I'm a Marine Officer stationed in Bangor, WA. Last night I closed the deal on a new Toyota Tacoma. As a proud Ag, I took my 12th Man Foundation and Association of Former Students stickers to put on. Turns out the finance manager was a Marine in the 1970s. After we chatted about his service and changes in the Marine Corps from my decade of service and his, I asked for window cleaner to put the stickers on. Once he saw the stickers he got even more excited. He quickly told me how the best Officers he served with were Aggies. He continued to talk for a solid 5 min. about how much better the Aggies were than the other Officers he served with. Just wanted to say I'm thankful for those who came before me and helped build the Aggie and Marine reputations. Gig 'em and Semper Fi.

Too bad you didn't reveal all this BEFORE you bought the truck!

wtf are you doing in bangor?

Nuke sites? Security up there I'm guessing?

I used to be a pest on one of the TTech message boards, so you can imagine how loved I was and how anti-A&M they were.

Somehow I found out that a poster was former enlisted Army. Also found out that he had served under a mutual friend, the late Marcus G. Dudley '75, who was my 1st SGT as a BQ fish.

The guy said flat out that Marc was the finest officer under which he ever served.

Lmao Navy weapon watch....

Only had the pleasure of serving under one Ag. He was a weapons officer on my first ship. He was one of the best DIVO's on the ship.

Yep, there have been some outstanding officers in the military components over time.

Now, here's a toss up for you, how many AGGIES have earned 4 stars in the (1.) US Army and 2.) USMC?

None of you know how many AGGIES have achieved the 4 star status in the US ARMY or usmc?

It was already debated on here...so guess nobody wants to rehash?

Guess not, but some of you marine AGS and ARMY AGS need to step up, take some chances and win them, hen get promoted to 4 stars. The chances in the USMC are likely better than in the Army. Somebody, do it!

First Name Middle Initial Last Name Rank Service Class Stars
Otto P. Weyland GENERAL USAF 1923 4
Bernard A. Schriever GENERAL USAF 1931 4
Jerome J. Johnson ADMIRAL USN 1956 4
Joseph W. Ashy GENERAL USAF 1962 4
Patrick K. Gamble GENERAL USAF 1967 4
Hal M. Hornburg GENERAL USAF 1968 4
Teed M. Moseley GENERAL USAF 1971 4
William M. Frazier III GENERAL USAF 1974 4

Andrew D. Bruce LT GENERAL USA 1916 3
John T Walker LT GENERAL USMC 1917 3
Ion M. Bethel LT GENERAL USMC 1925 3
Robert W. Colglazier LT GENERAL USAR 1925 3
Harry H. Critz LT GENERAL USA 1934 3
Ormond R. Simpson LT GENERAL USMC 1936 3
Woodrow W. Vaughan LT GENERAL USA 1936 3
James F. Hollingsworth LT GENERAL USA 1940 3
Herron M. Maples LT GENERAL USA 1940 3
Jay T. Robbins LT GENERAL USAF 1940 3
John H. Miller LT GENERAL USMC 1946 3
Eivind H. Johansen LT GENERAL USA 1950 3
Herman O. Thompson LT GENERAL USAF 1951 3
Richard T. Gaskill VICE ADMIRAL USN 1952 3
Kenneth E. Lewi LT GENERAL USA 1952 3
James S. Cassity, Jr. LT GENERAL USAF 1957 3
Melvin F. Chubb, Jr. LT GENERAL USAF 1962 3
David B. Robinson V ADMIRAL USN 1962 3
James T. Scott LT GENERAL USA 1964 3
Herbert A. Browne VICE ADMIRAL USN 1965 3
Theodore G. Stroup LT GENERAL USA 1965 3
Leonard D. Holder, Jr. LT GENERAL USA 1966 3
Donald L Peterson LT GENERAL USAF 1966 3
John A. Van Alstyne LT GENERAL USA 1966 3
Randolph W. House LT GENERAL USA 1967 3
John B. Sylvester LT GENERAL USA 1967 3
Gerald F. Perryman, Jr. LT GENERAL USAF 1970 3
Patrick P. Caruana LT GENERAL USAF 1972 3
Joseph F. Weber LT GENERAL USMC 1972 3
Loyd S. Utterback LT GENERAL USAF 1975 3
Alfred G. Harms, Jr. VICE ADMIRAL USN 1978 3


Bennet Puryear, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USA 1906 2
George F. Moore MAJ GENERAL USA 1908 2
Howard C. Davidson MAJ GENERAL USAF 1911 2
William E. Farthing MAJ GENERAL USAF 1914 2
Roderick R. Allen MAJ GENERAL USA 1915 2
Percy W. Clarkson MAJ GENERAL USA 1915 2
Edmond H. Leavey MAJ GENERAL USA 1915 2
Ralph H. Wooten MAJ GENERAL USAF 1916 2
Albert M. Bledsoe REAR ADMIRAL USN 1917 2
Harry H. Johnson MAJ GENERAL USA 1917 2
Herman M Ainsworth MAJ GENERAL USA 1919 2
J. D. Hill MAJ GENERAL USA 1921 2
Gerald Bogle REAR ADMIRAL USN 1923 2
Robert B. Williams MAJ GENERAL USAF 1923 2
William D. Old MAJ GENERAL USAF 1924 2
Manning E Tillery MAJ GENERAL USAF 1926 2
William L Kennedy MAJ GENERAL USAF 1928 2
George P. Munson, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USAR 1928 2
Stuart S. Hoff MAJ GENERAL USA 1929 2
Benjamin H. Pochyla MAJ GENERAL USA 1929 2
Frederick H. Weston MAJ GENERAL TX ARNG 1929 2
Alvin R. Luedecke MAJ GENERAL USAF 1932 2
James Earl Rudder MAJ GENERAL USAR 1932 2
John H. White MAJ GENERAL USAF 1932 2
Robert F. Worden MAJ GENERAL USAF 1933 2
Bruno A. Hochmuth MAJ GENERAL USMC 1935 2
Raymond A. Moore REAR ADMIRAL USN 1935 2
Raymond L. Murray MAJ GENERAL USMC 1935 2
Wood B. Kyle MAJ GENERAL USMC 1936 2
Robert L. Pou, Jr. MAJ GENERAL TX ARNG 1937 2
Andrew P. Rollins, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USA 1939 2
John H. Buckner MAJ GENERAL USAF 1940 2
Homer S. Hill MAJ GENERAL USMC 1940 2
William A. Becker MAJ GENERAL USA 1941 2
George L. Cassell REAR ADMIRAL USN 1941 2
Otto E. Scherz MAJ GENERAL TX ARNG 1942 2
Harold C. Teubner MAJ GENERAL USAF 1942 2
Harold B. Gibson MAJ GENERAL USA 1943 2
Tom E. Marchbanks, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USAF 1943 2
Homer D. Smith MAJ GENERAL USA 1943 2
Merton D. Van Orden REAR ADMIRAL USN 1943 2
Wesley E. Peel MAJ GENERAL USA 1946 2
William L. Webb, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USA 1946 2
Guy H. Goddard MAJ GENERAL USAF 1947 2
Charles R. Bond, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USAF 1949 2
Robert E. Crosser MAJ GENERAL USAR 1949 2
Charles I. McGinnis MAJ GENERAL USA 1949 2
James L. Brown MAJ GENERAL USAF 1950 2
Glenn H. Kothmann MAJ GENERAL TX ARNG 1950 2
Waymond C. Nutt MAJ GENERAL USAF 1951 2
Howard H. Haynes REAR ADMIRAL USN 1952 2
Charles H. Kone MAJ GENERAL TX ARNG 1952 2
John H. Storrie MAJ GENERAL USAF 1952 2
James W. Taylor MAJ GENERAL USAF 1952 2
William R. Wray MAJ GENERAL USA 1952 2
Dionel E. Aviles MAJ GENERAL USAR 1953 2
Charles R. Cargill MAJ GENERAL USAFR 1953 2
Harry V. Steel, Jr. MAJ GENERAL TX ARNG 1953 2
G. J. Wilson, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USAR 1953 2
Thomas G. Darling MAJ GENERAL USAF 1954 2
George H. Akin MAJ GENERAL USA 1956 2
Don O. Daniel MAJ GENERAL TX ARNG 1956 2
Thomas R. Olsen MAJ GENERAL USAF 1956 2
Paul L. Greenberg MAJ GENERAL USA 1958 2
Sam C. Turk MAJ GENERAL TX ARNG 1958 2
Ira E. Scott MAJ GENERAL TSG 1959 2
James R. Taylor MAJ GENERAL USA 1959 2
Richard A. Box MAJ GENERAL TSG 1961 2
Robert Smith III REAR ADMIRAL USNR 1961 2
Darrel P. Baker MAJ GENERAL TX ARNG 1962 2
John J. Closner III MAJ GENERAL USAFR 1962 2
Jay T. Edwards III MAJ GENERAL USAF 1962 2
Charles W. McClain, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USA 1962 2
Walter B. Moore MAJ GENERAL USA 1962 2
Gerald H. Putnam MAJ GENERAL USA 1962 2
Jay D. Blume, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USAF 1963 2
Billy G. McCoy MAJ GENERAL USAF 1963 2
Hiram H. Burr, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USAF 1965 2
Marvin Ted Hopgood MAJ GENERAL USMC 1965 2
James M. Hurley MAJ GENERAL USAF 1965 2
John E. Simek MAJ GENERAL USAR 1965 2
Alvin W. Jones MAJ GENERAL USAR 1966 2
Frank D. Watson MAJ GENERAL USAFR 1966 2
Geoffrey L. Chesbrough REAR ADMIRAL USN 1967 2
Joe M. Ernst MAJ GENERAL USAR 1967 2
Richard L. Engel MAJ GENERAL USAF 1968 2
Michael C. Kostelnik MAJ GENERAL USAF 1968 2
William W. Pickavance, Jr. REAR ADMIRAL USN 1968 2
Kenneth W. Hess MAJ GENERAL USAF 1969 2
Wilbert D. Pearson, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USAF 1969 2
Veerapun Putamanonda MAJ GENERAL RTA 1969 2
Michael H. Taylor MAJ GENERAL TX ARNG 1970 2
Darren G. Owens MAJ GENERAL TX ARNG 1973 2
William H. McCoy, Jr. MAJ GENERAL USA 1973 2
Randolph D. Alles MAJ GENERAL USMC 1975 2
James W. Robinson MAJ GENERAL TSG 1975 2
Harold Gary Bunch MAJ GENERAL USA 1976 2
P. David Gillett MAJ GENERAL USAF 1976 2
Robert C. Williams MAJ GENERAL USPHS 1976 2
Floyd F. Carpenter MAJ GENERAL USAF 1977 2
David A. Rubenstein MAJ GENERAL USA 1977 2
James W. Hyatt MAJ GENERAL USAF 1980 2
Merdith W. B. (Bo) MAJ GENERAL USA 1985 2
Eddy M. Spurgin MAJ GENERAL TX-ARNG 1980 2

Douglas B. Netherwood BRIG GENERAL USA 1908 1
John A. Warden BRIG GENERAL USA 1908 1
William C. Crane, Jr. BRIG GENERAL USA 1910 1
John F. Davis BRIG GENERAL USA 1911 1
Oscar B. Abbott BRIG GENERAL USA 1913 1
Eugene A. Eversberg BRIG GENERAL USAR 1913 1
Jerome J. Waters BRIG GENERAL USA 1913 1
Robert R. Neyland, Jr. BRIG GENERAL USA 1914 1
Victor A. Barraco BRIG GENERAL USMC 1915 1
Claudius M. Easley BRIG GENERAL USA 1916 1
Durant S. Buchanan BRIG GENERAL USMC 1917 1
Walter T. H. Galliford BRIG GENERAL USMC 1917 1
Nat S. Perrine BRIG GENERAL USA 1917 1
George H. Beverley BRIG GENERAL USAF 1919 1
Paul L. Neal BRIG GENERAL USA 1919 1
John L. Pierce BRIG GENERAL USA 1919 1
Arthur B. Knickerbocker BRIG GENERAL TX ARNG 1921 1
Cranford C. Warden BRIG GENERAL USA 1921 1
Aubry L. Moore BRIG GENERAL USAF 1923 1
Spencer J. Buchanan BRIG GENERAL USAR 1925 1
William R. Frederick BRIG GENERAL USA 1925 1
Richard J. Werner BRIG GENERAL USA 1925 1
William L Lee BRIG GENERAL USAF 1927 1
James P. Newberry BRIG GENERAL USAF 1927 1
Charles S. Hays BRIG GENERAL USA 1932 1
Travis M. Hetherington BRIG GENERAL USAF 1932 1
John A. Hilger BRIG GENERAL USAF 1932 1
Graber Kidwell BRIG GENERAL USAR 1932 1
John M. Kenderdine BRIG GENERAL USA 1932 1
Odell M. Conoley BRIG GENERAL USMC 1935 1
Kay Halsell II BRIG GENERAL TX ARNG 1935 1
Clifford M. Simmang BRIG GENERAL USAR 1936 1
Carter C. Speed BRIG GENERAL USA 1936 1
Jack T. Brown BRIG GENERAL TX ARNG 1937 1
Kyle L. Riddle BRIG GENERAL USAF 1937 1
Theodore H. Andrews BRIG GENERAL USA 1938 1
David L. Hill BRIG GENERAL TX ANG 1938 1
Robert M. Williams BRIG GENERAL USA 1938 1
Clarence A. Wilson BRIG GENERAL USAR 1938 1
Ogbourne D. Butler BRIG GENERAL USAR 1939 1
Andrew W. Rogers BRIG GENERAL AUS 1939 1
Joe. G. Hanover, Jr. BRIG GENERAL AUS 1940 1
George P. Cole BRIG GENERAL USAF 1941 1
Thomas F. McCord BRIG GENERAL USA 1940 1
Hubert O. Johnson, Jr. BRIG GENERAL USAF 1941 1
Seaborn J. Buckalew, Jr. BRIG GENERAL USA 1942 1
Charles M. Taylor BRIG GENERAL CA ARNG 1942 1
Victor H. Thompson, Jr. BRIG GENERAL USAF 1942 1
Mike P. Cokinos BRIG GENERAL USAR 1943 1
Charles V.L. Elia BRIG GENERAL USA 1943 1
Jack N. Kraras BRIG GENERAL USA 1943 1
Guy M. Townsend BRIG GENERAL USAF 1943 1
George W. Connell BRIG GENERAL USA 1945 1
Irby B. Jarvis, Jr. BRIG GENERAL USAF 1945 1
Joseph E. Wesp BRIG GENERAL USAF 1945 1
Allen D. Rooke BRIG GENERAL USA 1946 1
David O. Williams, Jr. BRIG GENERAL USAF 1946 1
Thomas G. Murnane BRIG GENERAL USA 1947 1
Carl D. McIntosh BRIG GENERAL USAR 1948 1
Robert M. Mullens BRIG GENERAL USA 1948 1
John D. Roper BRIG GENERAL USAF 1948 1
Billy M. Vaughn BRIG GENERAL USA 1949 1
Walter O. Bachus BRIG GENERAL USA 1950 1
Wilman D. Barnes BRIG GENERAL USA 1951 1
Keith L. Hargrove BRIG GENERAL USAR 1951 1
Frank A. Ramsey BRIG GENERAL USA 1951 1
Walter Jack Dingler BRIG GENERAL TX ARNG 1952 1
Louis L. Stuart, Jr. BRIG GENERAL USAR 1952 1
Robert C. Beyer BRIG GENERAL USA 1953 1
George R. Harper BRIG GENERAL TX ARNG 1953 1
Robert O. Petty BRIG GENERAL USAF 1953 1
Charles M. Scott, Jr. BRIG GENERAL AZ ARNG 1953 1
Donald J. Johnson BRIG GENERAL TSG 1955 1
Woodrow A. Free BRIG GENERAL USAR 1956 1
Dennis A. Wilkie BRIG GENERAL USA 1956 1
Donald L. Moore BRIG GENERAL USAF 1957 1
Paul J. Carroll, Jr. BRIG GENERAL CA ANG 1958 1
John J. Roark BRIG GENERAL TX ARNG 1958 1
James E. Freytag BRIG GENERAL USAF 1959 1
Donald W. Mayhue BRIG GENERAL CAARNG 1959 1
John Serur BRIG GENERAL USAF 1959 1
Charles R. Weaver BRIG GENERAL TSG 1959 1
Ed W. Hall BRIG GENERAL SCSG 1960 1
Kenneth F. Keller BRIG GENERAL USAF 1960 1
Edmond S. Solymosy BRIG GENERAL USA 1960 1
Malcolm Bolton BRIG GENERAL USAF 1961 1
Don M. Ogg BRIG GENERAL TX ARNG 1961 1
Jimmy L. Cash BRIG GENERAL USAF 1962 1
Michael M. Schneider BRIG GENERAL USA 1962 1
John A. Hedrick BRIG GENERAL USA 1963 1
Ronald D. Gray BRIG GENERAL USAF 1964 1
George E. Chapman BRIG GENERAL USAF 1965 1
Manuel A Guzman BRIG GENERAL PR ARNG 1965 1
Lee V. Greer BRIG GENERAL USAF 1967 1
Samuel M Cannon BRIG GENERAL USA 1967 1
Stephen D. Korenek BRIG GENERAL AK ARNG 1968 1
Thomas S Bailey, Jr. BRIG GENERAL USA 1969 1
James A. Mobley BRIG GENERAL USAR 1969 1
James M. Richards III BRIG GENERAL USAF 1969 1
Robert T. Howard BRIG GENERAL USA 1970 1
Henry J. Ostermann BRIG GENERAL USAR 1972 1
Robert L. Herndon BRIG GENERAL USA 1973 1
Louis W. Weber BRIG GENERAL USA 1975 1
Walter L. Miller, Jr. BRIG GENERAL USMC 1979 1
Joe E. Ramirez BRIG GENERAL USA 1979 1
James K. Brown, Jr. BRIG GENERAL TX-ARNG 1975 1
Stephen W. Wilson BRIG GENERAL USAF 1981 1
Edward P. Yarish BRIG GENERAL USAF 1983 1
Gregory J. Lengyel BRIG GENERAL USAF 1985 1
Timothy S. Green BRIG GENERAL USAF 1986 1
Barrye L. Price BRIG GENERAL USA 1994 1
Tommie G. Smith BRIG GENERAL USA 2001 1

Thanks Frank, not a single 4 star Army, nor marine general from A&M. That's not A&M's fault, that's the Army and marines not selecting an AG for the 4th star.

Out of curiosity, how much correlation is there between these guy's achievements at aTm during college and their final rank in the service?

Were these the guys who were the top brass in the corps or just average guys...or even slackers?

quote:

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not a single 4 star Army, nor marine general from A&M

---

Weyland and Schriever both hit four stars in USAF, but most of their careers were in the Army before the Air Force became a separate branch.

And regarding the Marines, I thought there was only one 4-star in the Marines at any one time, the Commandant. Or is my memory faulty.

And the cadets I recall that reached flag rank, yeah, they pretty much kicked butt in college, too.

The Marines have two by statute, but those don't include a possible JCS Chair or Combatant Commander positions.

And I'd argue that position within the Corps is very weakly correlated to success in the military.

When I say "kicked butt", I meant they had good grades, did RV or otherwise were some sort of leadership position. Didn't mean that they were Corps Commander or anything.

I was just asking because I think I heard that Custer, and maybe Patton, was a terrible student and amost got kicked out of school and finished near the bottom of his class.

I'm sure many others who achieved a high rank have been highly driven in all phases of their life.

Last in Their Class: Custer, Pickett and the Goats of West Point

quote:

---

Today's Goat, the West Point cadet finishing at the bottom of his class, is temporary celebrity among his classmates. But in the 19th century, he was something of a cult figure. Custer's contemporaries at the Academy believed that the same spirit of adventure that led him to carouse at local taverns motivated his dramatic cavalry attacks in the Civil War and afterwards. And the same willingness to accept punishment from Academy authorities also sent George Pickett into the teeth of the Union guns at Gettsyburg. The story James S. Robbins tells goes from the beginnings of West Point through the carnage of the Civil War to the grassy bluffs over the Little Big Horn. The Goats he profiles tell us much about the soul of the American solider, his daring, imagination and desire to prove himself against high odds.

---

I think it depends. If you are the 'goat' because you'd rather be partying (Custer) you probably can succeed. If you're the goat because you are struggling (Pickett) not so much.

Was just checking some stuff on Patton. He flunked out and re-took his plebe year at West Point, but ended 46 out of 103. The author I read said the Patton suffered dyslexia. So he had a learning disability, but was darn smart.

I'm not a military guy, but from the few books I've read following our modern wars (Franks and Schwartzkopf sp?), it seems to be a pretty political dance to move up in the top end of the service. From what I gathered, it's almost as important to not step on anyone's toes and not stick your neck out as it is about ability.

Marine LT. General Joe Weber '72 VP Student Affairs 2008

Lt. General John Miller '49

Major Generals Randolph Alles '76, David Garza '77, Marvin Hopgood '65

Brig. General Walter Miller, Jr '79

All Marines !

[This message has been edited by BigJim49 AustinNowDallas (edited 10/17/2012 2:14p).]

Quite rigth, Big Jim, and not a single 4 star amonst them. The marines may be as political as the Army.

canyon, the marines have 4 star billets, and I'd have to check to see just how many, but they are somewhat more egalitarian, at least in voice, than any other service. It would seem that with the Red Ass drive of Aggies who are commissioned in the marines one of them would have achieved the 4 star mark. It ain;t happened yet.

quote:

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And I'd argue that position within the Corps is very weakly correlated to success in the military.

---

Possibly, perhaps even likely, but some Ags have made it up to cosmic level in the Navy and the Air Force, so the Corps is not at fault for lack of preparation for military advancement, it would seem. However, why not poll those upward bound officers on active duty and determine empiricallty, if (1) the Corps was a definite help for their careers, (2) somewhat helped, (3) had no real effect on their career advancement.

quote:

---

Tommie G. Smith BRIG GENERAL USA 2001 1

---

With all due respect, how does a guy make it up the ranks this quickly?

Assuming he graduated at 22, he would have made general at 33 years of age. What is the average age that someone reaches this rank?

pb - one might guess that he got an advanced degree from A&M, not an undergrad.

ahhh, ok, that makes more sense

He might be an MD. Some Meidcal Corps commissions (MD)starts at CPT, MAJ and above depending upon specialty and experience.

From aggienetwork.com:

Tommie G. Smith ’01

Army, Brig. Gen.

San Antonio, TX

Brig. Gen. Tommie G. Smith was born June 24, 1929. He graduated from Texas A&M University with a Masters degree in Educational Human Resources Development.

Brig. Gen. Tommie G. Smith is retired from his military career and currently resides in San Antonio, TX.

^ If that's true and he graduated from A&M in 2001 at age 72, it's safe to say that his Aggie experience had no bearing on his military career.

dork, did you mean '41?