BallerStaf2003 said:

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Sam took the black, he has no house or status.

They just put whoever was still alive up there.

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It's been shown you can have your heritage reinstated by a king. Stannis tried to do it with Jon. I think in the past multiple people tried to have Aemon put on the throne.

Yes, Sam took the Black but that was before his father and brother were fried.
Being the sole heir to House Tarley supersedes his oath.

Lol, i just realized that 2 of the randos at the 'crappy acting attempt 'awkward millenial humor' scene that fell on its face as a supposed trial/oops election meeting (with the water bottle) were that ****ed up 10 year old teat sucker and that moron that got married at the red wedding. What!?

I mean the freys murdered his whole family but didnt bother with him? Or he didnt mind and took a honeymoon cruise!?

Its minor garbage compared to the rest of the trash truck, but just shows how utterly idiotic this was.

Lol - congrats on taking 7 years of 93% plus rt scores and vomiting before the finish line with a 37%

The unsullied don't bother me as much because they were doing that "hold the line, retreat across the trench, fall back into the castle" bit and if they were doing that in several different places it's conceivable that quite a few of them made it out alive.

There being any more than a handful of Dothraki left is just absolutely stupid though.

Anyone else find it funny that the master of coin (Bronn) doesn't know how interest and borrowing money works?

"This argument is even worse than your last one. Just because some else ALSO became a genocidal maniac doesn't mean that Cersei suddenly isn't one."

I think Ronin might take exception to this...

easttexasaggie04 said:

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The one thing that bothers me more than it should is that it seemed like 50-100 Unsullied survived the Battle of Winterfell. We saw the small group run into the gates when it looked like all hope was lost. Then last night we saw thousands of Unsullied looking as sharp as ever after taking Kings Landing. The same goes for the Dothraki. We saw maybe 15 running back after facing the WW army.

I don't get how the army grew by 100x

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I don't think by any measure that only a handful survived WF. What you saw was one portion of them at one small part of the front of WF. It's representative of what happened it does not show the fate of ALL of them.

After as they were planning for KL they literally said HALF were lost and they numbered somewhere between 10-13K originally. Dany traded for 8000+5000 in training. Assuming all the in training were full Unsullied 5 seasons later thats 13K.

So maybe 6500 remained after WF.

Likewise the Dothraki were not all wiped out. they had 100K initially but maybe had lost some already in other battles. And again after WF in the planning for KL the lead Dothraki guy left some pieces on the board - let's say 5% survived. That might be 4000-5000 Dothraki left. Just because we saw all of the fire swords go out does not mean they all died. We saw some return - again shown a small portion of the battle area and a small representative group but that was supposed to tell you some small percentage survived to retreat back (with Jorah).

That 6500 and the 4-5K added together = I can believe there were 10k+ after the battle in KL when she addressed them. It didn't look like much more than that. The dragon did most of the work really. they had few losses there.

They could have made it less confusing and still achieved the same purpose if on their 'battle board' they'd have just had some of the dothraki staged somewhere else. So it'd be like 'we didn't see them, but they were doing something else so we don't know how many of them survived or not.'

Instead we see them crash into the army of the dead and a handful of them come running back but then the next episode when they're pulling the pieces of the board HALF of them lived? That's just crazy.

So did Jon leave the nights watch to live North of the Wall or was he just going on a patrol and coming back?

bobinator said:

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They could have made it less confusing and still achieved the same purpose if on their 'battle board' they'd have just had some of the dothraki staged somewhere else. So it'd be like 'we didn't see them, but they were doing something else so we don't know how many of them survived or not.'

Instead we see them crash into the army of the dead and a handful of them come running back but then the next episode when they're pulling the pieces of the board HALF of them lived? That's just crazy. N

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nobody said half of them lived. I don't think it is close to that. more like 5% like I said.

I attribute the Dothraki guy sweeping half of the pieces off to his poor math - I'm assuming he isn't educated and higher math represented by pieces on a board escapes him.


you can blame all of that on the rushed nature of things though. they could have certainly shown it better or explained it more.

Do you think they all would have just declared for Jon right away?

I felt like Yara would have stuck by her pledge to Dany, regardless. I also kinda got the feeling most of them there were tired of just letting Targs have the throne. Plus, the Unsullied had Jon so that situation had to be handled the right way to keep him from being killed.

Big bag of meh from me. The episode wasnt a bad finish to this season BUT this season was a TERRIBLE finish to this series.

Truvada_for_prep said:

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So did Jon leave the nights watch to live North of the Wall or was he just going on a patrol and coming back?

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This. I was wondering that as well. Everyone seems to think he's just leaving to live with the Wildlings, but if Jon is still a man of his word and stands by his oath, I fully expect him to escort the Wildlings to their home and then return to Castle Black as the new leader.

swc93 said:

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I guess none of Varys's letters actually went out; otherwise everyone on the Jedi Counsel at the end would have been declaring for John.

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Wow totally forgot about this. It seemed like some had gone out before they came for him since I believe the little pile we saw before was gone.

I would be ok with this too.

Their council discusses how Jon has disappeared, and he's the true heir so what do we do now? Well, let's try something different and elect a king instead of just assuming the throne should go to a Targ.

Bran informs Sansa and Arya later of Jon's fate. We don't get Jon saying bye to his family this way but maybe overall it's smoother. I agree that Jon getting sent to the defunct Night's Watch is a bit confusing.

Zombie Jon Snow said:

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imho....

they should have just had Jon escape the city after and we don't know where he is. i mean there was nobody there anyway.

he was no part of the council meetings anyway. Just have them all say they haven't seen him and GW says he was the last one seen entering before the Queen was found dead. they know it was him but don't know where he is.

It makes sense Tyrion was held - and Grey Worm kind of follows orders and had nobody to tell him what to do with Tyrion. Then have Bran appoint Tyrion as he did much to Grey Worms chagrin. And the Unsullied and Dothraki decide to leave.

then have a final scene with Jon showing up at the wall, greeting Tormund on his own and they set off for the far north.

no Nights Watch stuff which does not make sense at this point anyway. Have it be on jon's own accord. He doesn't want to rule anything anyway.

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Zombie Jon Snow said:

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aggierogue said:

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Sex Panther said:

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OldShadeOfBlue said:

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Sex Panther said:

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AustinAg2K said:

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How is Sam not in the Night's Watch anymore?

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There is no Night's Watch

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Did you miss the last 30 minutes of this episode?

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If you or anyone else thinks there's still a Night's Watch and didn't get it... I don't know what to tell you. It's already been touched upon. Bran and Tyrion sent him there to let him be free and go north of the wall. Whatever is left of the Night's Watch is just the few who didn't die and the remaining Wildlings who are hanging out up there.

They don't care about the vow anymore so Sam can go do whatever he wanted. Their job was to protect the wall, and keep out the Army of the Dead and Wildlings. So now their watch has ended.

Plus Sam was studying to be a Maester, and Bran needed a Maester. Pretty sure the King can have that kind of pull.

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So why does Tyrion tell Jon (alone) that he one day see him again because after 5 years (as the hand) he might want to piss off the wall at the edge of the world?

I get what you're saying, but I think dismissing the idea that there is still a night's watch is a big assumption on your part. Most south of the wall didnt believe in WWs or a Night King when the show started. So why have a wall then in the first place?

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So if you are Bran - and your brother is being held by a militaristic but simple minded tyrant who only gets the concept of justice and punishment and you want your brother freed cuz he did the right thing.

And you know everything so you know there really is no CB or NW any more. But you can convince this dimwit that it is a lifetime punishment instead of just setting him free.

Are you gonna tell Tyrion that and ruin it potentially? Or let Tyrion believe it too.

It's best if everyone believes it really.

I took that as a smooth move by a king that knows all. When does Bran ever tell anyone anything up front. He usually holds back 90% of everything unless it has already happened. the dude was just sitting there smirking waiting for them to make him the king - and he came there because of it.

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You both may be right. It was an ambiguous plot point ending. Who knows. Believe what you want.