Right on cue, someone posts there's no way Hugh turns on Rhaenyra
***Fire and Blood AND House of Dragons Discussion*** SHOW SPOILER ALERT
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Last: 5 mo ago by canadiaggie
There are more impressive "guesses" being put out there on the main thread.
They can see the future...El_duderino said:
Right on cue, someone posts there's no way Hugh turns on Rhaenyra
This poster almost nailed it, they are 100% combining Nettles and Rhaena though, not Nettles and Mysaria. Hopefully Rhaena doesn't end up as Daemon's mistress then. There's only so much Targaryencest I can handle.Dr. Not Yet Dr. Ag said:The Porkchop Express said:tk for tu juan said:
So Ulf wasn't lying about his lineage? Nice
They've crammed Addam and Alyn down our throats to get him on dragons. I have a bad feeling they are going to combine the character of nettles with the white worm and get her on sheepstealer so she can steal daemon back from Rhaenyra
Yup, I have the same sense. There is no way this isn't happening and I hate the decision.
I don't overall hate the change except for that, but I wonder how they'll handle Rhaenyra's descent into paranoia since that was a part of it. Maybe they'll just pin it all on Ulf/Hugh. I think Mysaria is going to play a role in Rhaenyra's downfall, it seems like they are making her rely more and more on Mysaria and less on Jace or any other of her councillors
What a sad end of the season. I only remember a few of the major plot points from the book and assumed that we weren't getting some of those to end the season. I did not expect this absolute dud of an ending though. How do they not have the same conversation with Rhaenyra and Alicent in the next to last episode and then at least end the season with Rhaenyra sitting on the Iron Throne. You could even have the final shot being the throne cutting her and drawing blood as a bad omen of things to come.
This season could have totally redeemed itself if it were 10 episodes, Battle of the Gullet in ep 9, Fall of King's Landing in ep 10.
This season just felt like a lot of killing time. There needed to be at least one more big event to wrap it up.
I thought I read somewhere a while back that the loose plan for this show was to run 4 seasons. This season really makes it feel like they're trying to milk it for 5..
This season just felt like a lot of killing time. There needed to be at least one more big event to wrap it up.
I thought I read somewhere a while back that the loose plan for this show was to run 4 seasons. This season really makes it feel like they're trying to milk it for 5..
Just watched episodes 1-4. Aegon just died. I'm predicting Cristin Cole is the next king, it's the only position left he can fail upward to.
boy09 said:
This season could have totally redeemed itself if it were 10 episodes, Battle of the Gullet in ep 9, Fall of King's Landing in ep 10.
This season just felt like a lot of killing time. There needed to be at least one more big event to wrap it up.
I thought I read somewhere a while back that the loose plan for this show was to run 4 seasons. This season really makes it feel like they're trying to milk it for 5..
The question is really where does this show end. There are various spots but some of these characters keep on going for a while. And introducing the "cross dressing pirate" character is more of something from after the actual Dance itself in Fire & Blood.
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The Dog Lord said:
What a sad end of the season. I only remember a few of the major plot points from the book and assumed that we weren't getting some of those to end the season. I did not expect this absolute dud of an ending though. How do they not have the same conversation with Rhaenyra and Alicent in the next to last episode and then at least end the season with Rhaenyra sitting on the Iron Throne. You could even have the final shot being the throne cutting her and drawing blood as a bad omen of things to come.
To do that, they would have had to rush even more than D&D did in the original series. I mean there are 3 major battles occurring between now and when Rhaenyra takes backs KL, including the battle of the gullet where Jace gets killed and her other son is taken captive. The latter is what knocks her fully off her rocker
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boy09 said:
This season could have totally redeemed itself if it were 10 episodes, Battle of the Gullet in ep 9, Fall of King's Landing in ep 10.
This season just felt like a lot of killing time. There needed to be at least one more big event to wrap it up.
I thought I read somewhere a while back that the loose plan for this show was to run 4 seasons. This season really makes it feel like they're trying to milk it for 5..
I'm just going to repeat a point I was trying to make in my previous post. If you did this as you outlined, , you are basically doing the same **** ass job D&D did with Dany in GoT, and fast forwarding thru development to "get to the fun stuff". I don't think the writers want to make the same mistake with another major female character. You literally would be omitting major conflicts and making that character go crazy almost overnight and without any "earned" reason.
I guess I'd much rather they take their time and earn the plot twists and character dev for an extra season or two compared to abbreviating things like D&D did and things seemingly happened for no reason. ****, that's all anyone said those last two seasons. We all wish they would have let the story breathe more and stretched it out compared to how they ended it.
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As a related aside, I did appreciate the subtle seed of the three new dragonriders, common folk, being a little miffed and potentially turned off during the strategy meeting while discussing the impending deaths of so many common folk. There was a noticeable disconnect there and assuming they show Hugh and Ulf turning cloak, it was great foreshadowing
The latter half of the season has really laid the groundwork for Rhaenyra's heel turn
HotD's real problem is the two year gap between seasons.
HotD's real problem is the two year gap between seasons.
HummingbirdSaltalamacchia said:
As a related aside, I did appreciate the subtle seed of the three new dragonriders, common folk, being a little miffed and potentially turned off during the strategy meeting while discussing the impending deaths of so many common folk. There was a noticeable disconnect there and assuming they show Hugh and Ulf turning cloak, it was great foreshadowing
Calling it now, Hugh is going to be commanded to destroy Tumbleton, his wife will die, and he'll switch sides. Ulf seems like he'd do it just for material reward.
What are some things you feel the show does better than the book?
I think show Viserys, Aegon II are FAR superior to their book versions.
I think show Viserys, Aegon II are FAR superior to their book versions.
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canadiaggie said:HummingbirdSaltalamacchia said:
As a related aside, I did appreciate the subtle seed of the three new dragonriders, common folk, being a little miffed and potentially turned off during the strategy meeting while discussing the impending deaths of so many common folk. There was a noticeable disconnect there and assuming they show Hugh and Ulf turning cloak, it was great foreshadowing
Calling it now, Hugh is going to be commanded to destroy Tumbleton, his wife will die, and he'll switch sides. Ulf seems like he'd do it just for material reward.
Agreed 100%
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canadiaggie said:
What are some things you feel the show does better than the book?
I think show Viserys, Aegon II are FAR superior to their book versions.
The biggest one for me is just the character motivations. The source material is basically just a chronology with some exposition /theorizing by maesters and Mushroom. But none of it is definitive. The shows gets into things like Jace and his parentage and that insecurity. Why Aemond is how he is. Or how His killing of Luke was more of an accident and not purely malevolent, juxtaposed against his blatant attack on Aegon. That sort of stuff. Viserys and Aegon II are other great examples of characters that were pretty one note that were fleshed out really well. Even the dynamic between Rhaenyra and Alicent(which was altered from the books as well) is given more nuance. Cristen Cole's motivations. So I think the show is doing a pretty good job about how certain events are interpreted from different parties and is attempting to work in that "gray" without necessarily passing judgement. Which think will work well when certain characters perform certain events in the future
HummingbirdSaltalamacchia said:boy09 said:
This season could have totally redeemed itself if it were 10 episodes, Battle of the Gullet in ep 9, Fall of King's Landing in ep 10.
This season just felt like a lot of killing time. There needed to be at least one more big event to wrap it up.
I thought I read somewhere a while back that the loose plan for this show was to run 4 seasons. This season really makes it feel like they're trying to milk it for 5..
I'm just going to repeat a point I was trying to make in my previous post. If you did this as you outlined, , you are basically doing the same **** ass job D&D did with Dany in GoT, and fast forwarding thru development to "get to the fun stuff". I don't think the writers want to make the same mistake with another major female character. You literally would be omitting major conflicts and making that character go crazy almost overnight and without any "earned" reason.
I guess I'd much rather they take their time and earn the plot twists and character dev for an extra season or two compared to abbreviating things like D&D did and things seemingly happened for no reason. ****, that's all anyone said those last two seasons. We all wish they would have let the story breathe more and stretched it out compared to how they ended it.
Fair enough. Maybe save the Fall of KL, but the Gullet could have 100% happened before the end of this season. The only thing I can think is that they wanted to keep Jace around til season 3.
Also, Alicent telling Rhaenyra to take KL in 3 days makes me think they are going to jack with the timeline a bit
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boy09 said:HummingbirdSaltalamacchia said:boy09 said:
This season could have totally redeemed itself if it were 10 episodes, Battle of the Gullet in ep 9, Fall of King's Landing in ep 10.
This season just felt like a lot of killing time. There needed to be at least one more big event to wrap it up.
I thought I read somewhere a while back that the loose plan for this show was to run 4 seasons. This season really makes it feel like they're trying to milk it for 5..
I'm just going to repeat a point I was trying to make in my previous post. If you did this as you outlined, , you are basically doing the same **** ass job D&D did with Dany in GoT, and fast forwarding thru development to "get to the fun stuff". I don't think the writers want to make the same mistake with another major female character. You literally would be omitting major conflicts and making that character go crazy almost overnight and without any "earned" reason.
I guess I'd much rather they take their time and earn the plot twists and character dev for an extra season or two compared to abbreviating things like D&D did and things seemingly happened for no reason. ****, that's all anyone said those last two seasons. We all wish they would have let the story breathe more and stretched it out compared to how they ended it.
Fair enough. Maybe save the Fall of KL, but the Gullet could have 100% happened before the end of this season. The only thing I can think is that they wanted to keep Jace around til season 3.
Also, Alicent telling Rhaenyra to take KL in 3 days makes me think they are going to jack with the timeline a bit
For sure/ I think it's mainly so that the end of season two isn't a complete mirror of the end of season 1 with Jace being killed like Luke in season 1
Regarding Alicent telling Rhaenyra to take KL, that's also under the presumption she would be giving Aegon up. Which he just flew the coop so can't exactly do that. Could easily be another catalyst to Rhaenyras decent into madness and her eventual comeuppance with any inference that it was done as a deceit
boy09 said:HummingbirdSaltalamacchia said:boy09 said:
This season could have totally redeemed itself if it were 10 episodes, Battle of the Gullet in ep 9, Fall of King's Landing in ep 10.
This season just felt like a lot of killing time. There needed to be at least one more big event to wrap it up.
I thought I read somewhere a while back that the loose plan for this show was to run 4 seasons. This season really makes it feel like they're trying to milk it for 5..
I'm just going to repeat a point I was trying to make in my previous post. If you did this as you outlined, , you are basically doing the same **** ass job D&D did with Dany in GoT, and fast forwarding thru development to "get to the fun stuff". I don't think the writers want to make the same mistake with another major female character. You literally would be omitting major conflicts and making that character go crazy almost overnight and without any "earned" reason.
I guess I'd much rather they take their time and earn the plot twists and character dev for an extra season or two compared to abbreviating things like D&D did and things seemingly happened for no reason. ****, that's all anyone said those last two seasons. We all wish they would have let the story breathe more and stretched it out compared to how they ended it.
Fair enough. Maybe save the Fall of KL, but the Gullet could have 100% happened before the end of this season. The only thing I can think is that they wanted to keep Jace around til season 3.
Also, Alicent telling Rhaenyra to take KL in 3 days makes me think they are going to jack with the timeline a bit
I anticipate it'll go something like this.
S3E1 - set-up episode. Maybe we get the Fishfeed
S3E2 - Fall of KL
S3E3 - Filler
S3E4 - Gullet. Jace dies. Younger Aegon/Viserys are captured/MIA. Rhaenyra starts to unravel. Tyrant Queen/Maegor 2.0
Rest of S3 will probably go from there. Tumbleton and the Betrayal will be near the end of the season. End of season is Shepherd and the start of the unrest which will carry over into Storming of the Dragonpit in S4.
The Gullet was the thing I thought might actually happen this season, but I also thought that something like taking King's Landing could have been reworked in the timeline as well. To do almost nothing was surprising.boy09 said:HummingbirdSaltalamacchia said:boy09 said:
This season could have totally redeemed itself if it were 10 episodes, Battle of the Gullet in ep 9, Fall of King's Landing in ep 10.
This season just felt like a lot of killing time. There needed to be at least one more big event to wrap it up.
I thought I read somewhere a while back that the loose plan for this show was to run 4 seasons. This season really makes it feel like they're trying to milk it for 5..
I'm just going to repeat a point I was trying to make in my previous post. If you did this as you outlined, , you are basically doing the same **** ass job D&D did with Dany in GoT, and fast forwarding thru development to "get to the fun stuff". I don't think the writers want to make the same mistake with another major female character. You literally would be omitting major conflicts and making that character go crazy almost overnight and without any "earned" reason.
I guess I'd much rather they take their time and earn the plot twists and character dev for an extra season or two compared to abbreviating things like D&D did and things seemingly happened for no reason. ****, that's all anyone said those last two seasons. We all wish they would have let the story breathe more and stretched it out compared to how they ended it.
Fair enough. Maybe save the Fall of KL, but the Gullet could have 100% happened before the end of this season. The only thing I can think is that they wanted to keep Jace around til season 3.
Also, Alicent telling Rhaenyra to take KL in 3 days makes me think they are going to jack with the timeline a bit
Agreed. The characters feel like real flawed people. In F&B they were just historian's images of people.HummingbirdSaltalamacchia said:canadiaggie said:
What are some things you feel the show does better than the book?
I think show Viserys, Aegon II are FAR superior to their book versions.
The biggest one for me is just the character motivations. The source material is basically just a chronology with some exposition /theorizing by maesters and Mushroom. But none of it is definitive. The shows gets into things like Jace and his parentage and that insecurity. Why Aemond is how he is. Or how His killing of Luke was more of an accident and not purely malevolent, juxtaposed against his blatant attack on Aegon. That sort of stuff. Viserys and Aegon II are other great examples of characters that were pretty one note that were fleshed out really well. Even the dynamic between Rhaenyra and Alicent(which was altered from the books as well) is given more nuance. Cristen Cole's motivations. So I think the show is doing a pretty good job about how certain events are interpreted from different parties and is attempting to work in that "gray" without necessarily passing judgement. Which think will work well when certain characters perform certain events in the future
I think the online fandom is super married to F&B as if it is some sort of definitive canon but it really has very little characterization and detail. I think only Daemon and Rhaenyra get some personality sprinkled in. Alicent is just evil stepmother 2.0, Aegon is just a generic scheming bad guy, Larys has zero discernible motivations, Otto has ZERO flavor, Viserys is basically forgotten a day after his death.
Here in the show, I like how Viserys is the specter looming all over the show. He influences everyone from Alicent (committed to decency/conservative, status quo rule) to Aegon (wanting father/mother's love and finding it in the crowd instead), to Rhaenyra (Aegon's dream) to Daemon (finding his place in life).
If Variety's report is accurate and they are planning to end the series with S4, then everyone should be getting a lot of the violence and treachery they were hoping for in the next two seasons. The entire war is still left, basically.
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