It was amazing. Currant, vanilla, anise. Very layered. Decanted for 2hrs before starting. Still rounding into form. Prob better in 3-5yrs. Will hold the rest of my 2016s for that long.
Whats in your wine cellar?
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Last: 3 hrs ago by WestUAg
I think DV is my favorite aged Napa cab. A DV with 15-20 years of age is divine. Same with Maya, albeit pricier. Ridge Monte Bello (not Napa) is my another great aged cab.
As far as Realm, I only buy their Dr Crane these days. Yes it's expensive but most Cranes are. Still…not sure how long I'll that will go on. Same with Scarecrow. I'm on the fence for this vintage especially since my buddy who always takes a bottle of each of my three packs moved overseas for a few years and has frozen all wine buying.
I had an interesting talk with a few winemakers about how they are not raising prices because they know buyers can get tons of great older wine (including BDX) for cheaper than what a lot of domestic Napa wineries are charging. Napa is in a bubble right now and they don't want to be inside of it when it pops.
As far as Realm, I only buy their Dr Crane these days. Yes it's expensive but most Cranes are. Still…not sure how long I'll that will go on. Same with Scarecrow. I'm on the fence for this vintage especially since my buddy who always takes a bottle of each of my three packs moved overseas for a few years and has frozen all wine buying.
I had an interesting talk with a few winemakers about how they are not raising prices because they know buyers can get tons of great older wine (including BDX) for cheaper than what a lot of domestic Napa wineries are charging. Napa is in a bubble right now and they don't want to be inside of it when it pops.
WestUAg said:
I popped a 13 Roy piper tonight. It was drinking perfectly, tannins very well integrated, lots of sediment.
'14 had a lot of sediment too, so we're told. Luckily Roy double decanted before dinner to save us from the dregs.
Yesterday's cold and soaking wet tour of Napa took us up to Howell Mountain. A diving buddy had recommended O'Shaughnessy so we stopped there first. Tried the chard which is from the owner's Oakville vineyard, the '19 Howell Mountain cab, the '19 Mt Veeder cab, and a '21 Howell Mountain zin that they made from their neighbor's fruit (they actually bought all the fruit from their neighbors as a thank you for helping save them during the fires of 2020). My favorite was the '19 Howell Mountain. My wife like the Mt Veeder best. But my favorite part of the tour was walking thru the owners wine cellar and seeing so many cool old Napa wines, along with so many French greats. Also, there was a rule that the first person in our group that referenced the Key & Peele substitute teacher skit would get kicked in the ding a ling. Our tour guide was the one that actually said it so we gave her props and spared her the kick.
Next up was Outpost. They poured the '19 and '21 estate cabs. Both were good but the '19 won today. I'll check in again in about 7-9 years. Also had a zin, which was a bit much and needed some pizza or red sauce pasta dish to go with it. The Grenache was a bit young but I bought some to age and see what happens. It's been since the 2008 vintage that I've had Outpost so I was glad the wines were still quality. The '19 was my favorite of the two morning visits.
A late lunch at Mustards included a 2014 Realm Houyi.
Then a visit to one of my favorites, where we took a thank you bottle from 1986 to share. These two bottles were my favorites red and white of the day.
BSD said:
Yesterday's cold and soaking wet tour of Napa took us up to Howell Mountain. A diving buddy had recommended O'Shaughnessy so we stopped there first. Tried the chard which is from the owner's Oakville vineyard, the '19 Howell Mountain cab, the '19 Mt Veeder cab, and a '21 Howell Mountain zin that they made from their neighbor's fruit (they actually bought all the fruit from their neighbors as a thank you for helping save them during the fires of 2020). My favorite was the '19 Howell Mountain. My wife like the Mt Veeder best. But my favorite part of the tour was walking thru the owners wine cellar and seeing so many cool old Napa wines, along with so many French greats. Also, there was a rule that the first person in our group that referenced the Key & Peele substitute teacher skit would get kicked in the ding a ling. Our tour guide was the one that actually said it so we gave her props and spared her the kick.
Next up was Outpost. They poured the '19 and '21 estate cabs. Both were good but the '19 won today. I'll check in again in about 7-9 years. Also had a zin, which was a bit much and needed some pizza or red sauce pasta dish to go with it. The Grenache was a bit young but I bought some to age and see what happens. It's been since the 2008 vintage that I've had Outpost so I was glad the wines were still quality. The '19 was my favorite of the two morning visits.
A late lunch at Mustards included a 2014 Realm Houyi.
Then a visit to one of my favorites, where we took a thank you bottle from 1986 to share. These two bottles were my favorites red and white of the day.
Nice day for sure. Made me remember that I have a 2013 Outpost True that I want to try.
I really wish all these winemakers would discuss what clones they use. More and more do, but for most you still have to ask or dig deep. Understandably some don't really want to share that information though...
Ropy Piper is open about it if you ask. Quilceda Creek touts their clones. BV has some clonal bottles labeled as such. I hope (expect) to see more of that.
Ropy Piper is open about it if you ask. Quilceda Creek touts their clones. BV has some clonal bottles labeled as such. I hope (expect) to see more of that.
I love the labels that shows the harvest date, clone, brix and all other gale and harvest data. Anthem bottles are a great example. I think all labels should be required
To do this and have the winemaker noted.
To do this and have the winemaker noted.
I don't agree that it should be required, but YES I think it very valuable. VHR does it as well.WestUAg said:
I love the labels that shows the harvest date, clone, brix and all other gale and harvest data. Anthem bottles are a great example. I think all labels should be required
To do this and have the winemaker noted.
Interesting thing about the winemakers we all discuss and like.
On the one hand, there's the notion that the "where" if the vineyard is so important. Then again, if that's true, why is the identity of the winemaker so important?
I have a lot Of old wine in my cellar (70's and 80's). It's very hard to find out who the winemakers were from back in the day…a lot Of times I you can't event tell what vineyard The grapes Came From.
Sunday Funday
The last day in Napa started off at Failla, as we all felt the need for Pinot. I wasn't overly impressed with what they were pouring for the regular tasting so asked them to dig a little deeper and show me some mailing list wines. It ended up being a good call and we left happy. Ordered a few from Sonoma Coast vineyards to be sent home…and a nice Syrah.
Then we went over to Rivers Marie to hang out with Will for the afternoon. The B Theriot chard continues to be a favorite of mine. The Caterwaul Last Rites was impressive, as was the 2018 RM Summa Old Vines. The 2018 William & Mary Prop Red was in a perfect place and was my favorite of the day.
Oh yeah, Will wants to come down to an A&M game (after harvest and when it's cooler) so let's keep that in mind for a bottle share.
And finally, dinner with Houston friends in a yurt at Charter Oak. While in a unique setting, It wasn't the best meal I've ever had, but it had some really great components and was one of the most fun dinners I've had. The service was great. Had the wines below. All in all, it was nice to get back out there after 5.5 years.
Then we went over to Rivers Marie to hang out with Will for the afternoon. The B Theriot chard continues to be a favorite of mine. The Caterwaul Last Rites was impressive, as was the 2018 RM Summa Old Vines. The 2018 William & Mary Prop Red was in a perfect place and was my favorite of the day.
Oh yeah, Will wants to come down to an A&M game (after harvest and when it's cooler) so let's keep that in mind for a bottle share.
And finally, dinner with Houston friends in a yurt at Charter Oak. While in a unique setting, It wasn't the best meal I've ever had, but it had some really great components and was one of the most fun dinners I've had. The service was great. Had the wines below. All in all, it was nice to get back out there after 5.5 years.
I pulled the trigger on the Last Bottle mystery offering today. Usually they give you enough info to figure out what it is with a quick Google search, but not today. Hope it is something decent.
We went to Sushi Bar in Chicago Saturday, and it was fantastic. It is a 17 course restaurant omekase, all nigiri, all fish except one of the courses is wagyu with ossetra caviar. My wife did the reserve sake pairing and it was amazing. I tasted her sake and had a very nice Ridge Grenache blanc.
I went to the same place when they opened in Dallas back in December. It's a really fun meal and good food, but damn if we didn't leave with almost a $1k bill for two people after including add ons and wine/champagne pairings.
We were in the same ballpark with all the add-ons. It's a lot, but to be fair everything at SB costs about the same as at every other high end omekase in Chicago. We've been to a few, and this was my favorite. Only one that's topped it for me was O Ya in Boston.
BigAg95 said:
I pulled the trigger on the Last Bottle mystery offering today. Usually they give you enough info to figure out what it is with a quick Google search, but not today. Hope it is something decent.
Ditto, that's our daily drinker price point. Yolo and all that.
We were stuck in East Texas all weekend, sharing a hotel with our 3.5 year old. When he went to bed, we made the best of our time there.
R/wine is guessing this. I picked up 3 bottles.
https://thebeauvignecollection.com/13th-anniversary-cult/
https://thebeauvignecollection.com/13th-anniversary-cult/
siggghhhhh...guess i'll be buying a 3 pack as well.
Also got a '21 Juliet through Wine Spies for $55 as an "Undisclosed" bottle couple weeks back
Also got a '21 Juliet through Wine Spies for $55 as an "Undisclosed" bottle couple weeks back
I grabbed 4 so I could try one now and lay down the other 3. How is the Beau Vigne stuff generally? LB has been offering it a lot lately and it looks like they've changed hands a few times over the past few years. I can't find much info out there on the 2021 Cult.Stan Crowch said:
R/wine is guessing this. I picked up 3 bottles.
https://thebeauvignecollection.com/13th-anniversary-cult/
I would just like them to say if they added acid and used commercial yeasts. that would be a good start.WestUAg said:
I love the labels that shows the harvest date, clone, brix and all other gale and harvest data. Anthem bottles are a great example. I think all labels should be required
To do this and have the winemaker noted.
I do find the harvest date info interesting. I don't know enough about clones for Cab for it to mean much to me, I guess I'm a bit more familiar with the wider used chardonnay clones.
Question - has anyone tried this?
2013 Acumen "PEAK - Attelas Vineyard" Napa Valley Cabernet Sauvignon
I have an opportunity to buy this sixer, but I don't find reviews or anything really. Much appreciated.
2013 Acumen "PEAK - Attelas Vineyard" Napa Valley Cabernet Sauvignon
I have an opportunity to buy this sixer, but I don't find reviews or anything really. Much appreciated.
Atlas Peak wine by Phillip Titus? Seems like it might be worth a shot at the right price. But if you don't like one, you'll have five leftover!
The only reviews I could find were on the KL Wines site.
The only reviews I could find were on the KL Wines site.
Most Napa cabs can just be lined up by price. The higher the price the more concentrated.
I'll probably get reamed for this, but once you get to about $100 Napa cabs are on a trajectory. Other than some clonal variation, most are on the same arc. You pay for higher concentration.
And with optical sorting and MOX, even that correlation is changing some.
The upside is Napa is very consistent at those prices. Nowhere nearly the variability of Bordeaux or Burgundy.
I'll probably get reamed for this, but once you get to about $100 Napa cabs are on a trajectory. Other than some clonal variation, most are on the same arc. You pay for higher concentration.
And with optical sorting and MOX, even that correlation is changing some.
The upside is Napa is very consistent at those prices. Nowhere nearly the variability of Bordeaux or Burgundy.
BSD said:
Atlas Peak wine by Phillip Titus? Seems like it might be worth a shot at the right price. But if you don't like one, you'll have five leftover!
The only reviews I could find were on the KL Wines site.
One more thing: Michael Wolf is the vineyard manager. He's managed some nice vineyards in the past. Still, I'm not familiar with this wine.
This was past its prime, but still drank surprisingly well for turning 30 this year.
So today's topic: wine clubs.
I joined Flowers wine club because I had a Pinot and a Chardonnay from them and liked both. Then they somehow changed the discount percentage. So they ended to sending me 3 bottles of Pinot and 3 bottles of Chardonnay but they were all something like $90 each but only 10% off. Here's the thing. Same stuff is at total wine and for about the same price - may have even been cheaper.
Like what's the point? If there is no exclusivity and no discount doesn't that invalidate the need for a wine club?
The only other one I am in is Le Cuvier out of Paso Robles and the place is quirky and hippie but they offer 25% off and you can't get their stuff any other way. It's pretty unique stuff so to me this is the exactly why you would join a wine club.
What am I missing here?
I joined Flowers wine club because I had a Pinot and a Chardonnay from them and liked both. Then they somehow changed the discount percentage. So they ended to sending me 3 bottles of Pinot and 3 bottles of Chardonnay but they were all something like $90 each but only 10% off. Here's the thing. Same stuff is at total wine and for about the same price - may have even been cheaper.
Like what's the point? If there is no exclusivity and no discount doesn't that invalidate the need for a wine club?
The only other one I am in is Le Cuvier out of Paso Robles and the place is quirky and hippie but they offer 25% off and you can't get their stuff any other way. It's pretty unique stuff so to me this is the exactly why you would join a wine club.
What am I missing here?
You pretty much answered your own question. It really depends on the club. Some offer better discounts, wine only available to club members, etc. and can make sense. Others don't.Objective Aggie said:
So today's topic: wine clubs.
I joined Flowers wine club because I had a Pinot and a Chardonnay from them and liked both. Then they somehow changed the discount percentage. So they ended to sending me 3 bottles of Pinot and 3 bottles of Chardonnay but they were all something like $90 each but only 10% off. Here's the thing. Same stuff is at total wine and for about the same price - may have even been cheaper.
Like what's the point? If there is no exclusivity and no discount doesn't that invalidate the need for a wine club?
The only other one I am in is Le Cuvier out of Paso Robles and the place is quirky and hippie but they offer 25% off and you can't get their stuff any other way. It's pretty unique stuff so to me this is the exactly why you would join a wine club.
What am I missing here?
Isn't Flowers part of the Quintessa family? I was a member of Quintessa for a very short period of time until I found out it was cheaper at Spec's. Seems as though their wine clubs offer little to no value.
Wine clubs are the DTC (Direct To Consumer) lifeblood of wineries. Subscription sales are what allow most small wineries to function.
That being said if wines that are in distribution are included in a wine club, it very much defeats the purpose of the club UNLESS the club discount is much steeper than anything you can find in distribution. From the winery's point of view, if you'll buy bottles DTC from them at prices similar (or just slightly lower) than you could via distribution, they make a whole lot more per bottle that way.
If there is a small winery you like, especially one that is 100% DTC, then joining the club is a good way to ensure that winery will continue to be able to produce their wines that you like.
That being said if wines that are in distribution are included in a wine club, it very much defeats the purpose of the club UNLESS the club discount is much steeper than anything you can find in distribution. From the winery's point of view, if you'll buy bottles DTC from them at prices similar (or just slightly lower) than you could via distribution, they make a whole lot more per bottle that way.
If there is a small winery you like, especially one that is 100% DTC, then joining the club is a good way to ensure that winery will continue to be able to produce their wines that you like.
Funny you should mention Le Cuvier, I'll be there in a couple of weeks.
Part of the reason we have several wine clubs is because there's no other way to get those wines as they're mostly small producers that either have very limited local distribution or don't distribute at all. I'm also a member of J Winery which is a big producer, but I can customize that shipment to get all the single vineyard wines that I want and leave off everything I can get cheaper locally.
Part of the reason we have several wine clubs is because there's no other way to get those wines as they're mostly small producers that either have very limited local distribution or don't distribute at all. I'm also a member of J Winery which is a big producer, but I can customize that shipment to get all the single vineyard wines that I want and leave off everything I can get cheaper locally.
Yes, Flowers and Quintessa are both part of the Huneeus Wines company. Flowers has pretty wide distro now. What wines were the ones you saw at Total Wines that were $90 or so? Their Sonoma blend stuff is about $55 or so if I recall correctly. Could be more now.JCA1 said:You pretty much answered your own question. It really depends on the club. Some offer better discounts, wine only available to club members, etc. and can make sense. Others don't.Objective Aggie said:
So today's topic: wine clubs.
I joined Flowers wine club because I had a Pinot and a Chardonnay from them and liked both. Then they somehow changed the discount percentage. So they ended to sending me 3 bottles of Pinot and 3 bottles of Chardonnay but they were all something like $90 each but only 10% off. Here's the thing. Same stuff is at total wine and for about the same price - may have even been cheaper.
Like what's the point? If there is no exclusivity and no discount doesn't that invalidate the need for a wine club?
The only other one I am in is Le Cuvier out of Paso Robles and the place is quirky and hippie but they offer 25% off and you can't get their stuff any other way. It's pretty unique stuff so to me this is the exactly why you would join a wine club.
What am I missing here?
Isn't Flowers part of the Quintessa family? I was a member of Quintessa for a very short period of time until I found out it was cheaper at Spec's. Seems as though their wine clubs offer little to no value.
Another benefit of a club is attending events. If you are not near the winery, that added benefit is wasted and you're not going to get as much value out of the club either.
Quote:
Another benefit of a club is attending events. If you are not near the winery, that added benefit is wasted and you're not going to get as much value out of the club either.
Yes, very true. But even when signing up locals, I try to stress that the primary benefit to the club is pricing, second is access to limited releases, after that the parties...
Yea it's definitely an icing on top perk and not as much of a reason to join as those first 2 points!
The Roy Piper Wines email that just came out is announcing a one-off Pinot from the 2021 vintage in Santa Rita Hills. Looks promising.
From his description very definitely NOT typical for the area. Hopefully pure Burgundian. 13.6% alcohol would indicate the grapes weren't overripe like most CA Pinot.
I will buy.
I will buy.
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