Bop, if you are so interested in membership and possibly commisioning in the TSG, why don't you contact them?

http://www.gotxsg.com/units.php?send_to_url=/join.php

[This message has been edited by Bqaggie86 (edited 1/15/2012 9:22p).]

Not interested in membership, just thought someone would know answer to previous question posted.

Otherwise, if one does not possess extraordinarily occupational skills, political position, accumulative degrees, or civilian accomplishments (without ANY prior military experience) is the door to a TSG commission somewhat closed ?

It is my understanding that LTC Brewer is TSG (and that TSG is who promoted him from MAJ). But, I could be wrong.

More to the topic of salutes, I've been ordered to render, and volunteered salutes to a number of people who did not "rate' one. The MFA in Poetry who used to work at the Puzzle Palace leaps to mind for one example; members of the American Legion in a parade, for another.

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Without prior military experience, how can a degree, or specific skill, get you a commission in the TSG

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Who cares , lawyers/doctors/veterinarians receive commissions for having a degree/skill in the regular army.

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More to the topic of salutes, I've been ordered to render, and volunteered salutes to a number of people who did not "rate' one.

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Back in the dark ages when I began my term at Sing-Sing on the Brazos, for some reason, the custodial staff wore uniforms that had a military-like quality to them. Khaki, with epaulets, and a round service-hat looking headgear.

Never saw it myself, but it was alleged that some confused freshmen would salute them, mistaking them for officers.

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Who cares , lawyers/doctors/veterinarians receive commissions for having a degree/skill in the regular army.

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I know that you're trolling, which normally isn't allowed on this board, but for discussion's sake:

Yes, they receive commissions. From the POTUS. In the Regular Army. That's the point of this discussion. Do you have to salute someone who is an officer in the TSG if you are in the Regular Army (or USMC, etc).

Per Army Regulation, the answer is no. I looked it up, you do not have to salute them because they are not commissioned in federal service by the POTUS. They are commissioned by the governor of Texas. So, there you are.

Non-prior service personnel in the Texas State Guard may be directly commissioned as officers if they have a particular skill such as a licensed medical professional.

Other members may be promoted to an officer after serving in the State Guard, and holding at least a 4-year college degree, applying for, and being accepted into Officer Candidate School-probably only 50 or so OCS folks a year-and it's not a guaranteed pass. There is also a warrant Officer commissioning path for technical specialists.

Regarding salutes, TXSG is a part of the Texas Military Forces, answerable to the Adjutant General and the Governor. All State Guard troops are trained to display military courtesy to regular, national guard, and reserve troops of all ranks, with saluting as appropriate based on rank.

If one of those troops chooses not to reciprocate the courtesy, I guess that's on them. However, if they are in the Texas Army or Air National Guard, they may be standing tall in front of the Man who will expect an explanation if they feel State Guard officers do not warrant basic military courtesy.

I hope this will put this whole matter to rest-as I sense some trolling from some folks who don't know the real story, nor seek to find out.

54...
Thank you !

Since this is TexAgs, and it's not TexAgs w/o thread drift . . .

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Never saw it myself, but it was alleged that some confused freshmen would salute them, mistaking them for officers.

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More than once, in a lifetime around such things, I have seen CPO (E-7 aka "Chief" saluted with adjacent officers ignored. Probably worst around A&M with Chiefs in white or blue uniforms and the officers in Service Dress Khaki (esp. while wearing overseas covers).

When IT happens its an abominal disgrace to those who've "paid their dues" properly.

TSG simply needs to change uniform and rank insignas and not piggy-back copy-cat the REAL deal.

I'd rather those Navy guys wear rank that I can understand. Although it was nice the attention I got when I called the VOQ at CC NAS when I was a Captain in the Army.

Thanks RangerAg. I guess it would depend on where I was working and who I worked for. LoL, not sure I care much for the idea of saluting TSG folks and "the MAN" I work for probably feels the same way.

FLYArmy97, didn't know he was an MI officer. interesting. Although I'll be long retired before I see GO status! LoL







We keep you alive to serve this ship. Row well, and live!

[This message has been edited by CAVGrunt97 (edited 1/22/2012 9:52a).]

Now we come to the delicate issue of an officer of the TSG (say a Captain or Colonel) first iniitiating a salute to lesser rank in the Regular or Reserve US military (to say a 2nd or 1st Lt) ?

And please don't tell Bop the occasion does not present somewhat of a dilemma !

How about enlisted ranks of the Regular or Reserve saluting officers of the TSG ?

GOOD BET - THERE'S NEVER BEEN A WRITTEN POLICY (AR's) COVERNING THIS TOPIC.

[This message has been edited by BeBopAg (edited 1/22/2012 12:30p).]

Man, I guess old BeBop has a real bug up his ass against the Texas State Guard. Time for him to let it go. TSG is a lawful state militia and is part of the Texas Military Forces. I have no idea why a TSG officer would salute any lower ranking officer, regardless of service. Remember, many state guard officers are prior service and have already earned the right to wear the uniform. Many are combat vets.

Okay, Bob, here's the scoop from a retired Navy Captain who used to be Chief of Staff of TSG's Maritime Regiment until had to quit to fight cancer. This is what I posted on TexAgs sometime back regarding TSG Commissions:

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Officer Commissioning Requirements

1. Prior Service Officers – can come in at former Federal Commissioned rank (plus one, but no higher than O6 or CW5)
2. Prior Service Enlisted – can come in at former Federal Enlisted rank (plus one, but no higher than E7). For O1 Commission:
a. Prior Federal Service/Currently Enlisted in TXSG– max 45 YOA; minimum 3 yrs ACDU or 5 yrs RESDU; minimum E5; served in leadership position; minimum 60 hrs college; 1 yr enlisted member of TXSG; memo of recommendation from unit CO; complete TXSG OCS w/in 2 yrs.
b. Prior Federal Service/Currently Enlisted in TXSG/OCS Candidate – max 35 YOA; federal active duty or reserve duty; minimum 60 hrs college; 1 yr enlisted member of TXSG; memo of recommendation from unit CO, CSM/CCM/MCPOC; pass physical exam; complete OCS; complete required professional courses within 24 months thereafter.
3. Non-Prior Service
a. Non Prior Federal or State Service/New Applicant with Professional Skills – Chaplain, Medical, Judge Advocate, and Info Tech fields may receive direct commissions based on various factors to determine entry rank.
b. Non-Prior Federal Service/Currently Enlisted in TXSG/OCS Candidate – max 35 YOA; minimum Bachelor Degree; complete TXSG Basic Orientation Training (BOT) course; 2 yr enlisted member of TXSG; pass physical exam; complete Officer Basic Course/ASPC w/in 24 mos.
4. Non-Prior or Prior Federal Service/Currently Enlisted in TXSG – max 35 YOA; minimum Bachelor Degree; 4 yrs college ROTC completed; participating member of TXSG; memo of recommendation from commander; complete OBC/ASPC w/in 24 months.

Warrant Officer Requirements

Max 60 YOA; minimum of 3 yrs federal service; minimum 30 hours college; 1 yr enlisted member of TXSG; current TXSG minimum of E7; memo of recommendation from Commander; complete required professional courses within 24 months.

NOTE: as with all other military programs, if you don’t find a perfect match to your situation in the above outline, there may be alternative routes to a commission. If you want a commission, don’t give up on it until you receive a final “turn-down” letter. There are waivers available for various reasons. Contact the Maritime Regiment recruited at www.gotxsg.com for more information and let you desires be known. We would love to have more Ags in the fold!

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If you'd like to read the regs, I can send you copies. Email me at leeroy dot lance at gmail dot com and I'll be glad to send you a copy of what I have (circa 2009).

O.K., let's just say military and quasi-military saluting etiquette and/or priorities are all somewhat immaterialy insignificant.

Just hope someone's a$$ does not get chewed-out by a superior rank.

From what I've read, the TSG seems to do its own thing at National Guard centers and its training sites, so if regular military and TSG are out together, I'm assuming the **** has hit the fan and who salutes whom is the least of their worries.

I think Bop has got to be the best Troll ever.

Never had any problems with saluting between NG and TSG...since we all came under the Governor as our Commander in Chief and the State Adjutant General as our overall commander, AND all being part of the State Military Forces, we rendered proper greetings, salutes and respect accordingly. You can find reference to the "State Military Forces" and the "Adjutant General" in Texas Government Code, Chapter 431.

[This message has been edited by Lee72 (edited 1/24/2012 2:21p).]

My two cents, at least with regard to A&M. When you consider the combined total of ROTC & Commandant's Office staff & cadre, you have a mix of active component, reserve component on active duty, reserve component not on active duty, retirees and Texas State Guard. To the cadets, it should be transparent, and I would think that all cadre/staff are professional enough not to draw distinctions between anyone's status.

As far as saluting goes, in the Civil Air Patrol, it's clearly deliniated in their regs and in training that members, no matter of rank, are supposed to salute USAF Officers regardless of their rank. HOWEVER, usually folks abide by normal saluting practices based on the rank they see, that is, a USAF Capt will most likely salute me first as I wear CAP Lt Col rank (and being a real USN O6 under the CAP uniform, I have a real bone in my craw about saluting a junior officer first...so I don't...if he blows me off, so be it...if he decides he wants to make an issue of it, I'll pull out my USN ID and go from there to see how much he wants to bicker about it). I've not yet met a junior USAF officer who has not rendered salutes to my CAP rank (maybe because they we are usually on USAF training bases where many nationalities are lodged and it is best to err on the side of maybe than to err on the side of wrong.

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I think Bop has got to be the best Troll ever.

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^This
His tenacity and skill at trolling are truly impressive.

Bop thinks EVERY entering Texas A&M freshman (and transfer student) who opts out of joining the Cadet Corps should be given a personal orientation pitch as to the attributes and values of voluntary joining the Texas State Guard.

Texas A&M should certainly have the highest percentage of "university students in the state" as members of the Texas State Guard.

D&C's should have the same orientation program (not via Internet) but in person or via an assembly.

Let us not forget that TXSG members qualify for tuition reimbursement (although it is a very small amount) Unfortunately, college students in the TXSG are usually considered nondeployable in emergencies because school comes first.

A member of the state legislature can be in the TSG and be awarded a rank regardless of prior service. I know this cause a friend is a state rep and was invited to join the TSG and has the rank of ..cough cough.... Major.... no prior service.

Wonder if one could purchase rank in the TSG via a political contributions or whatever ?

[This message has been edited by BeBopAg (edited 2/2/2012 7:50p).]

BeBop ~ rank is not just handed out in the Texas State Guard. Direct commissioning requirements are very similar to the federal services - Doctors, Lawyers, Vets, and Chaplains for example. Most of the officers have had federally recognized commissions see the info on BG Rodriguez that was posted earlier.
Soldiers in the Texas State Guard are authorized under Title 32 United States Code Section 109 and under Chapter 431 of the Texas Government Code. Soldiers also fall under the juridiction of the Texas Code of Military Justice as do the Army and Air National Guard when not in title 10 status.

Here are some articles concerning the Texas State Guard if you would like to read them:
http://www.txsg.state.tx.us/news/article.aspx?id=20110506
Here is one concerning some officer appointments - I am sure they would both be happy to answer any questions about their qualifications.
http://www.txsg.state.tx.us/news/article.aspx?id=20100801

Also, if you have any other questions, I would be happy to answer them. I have never had any problems with any National Guard troops concerning my rank when I am preparing their will or power of attorney during their SRP or defending them as their counsel in Admin separation boards. You can also contact Col. Betty in the Trigon as he came into the State Guard after retiring from federal service as an O-6.



[This message has been edited by law-aggie90 (edited 2/6/2012 4:57p).]

This thread is ridiculous. These men and women voluntarily put on a uniform to serve the great state of Texas. That should be commended, not ridiculed.

Ever state in the U.S.A. should have similar HOME GUARD units with the same quasi-military standards.

O.K., uniforms can be different.

BeBop,
I agree. The state defense forces have come a long way in the last several years. At one time, during WWII, they were quite strong but then became more of a good ol boys network. But with the increased use of the national guard and the global war on terror, state defense forces have again become relevant and called upon for both homeland security missions as well as defense support of civil authorities for natural disasters, shelter and recovery operations. Now, with increased standards for training and education and actual missions the state guard has grown in areas of responsiblity and effectiveness. Many of our soldiers are prior federal troops with combat experience and some of those were wounded and could not continue their federal service but still have the desire to serve and are still able to serve the Texas State Guard in a non-combat capacity.
Texas has the largest state defense force, but Alaska, California, Tennessee, New York and Maryland also have quiet active defense forces.

Hurrah, and all power to the State Guard Forces of the U.S.A..

Bop still thinks something is terribly wrong when a 2nd Lt, say one uniformed and serving in the Regular Army or USAF, is required to initiate a salute to a 1st Lt or Captain in State Home Guard uniform (when or wherever) and as an individual who may possibly have never served one day of Active Duty military service.

As a cadet, my buddies and I always perceived the Texas State Guard ranks as somewhat "artificial." Nonetheless, all those guys working at A&M had positional authority over us, so we showed the appropriate respect.

Nowadays, I think the State Guard would be a pretty great way to continue to serve after I finish my 20 years.

If an AD 2LT salutes any 1LT, he deserves all the 2LT jokes he gets.

Now, seriously, can we let this thread die?

Ever hear a 1st Lt ask another 1st Lt their DOR (date of rank).

In some situations...longivity in rank does have some seniority bearing or protocol (yea, as in who is actually giving orders to whom).

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If an AD 2LT salutes any 1LT, he deserves all the 2LT jokes he gets.

Now, seriously, can we let this thread die?

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I agree