****** Game of Thrones - Season 8 ******

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Tony Franklins Other Shoe
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Little Mormont had to die. There is only one true Brooder....King of the North and Jon Snow Stark Targaryen is that person.
Federale01
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King Richard II rode out on horseback during the Peasant Revolt and met the rioters in person to hear their demands. He was 13 or 14 when he did. What you are saying is 100 percent true. Regencies were used frequently, but there was no set age on when they ended. It was once that individual proved they were capable or leading in their own right. Henry VI had a very long regency but that was because he was a dullard, which was part of the reason why he was deposed by Edward IV.
smokeythebear
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aTmAg said:

smokeythebear said:

aTmAg said:

smokeythebear said:

It doesn't matter what you would do, it only matters what precedence the show sets. When Joffrey takes over the throne for himself and Bran is shown making decisions in Winterfell (with the advice of Maester Lewin) then it absolutely makes sense that young kids would be the head of their household in other houses.
The fact that any of that happens is a flaw in the writing. I don't know who. Since Ned Stark was supposed to be Joffrey's regent (and Cersie stole that), I'm inclined too blame HBO.
Except that precedence was very clearly set by the books...
Which character(s)?
Joffrey, Tommen, and Bran.
Zombie Jon Snow
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Tony Franklins Other Shoe said:

Little Mormont had to die. There is only one true Brooder....King of the North and Jon Snow Stark Targaryen is that person.

YEAH!!!!!!.....wait I relinquished that title though. Hmmmmm......

(if your aunt was khaleesi hot and rode dragons you'd hit it too......nomsayin.... don't judge me)
Mantis Toboggan MD
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gigemJTH12 said:

There are no spoilers in this. Mostly all screenshots of the preview. Aside from a pic of Dany standing by the battle strategy map. I am curious about the picture of the battle map. Really curious how Euron plans to use his ships for this battle. Doesn't seem like it helps much.

https://ew.com/tv/2019/05/01/game-thrones-season-8-episode-4/

Is the caption in the link incorrect or am I missing something? The fleet in the picture is sailing with the Targaryen sigil.
Teddy Perkins
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That was incorrect. Looks like they fixed it.
Mantis Toboggan MD
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Yup, they did. That was quick.
bonfarr
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Where did Danerys get more ships? Yara said she only had 3 left after the disaster from last season.
Urban Ag
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aTmAg said:

smokeythebear said:

It doesn't matter what you would do, it only matters what precedence the show sets. When Joffrey takes over the throne for himself and Bran is shown making decisions in Winterfell (with the advice of Maester Lewin) then it absolutely makes sense that young kids would be the head of their household in other houses.
The fact that any of that happens is a flaw in the writing. I don't know who. Since Ned Stark was supposed to be Joffrey's regent (and Cersie stole that), I'm inclined too blame HBO.
Based on how Robyn, Bran, Joffrey, and Tommen were guided as child rulers, I just assumed most viewers would not jump to the conclusion that little Lady Mormont and Little Lord Karstark, were really calling all the shots. Further, that if they ordered their people to do something really reckless, the grownups wouldn't let it actually happen. Little Robyn Arryn wanted to throw people out the moon door, he didn't get to.

Further, this is actually how sh** works in the books and it transferred to the series. And almost all the characters in the books are younger. Girls become women when they get their first cycle. Boys become men as teens. It's not bad or lazing writing. It's part of the world GRRM created. You think it's stupid, great, but HBO didn't just decide to create child rulers in a fantasy epic to piss off aerospace engineers to the point they can't get past it. This is how it works in Westeros and Essos for that matter. Lines of succession are honored. It's why Randal Tarley told Sam to take the black or he'd kill him. Culture dictated Sam would have succeeded him and he couldn't stand it.

Regardless, all of this is just really to show that these houses have been so devastated that the lines of family succession are down to kids and tweens in some cases. In a story with dragon, zombies, and magic I have a hard time understanding why child or teen rulers is that hard to work with.
Rustys-Beef-o-Reeno
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bonfarr said:

Where did Danerys get more ships? Yara said she only had 3 left after the disaster from last season.


Magic
bonfarr
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I think some of the guys *****ing so much about it were used to being all-time Dungeon Master in their D&D games where they get to say exactly how everything goes.
aTmAg
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smokeythebear said:

aTmAg said:

smokeythebear said:

aTmAg said:

smokeythebear said:

It doesn't matter what you would do, it only matters what precedence the show sets. When Joffrey takes over the throne for himself and Bran is shown making decisions in Winterfell (with the advice of Maester Lewin) then it absolutely makes sense that young kids would be the head of their household in other houses.
The fact that any of that happens is a flaw in the writing. I don't know who. Since Ned Stark was supposed to be Joffrey's regent (and Cersie stole that), I'm inclined too blame HBO.
Except that precedence was very clearly set by the books...
Which character(s)?
Joffrey, Tommen, and Bran.
Cersie was the regent for Joffrey and Tomnen. I forget on Bran.

One issue I have is that the regent seems to have no power in GoT. In reality, a young king wouldn't be able to defy the regent and start a war by executing somebody important on a whim. But of course the entire story wouldn't have happened if they followed that.
wangus12
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bonfarr said:

Where did Danerys get more ships? Yara said she only had 3 left after the disaster from last season.
Well they obviously had more since they were able to transport all the Dothraki and Unsullied up to Winterfell, most likely though White Harbor
Urban Ag
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bonfarr said:

I think some of the guys *****ing so much about it were used to being all-time Dungeon Master in their D&D games where they get to say exactly how everything goes.
Over the years I've quit watching a number of shows because I no longer enjoyed them. Seems like there are a lot of posters here all of a sudden that don't like GOT anymore and simply love to make sure everyone else knows it.

Again.

And again.

And again.
Social Media Influencer
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This is another "NDA" thing, isn't it, where we think you're asking earnest questions but "in reality" you haven't been watching the show, you just want to argue about how you think things work in the real world?
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bonfarr said:

I think some of the guys *****ing so much about it were used to being all-time Dungeon Master in their D&D games where they get to say exactly how everything goes.
http://www.cc.com/video-clips/0h6mjz/reno-911--mighty-foes

"I live in a world of cold steel."
tk for tu juan
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aTmAg just likes to hear himself talk
aTmAg
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Social Media Influencer said:

This is another "NDA" thing, isn't it, where we think you're asking earnest questions but "in reality" you haven't been watching the show, you just want to argue about how you think things work in the real world?
You think I haven't been watching the show? Really?
Zombie Jon Snow
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bonfarr said:

Where did Danerys get more ships? Yara said she only had 3 left after the disaster from last season.

Dany still had maybe half of her ships.

Going back to S6 she gets her fleet from Yara and the original iron fleet that Yara and Theon brought to Mereen. And also more ships from the slavers revolt in the bay who they torched (some of the ships).

But Euron during that time was back in the iron islands building another fleet- recall they ditched him there (Yara and Theon) when Euron was busy not drowning and getting his crown.

So Euron built another entire fleet. Probably not as big though.


During S7 Dany's fleet takes her army to Dragonstone. Then when they sent the Unsullied to Casterly Rock they went by sea. That would presumably be halfish of her fleet not all of it because the Dothraki stayed behind.

Euron showed up at Dragonstone with his new fleet and took the mostly unguarded remains of Dany's fleet and captured Yara. Then he went to KL to impress Cersei and ask her to marry him - but she said he needed to get her an army first and he left for Essos and the Golden Company.

Then at the end of S7 Dany uses the remaining fleet returned from Casterly Rock to go up to White Harbor in S7 at the end. They literally talked about using the fleet to get the Unsullied up there and meeting the Dothraki who they sent on foot. (thats why Jon and Dany had boat sex).

In S8 Theon rescued Yara at KL (after Euron returned with the GC) and they stole 3 ships - that's the 3 she is talking about and all THEY have meaning she and Theon.


From S7 E10 - planning discussion:


Quote:

Jon: If we have the Dothraki ride hard on the kingsroad, they'll arrive at Winterfell within the fortnight.


Daenerys: And the Unsullied?

Jon: We can sail with them to White Harbor, meet the Dothraki here on the kingsroad, then ride together to Winterfell.



Render
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Urban Ag said:

In a story with dragon, zombies, and magic I have a hard time understanding why child or teen rulers is that hard to work with.

I agree with your points, but I've never been a fan of this argument.
Even though a story is fiction, the basics of existence should still be in place.
Lapses in basic common sense and logic are unacceptable, even in fictional stories.
(Not saying your lineage point is illogical, just speaking in general. Seems like TA people excuse obvious lapses in common sense all the time just because the story is "fictional".)
Urban Ag
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aTmAg said:

smokeythebear said:

aTmAg said:

smokeythebear said:

aTmAg said:

smokeythebear said:

It doesn't matter what you would do, it only matters what precedence the show sets. When Joffrey takes over the throne for himself and Bran is shown making decisions in Winterfell (with the advice of Maester Lewin) then it absolutely makes sense that young kids would be the head of their household in other houses.
The fact that any of that happens is a flaw in the writing. I don't know who. Since Ned Stark was supposed to be Joffrey's regent (and Cersie stole that), I'm inclined too blame HBO.
Except that precedence was very clearly set by the books...
Which character(s)?
Joffrey, Tommen, and Bran.
Cersie was the regent for Joffrey and Tomnen. I forget on Bran.

One issue I have is that the regent seems to have no power in GoT. In reality, a young king wouldn't be able to defy the regent and start a war by executing somebody important on a whim. But of course the entire story wouldn't have happened if they followed that.
1) This isn't reality, it's a tv series based on five epic fantasy novels
2) Joffrey had agreed with Cersei and his advisors to let Ned take the black. No one thought he was going to do that (maybe LF) and you can't overrule the king publicly. This is why Tywin sent Tyrion back to be hand to ensure the little a-hole didn't pull more stunts like that.
3) This isn't reality, it's a tv series based on five epic fantasy novels
4) If we want to compare to reality, there are numerous example of child/teen rulers, especially among the Egyptians, Greeks, and Romans.
5) This isn't reality, it's a tv series based on five epic fantasy novels
Urban Ag
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Render said:

Urban Ag said:

In a story with dragon, zombies, and magic I have a hard time understanding why child or teen rulers is that hard to work with.

I agree with your points, but I've never been a fan of this argument.
Even though a story is fiction, the basics of existence should still be in place.
Lapses in basic common sense and logic are unacceptable, even in fictional stories.
(Not saying your lineage point is illogical, just speaking in general. Seems like TA people excuse obvious lapses in common sense all the time just because the story is "fictional".)
Well then your beef is with GRRM because it's the universe he created in which you can on occasion end up with a child/teen ruler.

And as I posted above, there is plenty of historical precedence of child/teen rulers among the Greeks, Romans, Egyptians, Chinese, and even in Medieval Europe.

I'm done with it.
Render
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Urban Ag said:

Render said:

Urban Ag said:

In a story with dragon, zombies, and magic I have a hard time understanding why child or teen rulers is that hard to work with.

I agree with your points, but I've never been a fan of this argument.
Even though a story is fiction, the basics of existence should still be in place.
Lapses in basic common sense and logic are unacceptable, even in fictional stories.
(Not saying your lineage point is illogical, just speaking in general. Seems like TA people excuse obvious lapses in common sense all the time just because the story is "fictional".)
Well then your beef is with GRRM because it's the universe he created in which you can on occasion end up with a child/teen ruler.

And as I posted above, there is plenty of historical precedence of child/teen rulers among the Greeks, Romans, Egyptians, Chinese, and even in Medieval Europe.

I'm done with it.

Lol, dude I agree with you. I was just making a quick aside.
bangobango
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Jon and Rob are like 15 years old in the books. Dany is like 13 I think. People used to be expected to grow up a lot quicker back then.
aTmAg
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Urban Ag said:

aTmAg said:

smokeythebear said:

aTmAg said:

smokeythebear said:

aTmAg said:

smokeythebear said:

It doesn't matter what you would do, it only matters what precedence the show sets. When Joffrey takes over the throne for himself and Bran is shown making decisions in Winterfell (with the advice of Maester Lewin) then it absolutely makes sense that young kids would be the head of their household in other houses.
The fact that any of that happens is a flaw in the writing. I don't know who. Since Ned Stark was supposed to be Joffrey's regent (and Cersie stole that), I'm inclined too blame HBO.
Except that precedence was very clearly set by the books...
Which character(s)?
Joffrey, Tommen, and Bran.
Cersie was the regent for Joffrey and Tomnen. I forget on Bran.

One issue I have is that the regent seems to have no power in GoT. In reality, a young king wouldn't be able to defy the regent and start a war by executing somebody important on a whim. But of course the entire story wouldn't have happened if they followed that.
1) This isn't reality, it's a tv series based on five epic fantasy novels
2) Joffrey had agreed with Cersei and his advisors to let Ned take the black. No one thought he was going to do that (maybe LF) and you can't overrule the king publicly. This is why Tywin sent Tyrion back to be hand to ensure the little a-hole didn't pull more stunts like that.
3) This isn't reality, it's a tv series based on five epic fantasy novels
4) If we want to compare to reality, there are numerous example of child/teen rulers, especially among the Egyptians, Greeks, and Romans.
5) This isn't reality, it's a tv series based on five epic fantasy novels
Yes.. but even in this non-reality it's stupid and laughable to have a 10 year old Momont chick running a city and leading veterans fighters into battle. That's the point. Her whole story line was ridiculous and is a knock against an otherwise great show.
Icecream_Ag
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King tut ruled for a decade an was 19 when he died, yet a 10 year old head of house in a fantasy show defies reality
bangobango
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And I mean this in the nicest way possible, but some of you need to actually read the books before you start stating what you think the books said or what the author means.
Icecream_Ag
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bangobango said:

Jon and Rob are like 15 years old in the books. Dany is like 13 I think. People used to be expected to grow up a lot quicker back then.
Arya is like 11 so the whole Arya/gendry fascination from book people is scary
Bunk Moreland
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bangobango said:

And I mean this in the nicest way possible, but some of you either need to actually read the books before you start stating what you think the books said or what the author means.

And I mean this in the nicest way possible...but some of you either need to give it up, or actually separate a ****load of what happened/was explained in the book & what is happening/will happen on the show.

This entire thread is littered with book-only narratives and it makes it damn near impossible for non-book readers to know if they missed earlier references that were scenes on the show, or if it's just y'all getting off on little factoids that will not matter in any way whatsoever on the show.
Social Media Influencer
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The age thing has been explained with references to the books, the shows, and real world history.

But that probably won't convince some posters.
aTmAg
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Icecream_Ag said:

King tut ruled for a decade an was 19 when he died, yet a 10 year old head of house in a fantasy show defies reality
From what I remember, he didn't run crap. His advisers did.
bearamedic99
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Episode titles for the remaining episodes have leaked

Ep 71. Shwarma
Ep 72. Rise of Mormont
Ep 73. Return of the Queen
redline248
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We're sitting here talking about whether or not a kid can be the lord of their own f-cking house. I guess y'all got bored with battle strategies of not bombarding the undead for more than 1 minute before charging into darkness, or how sweet your tvs are?
redline248
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aTmAg said:

Icecream_Ag said:

King tut ruled for a decade an was 19 when he died, yet a 10 year old head of house in a fantasy show defies reality
From what I remember, he didn't run crap. His advisers did.
You remember? Damn, you're old.
Bunk Moreland
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I'm not referring to that point. I'm referring to hundreds of topics that have been hashed out over 200+ pages in general.
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