Game of Thrones - Season 7

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SpreadsheetAg
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hunter2012 said:

SpreadsheetAg said:

bonfarr said:

Ervin Burrell said:

Two other observations:

1. Anyone find it weird the maesters won't perform that procedure on people they know will die anyway?

2. Grey Worm was quite intuitive on what to do for being a genital-less first timer.


Dangerous for the surgeon not the patient. The maester said the one who pioneered the procedure died of grayscale.
See I took it to mean, 1) yes he caught grayscale ; 2) if he had the solution, why couldn't he cure himself (or find someone to help him - which I guess is the big risk)


can i just point out the awesome transition from Jorah's surgery to the stew.

Also Sam's determination face was hilarious...
Yes, loved both... and the interaction with Archmaester "Slughorn" Ebrose is great as well.
FightinTexasAg15
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I think they meant niece, as in myrcella
M.C. Swag
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Another solid episode. The plot is really moving along now and I can tell the show creators are eager to move on from the Iron Throne dilemma and go to the crux of the story... living vs dead.

Start with the sea battle first:
I thought the battle was a bit rushed and I didn't quite understand where the fireballs were coming from. But once Euron crashed (literally) on the deck of Yara's ship, things turned up a notch. Just great action.

I thought it was really cool that Euron killed each of the Sand Snakes with their own weapons. It was 'poetic' to see 1 sand snake hanging from the whip of the other while the spear was the anchor for both of their corpses.

I wonder how devastating of a blow that was to Dany/Tyrion's assault plans? Yara's fleet was crucial to escorting Dorne's army. Does Olenna have enough firepower to siege King's Landing by herself? Or will Dany be forced to use Dothraki/Unsullied?

Jon/Sansa:
Still not overly hyped about the way Sansa is being portrayed. She continues to openly defy her brother. And I wasn't comfortable with their exchange.

Sansa: "You can't go to Dragonstone, it's a trap!"
Jon: "You'll be in charge while I'm gone."
Sansa: "Ok, have a good trip!"

LF obviously sees an opportunity here. I'm assuming his angle is to plant seeds of doubt in Sansa and feed into her discord with Jon? We'll see if Sansa is more than just a whiny pawn. I was hoping she had evolved past that.

Also, as an older brother to my own sister, I would be quick to choke any guy who had the hots for my mom and then proclaimed the same love for my sister. Especially when that person is twice my sister's age and intruded in my ancestral crypt and chose that time to tell me of their lustful ambitions.

Arya:
**** YEA! GO HOME GIRL!

I'm so hyped to see a Stark family reunion, I don't care how implausible it was to see that Arya didn't know who the ruler of Winterfell was. Although, I did groan in exasperation when Jon announced he was leaving for Dragonstone...undoubtedly stalling a Jon and Arya get together.

Nymeria was a good call back. Not sure if that was the show officially saying goodbye to the Direwolf or setting up a more impactful plot point in the future. You know, as like a reminder to the audience "yea, this mofo is still out here and it is huge. Just keep that in mind."

Btw, anyone else notice her hairstyle? She wears it exactly like Ned used to. Arya is definitely finding her roots.

Sam/Jorah:
I know some people dislike Sam, Jorah, and the story in Oldtown...but I'm not one of them. I love Samwell Tarly and he continues to show there are many forms of bravery and honor. Violating the rules of his 'school' in order to save the son of his former commander is awesome. In a show full of 'grey' characters, Sam is clearly one of the few pure good guys.

Also, the greyscale surgery scene cutting (literally) into a soldier eating a cheese pie was brilliant and disgusting. I still hate the Arch Maester. He's condescending and arrogant. Hope Sam schools him somehow before his time in Oldtown is up.

Going forward, I'm pumped to see Jon meet Dany and reunite with Tyrion. I wonder how the "bend the knee" expectation plays out. I know it was meant to hint at a power play or feud, but I've discussed this in the past. I don't believe Jon would have a problem with submitting to another ruler, providing they are just and committed to protecting the realm (which appears to be Dany's MO). So in my mind, Jon would acquiesce to Dany and work with her. But I do wonder if the show will show any hints of romanticism between them? I know they're technically related (Aunt/Nephew) but we've seen stranger relationships. On paper, they are a perfect match.
Ogre09
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dromo07 said:

Quote:

He obviously hated them since they murdered his sister and he had proven himself at being a great strategist so getting completely blindsided and your whole navy destroyed in one night doesn't seem to fit him.
Whose sister did they murder?


Niece, not sister.
AgMarauder04
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dromo07 said:

Quote:

He obviously hated them since they murdered his sister and he had proven himself at being a great strategist so getting completely blindsided and your whole navy destroyed in one night doesn't seem to fit him.
Whose sister did they murder?
They murdered Mycella, Tyrion's niece.
FightinTexasAg15
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M.C. Swag said:

Start with the sea battle first:
I thought the battle was a bit rushed and I didn't quite understand where the fireballs were coming from.
If I remember right, in the books Euron has some Mages/pyromancers in his army that he picked up. Which could explain the fireballs
wangus12
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Quote:

I wonder how the "bend the knee" expectation plays out. I know it was meant to hint at a power play or feud, but I've discussed this in the past. I don't believe Jon would have a problem with submitting to another ruler, providing they are just and committed to protecting the realm (which appears to be Dany's MO).
I don't think Jon is going to bend the knee. He is still King in the North and has to keep the northern houses together. I don't think he is gonna throw that away immediately by being the 2nd KITN to bend the knee to a Targ
Dro07
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Gotcha for some reason i thought I missed a plot point of a sister getting killed.

bangobango
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M.C. Swag said:

Another solid episode. The plot is really moving along now and I can tell the show creators are eager to move on from the Iron Throne dilemma and go to the crux of the story... living vs dead.

Start with the sea battle first:
I thought the battle was a bit rushed and I didn't quite understand where the fireballs were coming from. But once Euron crashed (literally) on the deck of Yara's ship, things turned up a notch. Just great action.

I thought it was really cool that Euron killed each of the Sand Snakes with their own weapons. It was 'poetic' to see 1 sand snake hanging from the whip of the other while the spear was the anchor for both of their corpses.

I wonder how devastating of a blow that was to Dany/Tyrion's assault plans? Yara's fleet was crucial to escorting Dorne's army. Does Olenna have enough firepower to siege King's Landing by herself? Or will Dany be forced to use Dothraki/Unsullied?

Jon/Sansa:
Still not overly hyped about the way Sansa is being portrayed. She continues to openly defy her brother. And I wasn't comfortable with their exchange.

Sansa: "You can't go to Dragonstone, it's a trap!"
Jon: "You'll be in charge while I'm gone."
Sansa: "Ok, have a good trip!"

LF obviously sees an opportunity here. I'm assuming his angle is to plant seeds of doubt in Sansa and feed into her discord with Jon? We'll see if Sansa is more than just a whiny pawn. I was hoping she had evolved past that.

Also, as an older brother to my own sister, I would be quick to choke any guy who had the hots for my mom and then proclaimed the same love for my sister. Especially when that person is twice my sister's age and intruded in my ancestral crypt and chose that time to tell me of their lustful ambitions.

Arya:
**** YEA! GO HOME GIRL!

I'm so hyped to see a Stark family reunion, I don't care how implausible it was to see that Arya didn't know who the ruler of Winterfell was. Although, I did groan in exasperation when Jon announced he was leaving for Dragonstone...undoubtedly stalling a Jon and Arya get together.

Nymeria was a good call back. Not sure if that was the show officially saying goodbye to the Direwolf or setting up a more impactful plot point in the future. You know, as like a reminder to the audience "yea, this mofo is still out here and it is huge. Just keep that in mind."

Btw, anyone else notice her hairstyle? She wears it exactly like Ned used to. Arya is definitely finding her roots.

Sam/Jorah:
I know some people dislike Sam, Jorah, and the story in Oldtown...but I'm not one of them. I love Samwell Tarly and he continues to show there are many forms of bravery and honor. Violating the rules of his 'school' in order to save the son of his former commander is awesome. In a show full of 'grey' characters, Sam is clearly one of the few pure good guys.

Also, the greyscale surgery scene cutting (literally) into a soldier eating a cheese pie was brilliant and disgusting. I still hate the Arch Maester. He's condescending and arrogant. Hope Sam schools him somehow before his time in Oldtown is up.

Going forward, I'm pumped to see Jon meet Dany and reunite with Tyrion. I wonder how the "bend the knee" expectation plays out. I know it was meant to hint at a power play or feud, but I've discussed this in the past. I don't believe Jon would have a problem with submitting to another ruler, providing they are just and committed to protecting the realm (which appears to be Dany's MO). So in my mind, Jon would acquiesce to Dany and work with her. But I do wonder if the show will show any hints of romanticism between them? I know they're technically related (Aunt/Nephew) but we've seen stranger relationships. On paper, they are a perfect match.


I think (hope) what they are doing with Sansa and Jon is showing Jon making many of the same mistakes Ned made that led to his death (choking Littlefinger, for example), but the difference will be Sansa will bail Jon out in the end and be his ace in the hole, so to speak. She will out double cross the ultimate double crosser, and when the reveal happens, she will have her speech about wolfs and winter and staying in a pack.

Arya may have a crucial role to play in that, as well. I am hoping for a pretty cool reveal down the road where you think Sansa has screwed Jon, but then it turns out she has completely outmaneuvered Littlefinger somehow.

I think they already started setting up a romance between Dany and Jon with her "He sounds like a great man" comment.
SpreadsheetAg
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M.C. Swag said:

Going forward, I'm pumped to see Jon meet Dany and reunite with Tyrion. I wonder how the "bend the knee" expectation plays out. I know it was meant to hint at a power play or feud, but I've discussed this in the past. I don't believe Jon would have a problem with submitting to another ruler, providing they are just and committed to protecting the realm (which appears to be Dany's MO). So in my mind, Jon would acquiesce to Dany and work with her. But I do wonder if the show will show any hints of romanticism between them? I know they're technically related (Aunt/Nephew) but we've seen stranger relationships. On paper, they are a perfect match.
Jon won't bend the knee (not right out of the gate) - until he gets her commitment to help him fight the WW's and beat back the Army of the dead. I bet she refuses to help until she can secure her dominion over the 7 kingdoms. So an impasse.

They are boinking by curtain close on episode 7.
M.C. Swag
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Agree to disagree. If things don't play out romantically like they could (which would solve that problem entirely as Jon would remain King of not only the North but all of Westeros), submitting to Dany changes nothing for the Northern folk. Jon would remain the 'warden' and all would be as it was. Additionally, they don't really have much choice. They need Dany's dragons and the dragonglass. Jon's ultimate ambition isn't to rule...it's to protect. Dany offers that protection. I can't see any reason to refuse patronage to a good ruler who offers certain protection.
irish pete ag06
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dromo07 said:

Quote:

He obviously hated them since they murdered his sister and he had proven himself at being a great strategist so getting completely blindsided and your whole navy destroyed in one night doesn't seem to fit him.
Whose sister did they murder?


Edit... was covered multiple times above
Ogre09
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Solid review

I kept thinking Aria's hair looked strange, but the Ned comparison makes aense.
Quad Dog
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How about Jon does bend the knee, but not in submission. He bends it in proposal.
hunter2012
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Ol Jock 99 said:

One thing that has bugged me about the Unsullied from the very beginning... You don't cut off the balls, and thus the source of testosterone, want if you want to create an army of excellent soldiers. An army of male sopranos, or an army of guys like Varys, ok sure, but not soldiers.

DIDN'T YOU THINK OF THAT MARTIN?!?!?!?


what if they took the twig and left the berries.
G Martin 87
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FightinTexasAg15 said:

M.C. Swag said:

Start with the sea battle first:
I thought the battle was a bit rushed and I didn't quite understand where the fireballs were coming from.
If I remember right, in the books Euron has some Mages/pyromancers in his army that he picked up. Which could explain the fireballs
Or the Iron Fleet has some ships equipped with trebuchets, like the slaver ships used.
Belton Ag
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Quote:

Arya:
**** YEA! GO HOME GIRL!

I'm so hyped to see a Stark family reunion, I don't care how implausible it was to see that Arya didn't know who the ruler of Winterfell was. Although, I did groan in exasperation when Jon announced he was leaving for Dragonstone...undoubtedly stalling a Jon and Arya get together.

Nymeria was a good call back. Not sure if that was the show officially saying goodbye to the Direwolf or setting up a more impactful plot point in the future. You know, as like a reminder to the audience "yea, this mofo is still out here and it is huge. Just keep that in mind."

Btw, anyone else notice her hairstyle? She wears it exactly like Ned used to. Arya is definitely finding her roots.
I'm not so sure Arya goes home now. I think it's possible the meeting with Nymeria, Nymeria rejecting her invitation to go home and her saying "That's not you" is symbolic of Arya's identity struggle. "That's not you" could be a reference to herself; she is like the wolf and does not want to go home, she will go be like the wolf and do her own thing.

I wouldn't be surprised to see her heading south again in the next episode. The bad thing is that if she doesn't go to Winterfell, she may not be able to tell Sansa of Littlefinger's role in their father's death (if she knows, I can't remember), and Littlefinger gets to carry on.
PascalsWager
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I still don't understand the needless complication of the "Warden" titles. WHY? What purpose does it possibly serve. There are 9 administrative regions and only 4 directions. So why have wardens of the directions. Just use Lord Paramount. It makes things so confusing for no reason.
mhayden
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I just can't enjoy any of Euron's scenes... Seems like his character is completely out of place in this show. Almost all the significant characters were fleshed out from day one, with careful significant given towards how moves they made early on would impact them later.

Then Euron waltzes across a bridge late last season, kills his dad and suddenly he's a force.

He seemingly exists in the show as a way to drag things out or as a deus ex machina.
G Martin 87
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PascalsWager said:

I still don't understand the needless complication of the "Warden" titles. WHY? What purpose does it possibly serve. There are 9 administrative regions and only 4 directions. So why have wardens of the directions. Just use Lord Paramount. It makes things so confusing for no reason.
It's an additional title, awarded to the most prominent house in that direction as additional compensation. See "The Dictator's Handbook" for info on how this sort of thing works.
wangus12
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SpreadsheetAg said:

M.C. Swag said:

Going forward, I'm pumped to see Jon meet Dany and reunite with Tyrion. I wonder how the "bend the knee" expectation plays out. I know it was meant to hint at a power play or feud, but I've discussed this in the past. I don't believe Jon would have a problem with submitting to another ruler, providing they are just and committed to protecting the realm (which appears to be Dany's MO). So in my mind, Jon would acquiesce to Dany and work with her. But I do wonder if the show will show any hints of romanticism between them? I know they're technically related (Aunt/Nephew) but we've seen stranger relationships. On paper, they are a perfect match.
Jon won't bend the knee (not right out of the gate) - until he gets her commitment to help him fight the WW's and beat back the Army of the dead. I bet she refuses to help until she can secure her dominion over the 7 kingdoms. So an impasse.

They are boinking by curtain close on episode 7.
I agree with this. He isn't going to bend the knee straight away. He probably won't trust her and she will be just as skeptical of WW and such.

Like MC said, Jon is definitely out to protect the North and by the end of the season when things probably become desperate, he'll do anything including bending the knee.

I'd rather he didn't because Dany has really become rather arrogant/annoying in my book in how much she deserves to rule. My boy Varys has been keeping the realm together for years.
CapCityAg89
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Yea, I'm trying to figure out where the show is going with Dorne. They are one of the seven and supposedly have a great army untouched by the war of the five kings. Now they have no ruling family and not even the supposed ruling illegitimate daughters. If most of that army was still in Dorne, why did all the sand snakes go to Dragonstone only to turn back around? Just a bunch of disconnects right now.
TresPuertas
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John and Dany both claim to be concerned with the people and the bigger issues. John even said thAt he didn't ask to be king, but accepted because that's what the people wanted.

There may be a minor power struggle in the beginning, i.e. Bending the knee, but they'll both get over that when they discuss their intentions
PascalsWager
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G Martin 87 said:

PascalsWager said:

I still don't understand the needless complication of the "Warden" titles. WHY? What purpose does it possibly serve. There are 9 administrative regions and only 4 directions. So why have wardens of the directions. Just use Lord Paramount. It makes things so confusing for no reason.
It's an additional title, awarded to the most prominent house in that direction as additional compensation. See "The Dictator's Handbook" for info on how this sort of thing works.
Ok so let's say Randal is given that title Warden of the South. What does that mean in practice? Do the Tyrell's become HIS bannermen afterwards? Does Horn Hill become the new capital of the Reach. Or is it just some extra dollars for 3rd tier house who's still bowing down the Tyrells and Highgarden? What he's offered is key to understanding his motivation to help Jamie in this situation.

My point is that in an already complex world it adds needless complication. Just tell him he'll be the main lord in the Reach.
RDV-1992
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free_mhayden said:

I just can't enjoy any of Euron's scenes... Seems like his character is completely out of place in this show. Almost all the significant characters were fleshed out from day one, with careful significant given towards how moves they made early on would impact them later.

Then Euron waltzes across a bridge late last season, kills his dad and suddenly he's a force.

He seemingly exists in the show as a way to drag things out or as a deus ex machina.

I like him for some reason. He is a chaotic force. I thought that the battle on the water was good. I took his sneaking up on Yara as an example of Yara's complacency + his excellence.

The more I think about it, the more I believe that he is a necessary component to the story. As explained in episode 1, the Lannisters need allies, and thats what the Greyjoys are. In simpler terms they make things more even between the two sides, which will make for more interesting storytelling.

Will be interesting to see next weeks episode, with Jon and Dany meeting for the first time.
mickeyrig06sq3
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FightinTexasAg15 said:

On one hand I feel like Nymeria and her pack will have to come back into play, I don't think they would show her again if it wouldn't be important later.

On the other hand, the other direwolves have all been pretty much pointless, so maybe it was just a fan service that won't be touched on again.

Hopefully in one of the battles the wolfpack will arrive and take out some Lannister/Lannister allies or zombies.
Edited, Belton beat me to it.

I think we'll see her return long enough to show she's ok, deliver a summation of what she's be up to, and then she'll leave after she realizes she can't fit back in. I wonder if Bran will do the same, and she'll leave with him as a bodyguard.
CapCityAg89
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hunter2012 said:

Ol Jock 99 said:

One thing that has bugged me about the Unsullied from the very beginning... You don't cut off the balls, and thus the source of testosterone, want if you want to create an army of excellent soldiers. An army of male sopranos, or an army of guys like Varys, ok sure, but not soldiers.

DIDN'T YOU THINK OF THAT MARTIN?!?!?!?


what if they took the twig and left the berries.


No. The point of the unsullied is they are fearless and perfectly obedient. They don't get angry, or aggressive which is what the testosterone would provide. The perfect soldier in historic terms. The US changed world military strategies with foot soldiers trained to be creative, aggressive and smart as well as simply obedient.
hunter2012
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PascalsWager said:

G Martin 87 said:

PascalsWager said:

I still don't understand the needless complication of the "Warden" titles. WHY? What purpose does it possibly serve. There are 9 administrative regions and only 4 directions. So why have wardens of the directions. Just use Lord Paramount. It makes things so confusing for no reason.
It's an additional title, awarded to the most prominent house in that direction as additional compensation. See "The Dictator's Handbook" for info on how this sort of thing works.
Ok so let's say Randal is given that title Warden of the South. What does that mean in practice? Do the Tyrell's become HIS bannermen afterwards? Does Horn Hill become the new capital of the Reach. Or is it just some extra dollars for 3rd tier house who's still bowing down the Tyrells and Highgarden? What he's offered is key to understanding his motivation to help Jamie in this situation.

My point is that in an already complex world it adds needless complication. Just tell him he'll be the main lord in the Reach.


If its like the North, the Tarly's will be given Highgarden as it's the seat of power for the region.

The Boltons moved into Winterfell after being awarded the Warden of the North.
hunter2012
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Also if all 3 major players meet each other it will be the first time. Tyrion has met both but the reunion will be awesome.
Ol Jock 99
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Quote:

They don't get angry, or aggressive which is what the testosterone would provide.
Testosterone also provides basic strength, which is critical for medieval soldiers. They didn't cut them as adults; they cut them as young boys.
RDV-1992
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CapCityAg89 said:

Yea, I'm trying to figure out where the show is going with Dorne. They are one of the seven and supposedly have a great army untouched by the war of the five kings. Now they have no ruling family and not even the supposed ruling illegitimate daughters. If most of that army was still in Dorne, why did all the sand snakes go to Dragonstone only to turn back around? Just a bunch of disconnects right now.
Its not explained in the show, but in the books Dorne is the weakest of the 7 kingdoms, with the fewest troops. They were eventually brought into the 7 kingdoms by marriage, not war. Aegon couldn't conquer them because they went guerrilla versus facing him in battle with a standing army.
mhayden
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RDV-1992 said:

free_mhayden said:

I just can't enjoy any of Euron's scenes... Seems like his character is completely out of place in this show. Almost all the significant characters were fleshed out from day one, with careful significant given towards how moves they made early on would impact them later.

Then Euron waltzes across a bridge late last season, kills his (brother) and suddenly he's a force.

He seemingly exists in the show as a way to drag things out or as a deus ex machina.

I like him for some reason. He is a chaotic force. I thought that the battle on the water was good. I took his sneaking up on Yara as an example of Yara's complacency + his excellence.

The more I think about it, the more I believe that he is a necessary component to the story. As explained in episode 1, the Lannisters need allies, and thats what the Greyjoys are. In simpler terms they make things more even between the two sides, which will make for more interesting storytelling.

Will be interesting to see next weeks episode, with Jon and Dany meeting for the first time.

I also feel he is necessary - but I think that's not exactly a good thing. Feels like he was tossed in at the eleventh hour because a chaotic force was needed to extend the story.

Just seems like every other major player still in the "game" has been in the show for a really long time. Then this one comes along late last season, throws his brother over a bridge, and you literally had a lot of fans not know who he even was.

I guess i don't mind the chaos, I just wish we would have had some indication over the last 6 seasons that this chaos existed somewhere.
Ol Jock 99
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I don't see Euron making it more than a couple episodes more. Deliver the Dornes to Cersei, sail north, get burned.
FightinTexasAg15
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mickeyrig06sq3 said:

FightinTexasAg15 said:

On one hand I feel like Nymeria and her pack will have to come back into play, I don't think they would show her again if it wouldn't be important later.

On the other hand, the other direwolves have all been pretty much pointless, so maybe it was just a fan service that won't be touched on again.

Hopefully in one of the battles the wolfpack will arrive and take out some Lannister/Lannister allies or zombies.
Edited, Belton beat me to it.

I think we'll see her return long enough to show she's ok, deliver a summation of what she's be up to, and then she'll leave after she realizes she can't fit back in. I wonder if Bran will do the same, and she'll leave with him as a bodyguard.
This could happen, and Sansa could try and persuade her not to go, and we get the line from the trailer about the lone wolf dies but the pack survives
bangobango
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Ol Jock 99 said:

One thing that has bugged me about the Unsullied from the very beginning... You don't cut off the balls, and thus the source of testosterone, want if you want to create an army of excellent soldiers. An army of male sopranos, or an army of guys like Varys, ok sure, but not soldiers.

DIDN'T YOU THINK OF THAT MARTIN?!?!?!?
They address this in the books. What they lack in physical strength they make up for in discipline. The trade-off is considered worth it.
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