You know, I've tried not to hate on TLJ, but after rewatching it...
It's gonna take a miracle to right this ship...
It's gonna take a miracle to right this ship...
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Mr. Nobody said:
You know, I've tried not to hate on TLJ, but after rewatching it...
It's gonna take a miracle to right this ship...
It took a **** on the past and killed forward momentum and did not explain anything that took place. I think it is hilarious that Disney is completely crapping on it publicly now.
I'll have to wait and see how exactly they crap on TLJ and Rian Johnson, but it doesn't make it any better or vindicate themselves... Kennedy and the gang still put it out there and are ultimately responsible.
I still don't understand how someone can run the most valuable franchise in the world and not have a plan for the trilogy. Seems like gross incompetence to me.
I still don't understand how someone can run the most valuable franchise in the world and not have a plan for the trilogy. Seems like gross incompetence to me.
Just dropping in to say that I rewatched TLJ tonight to get ready for Thursday...so well done. Love that movie.
And I can't wait for a completely different film in TROS.
And I can't wait for a completely different film in TROS.
I'm ready to forget that this whole 7 8 9 trilogy happened and then move on to the next series of star wars films starring Keanu Reeves.
TRUMP 2020! KEEP AMERICA GREAT!
CNN is very fake news.
I Stand with Sul Ross.
#NotAnotherDime
BLM is a lie.
CNN is very fake news.
I Stand with Sul Ross.
#NotAnotherDime
BLM is a lie.
red asswillie wonka said:
we've had our tickets for 3 months...and then I read the epilepsy warning. I have a daughter with epilepsy. We're gonna give it a try. I'll bring in a blanket and throw it over her head.
kid will be fine
hubrisSex Panther said:
I'll have to wait and see how exactly they crap on TLJ and Rian Johnson, but it doesn't make it any better or vindicate themselves... Kennedy and the gang still put it out there and are ultimately responsible.
I still don't understand how someone can run the most valuable franchise in the world and not have a plan for the trilogy. Seems like gross incompetence to me.
I really don't think it was hubris. Some insanely dumb mistakes were made, yes, but I can at least see why they were made...
- The first mistake was Kennedy hiring only one, solo writer to start with - Michael Arndt - to write only one, solo movie, with no director or story group to help shepherd. Arndt is one of the most respected writers in Hollywood, but it absolutely should have been a committee effort from the start, if only to establish some general cornerstones and signposts. And I get that Lucas handed over a sequel trilogy outline, and that Arndt was working partly off that, so maybe they thought they did have a direction/plan from the start, but still.
- The second, far more costly mistake, IMO, was Bob Iger assuming they were well on their way with Arndt, and then immediately setting a summer 2015 release date with the announcement in 2012 that Disney was acquiring Lucasfilm. I will forever believe that that move is what truly doomed this whole endeavor. Because that date was only doable if everything went perfectly. And nothing EVER goes perfectly in this business. So between Abrams finally coming aboard months after Arndt had been writing, and them both realizing the current iteration wasn't working, all they could do was get Iger to push back to December 2015. That was as far as he could budge, because he had shareholders to answer to. But if he just would have NOT named a release year in the initial announcement, I legitimately believe we'd be in a much better place right now. Instead, what we got was Abrams and Kasdan having to basically start from scratch with an insane deadline, and thus the half-baked version of The Force Awakens we ultimately have now.
So, yes, Kennedy should have known better and hired a story group and/or director from the jump. But that mistake could have EASILY been remedied had Iger not needlessly set shareholder expectations with hard a release year right from the get go. Granted, that means everything would have been delayed a year, and yes, the movies made a fortune regardless, but the future of and enthusiasm for the franchise feels like it could have been so much more had they just taken another year to let this whole thing come together.
- The first mistake was Kennedy hiring only one, solo writer to start with - Michael Arndt - to write only one, solo movie, with no director or story group to help shepherd. Arndt is one of the most respected writers in Hollywood, but it absolutely should have been a committee effort from the start, if only to establish some general cornerstones and signposts. And I get that Lucas handed over a sequel trilogy outline, and that Arndt was working partly off that, so maybe they thought they did have a direction/plan from the start, but still.
- The second, far more costly mistake, IMO, was Bob Iger assuming they were well on their way with Arndt, and then immediately setting a summer 2015 release date with the announcement in 2012 that Disney was acquiring Lucasfilm. I will forever believe that that move is what truly doomed this whole endeavor. Because that date was only doable if everything went perfectly. And nothing EVER goes perfectly in this business. So between Abrams finally coming aboard months after Arndt had been writing, and them both realizing the current iteration wasn't working, all they could do was get Iger to push back to December 2015. That was as far as he could budge, because he had shareholders to answer to. But if he just would have NOT named a release year in the initial announcement, I legitimately believe we'd be in a much better place right now. Instead, what we got was Abrams and Kasdan having to basically start from scratch with an insane deadline, and thus the half-baked version of The Force Awakens we ultimately have now.
So, yes, Kennedy should have known better and hired a story group and/or director from the jump. But that mistake could have EASILY been remedied had Iger not needlessly set shareholder expectations with hard a release year right from the get go. Granted, that means everything would have been delayed a year, and yes, the movies made a fortune regardless, but the future of and enthusiasm for the franchise feels like it could have been so much more had they just taken another year to let this whole thing come together.
https://thedigitalbits.com/columns/my-two-cents/121719-2000
Quote:
One more thing this evening: I spent my afternoon today at a press screening for Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker. I'll say more about the film in time. The review embargo lifts tonight, but I really want to make sure that you all get the chance to see it for yourselves before I post a full review. I will make just a couple of quick non-spoilery comments now though. First, I was very entertained by the film, and largely satisfied by it. I think it pays off the sequel trilogy nicely and is actually a better film because of the choices made in The Last Jedi. It also makes both that film and The Force Awakens better in retrospect. Second, I strongly urge you to avoid reviews and spoilers before you see it. Just go and give it a chance to do it's thing. That's my two cents for now.
Which one of you is this going to be on Thursday?!?
I.e. avoid the general board?
Omg- star wars spoilers and early signing day. Not sure we'll make it.
Omg- star wars spoilers and early signing day. Not sure we'll make it.
Quote:
So, yes, Kennedy should have known better and hired a story group and/or director from the jump.
Did you forget that there was supposed to be a story group? Kennedy herself announced it way back in 2012, and Kiri Hart was the one that supposedly put it together as it was apparently founded in 2013.
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Lucasfilm_Story_Group
In the old Rebels Recon for Rebels episodes, Filoni would talk about some of the discussions he had with Hildalgo about stuff. Probably the only thing I really remember Story Group actually contributing to.
Currently at 58% after 32 reviews...
https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_wars_the_rise_of_skywalker/
For reference:
93% = TFA
91% = TLJ
https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_wars_the_rise_of_skywalker/
For reference:
93% = TFA
91% = TLJ
jabberwalkie09 said:Quote:
So, yes, Kennedy should have known better and hired a story group and/or director from the jump.
Did you forget that there was supposed to be a story group? Kennedy herself announced it way back in 2012, and Kiri Hart was the one that supposedly put it together as it was apparently founded in 2013.
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Lucasfilm_Story_Group
In the old Rebels Recon for Rebels episodes, Filoni would talk about some of the discussions he had with Hildalgo about stuff. Probably the only thing I really remember Story Group actually contributing to.
Sorry, I meant like an actual, cinematic "story group." Whatever they have now (and had back then) sounds like more of a Jedi Council-esque body whose primary function is more of a canon-decider, fact-checker, ensurer-of-continuity-across-all-mediums-and-content role; like a living, breathing Star Wars encyclopedia/advisory board. But there's a huge difference between that and cinematic storytelling. They need(ed) a separate group who's ONLY concern was the movies; a group who were no doubt fans, but possessed a vast amount of experience in filmmaking and screenwriting, lead by either a director or a Kevin Feige type (the latter of which is admittedly hard to come by). And then THAT group should have consulted with the "story group" as needed.
TCTTS said:jabberwalkie09 said:Quote:
So, yes, Kennedy should have known better and hired a story group and/or director from the jump.
Did you forget that there was supposed to be a story group? Kennedy herself announced it way back in 2012, and Kiri Hart was the one that supposedly put it together as it was apparently founded in 2013.
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Lucasfilm_Story_Group
In the old Rebels Recon for Rebels episodes, Filoni would talk about some of the discussions he had with Hildalgo about stuff. Probably the only thing I really remember Story Group actually contributing to.
Sorry, I meant like an actual, cinematic "story group." Whatever they have now (and had back then) sounds like more of a Jedi Council-esque body whose primary function is more of a canon-decider, fact-checker, ensurer-of-continuity-across-all-mediums-and-content role; like a living, breathing Star Wars encyclopedia/advisory board. But there's a huge difference between that and cinematic storytelling. They need(ed) a separate group who's ONLY concern was the movies; a group who were no doubt fans, but possessed a vast amount of experience in filmmaking and screenwriting, lead by either a director or a Kevin Feige type (the latter of which is admittedly hard to come by). And then THAT group should have consulted with the "story group" as needed.
I think I get what you're saying, Lucasfilm should have had a creative head that worked with the previously formed story group. I think communicating with them as needed is partially how we ended up with TLJ, but we've beat that dead horse enough. However, I think that having that creative group only focus on the movies would be problematic down the line evidenced by the issues that Marvel had with their movie and tv divisions being separate.
I know people aren't too hot on Filoni's direction of episodes for The Mandalorian, but I'd argue the guy has done a better job in both TCW and Rebels doing exactly what we just described here, than whatever has been going on in this franchise lately.
And with this last bittersweet post...I'll see y'all on the spoilers thread pretty damn late Friday night.
And that negative rating on Rotten Tomatoes is the last piece of confirmation I need that I'll enjoy this one!
And that negative rating on Rotten Tomatoes is the last piece of confirmation I need that I'll enjoy this one!
The Vox review hated it, so that makes me happy!!
Also, some of these reviewers are so freaking pretentious. Reminds me of the south park episode where everyone was enjoying the smell of their own flatulence.
A couple, sure. But most of these read like rationale people giving sound reasoning for why this movie didn't work for them.
when do you sleep? :-)
The ones I randomly read came off as "this mediocre film is paying fan service to the idiots who did not comprehend the greatness of The Last Jedi". And I generally agree with your sentiments that most people over react to these reviewers, but I hated the last Jedi and don't appreciate the condescending tone to those of us who didn't like it.
With that being said, the "soulless" tone that some of the reviewers headlines includes is bothersome.
The ones I randomly read came off as "this mediocre film is paying fan service to the idiots who did not comprehend the greatness of The Last Jedi". And I generally agree with your sentiments that most people over react to these reviewers, but I hated the last Jedi and don't appreciate the condescending tone to those of us who didn't like it.
With that being said, the "soulless" tone that some of the reviewers headlines includes is bothersome.
I will say that if reviews contain bull**** like this then we are fine
From io9 review - Gizmodo
They're also given an arbitrary timeline of a few days which is supposed to add tension to the proceedings but doesn't, mainly because the passage of time in Star Wars has rarely been a big thing, so why start now? (Does anyone wear watches? Which sun do they go by?)
From io9 review - Gizmodo
They're also given an arbitrary timeline of a few days which is supposed to add tension to the proceedings but doesn't, mainly because the passage of time in Star Wars has rarely been a big thing, so why start now? (Does anyone wear watches? Which sun do they go by?)
Fighting Texas Aggie Class of 2012
As someone who enjoyed last Jedi, there is still nothing that concerns me in these reviews. I will be walking out of that theater tomorrow night with the biggest **** eating grin on my face. You know why? Because I *************ing love Star Wars
Fighting Texas Aggie Class of 2012
Hard to believe this could be worse than AOTC
I truly don't believe it is. Jj is in the unenviable position of following up to a polarizing film but media darling and is closing off the sky walker saga. There is no world this is worse than attack of the clones
Fighting Texas Aggie Class of 2012
I guarantee this though. Kennedy is gone before the end of 2020
Fighting Texas Aggie Class of 2012
The very same people that loved that pile of garbage TLJ are the same ones who now hate this film.
That's all I need to know expect something I'll love.
That's all I need to know expect something I'll love.
After the unevenness of this sequel trilogy, I'm going to strick with a lot of the ideas and events that happened in the now "Legends" book universe for how this story really should have played out and ended.
Thrawn, Luke establishing a new Jedi Order, Han and Leia having a few kids who become their own outstanding characters.... I'd rather that be the legacy I look back to after the first set of films.
For anyone interested in a different view of how things played out after RoTJ, I cannot recommend the Thawn trilogy enough. Thrawn is top 3 in Star Wars villains and I would have loved to see him on the big screen.
Thrawn, Luke establishing a new Jedi Order, Han and Leia having a few kids who become their own outstanding characters.... I'd rather that be the legacy I look back to after the first set of films.
For anyone interested in a different view of how things played out after RoTJ, I cannot recommend the Thawn trilogy enough. Thrawn is top 3 in Star Wars villains and I would have loved to see him on the big screen.
And therein lies the problem. There was so much EU lore, people loved some of it (and some of it is truly awful by all accounts)... anything short of that Exact material for diehard fans wasn't going to be good enough. It didn't stand a chance.JRC0811 said:
After the unevenness of this sequel trilogy, I'm going to strick with a lot of the ideas and events that happened in the now "Legends" book universe for how this story really should have played out and ended.
Thrawn, Luke establishing a new Jedi Order, Han and Leia having a few kids who become their own outstanding characters.... I'd rather that be the legacy I look back to after the first set of films.
For anyone interested in a different view of how things played out after RoTJ, I cannot recommend the Thawn trilogy enough. Thrawn is top 3 in Star Wars villains and I would have loved to see him on the big screen.
Obviously it's been a subpar trilogy to date and they definitely should have planned out all 3 movies, but why don't you at least give the last third of it a chance before going all "woe is me"?
I am listening to Binge Mode right now and got to their force awakens episode. I never realized Kathleen Kennedy was directly approached by George Lucas to shepherd Star Wars. That explains a lot honestly
Fighting Texas Aggie Class of 2012
Buck Compton said:And therein lies the problem. There was so much EU lore, people loved some of it (and some of it is truly awful by all accounts)... anything short of that Exact material for diehard fans wasn't going to be good enough. It didn't stand a chance.JRC0811 said:
After the unevenness of this sequel trilogy, I'm going to strick with a lot of the ideas and events that happened in the now "Legends" book universe for how this story really should have played out and ended.
Thrawn, Luke establishing a new Jedi Order, Han and Leia having a few kids who become their own outstanding characters.... I'd rather that be the legacy I look back to after the first set of films.
For anyone interested in a different view of how things played out after RoTJ, I cannot recommend the Thawn trilogy enough. Thrawn is top 3 in Star Wars villains and I would have loved to see him on the big screen.
Obviously it's been a subpar trilogy to date and they definitely should have planned out all 3 movies, but why don't you at least give the last third of it a chance before going all "woe is me"?
Well, can't deny I'm a hardcore fan since I probably read the lion's share of those books in middle school through early adulthood.
I'm going to still see it and give it a chance, but, I think my main frustration lie that the original two series were Lucas' vision for better or worse. The EU books were approved by Lucas as an extension to the universe, also for better or worse. But, there was a plan/idea/vision for the story, at least.
The overarching issue with these movies is it sounds like they've been created by corporate committee.
I trust this guy's take on many movies. And he is a die hard Star Wars fan....he thinks this is the worst of 9 Star Wars films...eekk
been created by corporate committee
I am not a committee! - Kathleen Kennedy
I am not a committee! - Kathleen Kennedy
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