fig96 said:

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redline248 said:

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I used "girl power" to stay consistent in the post, but yes, Rogue One is not quite the same as in TLJ, or 20 secs of End Game for example.

But the idea was to have the hero be a woman that doesn't go along with society's plan, so to speak. The makers of that movie pulled it off successfully, because - in my opinion - it wasn't the ultimate goal of the movie.

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I think we hit on the key point here.

They had some similar themes. One was a well made, well written movie. The other wasn't. Those were choices the creators made, not some outside agenda.

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So DEI focused "creators" are just less talented and less able to tell an interesting story? Interesting theory.

Flashdiaz said:

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I think the 'gnashing of the teeth' is we want a good story first. We've been burned by Disney's failure to tell a coherent and thought out story. So when interviewed and the first thing she says is it's going to be centered around a woman, I get that same feeling of here we go again with a messy story because it wasn't the primary focus.
I sincerely hope it was just poor emphasis on her part and that the driver is the story and not the gender of who will play the hero.

In contrast, Patty Jenkins Rogue Squadron announcement was spot on. Talked about the story and the direction it was going to take. She didn't start off by saying 'we're going to have female x-wing pilots'. At the time, it was a very exciting pitch (that is until WW84 came out).

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That's the only part of a single interview that people are reporting on because it's ragebait, and it's been working as has been displayed in this thread.

Contrast it to the instagram post, which they discuss in the same interview, where she actually announced it months ago:

https://www.instagram.com/sharmeenobaidchinoy/reel/CqvScWQIadh/?hl=en

Quote:

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It has been quite a day in London....The news is OUT! I am so very excited to be directing the next Star Wars movie and bringing @daisyridley back to the galaxy...

I have always been attracted to the heroes journey and the world definitely needs more heroes! - the blueprints of the heroes we see on screen are rooted in reality - I've spent my life meeting real life heroes, who have overcome the most oppressive empires and battled impossible odds and that to me is the heart of Star Wars...which is why I was attracted to the promise of a new Jedi Order …And why I'm particularly excited about being immersed inside a Jedi Academy with a powerful Jedi Master... #starwars

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fig96 said:

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jokershady said:

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Murder Hornet said:

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ChipFTAC01 said:

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Mary Sue?

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a female character that can do no wrong, has nothing to learn, is overpowered from the start.

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honestly the best example of this was the remake of Mulan….way worse than anything with Rey in Star Wars and that's saying something…..

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The live action remakes in general are just bad cash grabs, let's remake this thing in real life so we can remove all of the animated charm.

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not to derail and you are correct…

But the Milan remake just stung so much more because it looked like the first remake that was going to do something interesting and different….like crouching tiger meets Mulan which would've been awesome…..

Instead we get Mulan who's a perfect martial arts prodigy as a child getting trained by her father to enhance her "chi" and she's perfect from the start COMPLETELY DESTROYING what made the original Mulan characters journey so meaningful and interesting…

And truthfully…the original Mulan was a much better "girl power" film because it was done right! She took a massive risk taking her fathers place to protect him even though she was this clumsy person who couldn't fight making her sacrifice so much more meaningful and having a much more interesting journey…..

Dangit Disney I still have hope you can learn from these mistakes cause I am rooting for you I want good films again but…..yeeeesh……it's getting harder and harder to stay optimistic…..

fig96 said:

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captkirk said:

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fig96 said:

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redline248 said:

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I used "girl power" to stay consistent in the post, but yes, Rogue One is not quite the same as in TLJ, or 20 secs of End Game for example.

But the idea was to have the hero be a woman that doesn't go along with society's plan, so to speak. The makers of that movie pulled it off successfully, because - in my opinion - it wasn't the ultimate goal of the movie.

---

I think we hit on the key point here.

They had some similar themes. One was a well made, well written movie. The other wasn't. Those were choices the creators made, not some outside agenda.

---

So DEI focused "creators" are just less talented and less able to tell an interesting story? Interesting theory.

---

Creators who make bad choices tell less interesting stories. For example, someone like Rian Johnson who's very hit or miss and sometimes thinks he's more clever than he is.

You can have great diverse stories (Rogue One, Andor) or bad ones. This is not hard.

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I'm just looking at the string of bad stories since Kennedy took over and am trying to make a connection. Rogue One is the only good property they've put out. Mando season 1 was decent because some fans (Favreau) came to the rescue

captkirk said:

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fig96 said:

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captkirk said:

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fig96 said:

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redline248 said:

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I used "girl power" to stay consistent in the post, but yes, Rogue One is not quite the same as in TLJ, or 20 secs of End Game for example.

But the idea was to have the hero be a woman that doesn't go along with society's plan, so to speak. The makers of that movie pulled it off successfully, because - in my opinion - it wasn't the ultimate goal of the movie.

---

I think we hit on the key point here.

They had some similar themes. One was a well made, well written movie. The other wasn't. Those were choices the creators made, not some outside agenda.

---

So DEI focused "creators" are just less talented and less able to tell an interesting story? Interesting theory.

---

Creators who make bad choices tell less interesting stories. For example, someone like Rian Johnson who's very hit or miss and sometimes thinks he's more clever than he is.

You can have great diverse stories (Rogue One, Andor) or bad ones. This is not hard.

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I'm just looking at the string of bad stories since Kennedy took over and am trying to make a connection. Rogue One is the only good property they've put out

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Yeah, Andor, Bad Batch, Mandalorian, Ahsoka, Solo, all terrible.

(I know opinions are split on Solo but if you hated it it wasn't because it was too girl power-y.)

bluefire579 said:

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Flashdiaz said:

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I think the 'gnashing of the teeth' is we want a good story first. We've been burned by Disney's failure to tell a coherent and thought out story. So when interviewed and the first thing she says is it's going to be centered around a woman, I get that same feeling of here we go again with a messy story because it wasn't the primary focus.
I sincerely hope it was just poor emphasis on her part and that the driver is the story and not the gender of who will play the hero.

In contrast, Patty Jenkins Rogue Squadron announcement was spot on. Talked about the story and the direction it was going to take. She didn't start off by saying 'we're going to have female x-wing pilots'. At the time, it was a very exciting pitch (that is until WW84 came out).

---

That's the only part of a single interview that people are reporting on because it's ragebait, and it's been working as has been displayed in this thread.

Contrast it to the instagram post, which they discuss in the same interview, where she actually announced it months ago:

https://www.instagram.com/sharmeenobaidchinoy/reel/CqvScWQIadh/?hl=en

Quote:

---

It has been quite a day in London....The news is OUT! I am so very excited to be directing the next Star Wars movie and bringing @daisyridley back to the galaxy...

I have always been attracted to the heroes journey and the world definitely needs more heroes! - the blueprints of the heroes we see on screen are rooted in reality - I've spent my life meeting real life heroes, who have overcome the most oppressive empires and battled impossible odds and that to me is the heart of Star Wars...which is why I was attracted to the promise of a new Jedi Order …And why I'm particularly excited about being immersed inside a Jedi Academy with a powerful Jedi Master... #starwars

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yes! more of this please!

fig96 said:

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I know you're not here to actually contribute to the discussion, but this was just posted as part of this conversation a page or two back.

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Sorry judgy mcjudgerson, didn't go that far back.

fig96 said:

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captkirk said:

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fig96 said:

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redline248 said:

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I used "girl power" to stay consistent in the post, but yes, Rogue One is not quite the same as in TLJ, or 20 secs of End Game for example.

But the idea was to have the hero be a woman that doesn't go along with society's plan, so to speak. The makers of that movie pulled it off successfully, because - in my opinion - it wasn't the ultimate goal of the movie.

---

I think we hit on the key point here.

They had some similar themes. One was a well made, well written movie. The other wasn't. Those were choices the creators made, not some outside agenda.

---

So DEI focused "creators" are just less talented and less able to tell an interesting story? Interesting theory.

---

Creators who make bad choices tell less interesting stories. For example, someone like Rian Johnson who's very hit or miss and sometimes thinks he's more clever than he is.

You can have great diverse stories (Rogue One, Andor) or bad ones. This is not hard.

---

Yes, I think the difference is that those films didn't feel like their women leads were written as a way to pander to attract female viewers.

And TBF, I think Rey was initially not set up that way in TFA. But 8 definitely felt like all sorts of pandering (not with her character specifically). Rey's main issue is that they didn't develop her at all, everything is plot driven with her. Kylo was the only real character-driven figure I can remember in the ST. And honestly I think Marvel is much more of a perpetrator of this than anything on the SW side. And I think you can see their box office numbers crumbling as a result. Although there are absolutely many other factors that are contributing.

I generally think promotion through pandering to specific genders and races absolutely does affect movie results. Look no further than the backlash against captain marvel and then her sequel. You are also right though that ultimately, if it's a good story, people will be more forgiving of it, like Barbie or Wonder Woman. Barbie is kind of a unique case though where they actually address in the movie how it has always been a way to pander to young girls, and why it has fallen out of favor with so many young women as a result.

bluefire579 said:

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https://www.instagram.com/sharmeenobaidchinoy/reel/CqvScWQIadh/?hl=en

Quote:

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It has been quite a day in London....The news is OUT! I am so very excited to be directing the next Star Wars movie and bringing @daisyridley back to the galaxy...

I have always been attracted to the heroes journey and the world definitely needs more heroes! - the blueprints of the heroes we see on screen are rooted in reality - I've spent my life meeting real life heroes, who have overcome the most oppressive empires and battled impossible odds and that to me is the heart of Star Wars...which is why I was attracted to the promise of a new Jedi Order …And why I'm particularly excited about being immersed inside a Jedi Academy with a powerful Jedi Master... #starwars

---

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Ugh, disgusting, classic Kennedy to hire someone who likes Star Wars to direct a Star Wars movie. Pitiful.

The Porkchop Express said:

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bluefire579 said:

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https://www.instagram.com/sharmeenobaidchinoy/reel/CqvScWQIadh/?hl=en

Quote:

---

It has been quite a day in London....The news is OUT! I am so very excited to be directing the next Star Wars movie and bringing @daisyridley back to the galaxy...

I have always been attracted to the heroes journey and the world definitely needs more heroes! - the blueprints of the heroes we see on screen are rooted in reality - I've spent my life meeting real life heroes, who have overcome the most oppressive empires and battled impossible odds and that to me is the heart of Star Wars...which is why I was attracted to the promise of a new Jedi Order …And why I'm particularly excited about being immersed inside a Jedi Academy with a powerful Jedi Master... #starwars

---

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Ugh, disgusting, classic Kennedy to hire someone who likes Star Wars to direct a Star Wars movie. Pitiful.

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She did this with JJ Abrams and we all saw how those turned out.

The Rise of Skywalker is your favorite movie of the last 10 years?

Hagen95 said:

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The Rise of Skywalker is your favorite movie of the last 10 years?

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That is really sad.

Hagen95 said:

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The Rise of Skywalker is your favorite movie of the last 10 years?

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The Force Awakens. Made $936 million domestic. I'm surprised you've never heard of it.

It would save us all a lot of angst if they would simply move on from Rey and start over. She's a tainted character because she's a Mary Sue and I'm not sure how you write your way out of a convoluted mess of an origin story in the ST. But I realize that is not going to happen.

As it stands, you are essentially rebooting the next "phase" with an Omega level meta-human for this universe (to borrow Marvel terminology), in Rey. Since she is leading the Jedi Academy maybe they just sideline her as the all-powerful leader who rarely gets involved in the day to day like Yoda. Probably the best way forward.

Farmer1906 said:

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Or you just move ahead in time and do a reboot. Have a grandma Rey die and build the world however you want.

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Would love to forget ST ever happened. Not in the cards though.

Farmer1906 said:

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Or you just move ahead in time and do a reboot. Have a grandma Rey die and build the world however you want.

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Or take something from the thousands of years of EU material and explore something new in the star wars universe.

powerbelly said:

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Farmer1906 said:

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Or you just move ahead in time and do a reboot. Have a grandma Rey die and build the world however you want.

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Or take something from the thousands of years of EU material and explore something new in the star wars universe.

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WE WANT KOTOR!!!! That is the Star Wars hill I will die on.

Chipotlemonger said:

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powerbelly said:

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Farmer1906 said:

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Or you just move ahead in time and do a reboot. Have a grandma Rey die and build the world however you want.

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Or take something from the thousands of years of EU material and explore something new in the star wars universe.

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WE WANT KOTOR!!!! That is the Star Wars hill I will die on.

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Jeez and I forgot hk47! Put him on film and he is a top 5 all time character

It needs to be a show as opposed to a movie. There is too much backstory to it all to fit in a movie or two. Hell you'd have to have just one movie dedicated to the time spent on Taris.