Shows a lot of the behind closed doors stuff that wasn't public or kept secret

BurnetAggie99 said:

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Shows a lot of the behind closed doors stuff that wasn't public or kept secret

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This.

Do yourself a favor and watch it

I'm rewatchikng this between football this weekend.

Bump for those that haven't seen it.

Some cool nostalgia from some of the stuff from the 80s.

Some cringe things to watch, especially McMahon & females, from the Attitude era.

I watched it too and really enjoyed it. It's as much a documentary on the last 40 years of wrestling as it is about McMahon.

I think they did fail to answer their ultimate question: "Who is Vince McMahon"

I wonder what the documentary would have been like if released in a few months when more details of his current lawsuits are revealed.

Remember WWE and Netflix just entered in a $500 million per year agreement to stream, so everything has to have a grain of salt.

Quad Dog said:

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I watched it too and really enjoyed it. It's as much a documentary on the last 40 years of wrestling as it is about McMahon.

I think they did fail to answer their ultimate question: "Who is Vince McMahon"

I wonder what the documentary would have been like if released in a few months when more details of his current lawsuits are revealed.

Remember WWE and Netflix just entered in a $500 million per year agreement to stream, so everything has to have a grain of salt.

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My wife and I watched the episode 3 last night which is the one about the Montreal Screwjob and it was basically an hour long episode about the history of wrestling during WWF's "New Generation" era. I enjoyed it and was geeking out about it since I'm a big wrestling fan that watched Raw religiously then. My wife was bored as she was expecting something more scandalous. I told her this was basically an episode to set the stage for what was to come next.....

Considering it was filmed right as the lawsuits started coming out, there was no way you were going to get a Vince tell all after the lawsuits. Plus with WWE coming on Netflix soon, they probably want to get it out to bury Vince and show that they are partners with the current version of WWE, not Vince's company.

If you haven't, go find and watch the documentary Wrestling with Shadows - it was doc about Bret Hart that was being filmed in real time when the Montreal Screwjob happened - it's fascinating and maybe one of the best docs (not just wrestling) that I've seen

Wolfpac 08 said:

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If you haven't, go find and watch the documentary Wrestling with Shadows - it was doc about Bret Hart that was being filmed in real time when the Montreal Screwjob happened - it's fascinating and maybe one of the best docs (not just wrestling) that I've seen

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I see its on youtube for free. I know what I will be doing tonight lol.

Actually, we can all thank Alundra Blaze (Madusa) for the screw job. If she hadn't shown up on WCW tv a couple of years before with the WWF Women's title and dropped it in the trash can, Vince likely lets Bret retain at Summer Slam and drop the following night on RAW.

Come to think of it, the Madusa promo was probably Bischoff's idea so, like everything else that went wrong with wrestling in the 90's, you can probably blame him

Quad Dog said:

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I watched it too and really enjoyed it. It's as much a documentary on the last 40 years of wrestling as it is about McMahon.

I think they did fail to answer their ultimate question: "Who is Vince McMahon"

I wonder what the documentary would have been like if released in a few months when more details of his current lawsuits are revealed.

Remember WWE and Netflix just entered in a $500 million per year agreement to stream, so everything has to have a grain of salt.

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A cheater, sex maniac, egotistical *******

He blurred the lines of fiction and non fiction at work and his entire life while at WWE. It's sorta sick

Just rewatched it with my gf who knew almost nothing about the wrestling industry. She was hooked and enjoyed it.

Wrestle Mania VI is the first wrestle mania I remember.

Also, no one mentioned the kid sporting the A&M hat during the Donald Trump bit?

Hungry Ojos said:

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Bret Hart did it to himself. I am completely, 100% on McMahon's side in that tift. He didn't "win" the belt, it was a prop that was given to him to advance a make believe story. When you no longer wanted to be involved in the story, the prop has to be returned. Bret is the biggest mark on the planet.

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But...none of them won the belt. It's all scripted and fake. Unless this is some kind of meta post I don't get?

I only know what I've learned from this documentary, but it sounds like the real screw job was agreeing to end it with a (whatever it's called) where the ref throws it all out, but McMahon screwed him anyway. Saying "sure I'll let you leave with your dignity" and then pulling the rug out from under him.

rhutton125 said:

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I only know what I've learned from this documentary, but it sounds like the real screw job was agreeing to end it with a (whatever it's called) where the ref throws it all out, but McMahon screwed him anyway. Saying "sure I'll let you leave with your dignity" and then pulling the rug out from under him.

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Bret Hart and Montreal Screw job?

I'm guessing something could have been discussed and planed to help both sides. But I can't imagine what Bret Hart was thinking. Did he actually think he was going to take his belt with him to McMahon 's rival?

Seems very unreasonable. McMahon is a POS, no doubt

Aggie Dad 26 said:

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rhutton125 said:

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I only know what I've learned from this documentary, but it sounds like the real screw job was agreeing to end it with a (whatever it's called) where the ref throws it all out, but McMahon screwed him anyway. Saying "sure I'll let you leave with your dignity" and then pulling the rug out from under him.

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Bret Hart and Montreal Screw job?

I'm guessing something could have been discussed and planed to help both sides. But I can't imagine what Bret Hart was thinking. Did he actually think he was going to take his belt with him to McMahon 's rival?

Seems very unreasonable. McMahon is a POS, no doubt

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No, the plan (as far as Bret knew) was to have a schmoz finish and let Bret retain the belt. Then they would rematch the next night on RAW and drop the title in what would have been his last WWF appearance.

Vince didn't trust him to do that (there had been a history of Flair brining the NWA championship to WWF tv in the early 90s, Madusa brining the WWF women's championship to WCW tv in 95) so he orchestrated the screw job to ensure that wouldn't happen.

I'm telling you guys, take 90 minutes and go watch Wrestling with Shadows if you're at all interested in the topic.

Skip to a little after the two minute mark

Hungry Ojos said:

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Bret Hart did it to himself. I am completely, 100% on McMahon's side in that tift. He didn't "win" the belt, it was a prop that was given to him to advance a make believe story. When you no longer wanted to be involved in the story, the prop has to be returned. Bret is the biggest mark on the planet.

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You have to watch the Wrestling with Shadows documentary like someone else recommended. Its really good and goes more into detail about what happened.

WCW offered Bret Hart a huge contract and Bret was torn about whether to leave because he was so loyal to Vince and WWE. Vince begged him to stay and offered him a contract worth less money and Bret took it. A year later Vince basically tells Bret sorry he cant honor the contract anymore and that he has to go.

The day of the match with Shawn Michaels, Vince tells Bret that he can end the match the way he wants and he wont get beat. Of course, Vince was planning to screw him over the entire time and had the ref in on it too.

With that said, Bret seems really bitter and jaded about the whole thing even to this day. He needs to get over it. Its a business and freaking make believe pre-determined wrestling lol, he shouldnt have put so much trust in a slime ball lime Vince.

Wolfpac 08 said:

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Aggie Dad 26 said:

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rhutton125 said:

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I only know what I've learned from this documentary, but it sounds like the real screw job was agreeing to end it with a (whatever it's called) where the ref throws it all out, but McMahon screwed him anyway. Saying "sure I'll let you leave with your dignity" and then pulling the rug out from under him.

---

Bret Hart and Montreal Screw job?

I'm guessing something could have been discussed and planed to help both sides. But I can't imagine what Bret Hart was thinking. Did he actually think he was going to take his belt with him to McMahon 's rival?

Seems very unreasonable. McMahon is a POS, no doubt

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No, the plan (as far as Bret knew) was to have a schmoz finish and let Bret retain the belt. Then they would rematch the next night on RAW and drop the title in what would have been his last WWF appearance.

Vince didn't trust him to do that (there had been a history of Flair brining the NWA championship to WWF tv in the early 90s, Madusa brining the WWF women's championship to WCW tv in 95) so he orchestrated the screw job to ensure that wouldn't happen.

I'm telling you guys, take 90 minutes and go watch Wrestling with Shadows if you're at all interested in the topic.

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Thanks for recommending that documentary. What I found interesting was that Bret wore a wire to the meeting with Vince the day of the match with Shawn Michaels. I believe his wife had also talked to the ref before the match just to make sure everything was on the up and up. It was obvious the relationship between Bret and Vince was very strained by that point, and Bret didnt trust him at all. Bret also requested creative control for the last 30 days of his time with WWE because of his distrust for Vince.

For Bret to be so surprised that Vince would screw him over after all of the above just seems so far-fetched. It was obvious he didnt trust Vince at all prior to the match especially after Vince reneging on his contract and begging him to stay. Bret seems like a good dude and very loyal, but a little (or a lot) naive. In Bret's world, your honor, your word, and loyalty mean everything, which is a little crazy in such a shady business like wrestling. I dont think Bret was the sharpest tool in the shed, especially after watching that documentary.

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In Bret's world, honor, your word, and loyalty mean everything, which is a little crazy in such a shady business like wrestling.

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I think this is spot on. Very Ned Stark in that regard (and met a similar fate bc of it).

The issue with Bret is that, bc of his dad and his old-school mindset, he saw the wrestling business as sacred and couldn't imagine anyone "dishonoring" the business - Vince, on the other hand, saw the wrestling business as a business and was willing to do whatever needed to be done to maintain full control, traditions be damned. He proved that when he **** all over the territory model to go national.

Outstanding!

Had forgotten about the guy slapping the **** out of John Stossel and Hogan choking that guy out.

'How about it T?'

'Yeah. just leave him in there a little bit longer'

Classic.

I loved it.

I'm not a wrestling fan. I had some buddies that were into the WCW. I was aware of Mr. McMahon, Triple H, Stone Cold, The Rock, etc. but never was a committed fan. Watched with buddies or randomly.

I thought the series was awesome.

I think Bret said somewhere in there that people had told him Vince was going to screw him over, and he'd seen it happen to others, but yeah he had that "surely it wouldn't happen to me" mindset. And unfortunately the worst fears came true.

I didn't understand the Bret issue.

He was leaving the WWF. Why did he think he deserved to win, cheap the belt, and then leave?

You're leaving. You leave the belt.

I think the interview portion with Undertaker saying Vince is a father to him and that he would take a bullet for him was record in 2021, so it was before the bulk of the allegations came out. It would be interesting to see if any of their opinions changed over the past year.

Bret says he wasn't going to leave with the belt. He just didn't want to drop it to Shawn Michaels due to the real life beef they had with each other. In his mind he was going to beat Michaels at the PPV then either drop it to someone else the next night on Raw or just forfeit the belt due to injury or whatever the writers wanted to come up with. He thought he built up enough respect with Vince to have whatever ending he wanted. Vince wasn't going to risk Bret not dropping it nor did he want his champion to show up on WCW without having lost previously. Vince knew WCW could market it as Bret coming to WCW because no one at WWF was good enough to beat him.

Rita the ref sued McMahon in 2023 for alleged sex assault that happened in the 1980s using the law NY passed to get Trump.

Cyndi Lauper as a character and the crossover with MTV had forgotten about that.

Hogan tv show thunder in paradise and movie no holds barred had forgotten about.

Wrestlemania 3 at the silver dome largest indoor crowd of all time.

Wrestlemania 7 with a shot of Mcauly Caulkin and Trump in the crowd.

Hogan going to WCW and match with Ric
Flair.

Best part so far is them saying "the WWF wasn't a good environment for women…"

So women have a hard time around roided and coked up madmen … more at 5.

They knew what they were getting into and were drawn to it. Can't go to the beach and complain about the sand.

Wild to look back and see how serious they took the whole spectacle of wrestling. Media was all over it, Feds involved DeA involved, all over wrestling.