Orthodoxy
k2aggie07 said:
Orthodoxy
k2aggie07 said:
There is only one Orthodox Church.
Dr. Watson said:k2aggie07 said:
There is only one Orthodox Church.
Fine. Your Russian coreligionists seem near evil in their disregard for LGBT people, abused women, and Syrian and Ukrainian noncombatants.
The king of double standards. May I ask what you and other desists or atheists have done? This gets so tiresome. Christian and white people are held by you to completely different standards than anyone else. The hatred is real.Dr. Watson said:k2aggie07 said:
There is only one Orthodox Church.
Fine. Your Russian coreligionists seem near evil in their disregard for LGBT people, abused women, and Syrian and Ukrainian noncombatants.
So what "vile politics"? It is called principles of the Church. Just because you think something is "okay" for subjective reasons does not make it right on Biblical grounds. I applaud the Orthodox Church for keeping constant Biblical principles.Marco Esquandolas said:
no, you don't get to "but what about" this topic. The topic is the Orthodox church, and there is a bunch of vile politics in that organization in certain parts of the world.
dermdoc said:So what "vile politics"? It is called principles of the Church. Just because you think something is "okay" for subjective reasons does not make it right on Biblical grounds. I applaud the Orthodox Church for keeping constant Biblical principles.Marco Esquandolas said:
no, you don't get to "but what about" this topic. The topic is the Orthodox church, and there is a bunch of vile politics in that organization in certain parts of the world.
dermdoc said:The king of double standards. May I ask what you and other desists or atheists have done? This gets so tiresome. Christian and white people are held by you to completely different standards than anyone else. The hatred is real.Dr. Watson said:k2aggie07 said:
There is only one Orthodox Church.
Fine. Your Russian coreligionists seem near evil in their disregard for LGBT people, abused women, and Syrian and Ukrainian noncombatants.
You and I know it does not matter with certain posters, Have a great night and God Bless!k2aggie07 said:
Certain people do not constitute the Church. The bishop by himself does not constitute the Church. Even a high ranking administrative bishop like the patriarch doesn't constitute the Church. Nor does he speak for it or on behalf of it.
So please specify who has done these things. The Church has not, even if certain bishops have.
Hiding behind bureaucracy? That's an interesting approach. The officials leading the Russian branch of the Orthodox Church have done and support all these things. If you wish to formally separate them out, fine. Same difference to me and most people.k2aggie07 said:
Certain people do not constitute the Church. The bishop by himself does not constitute the Church. Even a high ranking administrative bishop like the patriarch doesn't constitute the Church. Nor does he speak for it or on behalf of it.
So please specify who has done these things. The Church has not, even if certain bishops have.
Dr. Watson said:Hiding behind bureaucracy? That's an interesting approach. The officials leading the Russian branch of the Orthodox Church have done and support all these things. If you wish to formally separate them out, fine. Same difference to me and most people.k2aggie07 said:
Certain people do not constitute the Church. The bishop by himself does not constitute the Church. Even a high ranking administrative bishop like the patriarch doesn't constitute the Church. Nor does he speak for it or on behalf of it.
So please specify who has done these things. The Church has not, even if certain bishops have.
http://www.dw.com/en/is-the-russian-orthodox-church-serving-god-or-putin/a-38603157
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/14/world/europe/russia-orthodox-church.html
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/apr/4/vladimir-putin-patriarch-kirill-alliance-puts-athe/
k2aggie07 said:
Do you really think that the Church is summed up in one person? Five? Fifty?
If a bishop chooses to engage in political corruption, has he corrupted the Church or himself?
k2aggie07 said:
The only leader, head, and high priest of the Orthodox Church is Christ as a matter of doctrine. Hth.
k2aggie07 said:
If as you say flaunt the most basic tenet of this "philosophy" they its adherents?
You sorta kinda look like us.k2aggie07 said:
What does the Roman church have to do with Orthodoxy?
Quote:
Stark next turns his attention to the Spanish Inquisition, today a symbol of oppression and persecution. But as Stark makes clear, by the standards of the day, the Spanish Inquisition was actually fairly innocuous. Torture, for instance, was a standard way of getting confessions at the time, and while the Inquisition employed it, it did so within strict guidelines secular courts often lacked. In fact, the Inquisition's reputation was so much better than that of the secular courts that defendants would try to get their trials moved to an Inquisition venue.
Dr. Watson said:dermdoc said:So what "vile politics"? It is called principles of the Church. Just because you think something is "okay" for subjective reasons does not make it right on Biblical grounds. I applaud the Orthodox Church for keeping constant Biblical principles.Marco Esquandolas said:
no, you don't get to "but what about" this topic. The topic is the Orthodox church, and there is a bunch of vile politics in that organization in certain parts of the world.
It's Biblical to support Vladimir Putin? To push for laws making spousal abuse legal so long as no bones are broken? To support a climate against LGBT Russians that has led to extensive violence against the community and to say nothing about the state-sponsored murders of LGBT Chechians? To support the Russian involvement in Syria and Ukraine and to say nothing about Assad's murder of hundreds of thousands of his own people? To support pushing out non-Russian priests and religious groups in Crimea?
The Russian Orthodox Church has wedded itself to Putin and supports the Russian government above just about anything else so long as it grants them growing power.
jkag89 said:
Shedding Light on Dark Legends: The True Story of the Inquisition
By Mr. Matthew Rose
The Truth About the Spanish Inquisition
By Thomas F Madden
The Myth of the Spanish Inquisition
By Ellen Rice
From Nobody Expects the Spanish Inquisition to Be Explained Fairly
A Review of Bearing False Witness: Debunking Centuries of Anti-Catholic HistoryQuote:
Stark next turns his attention to the Spanish Inquisition, today a symbol of oppression and persecution. But as Stark makes clear, by the standards of the day, the Spanish Inquisition was actually fairly innocuous. Torture, for instance, was a standard way of getting confessions at the time, and while the Inquisition employed it, it did so within strict guidelines secular courts often lacked. In fact, the Inquisition's reputation was so much better than that of the secular courts that defendants would try to get their trials moved to an Inquisition venue.
Dr. Watson, you seem to be very informed on Russian matters and the church in Russia. Out of curiosity how many times have you been to Russia? I assume 10+ but I'd be interested to find out.Dr. Watson said:k2aggie07 said:
Do you really think that the Church is summed up in one person? Five? Fifty?
If a bishop chooses to engage in political corruption, has he corrupted the Church or himself?
Almost the entire organizational leadership is involved in this to enhance their own power and legislate their view of morality. At some point, appealing to a philosophy is pretty empty when contrasted with the actions of its adherents.
I understood the gist of what were trying to convey with mentioning the Inquisition, still believe you could have found a better way of conveying that idea. .Blithely shrugging off what I posted as "revisionist history" does yourself a disservice.Dr. Watson said:jkag89 said:
Shedding Light on Dark Legends: The True Story of the Inquisition
By Mr. Matthew Rose
The Truth About the Spanish Inquisition
By Thomas F Madden
The Myth of the Spanish Inquisition
By Ellen Rice
From Nobody Expects the Spanish Inquisition to Be Explained Fairly
A Review of Bearing False Witness: Debunking Centuries of Anti-Catholic HistoryQuote:
Stark next turns his attention to the Spanish Inquisition, today a symbol of oppression and persecution. But as Stark makes clear, by the standards of the day, the Spanish Inquisition was actually fairly innocuous. Torture, for instance, was a standard way of getting confessions at the time, and while the Inquisition employed it, it did so within strict guidelines secular courts often lacked. In fact, the Inquisition's reputation was so much better than that of the secular courts that defendants would try to get their trials moved to an Inquisition venue.
I'm aware of the revisionist history. The existence of a "Black Legend" doesn't explain away all of the actions of the Catholic Church in Spain and across Europe. Besides my point is not about the Inquisition. It's about ignoring the behavior of an institution by blaming only the members. It's like saying, "Enron is a fine, upstanding corporation with the highest ideals. It's just everyone in charge of Enron who had ethical issues."
Quote:
I'm aware of the revisionist history. The existence of a "Black Legend" doesn't explain away all of the actions of the Catholic Church in Spain and across Europe. Besides my point is not about the Inquisition. It's about ignoring the behavior of an institution by blaming only the members. It's like saying, "Enron is a fine, upstanding corporation with the highest ideals. It's just everyone in charge of Enron who had ethical issues."