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And all Caparzo did was try to help a kid out of a bombed out building.

But my comment was half tongue in cheek so turn your sarcasm meter on.

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No, he was in the process of taking that kid to the next town (in direct defiance of Miller's orders).

That whole part was another problem. So Caparzo was going to take this kid, away from her parents and drop her off at some random nearby town? And the parents were just going to remain in a bombed out house in the rain? Why wouldn't the parents just take their own kid to that town? What parent would trust their kid with a random set of soldiers hoping to ever see their daughter again? That whole story line was idiotic.

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I can't think of the term for a Spielberg movie like that, but the weird thing is how people almost replace real history with this sort of thing or consider it representative. And Tom Hanks is now a spokesman for a war and generation that were never in danger of being forgotten - by being in a Saturday popcorn fodder matinee.

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Is there a name for that? I feel like I could call it a fictumentary or something.

But is it new? Vietnam isn't really Vietnam anymore, it's Platoon, with a touch of Forrest Gump. They were making movies about WW2, during WW2. John Wayne never served a day in his life, but easily comes to mind as an Army, Navy and Marine officer.

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No I'm not talking about historical fiction at all. Spielberg movies are like a comic book or novel from the fifties. This movie has much in common with those as well as Guns of Navarone or the Dirty Dozen.

I mixed two ideas in the same post by accident.

So, if I'm understanding you correctly, your whole problem with the movie is saving Private Ryan. Storming the beach was fine, but once Miller got the order to go get Ryan, the whole thing went to ****.

More directed at OP, but you too VZ.

Pulp?

And I didn't mean to compare Platoon to SPR as a film, just that the fiction replaces reality.

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So, if I'm understanding you correctly, your whole problem with the movie is saving Private Ryan. Storming the beach was fine, but once Miller got the order to go get Ryan, the whole thing went to ****.

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I wouldn't say that, but after DDay it was another episode of Rat Patrol.

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Pulp?

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There you go. Probably the colloquial i was looking for

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One of the group (Miller).

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Is he not the one that slow-knifes Mellish? Doesn't he walk right by Upham afterwards? (I may be mistaken)

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All Germans look alike, huh?



The guy that got Mellish and walked by Upham was thicker, more built than the guy they let go and eventually took out Miller.

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So, if I'm understanding you correctly, your whole problem with the movie is saving Private Ryan. Storming the beach was fine, but once Miller got the order to go get Ryan, the whole thing went to ****.

More directed at OP, but you too VZ.

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I like the battle scenes because they are well done and immerse, but pretty much everything else is sub-par.

Just to be clear, other than the battles scenes, you thought SPR was a below-average movie?

Sounds about right. But the battle scenes are damn good.

Man I was reading up on Sobel (David Schwimmer from Band of Brothers). His life was depressing. He apparently was a good father (according to his kids), but they turned liberal and separated themselves from him during the Vietnam war. He attempted suicide, but lived even though the bullet severed both optic nerves causing permanent blindness. He spent the rest of his life (17 years) in a VA assisted living hospital. His wife divorced him and he died of malnutrition (way to go VA). He didn't even have a funeral service. That is screwed up.

I've always put this movie in the same category as Full Metal Jacket. There was a legitimate attempt to accurately depict the D-Day landings in a way that had never been done before (similar to FMJ's portrayal of Marine Corps basic). After that, it's just another war movie.

I agree, the scene where the Jewish soldier is taunting the German prisoners just seemed forced. As much as the beach landing sucks me into the moment this scene takes me out of it.

Ted Dansen & Dennis Farina were way too old to be cast in their roles.

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Man I was reading up on Sobel (David Schwimmer from Band of Brothers). His life was depressing. He apparently was a good father (according to his kids), but they turned liberal and separated themselves from him during the Vietnam war. He attempted suicide, but lived even though the bullet severed both optic nerves causing permanent blindness. He spent the rest of his life (17 years) in a VA assisted living hospital. His wife divorced him and he died of malnutrition (way to go VA). He didn't even have a funeral service. That is screwed up.

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Damn!

Yall do realize it's a movie right?

If they made a documentary they could have just put it on the History Channel (well not anymore, needs more aliens), or maybe the AHC channel.

Got to add a little drama to get the non historical buffs interested.

The whole idea of the Ryan mission is unrealistic, not just the insubordination or the evil Nazis. It's the same reason they put unnecessary love stories in a lot of movies. Got to bring in multiple demographics.

I think If you could somehow combine the first half of Full Metal Jacket and the first half of Saving Private Ryan, you would have the perfect movie.

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Yall do realize it's a movie right?

If they made a documentary they could have just put it on the History Channel (well not anymore, needs more aliens), or maybe the AHC channel.

Got to add a little drama to get the non historical buffs interested.

The whole idea of the Ryan mission is unrealistic, not just the insubordination or the evil Nazis. It's the same reason they put unnecessary love stories in a lot of movies. Got to bring in multiple demographics.

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Nope. I disagree. That is Hollywood's perception of what they need to do. The same Hollywood that would have ruined Star Wars. Great, dramatic historical stories and good historical fiction can stand on their own.

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Yall do realize it's a movie right?

If they made a documentary they could have just put it on the History Channel (well not anymore, needs more aliens), or maybe the AHC channel.

Got to add a little drama to get the non historical buffs interested.

The whole idea of the Ryan mission is unrealistic, not just the insubordination or the evil Nazis. It's the same reason they put unnecessary love stories in a lot of movies. Got to bring in multiple demographics.

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There was PLENTY of drama in the thick of WWII to keep non-historical buffs interested. Band of Brothers filled up 10 episodes worth. Surely Spielberg could find 1.5 hours worth?

I think Black Hawk Down is the greatest war movie ever made. There's no Hollywood plot or some attempt at character building. I wish Saving Private Ryan would have gone that route.

At the risk of asking a clichd question, have you read the book? It's fantastic and the afterword with interviews on both sides of the Somalian conflict is very, very interesting.

Black Hawk Down is a great book.

I have not read the book.

I can't believe I'm reading a thread packed with complaints about Saving Private Ryan.

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I can't believe I'm reading a thread packed with complaints about Saving Private Ryan.

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You have to let time pass to get a more objective assessment I think. It's strong points have always been known. Now everybody is able to look back reflect.

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I can't believe I'm reading a thread packed with complaints about Saving Private Ryan.

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So you think the movie is perfect?

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Also, SPR takes place days after Normandy, WAY before they found the concentration camps and a lot of the soldiers really knew about "The Final Solution".

I know that back in 1942 there was intel about it, but it wasn't propagated to the masses like it would be later (or would be in today's news cycle). Though, it was common knowledge by 1944 that Jews were being persecuted in Germany, and had been for about a decade. Maybe that's what Mellish was referring to with his "Juden" but it definitely SEEMED to be much more emotional to him, inferring something more sinister than just "persecution".


It's still one of the only movies (along with Band of Brothers) that I will watch whenever I see it on TV.

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I dont even care if the character knows of the political persecution of Jews in Germany, or the Final Solution. Just the fact that we have a WWII movie where the audience is bludgeoned over the head with Nazis/Jews.

It served zero purpose to the plot of SPR, one could argue it played into character development, but do we really care that we saw a nazi jam a knife into a jew on screen, or is the offense that we saw a nazi jam a knife into a soldier? Both could have been prevented, but the fact that he is Jewish changes nothing, if it were any other soldier in the company, we would still be pissed about that death.

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I think If you could somehow combine the first half of Full Metal Jacket and the first half of Saving Private Ryan, you would have the perfect movie.

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I'd think you'd have complaints about the time travel being confusing

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I think If you could somehow combine the first half of Full Metal Jacket and the first half of Saving Private Ryan, you would have the perfect movie.

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I'd think you'd have complaints about the time travel being confusing

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True, but what I meant is the first half of both movies are incredible. And if a movie combined those, it would be a perfect movie

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I think If you could somehow combine the first half of Full Metal Jacket and the first half of Saving Private Ryan, you would have the perfect movie.

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I'd think you'd have complaints about the time travel being confusing

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True, but what I meant is the first half of both movies are incredible. And if a movie combined those, it would be a perfect movie

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I was just making a joke. Agree with what you are saying completely although I do love both movies.

I figured as much.

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I can't believe I'm reading a thread packed with complaints about Saving Private Ryan.

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So you think the movie is perfect?

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Not sure how you got that from what I said.

I just thought it was an almost universally acclaimed film. Some of the complaints on this thread are pretty nit-picky.

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I always hated the scene with the Jewish soldier waving his david necklace at Germans yelling "yud'en" in their face.

There are what 2% jews in the us, probably less in the 1940s, and you magically got one in this company. It just seems like forced pornography (the non sexual definition of pornography).

It's like Spielberg is having to say "these guys just aren't enemies, they are evil nazis! holocaust! auschwitz! Wannsee conference! Look at em in chains!" If the film didn't have that scene in it, it would be less campy.

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Also, SPR takes place days after Normandy, WAY before they found the concentration camps and a lot of the soldiers really knew about "The Final Solution".

I know that back in 1942 there was intel about it, but it wasn't propagated to the masses like it would be later (or would be in today's news cycle). Though, it was common knowledge by 1944 that Jews were being persecuted in Germany, and had been for about a decade. Maybe that's what Mellish was referring to with his "Juden" but it definitely SEEMED to be much more emotional to him, inferring something more sinister than just "persecution".


It's still one of the only movies (along with Band of Brothers) that I will watch whenever I see it on TV.

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Just to point out, the fact that the Germans hated Jews was very well known and had been publicized for quite awhile.

The Knight of the Long Knives occurred in 1934. The Kristallnacht occurred in 1938. There was also a mass diaspora of Jews from Germany throughout the entirety of the 1930's. Germany also made the announcement in 1943 that it was "Judenrein/Judenfrei" or, free and clean of all Jews within its borders.

I don't think its a stretch for an American-Jew to wave his David necklace in the face of a bunch of German soldiers in 1944.

Melish's death implodes the whole movie for me. That and the overwrought irony of the guy Miller lets free killing him.

The main characters all dying to "Save Private Ryan" is a fine way to end the movie, but making me furious instead of touched/moved isn't.

Unpopular opinion I guess.

It's acclaimed because of the D-day scene as well as the other battles (and for good reason). I don't remember anybody acclaiming the interaction between the soldiers as anything special or even realistic.