quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

Once the players that transferred start lighting it up at other schools, I'll look at the transfers as negatives. So far, nothing about the subsequent success of any of them concerns me in the least.

---

Hibbert averaged 12 ppg at GMU and plays professionally in Greece apparently.

---

That's against a very different level of competition while getting 32 minutes per game.

---

Hibbert played 20 minutes a game on an NCAA Team here at A&M.

Whatever he's done, he's already proven you can win with him being your 1st or 2nd guy off the bench. And that was as a freshman?

quote:

---

Why does Johns have a scholarship?

---

He won't soon enough.

quote:

---

quote:

---

Here's the list of players he inherited.

Elston Turner - started for Kennedy
Khris Middleton - started for Kennedy left early
David Loubeau - started for Kennedy
Ray Turner - started for Kennedy
Dash Harris - started for Kennedy
Kourtney Roberson - started for Kennedy
Jordan Green - started for Kennedy
Jamal Branch - RUNNOFT immediately
Naji Hibbert - RUNNOFT
Daniel Alexander - RUNNOFT immediately
Kieth Davis - RUNNOFT

---

no way to spin this.

but old white guys eat up the excuses.

---

Also, include "traditional football/baseball fans"

quote:

---

Once the players that transferred start lighting it up at other schools, I'll look at the transfers as negatives. So far, nothing about the subsequent success of any of them concerns me in the least.

---

Except that overall Kennedy has an awful eye for talent and discernible system to recruit to so you get a smattering of players whose skill sets don't accent each other or whatever it is he's trying to accomplish.

quote:

---

quote:

---

i wouldnt call trocha an average post player.

---

He will be. I would consider him average for a true freshman.

---

glad to know we are going by the "GE" standard and not any actual rankings. he was one of the worst bigs in all of basketball this year, far from average.

• Trocha - fish (10 mpg, 1.6 pt, 2.0 reb)
  
• Kourtney Roberson fish (12mpg, 5.6 pt, 3.8 reb)
  
• Joe Jones fish (26mpg, 12.7pt, 7.3 reb)
  
• David Loubeau - 13min, 4.6pt, 3.2 reb
  
• Bryan Davis - (7 min, 2pt, 2.5 reb)
  
• Deandre Jordan - 20 mpg, 7.9pts, 6.0 reb)
  
• Keith Davis - 5 min per game, 1.0pts, 1.3 reb
  

basically, trocha was worse than every fish big since keith davis, and davis put up similar numbers in 1/2 the minutes. oh, and davis was so bad that Kennedy sent him on his way one year later.

quote:

---

quote:

---

Once the players that transferred start lighting it up at other schools, I'll look at the transfers as negatives. So far, nothing about the subsequent success of any of them concerns me in the least.

---

Except that overall Kennedy has an awful eye for talent and discernible system to recruit to so you get a smattering of players whose skill sets don't accent each other or whatever it is he's trying to accomplish.

---

I already said the much bigger issue than the transfers was the terrible recruiting.

quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

i wouldnt call trocha an average post player.

---

He will be. I would consider him average for a true freshman.

---

glad to know we are going by the "GE" standard and not any actual rankings. he was one of the worst bigs in all of basketball this year, far from average.

• Trocha - fish (10 mpg, 1.6 pt, 2.0 reb)
  
• Kourtney Roberson fish (12mpg, 5.6 pt, 3.8 reb)
  
• Joe Jones fish (26mpg, 12.7pt, 7.3 reb)
  
• David Loubeau - 13min, 4.6pt, 3.2 reb
  
• Bryan Davis - (7 min, 2pt, 2.5 reb)
  
• Deandre Jordan - 20 mpg, 7.9pts, 6.0 reb)
  
• Keith Davis - 5 min per game, 1.0pts, 1.3 reb
  

basically, trocha was worse than every fish big since keith davis, and davis put up similar numbers in 1/2 the minutes. oh, and davis was so bad that Kennedy sent him on his way one year later.

---

Jones, Loubeau, Davis, Jordan, and Roberson were above average players, even as fish. You also conveniently left off Miller and Johns.

Trocha definitely needed a redshirt year but Kennedy's previous post player recruiting was so poor he had to play.

i didnt conveniently leave off anyone. i inlcluded guys who had hype similar to trocha.

johns is a spare who wont be here next year (just like keith davis).
miller actually had better fish stats than trocha too, but miller was a nobody in terms of what he was expected to contribute.

anyway, the point i was responding to was your claim that trocha was an average fish big. the reality is that he is one of the worst fish bigs we've had in a decade, and his numbers compare similarly to two fish bigs that kennedy trap door-ed after their sophomore season (davis, johns).

quote:

---

I already said the much bigger issue than the transfers was the terrible recruiting.

---

They are both big issues, and speak to the larger problem of BK's program management. He is a lousy coach, he cannot afford to miss out on talent evaluations like he has. Yet he has missed out on these evaluations repeatedly.

The problem with BK is he is just a never ending cycle of trial and error with no real solutions ever coming about in regards to his problems. That is why the program has been piss poor since he has taken over.

What annoys me about the BK defenders in regards to the constant turnover of players, is the players are actually Aggies (in that they are students at A&M), yet the BK lovers throw them under the bus to defend BK, who is not an Aggie but a university employee, and is basically a highly paid, highly incompetent mercenary.

BK isn't a great guy who cares about these kids. He is going through them as fast as he can until he can find the right combination of players to cover up his coaching failures, to justify his undeserved employment here.

quote:

---

i didnt conveniently leave off anyone. i inlcluded guys who had hype similar to trocha.

johns is a spare who wont be here next year (just like keith davis).
miller actually had better fish stats than trocha too, but miller was a nobody in terms of what he was expected to contribute.

anyway, the point i was responding to was your claim that trocha was an average fish big. the reality is that he is one of the worst fish bigs we've had in a decade, and his numbers compare similarly to two fish bigs that kennedy trap door-ed after their sophomore season (davis, johns).

---

Maybe Trocha was below average for a true freshman. My main point in even stating that was to point out that Kennedy's utter failure to recruit a decent big man in the '11, '12, and '13 recruiting classes is a much bigger issue than the transfers out. Do you disagree with this?

Yes we all realize BK's ****ty recruiting, piss poor player development, and crappy coaching are all feeding the transfer issue.

quote:

---

quote:

---

I already said the much bigger issue than the transfers was the terrible recruiting.

---

They are both big issues, and speak to the larger problem of BK's program management. He is a lousy coach, he cannot afford to miss out on talent evaluations like he has. Yet he has missed out on these evaluations repeatedly.

The problem with BK is he is just a never ending cycle of trial and error with no real solutions ever coming about in regards to his problems. That is why the program has been piss poor since he has taken over.

What annoys me about the BK defenders in regards to the constant turnover of players, is the players are actually Aggies (in that they are students at A&M), yet the BK lovers throw them under the bus to defend BK, who is not an Aggie but a university employee, and is basically a highly paid, highly incompetent mercenary.

BK isn't a great guy who cares about these kids. He is going through them as fast as he can until he can find the right combination of players to cover up his coaching failures, to justify his undeserved employment here.

---

What's funny is that even given most of what you said is accurate, Kennedy has a MUCH better roster going into 2015-2016 than he inherited from Turgeon, and pretty much equivalent to what Gillispie left Turgeon.

Best case scenario would be to hire a great coach to come in and maximize the potential of that talent, but for a number of reasons that isn't going to happen.

All any of us can do at this point is root for Kennedy to continue the upward trajectory of the program in terms of win/loss and to address the positions of need in the 2016 recruiting class (PG and SF).

quote:

---

What's funny is that even given most of what you said is accurate, Kennedy has a MUCH better roster going into 2015-2016 than he inherited
from Turgeon, and pretty much equivalent to what Gillispie left Turgeon.

---

BK going into next year will have a much better roster on paper than any coach A&M has had in at least the last 30 years.

I bet he doesn't do as much with it as Turgeon as did with his first roster, and I bet he doesn't do as much as Turgeon did with his last roster either.

quote:

---

All any of us can do at this point is root for Kennedy to continue the upward trajectory of the program in terms of win/loss and to address the
positions of need in the 2016 recruiting class (PG and SF).

---

Upward trajectory of what? BK's initial suckiness? BK has yet to get the program to where he found it, and probably will not ever do that. The guy is a bad coach pure and simple, and I will root for him when he gives me a reason to root for him. Hint, he hasn't done so yet. I just hope he is not as bad a coach as I think and can actually do something with the talent next year.

quote:

---

quote:

---

What's funny is that even given most of what you said is accurate, Kennedy has a MUCH better roster going into 2015-2016 than he inherited
from Turgeon, and pretty much equivalent to what Gillispie left Turgeon.

---

BK going into next year will have a much better roster on paper than any coach A&M has had in at least the last 30 years.

I bet he doesn't do as much with it as Turgeon as did with his first roster, and I bet he doesn't do as much as Turgeon did with his last roster either.

quote:

---

All any of us can do at this point is root for Kennedy to continue the upward trajectory of the program in terms of win/loss and to address the
positions of need in the 2016 recruiting class (PG and SF).

---

Upward trajectory of what? BK's initial suckiness? BK has yet to get the program to where he found it, and probably will not ever do that. The guy is a bad coach pure and simple, and I will root for him when he gives me a reason to root for him. Hint, he hasn't done so yet. I just hope he is not as bad a coach as I think and can actually do something with the talent next year.

---

I'd say the 2008 roster with Deandre Jordan, Bryan Davis, Joe Jones, Chin Elonu, Dom Kirk, Josh Carter, Donald Sloan, Derrick Roland was the best on paper.

quote:

---

I'd say the 2008 roster with Deandre Jordan, Bryan Davis, Joe Jones, Chin Elonu, Dom Kirk, Josh Carter, Donald Sloan,
Derrick Roland was the best on paper.

---

This one on paper has that one beat hands down. Elonu wasn't even ranked as a recruit.

Now that roster had much better coaching and player development but in terms of recruiting rankings this one has that one beat. And we are not even taking into account the prospect of another highly ranked transfer coming into the fold.

quote:

---

quote:

---

What's funny is that even given most of what you said is accurate, Kennedy has a MUCH better roster going into 2015-2016 than he inherited
from Turgeon, and pretty much equivalent to what Gillispie left Turgeon.

---

BK going into next year will have a much better roster on paper than any coach A&M has had in at least the last 30 years.

I bet he doesn't do as much with it as Turgeon as did with his first roster, and I bet he doesn't do as much as Turgeon did with his last roster either.

quote:

---

All any of us can do at this point is root for Kennedy to continue the upward trajectory of the program in terms of win/loss and to address the
positions of need in the 2016 recruiting class (PG and SF).

---

Upward trajectory of what? BK's initial suckiness? BK has yet to get the program to where he found it, and probably will not ever do that. The guy is a bad coach pure and simple, and I will root for him when he gives me a reason to root for him. Hint, he hasn't done so yet. I just hope he is not as bad a coach as I think and can actually do something with the talent next year.

---

Upward trajectory from the first three abysmal years of Kennedy's tenure.

Turgeon went 25-11 in his first year (8 and 8 in conference) and entering the tournament as a 9 seed, losing in the second round.

$100 says that next year's team finishes above .500 in conference play and enters the NCAA tournament as a 9 seed or better. The only caveat I'll tie to this is that House doesn't go pro and the four recruits we signed play for us. You game?

I'll go on seeding. You cannot compare the big12 even back then vs. the SEC now.

I say he doesn't do better than a double digit seed and a first round loss. The bet is null if they lose House and/or fail to bring in all four recruits.

$100 is fine.

BK is simply not a very good coach no matter the talent and you will see that next year.

Finishing .500 in a 14 team league where 5 teams make the tournament in a "good" year is not really the same as finishing .500 in a league where 6 out of 12 make it. A 9 seed is about below what I expect for next year though, but it wouldn't be surprising to be that or lower..

To clarify, 10 seed or worse in the NCAA tournament, you win, 9 seed or better and I win. Bet is null if House and the four recruits don't play. You're on for $100.

quote:

---

To clarify, 10 seed or worse in the NCAA tournament, you win, 9 seed or better and I win. Bet is null if
House and the four recruits don't play. You're on for $100.

---

Deal.

Sophomore Davis, Sloan, Elonu and Roland arent near the players they were when they left A&M. Deandre was clueless.

can we bet on win totals? no chance next year's team sniffs 25 wins.
can we bet on top 50 wins? no chance next year's team beat's 2008 there either.
can we bet on weeks ranked in the top 25 poll?
can we bet on highest ranking in the polls?

quote:

---

can we bet on win totals? no chance next year's team sniffs 25 wins.
can we bet on top 50 wins? no chance next year's team beat's 2008 there either.
can we bet on weeks ranked in the top 25 poll?
can we bet on highest ranking in the polls?

---

We can bet on all of those things once the schedule is published.

quote:

---

quote:

---

can we bet on win totals? no chance next year's team sniffs 25 wins.
can we bet on top 50 wins? no chance next year's team beat's 2008 there either.
can we bet on weeks ranked in the top 25 poll?
can we bet on highest ranking in the polls?

---

We can bet on all of those things once the schedule is published.

---

great. we opened the pre-season poll that year at 16, climbed to #8, then hung around the top 12 for 6 more weeks (getting into the top 10 again) before finally falling out of the polls for week 17 (2/25).

I look forward to you getting our official published schedule and then betting me that kennedy's best team on paper can get 26 wins, spend 17+ weeks in the top 25 and climb to #7 or higher in the polls. i guess i've got a few months before that schedule comes out to figure out how many top 50 wins that 08 team had.

Two things are certain when it comes to bk. There will be no top 50 wins yet again, and there will be a bad home loss thrown in too. He is consistent, I'll give him that.

quote:

---

quote:

---

quote:

---

can we bet on win totals? no chance next year's team sniffs 25 wins.
can we bet on top 50 wins? no chance next year's team beat's 2008 there either.
can we bet on weeks ranked in the top 25 poll?
can we bet on highest ranking in the polls?

---

We can bet on all of those things once the schedule is published.

---

great. we opened the pre-season poll that year at 16, climbed to #8, then hung around the top 12 for 6 more weeks (getting into the top 10 again) before finally falling out of the polls for week 17 (2/25).

I look forward to you getting our official published schedule and then betting me that kennedy's best team on paper can get 26 wins, spend 17+ weeks in the top 25 and climb to #7 or higher in the polls. i guess i've got a few months before that schedule comes out to figure out how many top 50 wins that 08 team had.

---

They had 4. Ohio State, Texas, Oklahoma, BYU.
2008 Schedule
2008 RPI

Which poll are you looking at?

Good post. How absolutely right. Continuity is very important because it takes time for players to learn each other's tendencies, figure out how they like to play and how they react to certain situations, etc.

People point at the Dayton game and say "if we'd just had House we would have won!"

Well if we'd had Jamall Jones that probably would have been enough for a W too, and then maybe we get their 11 seed.

BK chased and TT for years. Let's hope he develops.

I hope Davis and Thomas workout, neither have the upside and high-end that Jordan had and has proven.

quote:

---

I hope Davis and Thomas workout, neither have the upside and high-end that Jordan had and has proven.

---

Both actually have a clue how to play basketball and won't be looking to leave after one year.

That might be true. Jordan was an impressive looking prospect who has proven his five star ranking was correct.

Yes but outside of dunking and being tall he had no clue when he got here. Love him but his Ag career was marked an "incomplete".

I'm talking about having an NBA career. Jordan had higher upside and has proven he can play in the NBA.

Thon Maker? What do you make of him? Kid isn't taking classes. Kid is on the take. Will be interesting to watch.

quote:

---

Good post. How absolutely right. Continuity is very important because it takes time for players to learn each other's tendencies, figure out how they like to play and how they react to certain situations, etc.

People point at the Dayton game and say "if we'd just had House we would have won!"

Well if we'd had Jamall Jones that probably would have been enough for a W too, and then maybe we get their 11 seed.

---

Continuity is important.

For a reference point, from the '11-'12 to '12-'13 season, we returned just four scholarship players representing 31 points per game (about half of total PPG).

From the '12-'13 season to the '13-'14 season, we returned just five scholarship players representing 33 points per game (about half of total PPG).

From the '13-'14 season to the '14-'15 season, we returned six scholarship players representing 42 points per game (about 2/3 of total PPG)

From the '14-'15 season to the '15-'16 season, we will return 8 or 9 scholarship players representing 53 to 54 points per game (about 3/4 of total PPG).

From a continuity standpoint, we're in a much better position going into next season than we were coming into any season up until now under Kennedy, returning over 75% of scoring.

Player development is lacking. And this doesn't just fall on BK. Players improved over the years under Turgeon and his staff. Donald Sloan and Bryan Davis, Walkup and Holmes. Is this sort of development taking place now?