More like the South just ran out of time LOL

quote:

---

Did the North really "dog stomp" the South?

---

They north cut the south off economically from the rest of the world, either destroyed or controlled all of their major interior transport lines, won the battles that mattered most, and topped the whole thing off, by marching an army through the south's heartland burning crops and cities to prove that Confederate government was incapable of defending its own borders and people. This in turn caused large scale desertion of southern soldiers from their units in order to try to defend their homes, families, and belongings themselves knowing that their government was incapable of doing so in their absence.

Victory really doesn't get much more decisive than that.

They were just inexperienced. They'll be much better next time.

quote:

---

quote:

---

Did the North really "dog stomp" the South?

---

They really only won by a field goal.

---

What?!? Sherman's OPS was over 1.200!

quote:

---

They were just inexperienced. They'll be much better next time.

---

Think how different things could have been if only they'd had Chavis running the defense....

I think the Civil War was the last time a leader named Sherman was victorious.

quote:

---

I think the Civil War was the last time a leader named Sherman was victorious.

---

...but but but he built a foundation. Grandpa sleepy deserves our gratitude.


/zoo

quote:

---

I think the Civil War was the last time a leader named Sherman was victorious.

---

Nobody can remove the flag off my left arm!! Try it and I'll shank your ass.

quote:

---

Should Six Flags over Texas change its name to Five Flags over Texas and forget the Confederacy existed and had a flag?

---

The rebel flag didn't fly over Texas.

quote:

---

France

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

Should Six Flags over Texas change its name to Five Flags over Texas and forget the Confederacy existed and had a flag?

---

The rebel flag didn't fly over Texas.
http://www.guidetosfot.com/parkinfo/history/sixflagsoftexas.png

---

Odd, I certainly bought one years ago at Six Flags.....

quote:

---

quote:

---

Should Six Flags over Texas change its name to Five Flags over Texas and forget the Confederacy existed and had a flag?

---

The rebel flag didn't fly over Texas.
http://www.guidetosfot.com/parkinfo/history/sixflagsoftexas.png

---

The Stars and Bars did.

It seems the situation in Columbia is escalating.



Capitol Confrontation

Coming down. As it should.

Enabling a society of whiners is what I say.

quote:

---

The south without federal aid is not a place anybody would want to live.

---

You talking about modern day south. If you are you're full of it. We have enough oil, food crops and textiles to sustain us without federal crap. Texas is a big state with several warm water ports. And plenty of watersheds. We might be the only state in the Union that could secede and survive. But maybe others could. But we would likely be the best off. All we have to do is run the illegals out and close the border from the Yankees, and we'd be set. Set up trade agreements with the rest of the southern states and Mexico, and there you have it. Yankees dont have anything we need. If we cut of West Texas Intermediate Crude from being shipped up north for heating oil, Those clowns would freeze to death come first good blizzard.

The South jumped out to an early lead and kept the game close for the first half, but the North's deeper bench began to tell in the second half and wound up winning by a healthy margin. Five star recruits Lee and Jackson put up some big yardage, but once Lincoln pulled some underperforming starters in favor of formerly unheralded walkons Grant and Sherman, the Union started piling on the points.

quote:

---

quote:

---

The south without federal aid is not a place anybody would want to live.

---

You talking about modern day south. If you are you're full of it. We have enough oil, food crops and textiles to sustain us without federal crap. Texas is a big state with several warm water ports. And plenty of watersheds. We might be the only state in the Union that could secede and survive. But maybe others could. But we would likely be the best off. All we have to do is run the illegals out and close the border from the Yankees, and we'd be set. Set up trade agreements with the rest of the southern states and Mexico, and there you have it. Yankees dont have anything we need. If we cut of West Texas Intermediate Crude from being shipped up north for heating oil, Those clowns would freeze to death come first good blizzard.

---

The facts disagree with you:

http://taxfoundation.org/blog/which-states-rely-most-federal-aid

But that is a swell e-mail forward you posted.

quote:

---

quote:

---

The US won the revolutionary war and dog stomped the crap out of the traitors in the south. To the victors go the spoils. The south lost, hence, they are (and will forever be) traitors.

---

Wade, I know it isn't the main argument of this entire thread, but I don't understand the logic of being labeled a traitor ONLY if one lost.

---

If the south had won, they would have established their own country. Maybe the next generation or two of U.S. citizens would have considered them traitors but eventually the two countries would have become allies.

Much like the revolutionary war. Brits don't consider Americans traitors now, because the Americans won. If the Americans lost, they would have been traitors, not revolutionaries.

Its semantics, but there is a difference.

quote:

---

The South jumped out to an early lead and kept the game close for the first half, but the North's deeper bench began to tell in the second half and wound up winning by a healthy margin. Five star recruits Lee and Jackson put up some big yardage, but once Lincoln pulled some underperforming starters in favor of formerly unheralded walkons Grant and Sherman, the Union started piling on the points.

---

This is awesome. Well done!

quote:

---

Well that is one of the most bizarre things I have ever read.

So I assume you were one of those people spitting on US troops as they returned home from Vietnam? Since they were "curb stomped" by the North Vietnamese "victors" and they are the people that get to write the only valid version of history. So everything they (North Vietnam) writes about the US and the conduct of our troops in that war is true in your world view?

I would also be very interested in your accounting of the War of 1812. You must have an interesting viewpoint on that conflict as well?

---

Valiant attempt, but you can do better. Those examples are not similar to the US civil war or revolutionary war. Step back and take a second to think about what the differences are, then, let me know what you have figured out.

quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

The south without federal aid is not a place anybody would want to live.

---

You talking about modern day south. If you are you're full of it. We have enough oil, food crops and textiles to sustain us without federal crap. Texas is a big state with several warm water ports. And plenty of watersheds. We might be the only state in the Union that could secede and survive. But maybe others could. But we would likely be the best off. All we have to do is run the illegals out and close the border from the Yankees, and we'd be set. Set up trade agreements with the rest of the southern states and Mexico, and there you have it. Yankees dont have anything we need. If we cut of West Texas Intermediate Crude from being shipped up north for heating oil, Those clowns would freeze to death come first good blizzard.

---

The facts disagree with you:

http://taxfoundation.org/blog/which-states-rely-most-federal-aid

But that is a swell e-mail forward you posted.

---

The percentages in that link are based off of a state's general revenue. Has nothing to do with the state's GDP, which is what the other poster was getting at. Your link is misleading.

Edit to clarify that I'm not disagreeing with your initial assertion that the Deep South is not in great shape economically. The other poster does make a fair point about Texas though. If Texas were its own country, we would have a top-15 ranked economy.

quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

The south without federal aid is not a place anybody would want to live.

---

You talking about modern day south. If you are you're full of it. We have enough oil, food crops and textiles to sustain us without federal crap. Texas is a big state with several warm water ports. And plenty of watersheds. We might be the only state in the Union that could secede and survive. But maybe others could. But we would likely be the best off. All we have to do is run the illegals out and close the border from the Yankees, and we'd be set. Set up trade agreements with the rest of the southern states and Mexico, and there you have it. Yankees dont have anything we need. If we cut of West Texas Intermediate Crude from being shipped up north for heating oil, Those clowns would freeze to death come first good blizzard.

---

The facts disagree with you:

http://taxfoundation.org/blog/which-states-rely-most-federal-aid

But that is a swell e-mail forward you posted.

---

The southern states are in piss poor condition. Not sure why we would want to be affiliated with them

quote:

---

Apparently you're only a traitor if you lose, while in fact traitorous acts led to some of the greatest moments in this countries history.

---

Well, yes. That's kind of how these things go. One mans traitor is another mans patriot.

quote:

---

A key chain that I carry with me everyday reminds me of my cousin, everyday. I also don't have to justify it because I don't have to answer for it to anybody. If you feel the flag means someone is racist, traitor etc. that's fine on you but by characterizing someone that displays that flag you are supporting prejudice against a certain type of people. The only way to fight prejudice is with more prejudice!

---

Like I said before, you are free to do whatever you like. But, if you don't recognize what your symbol actually stands for, that is on you.

It is humorous that you are feeling prejudiced against, especially with what the symbol you carry represents.

quote:

---

The percentages in that link are based off of a state's general revenue. Has nothing to do with the state's GDP, which is what the other poster was getting at. Your link is misleading.

---

So you think many of those southern states would fare well without federal funding...

Bold position to take, sir!

See my edit.

quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

The south without federal aid is not a place anybody would want to live.

---

You talking about modern day south. If you are you're full of it. We have enough oil, food crops and textiles to sustain us without federal crap. Texas is a big state with several warm water ports. And plenty of watersheds. We might be the only state in the Union that could secede and survive. But maybe others could. But we would likely be the best off. All we have to do is run the illegals out and close the border from the Yankees, and we'd be set. Set up trade agreements with the rest of the southern states and Mexico, and there you have it. Yankees dont have anything we need. If we cut of West Texas Intermediate Crude from being shipped up north for heating oil, Those clowns would freeze to death come first good blizzard.

---

The facts disagree with you:

http://taxfoundation.org/blog/which-states-rely-most-federal-aid

But that is a swell e-mail forward you posted.

---

Your link is accurate, but misleading. It only shows the distribution side of the financial relationship between the the Federal Government ad the states. In order to get the full picture you also have to take account of the taxes collected by the Federal government from each state to get a net amount.

Another aspect that can skew results is the nature of what is considered government spending. Many times if you look at methodologies you'll find federal salaries are included as federal spending within a state, including military personnel, which skews results for states like Texas with a number of large military bases, as each of those soldiers' salaries, as well as the general operating expenses of the base, is considered federal spending in Texas. In reality it would be better categorized as defense spending.

I know it's wikipedia, but the first table as you scroll down this page has a nice table, assembled with information directly from the IRS, that puts together a more complete picture of revenue vs. spending for each state. Although it unfortunately does still include military salaries as in state spending.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_taxation_and_spending_by_state

Organize by net dollars to get a good idea of the true giver states vs. welfare queens. The southern states still don't fare all that great, but the midwest has a much more pronounced presence at the top of the welfare stack.

quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

The US won the revolutionary war and dog stomped the crap out of the traitors in the south. To the victors go the spoils. The south lost, hence, they are (and will forever be) traitors.

---

Wade, I know it isn't the main argument of this entire thread, but I don't understand the logic of being labeled a traitor ONLY if one lost.

---

If the south had won, they would have established their own country. Maybe the next generation or two of U.S. citizens would have considered them traitors but eventually the two countries would have become allies.

Much like the revolutionary war. Brits don't consider Americans traitors now, because the Americans won. If the Americans lost, they would have been traitors, not revolutionaries.

Its semantics, but there is a difference.

---

The rest of this conversation is interesting with deep entrenched beliefs. Most of it comes down to opinion really as does the above bolded statement.

I don't know if you lived in England or not, but I have, and my perspective and experience there is not in line with your sentence. The perspective of revolutionaries and traitors has more to do with what side of the pond you are on and not about who won. A lot of Brits still think we are traitors. And they can call us that all they want because we were. Winning doesn't change that. Winning only allows you to NOT face the consequences of being one.

As far as having to limit your freedom (displaying rebel flag) etc. I would not be so quick to use the "masses" opinion on what you should do or not as your moral compass. As stated above, the masses are full of uneducated and stupid people. Not sure they are the best guides.

Wait, so just because all of social media believe something should happen, I should still think for myself? Poppycock!

quote:

---

quote:

---

The South will rise again.

---

no, it won't. it's too dumb and lazy.

---

And fat. Don't forget the fat part.

quote:

---

Should Six Flags over Texas change its name to Five Flags over Texas and forget the Confederacy existed and had a flag?

---

They shouldn't charge $10 for a GD funnel cake

You know who threw dozens of thousands of immigrants to their death on the promise of citizenship?

Lincoln was awesome...

State should decide. Just because some terrorist wanted to start a race war doesn't mean we have to respond without a discussion by the state.

quote:

---

I don't know if you lived in England or not, but I have, and my perspective and experience there is not in line with your sentence. The perspective of revolutionaries and traitors has more to do with what side of the pond you are on and not about who won. A lot of Brits still think we are traitors. And they can call us that all they want because we were. Winning doesn't change that. Winning only allows you to NOT face the consequences of being one.

As far as having to limit your freedom (displaying rebel flag) etc. I would not be so quick to use the "masses" opinion on what you should do or not as your moral compass. As stated above, the masses are full of uneducated and stupid people. Not sure they are the best guides.

---

I have not lived there. I have only visited a few times and worked with Brits in Afghanistan. I have never once been called a "traitor" by a Brit, nor have I seen/heard any negativity towards Americans based on what happened 200 years ago.

But, you sort of touch on the point I was trying to make. If the U.S. had lost the war the entire world would still remembered them as traitors to their country. However, because the U.S. won, we got to define what word describes the individuals that rebelled against the British Empire.

This is similar to the Confederacy. If they had won, the general opinion of them would have been successfully revolutionaries. Instead, they were appropriately put down and are regarded as (forgiven) traitors. It's just the way the world works.

quote:

---

As far as having to limit your freedom (displaying rebel flag) etc. I would not be so quick to use the "masses" opinion on what you should do or not as your moral compass. As stated above, the masses are full of uneducated and stupid people. Not sure they are the best guides.

---

I don't care one way or the other what SC does. I just think the states leadership needs to have an honest conversation about why they are flying the Confederate flag and why the legislature choose not to lower it to half-staff. I agree with Gov Haley's comments on the matter. It's time for SC to put the confederate flag where it belongs, in the past...

quote:

---

"Today we are here in a moment of unity in our state without ill will to say it is time to remove the flag from our capitol grounds," said Haley, a Republican and the state's first non-white governor, while flanked by a diverse group of South Carolina politicians.
"This flag, while an integral part of our past, does not represent the future of our great state," she said.

---

http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/22/politics/nikki-haley-confederate-flag-south-carolina-press-conference/index.html