****** Game of Thrones - Season 8 ******

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wangus12
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What if the reason Jon didn't say anything about whether he wanted the throne or not is because he wants to see Dany's reaction.

As Sam questioned in Ep1, "You gave up your crown. Would she do the same?"

Would she stand in the way of who is the rightful heir or is she truly power hungry
Marcus Aurelius
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They are all being very apocalyptic about the next episode. Interesting to see how much carnage occurs.
redline248
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The real reason is the writers love ending his scenes with unanswered questions.

I do think Jon cares about what she thinks, but isn't going to judge her on her immediate reaction. Hell, he looked like he wanted to punch Sam in the face when Sam told him.
hunter2012
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wangus12 said:

What if the reason Jon didn't say anything about whether he wanted the throne or not is because he wants to see Dany's reaction.

As Sam questioned in Ep1, "You gave up your crown. Would she do the same?"

Would she stand in the way of who is the rightful heir or is she truly power hungry
That question did affect him, so it could definitely be the reason. Dany's sees her claim to be legitimate rather than whose the better ruler so it will be interesting to see what she decides since Jon has the best claim now. Jon really just wants to live/fight for the living, which adds an extra irony. The man with the best claim to the throne also does not care about it the least of all the GoT players.
Thisguy1
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Jon lied about Bran telling him about his past, right? Or did I just forget it?

I didn't think he had and Jon just threw his name to give it some legitimacy and to protect Sam a little bit.
Urban Ag
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Furlock Bones said:

TPS_Report said:

Questions: Did Jon relinquish all family claims when he took the Oath of the Night's Watch? Did that oath survive his death and resurrection?
the point is he ended his watch and fulfilled his oath by dying. in his resurrection, he is free to do as he wants.
Yep. But all of these discussions are essentially pointless. Oaths, lineage, who has the better claim, etc, all of it is out the window. Even the machinations about Jon now that Dany knows he is Rhaegar's son. It's pointless. Dany has the better claim because her army says so. Period.

That said, I think the writers are really pushing the audience to question Dany once again. Will she go "Mad King" in lust to take the iron throne? They've really played that up and only tempered it with moments of vulnerability in her affection for Jon. One could even argue she's only willing to fight to save the North because she's fuming pissed off about losing a dragon.

Ultimately I still think Dany does the right thing.

If she survives and Cersei is defeated, she takes the throne but releases the Seven Kingdoms to rule themselves autonomously, and deems herself the Protector of the Realm, meaning she see her role as providing for the defense of the free people of Westeros, not ruling them with an iron fist. If she dies, I think she goes out in sacrificing her life for her people. I just think they are pushing the "Dany is drunk on power" thing too hard at this point and it will swing the other way.

The whole notion of "if you think this has a happy ending you're not paying attention" has essentially been dismantled by GRRM himself. He now says it will be "bittersweet". I have always taken that to mean a lot of characters we have come to love will perish and nothing more. I'm both good with that and at the same time I hope I am wrong because I'd love to see some twists we don't see coming.

And where is Mel? We know she is in this season and this is her hour.
boy09
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wangus12 said:

TPS_Report said:

Questions: Did Jon relinquish all family claims when he took the Oath of the Night's Watch? Did that oath survive his death and resurrection?
Its been widely regarded that nobody cares since he was murdered
Not to mention, the Night's Watch is pretty much useless/non-existent now.
Furlock Bones
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Urban Ag said:

Furlock Bones said:

TPS_Report said:

Questions: Did Jon relinquish all family claims when he took the Oath of the Night's Watch? Did that oath survive his death and resurrection?
the point is he ended his watch and fulfilled his oath by dying. in his resurrection, he is free to do as he wants.


And where is Mel? We know she is in this season and this is her hour.
there are strong theories out there if you want to have an idea. but, won't be posting in any potential spoilers.
Urban Ag
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No wildling threat greatly reduced the need for the NW. No wall completely erased the need for the NW. I would like to see Edd survive the BoW and don some flashy cloak ala Lando. When Tormund gives his sh** his response would be "zip it hillbilly, I've been wearing black for ten years".
hunter2012
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Quote:

And where is Mel? We know she is in this season and this is her hour.
Mel will show up in the King's Landing episodes. I regardless of what happens in winterfell I think Arya is going to go on a murder spree with her being one of the victims. Mel did say, "we'll meet again" when she saw the eyes Arya shuts forever and Arya hasn't seen her since so she has to survive the north or else they left a blatant plot hole/obvious foreshadow.
Urban Ag
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Yeah, I'm all for discussion but I am not searching out any rumors. I've read every book at least twice (SOS probably four times) and seen every episode at least twice. I'm just trying to enjoy the hell out of the last four weeks of GOT and don't want anything to be spoiled.
bonfarr
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SIAP but my theory on the battle against the Night King is that the Starks buried in the crypts below Winterfell are going to reanimate and battle the wights and the white walkers.

The books spend alot of time discussing the crypts and it is of huge importance to Martin. The dead are buried with an iron sword over their chests and it has been discussed that white walkers hate iron. In Season 2 they made a huge deal about Ned Stark's remains being returned so he could be buried in the crypts.

It has been set up with Tyrion and Sam hiding out in the crypts during the battle, the two of them are going to find out the secret of bringing the dead back to fight in one of the books Sam stole from the Citadel.

I see this playing out like the dead army that fought for the good guys in Lord of the Rings trilogy. Dead Ned is going to rise up and lead 30 generations of Starks in an epic battle.

CFTXAG10
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Always get a kick out of the spoiler pics w/ no context




Also, I think Jaime hangs around for a while after his interaction with Bran by the tree. Was glad to hear Bran say they needed him alive for the war, even though he left him with the cliffhanger "what makes you think there's an afterward?"
gigemJTH12
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No way Sam learns how to raise dead and does it that fast.

I don't think Tyrion makes it to the crypt.
The Dog Lord
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FIDO95 said:

redline248 said:

Yep, but who is leading Dorne, now? How did they react to having their previous leader ambushed on the high seas and given to Cersei? I think the show basically used that as a way to stop putting any effort into Dorne. In reality, that's a big pita Cersei would have to deal with.

House Tarly, gone. House Tyrell, gone. House Frey, gone. House Baratheon, gone (not counting bast@rds). Dorne/Martell is just another spoke of the wheel that is falling apart. Doesn't really matter. Curious to see what arises in the Spring.
Yes, in reality someone else in Dorne would step up, and they would be a major factor in the story (they still potentially are in the books). The show made it clear that Dorne would not be a major part of their story. If I had to guess, the ONLY reason it was even in the show was because of the Viper vs. the Mountain. They didn't even need Dorne's ships to bring Dany to Westeros since they could have given her a bunch of ships some other way.

jeffdjohnson
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Dan 07 said:

JABQ04 said:

PatAg said:

JABQ04 said:

I still maintain the NK wins it all. To quote Ramsay, "If you thinks this has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention."
You mean the character that was defeated by a former prisoner of his? A character we are intended to root for to win?


I guess I'm missing your point. I'm saying the NK wins. I threw in the Ramsay quote because I felt it sums up this entire situation. Good guys gonna get steamrolled here.
So they spent 10 years developing these characters and stories only to see them steamrolled at the end by an undead army of ice zombies? From a storytelling perspective I don't see it.


I think that is exactly the story GRRM has been setting up from the beginning. People worried about petty politics when we are all going to die anyways. Existential terror, etc...

The line in this episode about the Night King wanting to "erase the memory of the world" is interesting. Makes me wonder if this is all a cycle that has played out before. Winter comes and the NK erases the world. Spring comes, the NK retreats and the world starts again. Maybe the NK has never been defeated. Seems like a GRRM thing to do (i.e. there is always someone reaching for power in the face of inevitable death, after they die the cycle continues).
OldShadeOfBlue
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I'm fully expecting the Night King to snap his fingers turning half of Westeros into dust in the wind.
Urban Ag
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Good point about Mel telling Arya they would meet again. But what's your thought process on Mel not showing up until KL? Mel's entire purpose in the books/series was to see AA rise to power (first Stannis, then Jon) so as to unite the realm against the coming real war (the WW's). Why would she remain absent until KL?

In the absence of the prophecy/AA/Lightbringer, I could see this making sense as maybe the writers have just abandoned that entire part of the story and they close Mel's arc with Arya later in the season.
bonfarr
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gigemJTH12 said:

No way Sam learns how to raise dead and does it that fast.

I don't think Tyrion makes it to the crypt.


Sam will find out the secret and Bran will raise the dead.

Also we will learn that Bran as the 3 eyed Raven is also Bran the Builder and he built the wall when he went back in time.

He will rebuild it after the Night King is defeated.
Furlock Bones
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Urban Ag said:

Good point about Mel telling Arya they would meet again. But what's your thought process on Mel not showing up until KL? Mel's entire purpose in the books/series was to see AA rise to power (first Stannis, then Jon) so as to unite the realm against the coming real war (the WW's). Why would she remain absent until KL?

In the absence of the prophecy/AA/Lightbringer, I could see this making sense as maybe the writers have just abandoned that entire part of the story and they close Mel's arc with Arya later in the season.
if the NK doesn't actually go to Winterfell, the real battle with the NK could be in KL.
Robert C. Christian
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Urban Ag said:

Good point about Mel telling Arya they would meet again. But what's your thought process on Mel not showing up until KL? Mel's entire purpose in the books/series was to see AA rise to power (first Stannis, then Jon) so as to unite the realm against the coming real war (the WW's). Why would she remain absent until KL?

In the absence of the prophecy/AA/Lightbringer, I could see this making sense as maybe the writers have just abandoned that entire part of the story and they close Mel's arc with Arya later in the season.

She won't see it happen but once it does she goes to KL to see AA? That is my guess if she doesnt show herself til KL.
Stive
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Man....I just went back and watched the season 8 preview: the terror on Arya's face as she's running from whatever is chasing her.... They also show a scene of her using the stick which looked cool.

And Pod is a goner. They show him on the battlefield beside Brienne, and I'm betting he gives his life for her in some way.


Regarding the Direwolves, I don't think Ghost makes it out of the fight. I'm guessing he goes down like Summer did defending his master, buying Jon some time, etc.



Furlock Bones
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Stive said:

Man....I just went back and watched the season 8 preview: the terror on Arya's face as she's running from whatever is chasing her.... They also show a scene of her using the stick which looked cool.

And Pod is a goner. They show him on the battlefield beside Brienne, and I'm betting he gives his life for her in some way.


Regarding the Direwolves, I don't think Ghost makes it out of the fight. I'm guessing he goes down like Summer did defending his master, buying Jon some time, etc.




think a lot of people believe the same given that the show has made the direwolves mostly irrelevant for whatever reason.
boy09
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Urban Ag said:

But what's your thought process on Mel not showing up until KL?
Jon sent her away and told here to ride south, and if she ever returned to Winterfell he would have her hanged. So I really doubt she would show up in Winterfell.
hunter2012
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they're cheap way to draw an emotional reaction in today's age with all the millenial, "muh furr-babies". Seriously they'll kill a few characters but then kill one of the direwolves and everyone goes apesh*t. By dying they also don't affect the plot.
bonfarr
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Mel has to go to Winterfell if the Azor Ahai prophecy is going to happen. Azor Ahai is supposed to be reborn (Snow) and he will plunge his sword into Mel's heart which will set the sword aflame and it will be used to slay the Night King.
mazag08
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I'm sorry, what is this Azor Ahai that I keep seeing mentioned?
Joseph Parrish
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mazag08 said:

I'm sorry, what is this Azor Ahai that I keep seeing mentioned?
Book stuff.
agsquirrel97
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Joseph Parrish said:

mazag08 said:

I'm sorry, what is this Azor Ahai that I keep seeing mentioned?
Book stuff.
in the show they refer to it as "The Prince that was Promised" (or Princess).
Urban Ag
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boy09 said:

Urban Ag said:

But what's your thought process on Mel not showing up until KL?
Jon sent her away and told here to ride south, and if she ever returned to Winterfell he would have her hanged. So I really doubt she would show up in Winterfell.
sure but we have an entire cast at Winterfell right now that killed each other's family and friends and somehow they seem to be making it work. Plus Mel knows her days are numbered. I don't think she's staying away because she fears the noose.
bonfarr
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Mel thought Stannis was Azor Ahai but admitted she misread her visions and she has said a flame is burning inside her and she has also said she knows how she will die. She is going to show up in Winterfell and sacrifice herself.
Orlando Ayala Cant Read
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bonfarr said:

SIAP but my theory on the battle against the Night King is that the Starks buried in the crypts below Winterfell are going to reanimate and battle the wights and the white walkers.

The books spend alot of time discussing the crypts and it is of huge importance to Martin. The dead are buried with an iron sword over their chests and it has been discussed that white walkers hate iron. In Season 2 they made a huge deal about Ned Stark's remains being returned so he could be buried in the crypts.

It has been set up with Tyrion and Sam hiding out in the crypts during the battle, the two of them are going to find out the secret of bringing the dead back to fight in one of the books Sam stole from the Citadel.

I see this playing out like the dead army that fought for the good guys in Lord of the Rings trilogy. Dead Ned is going to rise up and lead 30 generations of Starks in an epic battle.



this sounds great and plausible for this show but there just doesn't seem to be enough time left in the show to do all this?
Urban Ag
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Well, regardless of what happens to Mel I just want to see her and her amazing cans again. Just one more time please.
Marcus Aurelius
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Urban Ag said:

Well, regardless of what happens to Mel I just want to see her and her amazing cans again. Just one more time please.
This. One more lurid scene please. Eye candy.
Southlake
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I have to eat some crow here ( no relation) : I thought for sure this episode would have a few major reveals or character deaths to blow us away, however, it was much a homage to these characters we've been so close to for a long time.

I've never been so happy to be wrong and can't remember enjoying an episode so much when I was!

Bravo.

Now, let's light this fire!
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