ever make a decision if empathy was ok or not?

dermdoc said:

---

k2aggie07 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

No problem at all and did not mean to sound triggered. Nothing wrong with a priest or preacher encouraging their flock to get closer to God. I have a problem when clergy start saying there are other things necessary for salvation besides the finished work of Christ.

---

I think as always this is a question of perspective. Christ's work is finished; Christ's work in me is not. Christ's work was unilateral; Christ's work in me is not. As far as God is concerned, all men are saved. So when we say "necessary" who has the deficiency? God, or men? There IS an answer to "what must I do to be saved?" And the answer is not "nothing Christ's work is finished."

---

So just curious, what must we do to be saved? I believe by grace we are saved. What can I, a lowly creature, do to be saved except by God's grace and have faith?

---

Probably not do stuff like this

https://www.houstonpress.com/news/alleged-aggie-doctor-brags-of-firing-obama-voting-employee-6743514

Or say stuff like this.

Quote:

---

Dermdoc did express one regret about his action. "I'll probably have to see some foreign med school grad with a hyphenated last name," he wrote. "This sucks."

---

Seems kind of irrelevant to worry about god's grace when you act like that.

That was ten years ago. I repented and was forgiven. I have been changed. Praise God!

schmendeler said:

---

AGC said:

---

Let he who is sock-less cast the first stone.

---

I have no socks. but I say, go forth and politics board no more.

---

And I am actually thankful for posts like the one here. It reminds me of what I need to not do.

dermdoc said:

---

That was ten years ago. I repented and was forgiven. I have been changed. Praise God!

---

Not a sock, just haven't posted in a long time.

I guess my point is, it is incredibly easy to forget about past actions and brush over them like they never happened.

As to how long ago you took those actions and said those words, why does that matter? Aren't you judged on your entire life, not just the parts you believe are moral?

Edit- hit my post limit for the day.

Two questions for you.

1.) you just posted on the politics board 4 days ago and seem to be a regular contributor. Why would you say otherwise?

2.) How did you repent and what did you do to earn forgiveness for your words and actions?

Edit 2 for Beer Baron

Not trying to berate him, just trying to understand how he correlates his past actions with his current words. Just looking for an explanation as to why he believes grace matters more than actions.

Since he had the most high profile example of the folks posting on this thread it seemed like a fair question to ask.

Edit 3- Dermdoc

My opinions on your actions are irrelevant.

As to being judged on your current actions, versus prior actions, where is the line drawn? What sins are forgivable and which aren't?

For example, let's say a gay man lived as a gay man his entire life, then, a week before he dies he decides to become Christian and repents his past actions.

Do you believe he will go to Heaven because he believes he has received gods grace? If not, why not?

I am forgiven, not perfect. That is why I need a Savior and by God's grace, I was given one. And I believe my faith in Christ declares me righteous and I am not judged. Praise God!

Ezekiel 18 says that we are judged by who we are now, not by who we were or who our parents are

Aggie4242 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

That was ten years ago. I repented and was forgiven. I have been changed. Praise God!

---

Not a sock, just haven't posted in a long time.



I guess my point is, it is incredibly easy to forget about past actions and brush over them like they never happened.

As to how long ago you took those actions and said those words, why does that matter? Aren't you judged on your entire life, not just the parts you believe are moral?

Edit- hit my post limit for the day.

Two questions for you.

1.) you just posted on the politics board 4 days ago and seem to be a regular contributor. Why would you say otherwise?

2.) How did you repent and what did you do to earn forgiveness for your words and actions?

---

I do not post nearly as much as I used to. Repent means to turn around or change. I made a decision to post less, read less, and try not to be angry.

I can not "earn" forgiveness. I confess my sins to God and am forgiven by grace given by Christ's atonement. I obviously can not make you or any one else forgive me.

Quote:

---

As to how long ago you took those actions and said those words, why does that matter? Aren't you judged on your entire life, not just the parts you believe are moral?

---

For sure he will be. And he will be judged on what choices he made after those events.

This isn't that hard, and not unlike basic human relationships. You will wrong your friends and you will try and make those wrongs right. It doesn't erase the wrong, but ones subsequent actions carry a significant amount of weight.

Beer Baron said:

---

Speaking as someone who agrees with him on virtually nothing, dermdoc has seemed like a good guy over here for the past few years, and I haven't seen any posts like the one you dug up from several years ago. I agree that whole thing sucked, and he seems to agree that it did too. Unless he's still doing stuff like that over on Politics, I'd say he's one of the few posters from there who actually learned something and became a better person. He should be cheered for that, not berated for it.

---

This. As a forum we probably have more unity on dermdoc's disposition than just about anything else. While he has his political and religious opinions he appears conciliatory and merciful in his posts here and his lightheartedness goes a long way towards accumulating good will, even in disagreement.

Thanks for the nice thoughts. But this is not about me. It is so much bigger. It is about realizing that we all "miss the mark" and need forgiveness and changing our ways or repentance. Without Christ, I would be lost.

Aggie4242 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

That was ten years ago. I repented and was forgiven. I have been changed. Praise God!

---

Not a sock, just haven't posted in a long time.

I guess my point is, it is incredibly easy to forget about past actions and brush over them like they never happened.

As to how long ago you took those actions and said those words, why does that matter? Aren't you judged on your entire life, not just the parts you believe are moral?

Edit- hit my post limit for the day.

Two questions for you.

1.) you just posted on the politics board 4 days ago and seem to be a regular contributor. Why would you say otherwise?

2.) How did you repent and what did you do to earn forgiveness for your words and actions?

Edit 2 for Beer Baron

Not trying to berate him, just trying to understand how he correlates his past actions with his current words. Just looking for an explanation as to why he believes grace matters more than actions.

Since he had the most high profile example of the folks posting on this thread it seemed like a fair question to ask.

Edit 3- Dermdoc

My opinions on your actions are irrelevant.

As to being judged on your current actions, versus prior actions, where is the line drawn? What sins are forgivable and which aren't?

For example, let's say a gay man lived as a gay man his entire life, then, a week before he dies he decides to become Christian and repents his past actions.

Do you believe he will go to Heaven because he believes he has received gods grace? If not, why not?

---

Scripture says there is only one unforgivable sin and that is to sin against the Holy Spirit. And there is much debate over what that means. I personally think it means going against the conviction of the Holy Spirit willfully or in other words rejecting God.

I have no idea on anyone's eternal destination. Only God does.

I do know that God is just, merciful, and loving. He loved us so much He allowed us to unjustly murder His Son. And even in the agony of crucifixion, He asked for forgiveness for his murderers. While we were yet sinners, He died for us.

So I am fully confident in His judgement.

Quote:

---

Not trying to berate him, just trying to understand how he correlates his past actions with his current words. Just looking for an explanation as to why he believes grace matters more than actions.

---

As an atheist, I don't believe in the whole "grace" thing at all, but his actions as far as I can tell have been in sharp contrast to the person who you quoted from ten years ago. I can recall a couple years ago being incredibly surprised (in a good way) by several of his posts, because I too was looking at him through the lens of the Politics Board persona I remembered from the same incident you posted.

Quote:

---

Since he had the most high profile example of the folks posting on this thread it seemed like a fair question to ask.

---

I just think given his current tone and behavior, there are other people around here who are much more deserving of this question at this time.

Not meaning to bore you with personal revelations, but one of the reasons I left the church during my twenties was because even though I believed, I was turned off by the way some "devout" Christians acted. And because of that, I began to doubt my salvation so I was determined to act more like them even if I did not agree with it. Just to make sure I was "saved". Couple that with a lot of life traumas and I was lost. God kept pursuing me and I here I am. Still on a journey or theosis or sanctification or whatever you want to call it but I am not alone as I have the Holy Spirit. Sweet peace that passeth all understanding. And as long as I am in step with the Spirit, I am completely unconcerned about comparing myself with "devout" folks.

And now I just need to work on yelling at baseball umps.

oh man, I know I've been accused of holier than thou behavior but there is a whole lot of judginess in those ten posts, Sir Not A Sock.

Posters like that are the ones who make the Christmas exchange a harder sell.

Quote:

---

As to how long ago you took those actions and said those words, why does that matter?

---

Because people change. 10 years ago, I was GigEm01. I was quite possibly the angriest person on Forum 16. I was filled with anger and contempt for others. I was violent. Then I met Christ. Then I started taking the red letters seriously. That's a night and day difference compared to who I am today.

I wonder if Tyson is back.

schmendeler said:

---

I wonder if Tyson is back.

---

With all this repentance going around he could be any one of us

dermdoc said:

---

Aggie4242 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

That was ten years ago. I repented and was forgiven. I have been changed. Praise God!

---

Not a sock, just haven't posted in a long time.

I guess my point is, it is incredibly easy to forget about past actions and brush over them like they never happened.

As to how long ago you took those actions and said those words, why does that matter? Aren't you judged on your entire life, not just the parts you believe are moral?

Edit- hit my post limit for the day.

Two questions for you.

1.) you just posted on the politics board 4 days ago and seem to be a regular contributor. Why would you say otherwise?

2.) How did you repent and what did you do to earn forgiveness for your words and actions?

Edit 2 for Beer Baron

Not trying to berate him, just trying to understand how he correlates his past actions with his current words. Just looking for an explanation as to why he believes grace matters more than actions.

Since he had the most high profile example of the folks posting on this thread it seemed like a fair question to ask.

Edit 3- Dermdoc

My opinions on your actions are irrelevant.

As to being judged on your current actions, versus prior actions, where is the line drawn? What sins are forgivable and which aren't?

For example, let's say a gay man lived as a gay man his entire life, then, a week before he dies he decides to become Christian and repents his past actions.

Do you believe he will go to Heaven because he believes he has received gods grace? If not, why not?

---

Scripture says there is only one unforgivable sin and that is to sin against the Holy Spirit. And there is much debate over what that means. I personally think it means going against the conviction of the Holy Spirit willfully or in other words rejecting God.

I have no idea on anyone's eternal destination. Only God does.

I do know that God is just, merciful, and loving. He loved us so much He allowed us to unjustly murder His Son. And even in the agony of crucifixion, He asked for forgiveness for his murderers. While we were yet sinners, He died for us.

So I am fully confident in His judgement.

---

You mentioned previously that you believe you had been forgiven. What made you believe that? Was it actions you took after that incident? Was it a change in your beliefs?

Again, I am not attacking you. I am genuinely curious why you believe you were forgiven and what you did to earn that forgiveness.

Yes.