CDC:

Even CDC now acknowledges what we are seeing via @RIHEALTH “When looking at the summer & fall of 2021, when delta became dominant in this country surviving a previous infection now provided greater protection against subsequent infection than vaccination” https://t.co/04Fr5JSIob https://t.co/BJTwiqWCG9

— Andrew Bostom, MD, MS (@andrewbostom) January 19, 2022

NYT (from CDC):

Finally honesty by the CDC via The NY Times:

“Unvaccinated people with a history of Covid also had lower rates of infection and hospitalization than those protected by vaccines alone.

The data are consistent with trends observed in international studies, the researchers said.” pic.twitter.com/DqyILGnxeV

— Eli Klein (@TheEliKlein) January 19, 2022

I mean in general the recovered population is less at risk from COVID-19 than the vaccinated population. The vaccinated population is older and has more co-morbidities than the recovered population. However, I think Texags gets it wrong when they view things from a bianary lens - immunity is a gradient not a one or zero. This doesn't mean there isn't value in getting vaccinated if you have bad previous infection, and if you've never had COVID then even by this data it's abundantly clear that you should get vaccinated.

At the end of the day it's just a ****ing shot. I don't think it should be mandated, but at the same time some the resistance to it is and has been ridiculous. A lot of people have assumed they had had COVID and were wrong and if you're a country trying to manage on a population scale, I can see how you'd view proof of vaccination as a more reliable metric than trying to determine if people have had COVID. It's very clear that in both the delta wave and omicron wave that a lot of people that thought they were immune to COVID and were unvaccinated were not immune. And that affects society as a whole.

At the end of the day I fully expect all of this to go away over the next 6 months or so because the virus will be endemic and case counting will be irrelevant and bad health outcomes will be much less common due to the cumulative level of immunity in society. I would still recommend you get booster shots in the fall - just as you should get a flu shot.

That was full on thoughtcrime just a short while ago. Nice to see them stating what we all already knew though.

Never gotten a flu shot and I've never gotten the flu. Remind why I should get a flu shot?

personally, I think getting vaccinated before getting natural immunity is/was the best play

getting pneumonia sucks

thenational said:

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Never gotten a flu shot and I've never gotten the flu. Remind why I should get a flu shot?

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Because getting the flu sucks. I got it in 2019 and it put me down for two weeks.

cone said:

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personally, I think getting vaccinated before getting natural immunity is/was the best play

getting pneumonia sucks

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Winner winner chicken dinner.

I think it makes sense on the surface.

If you were healthy enough to survive COVID round 1, you were likely going to survive COVID round 2, even if you felt the same or did a little worse the second time around. It's also more likely COVID round 2 was Omicron, which just a different form of the virus all together. But there's no guarantee whatsoever you were going to survive COVID round 1. Many unvaccinated people that had major issues with round 1 didn't survive to trial round 2.

If you're vaccinated, especially early alpha vaccinated, there was likely a reason for it (immunosuppressed, age, weight). If you caught Delta vaccinated and had multiple comorbidities, especially weight and age, there's no guarantee you were going to skate through.

coastalAg said:

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thenational said:

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Never gotten a flu shot and I've never gotten the flu. Remind why I should get a flu shot?

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Because getting the flu sucks. I got it in 2019 and it put me down for two weeks.

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So much this. As I get older fever sucks more and more.

cone said:

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personally, I think getting vaccinated before getting natural immunity is/was the best play

getting pneumonia sucks

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Not vaccinated and recovered in 24 hours, so... let's discuss both extremes.

you rolled the dice and came away a winner

i chose to further reduce my odds of pneumonia. i feel like a winner too.

You act like the dice is extremely weighted. It's not.

Again, it goes back to my point of extremes.

And left out of the conversation are those who recovered before the vaccines were available.

I made the choice to monitor my antibody level and still have antibodies 13 months later. No vaccine because based on objective lab reports I'm good.

The most fervent pushback I've seen is in response to mandating the shot, even though data and institutional knowledge indicated immunity was at minimum comparable to vaccination. Instead, literally thousands of people have lost, are in the process of losing, or operating under the threat of losing their employment based on demonstrably bad data and policy.

I acquired Covid while "socially distanced" (whatever the **** that means with an airborne virus) from a neighbor who didn't know he had it well before the vaccines were available. I took no conscious roll of the dice and my employer has restricted my ability to do my job and threatened to fire me if I can't deliver even though I pose no statistically appreciable difference in risk to my coworkers.

Illogical policy decisions like that harden even the most reasonable people.

Old Buffalo said:

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cone said:

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personally, I think getting vaccinated before getting natural immunity is/was the best play

getting pneumonia sucks

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Not vaccinated and recovered in 24 hours, so... let's discuss both extremes.

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To me, the risk of pneumonia, even if it was a small one, was the reason I got the shots. I had pneumonia 5-6 years ago and really felt like I was dying. I never want to experience that again, and given my personal health issues with allergies I just did not want to risk the chance of pneumonia.

Now that I am vaccinated and the virus is in a much less severe form I don't really worry about contracting it. Natural immunity is great, but the vaccine helped many avoid serious illness until the virus mutated to a less severe form.

Old Buffalo said:

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You act like the dice is extremely weighted. It's not.

Again, it goes back to my point of extremes.

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The covid dice is extremely weighted...in favor of mild or asymptomatic cases that pose no harm to the roller.

cone said:

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you rolled the dice and came away a winner

i chose to further reduce my odds of pneumonia. i feel like a winner too.

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Don't cash in your chips just yet. Know two vaccinated that just got home from 3-4 week stays for pneumonia.

100% agree

I'm no John Wayne and pneumonia sucks

not getting the covid jab or the flu shot. Never have, never will..

Quote:

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At the end of the day it's just a ****ing shot. I don't think it should be mandated, but at the same time some the resistance to it is and has been ridiculous. A lot of people have assumed they had had COVID and were wrong and if you're a country trying to manage on a population scale, I can see how you'd view proof of vaccination as a more reliable metric than trying to determine if people have had COVID. It's very clear that in both the delta wave and omicron wave that a lot of people that thought they were immune to COVID and were unvaccinated were not immune. And that affects society as a whole.

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The biggest issue is nuance is a real thing in health, wellness, medicine and science in general. But nuance has been ignored by leadership. And b/c of that, those in power and business leadership attempting to make policy regarding vaccination tend to be about as binary as you can get. The entire "get vaccinated or have serious illness" angle is a perfect example. Most still won't have a serious, hospital requiring infection from covid. Adds to the trust issues many have. Then to make things worse, the current administration and certain other state and local leadership have double downed their pressure to get vaccinated. Combined with the media going all in to only report the virus as deadly to all vs very select groups, and we now see too many just not wanting to get vaccinated. I get it. I get those wanting to wait until they feel more comfortable as well. The worst thing that happens with this is forcing the unvaccinated to be vaccinated. Of course there will be push back. Again, the messaging and direction the last 2 years has been an unmitigated disaster in many ways. At least we actually have the number of vaccinated we already do. And to not realize that natural immunity works similarly to vaccination has been comical. This might have been a "novel" virus initially but it is still a virus.

A lot have gotten vaccinated. Probably enough but I do not know. One thing I do believe is any and all attempts to force or mandate vaccination has to cease. More will eventually be vaccinated over time with a calm reasonable approach to this. I get businesses many time are worried that those that get ill will sue. My only answer is to stay the course and let employees make their own decisions. The government, at all levels, needs to back down as well. It's not working anyway. SCOTUS shot down POTUS regarding this last week. A decision I 100% agree with. But the issue I have is that you know they are working on another angle. My advice to them would be give it up. Stop trying to come up with a forceful way to get more vaccinated. Find more imaginative and open approaches. Doubt it will happen obviously.

CoachO_08 said:

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[Wrong forum. Keep the political comments off this forum. This is the warning. - Staff]

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The post above is pretty political, too....

Directly from the CDC.

What I still don't understand is the continued push and encouragement to vaccinate those with prior infection. The reduction of relative and real risk in unvaccinated with prior infection to vaccinated with prior infection is not sufficient in my eyes (especially with acknowledged increased risk of complications with vaccination post infection and recovery).

I just don't get it...

Aston94 said:

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Old Buffalo said:

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cone said:

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personally, I think getting vaccinated before getting natural immunity is/was the best play

getting pneumonia sucks

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Not vaccinated and recovered in 24 hours, so... let's discuss both extremes.

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To me, the risk of pneumonia, even if it was a small one, was the reason I got the shots. I had pneumonia 5-6 years ago and really felt like I was dying. I never want to experience that again, and given my personal health issues with allergies I just did not want to risk the chance of pneumonia.

Now that I am vaccinated and the virus is in a much less severe form I don't really worry about contracting it. Natural immunity is great, but the vaccine helped many avoid serious illness until the virus mutated to a less severe form.

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I had pneumonia about 4 years ago. Was in the ICU for 6 days, in the hospital for 7 or 8 total. I was training for a marathon and went from running 16+ mile runs (30+ miles a week) to taking over a month to be able to run a mile without stopping. And this is after the hospital stay where I thought I may die as nothing was making better.

I really don't care if my risk of getting covid pneumonia was .01%, that **** sucked and I thought the vaccine was worth it. Especially when you take into consideration that if you've had pneumonia you're more at risk to get it again, or at least that's my understanding.

cone said:

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you rolled the dice and came away a winner

i chose to further reduce my odds of pneumonia. i feel like a winner too.

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Some people roll the dice and get the vaccine and end up dead, with blood clots, heart conditions, etc. If the vaccine were harmless and worked as effectively as the "experts" said it would, I'd get it tomorrow.

I rolled the dice, got covid couple weeks ago, took ivermectin and other stuff and got over it in a few days. Why would I get vaccinated now? Absolutely no reason.

If I were in your shoes I wouldn't get vaccine now either. Natural immunity is great.

cone said:

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you rolled the dice and came away a winner

i chose to further reduce my odds of pneumonia. i feel like a winner too.

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Wrong. This is like rolling a die where 5 of the 6 sides are in your favor.

Year of the Germaphobe said:

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cone said:

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you rolled the dice and came away a winner

i chose to further reduce my odds of pneumonia. i feel like a winner too.

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Wrong. This is like rolling a die where 5 of the 6 sides are in your favor.

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5 of 6?! Try 47 out of 50. And that's just a case which doesn't require hospitalization. Correct that downward if you're young and healthy. And then the risk of death is a further fraction of that.

Sure, there's "a chance" but it's somewhere in the ballpark of the risk of getting male breast cancer.

i'm surprised people are so intolerant of other people's risk calculations