I'll have to check.

Killed of a Blantons, the MWND, and EHTBP this week. Time to open some new stuff. Gonna reach way back and open random things and see how I like them. Anyone heard about 4 grain in Central texas yet?

They've been on ABH. But only places like Twin or Total Wine.

I talked to my guy here at Twin and they got three bottles but all went wholesale to bars.

Though Twin has whiskey on sale til the 16th, buy two fifths or more and it's 15% off. Also some of the bigger stores have a big tasting event on the 14th. Should be 20+ whiskeys to taste, across all types. Or at least that's what College Station is planning.

DDP

CharlieBrown17 said:

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They've been on ABH. But only places like Twin or Total Wine.

I talked to my guy here at Twin and they got three bottles but all went wholesale to bars.

Though Twin has whiskey on sale til the 16th, buy two fifths or more and it's 15% off. Also some of the bigger stores have a big tasting event on the 14th. Should be 20+ whiskeys to taste, across all types. Or at least that's what College Station is planning.

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Went to the Twin at 620 and 2222 in Austin and picked up the following at lunch:

• Fire Oak Texas Bourbon Whiskey (made up the road in Liberty Hill) - I'm a fan
• Whitmeyer's Texas Single Barrel Cask Strength - first time I've seen Whitmeyer's here and looking forward to trying it
• Yellow Rose Outlaw Bourbon - been wanting to try this for a while

Saved $25.

Isn't the owner/distiller/something at fire oak an Ag? Think I met him at a tasting. Class of 90 something if I remember right.

752bro4 said:

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2 each of Gold and SFTB for me in Barcelona

And one of the golds will be gone before we make it back

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Sweet. Do you remember which terminal? Headed to Barcelona this summer.

It may be, but it is not my favorite so I just did not expect it. I tend to be more of a George Dickle fan when it comes to Tennessee Whiskey.

It was strange, I saw Jack Daniels and Coors Light on draft in several pubs while over there. With all the choices available those struck me a funny.

Edit for spelling dumb

Walked into some tickets for game 1 of the regional Friday in Austin so I'll be around this weekend if you want to trade samples/pours

Batch 2017-03, 125.9 proof, aged 6y 5m 25d apparently. They put a lot of info on this packaging which is nice

Jayelbee,
Florida has ABC stores and private stores. Based on what I keep seeing here regarding in-Texas supply, you'll likely be happy with the selections in Orlando. Florida ABC's handle the crazy allocations In the Fall via lottery, but keep up a good regular stock. Private stores seem to be a crap shoot with less likelihood of a major score. I don't recall any notable Orlando shops, only b/c I'm not able to really shop around there with a carload of kids waiting on me.

jayelbee said:

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Does bourbon get run on in Florida like it does in Texas? Are there any bottle shops near Disney that are worth visiting?

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I went hunting last year in the area. Things like Knob Creek 25th were readily available, however all the stuff we're searching for was gone just like here.

I did find some FR store picks here and there though.

Yellow Rose Outlaw Bourbon Whiskey

Nose: Toasted corn (go figure, since it says it is 100% corn)
Taste: A little flat. Some smokiness and a little sweet; maybe a hint of caramel. Pleasant, lingering heat.

They must use regular corn; this bourbon doesn't taste like an old shoe like the one's made with blue corn. It says it is "aged at least one year"; doesn't seem like that was long enough. You can't taste the oak at all. It's pretty decent, I'll drink this bottle and enjoy it. I'd call it a 6 or 6.5 on a scale of 1-10. This is not a $50 bottle of bourbon. Hopefully they are able to age some future batches longer to get a deeper flavor profile.

If you look hard enough you can find ECBP B518 in the Houston area now

What about Dallas??

ECBP hit a couple Total Wines in dallas today. Whether they still have some for tomorrow, I don't know. But I believe I saw that Total Wine off 75 at Walnut Hill got 3 cases.

Sold out at Total Wine in Allen.

Twin Liquors is having a sale on whiskey - 15% off for two bottles or more through June 16 - if anyone is interested.

There are a few bottles of the ECBP B518 left in West Houston at the Goody Goody on HWY 6 South

Weird that there's so much B518 floating around Texas. I don't think near this much A118 made it this way

CharlieBrown17 said:

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Weird that there's so much B518 floating around Texas. I don't think near this much A118 made it this way

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Nope

Is there any bourbon distilled in Texas that is worth what they are charging for it?

Trinity Ag said:

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Is there any bourbon distilled in Texas that is worth what they are charging for it?

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They are two that I like::
* TX Texas Straight Bourbon Whiskey from F&R Distilling in Ft Worth
* Small Batch Texas Bourbon Whiskey from Fire Oak Distillery in Liberty Hill

Both are reasonably priced and pretty good.

I like what Whitmeyer's is doing, but I'm not sure it's $80 juice. I keep buying it, but if it wasn't made here in Houston there's no way I'd pay that for it.

jh0400 said:

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I like what Whitmeyer's is doing, but I'm not sure it's $80 juice. I keep buying it, but if it wasn't made here in Houston there's no way I'd pay that for it.

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agreed. I've heard the cask strength is good but not at $69 a bottle at specs. That's the MSRP for ORVW, but not like we can find it.

jh0400 said:

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I like what Whitmeyer's is doing, but I'm not sure it's $80 juice. I keep buying it, but if it wasn't made here in Houston there's no way I'd pay that for it.

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This is exactly what I mean.

90% of it is merchant whiskey that wouldn't compare to Buffalo Trace or WT101, but they are charging $40-50 per bottle.

The other 10% seems to be 1-2 years old, and they are asking premium money for it.

I understand the concept of marketing -- and Lord know Texans like to buy Texas stuff -- but this doesn't seem sustainable.

Is there any Texas distillery that has the scope and scale (production, rickhouse storage, sufficient financial runway) to eventually mass market quality whiskey, aged 6-10 years?

Interesting story on Whitmeyers: Whitmeyers Distillery

The issue with "craft bourbon" compared to "craft beer" is that the small batch product isn't actually better than the large scale alternative. And is generally both worse AND more expensive.

I get supporting local business, but I'm not generally willing to pay more for a crappier product.

Any bourbon that's legitimately aged that long in Texas will be an absolute oak monster, probably to the point of being nearly undrinkable. Its just too damned hot for too damned long in Texas to properly age a nice bourbon.

One of the biggest reasons so much of America's whiskey production in the Kentucky/Tennessee area is climate. Four distinct seasons a year, each almost exactly 3 months long, none being too severe. Perfect aging conditions.

The only way a Texas distiller could really compete would be climate controlled rickhouses, that could simulate a more temperate climate.

Trinity Ag said:

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This is exactly what I mean.

The issue with "craft bourbon" compared to "craft beer" is that the small batch product isn't actually better than the large scale alternative. And is generally both worse AND more expensive.

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I think there are some good small distilleries out there, but the bad ones outweigh the good by a fair margin. Same thing goes for craft beer. There are some very good craft breweries, but there are also a lot of very bad ones.

I'm a sucker for young juice from small distilleries though, and some of them have been known to put out good sourced whiskey while they're waiting on their own to be ready. Nelson's Greenbrier comes to mind on this front. The Belle Meade single barrel and special finish bottles are all pretty good LDI whiskey, and their 108 line that was distilled and aged in Nashville are really good two year old juice. Of course the cask strength 108 was $60 for a 375, so it should be really good.

John Francis Donaghy said:

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Any bourbon that's legitimately aged that long in Texas will be an absolute oak monster, probably to the point of being nearly undrinkable. Its just too damned hot for too damned long in Texas to properly age a nice bourbon.

One of the biggest reasons so much of America's whiskey production in the Kentucky/Tennessee area is climate. Four distinct seasons a year, each almost exactly 3 months long, none being too severe. Perfect aging conditions.

The only way a Texas distiller could really compete would be climate controlled rickhouses, that could simulate a more temperate climate.

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Nailed it. The idea that Texas distillers are missing the mark by having stuff aged 2 years instead of 6-10 is misguided from what I've heard. With as hot and humid as it is here, distillers I've talked to have said that when they try to go longer than a couple of years, all that's left is sludge. That said, because it's so hot and humid, you can get (what I think is) a good tasty product in a 2 year time frame that would be outrageously young if it was from Kentucky.

Quote:

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That said, because it's so hot and humid, you can get (what I think is) a good tasty product in a 2 year time frame that would be outrageously young if it was from Kentucky.

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I thought it was more about the seasons hot to cold several times in a year rather than just staying hot? The change in seasons (temps) pushes the whiskey in and out of the barrels and when it's just hot all the time that's not happening right? At least that's what they said on the makers mark tour I took last summer. They age theirs to taste rather than age because they say it depends on what I just referenced.

BQRyno said:

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John Francis Donaghy said:

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Any bourbon that's legitimately aged that long in Texas will be an absolute oak monster, probably to the point of being nearly undrinkable. Its just too damned hot for too damned long in Texas to properly age a nice bourbon.

One of the biggest reasons so much of America's whiskey production in the Kentucky/Tennessee area is climate. Four distinct seasons a year, each almost exactly 3 months long, none being too severe. Perfect aging conditions.

The only way a Texas distiller could really compete would be climate controlled rickhouses, that could simulate a more temperate climate.

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Nailed it. The idea that Texas distillers are missing the mark by having stuff aged 2 years instead of 6-10 is misguided from what I've heard. With as hot and humid as it is here, distillers I've talked to have said that when they try to go longer than a couple of years, all that's left is sludge. That said, because it's so hot and humid, you can get (what I think is) a good tasty product in a 2 year time frame that would be outrageously young if it was from Kentucky.

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Yes, you can get the oak flavor into a bourbon quicker, but you won't get the benefit of time when it comes to mellowing the juice. What you'll end up with is a very sharp, oaky bourbon, that still has a lot of corn taste to it, which is basically what Garrison Brothers puts out. They are the closest ones to doing it like the big boys, and that's the end result.

agcrock2005 said:

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Quote:

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That said, because it's so hot and humid, you can get (what I think is) a good tasty product in a 2 year time frame that would be outrageously young if it was from Kentucky.

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I thought it was more about the seasons hot to cold several times in a year rather than just staying hot? The change in seasons (temps) pushes the whiskey in and out of the barrels and when it's just hot all the time that's not happening right? At least that's what they said on the makers mark tour I took last summer. They age theirs to taste rather than age because they say it depends on what I just referenced.

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You are exactly correct. But extreme heat introduces an additional factor on top of that dynamic. Think about dropping a tea bag in a cup of cool water, vs. A mug of hot water. That tea is going to steep much faster in the piping hot water.

In a rickhouse in 100+ degree heat, that stays that way for 5+ months at a time. That oak flavor from the wood is going to steep into the juice much more quckly than in 85-90 degree heat that drops back to the 50's or 60's overnight every night.

John Francis Donaghy said:

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Any bourbon that's legitimately aged that long in Texas will be an absolute oak monster, probably to the point of being nearly undrinkable. Its just too damned hot for too damned long in Texas to properly age a nice bourbon.

One of the biggest reasons so much of America's whiskey production in the Kentucky/Tennessee area is climate. Four distinct seasons a year, each almost exactly 3 months long, none being too severe. Perfect aging conditions.

The only way a Texas distiller could really compete would be climate controlled rickhouses, that could simulate a more temperate climate.

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I agree that you couldn't build 5 story, open air rickhouses in Houston or Dallas.

But the climate in Fredericksburg/Kerrville is pretty close to southern KY and TN. Summers are similar. Winters are a little less cold, and drier. Average temps are actually a little lower than Lynchburg.

If you can't do it here, then you can't do it here. Which makes me dubious of the future for the big "craft" industry in Texas charging premium prices for marginal bourbons