Get out of the city while your kids are young and there's nothing tying you/them down.
Moving to small town to get out of debt
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Last: 1 yr ago by canadianAg
This. Our kids are 8 and 12 now, so we're stuck in our current situation for another 10 years or so (that and my in-laws currently live in our guest house). We feel like we are too involved now with friends, sports, etc. to move them to a new place.NoahAg said:
Get out of the city while your kids are young and there's nothing tying you/them down.
We moved from Frisco to Granbury about 17 years ago, and I couldn't move back now. I was in tech at that point, and in a family business now.
I can't help you decide because you know your situation more than me, but I will say this... I love living in a smaller town.
We make it up to FTW (about 30 mins away) once or twice a month... everything that we need is pretty much here. Schools are good enough to get your kids into college and do well there. I have 2 in college and 2 about to be.
There is some small town politics, but there is definitely quite a bit more community than other places where I have lived.
Taxes are much better than the metroplex, and the quality of life seems better as well. We know several families that have moved to the area to get out of the metro-mess and they love it as well. Plenty of things to do, especially for an active family.
The only negative for us was travel ball... had to travel quite a bit on select/AAU teams... but the move was still worth it.
I can't help you decide because you know your situation more than me, but I will say this... I love living in a smaller town.
We make it up to FTW (about 30 mins away) once or twice a month... everything that we need is pretty much here. Schools are good enough to get your kids into college and do well there. I have 2 in college and 2 about to be.
There is some small town politics, but there is definitely quite a bit more community than other places where I have lived.
Taxes are much better than the metroplex, and the quality of life seems better as well. We know several families that have moved to the area to get out of the metro-mess and they love it as well. Plenty of things to do, especially for an active family.
The only negative for us was travel ball... had to travel quite a bit on select/AAU teams... but the move was still worth it.
I would move to a small town in a heartbeat, but my damn wife is a Plano native and can't be more than 2 miles from a f'in walmart or costco.
I grew up in Plano... we do Costco once or twice a month up in the Hulen area... not a big deal... just have to plan a bit more.
I overbuy toilet paper though... we could probably go 2 more covids before having to buy it again. :-)
I overbuy toilet paper though... we could probably go 2 more covids before having to buy it again. :-)
First, you need to figure out WHO you want to live near. If you have family that you want in your life on a regular basis, or in your kids life, you need to be within 10-15 minutes of them. People and relationships are the most important aspects of life. Make them a priority and you can work out the rest.
Schools - there are ways to make it work in most any district. Charter schools now bring a lot of options as does home-school. I would not move somewhere just for a school district without significant other connections.
529 Plan - In 10 years college will likely be tuition-free except perhaps the elite schools. You won't need to pay for college. Instead, use the money now to invest in and develop kids to highest level while young. I realize this sounds risky, but it's moving that way.
Schools - there are ways to make it work in most any district. Charter schools now bring a lot of options as does home-school. I would not move somewhere just for a school district without significant other connections.
529 Plan - In 10 years college will likely be tuition-free except perhaps the elite schools. You won't need to pay for college. Instead, use the money now to invest in and develop kids to highest level while young. I realize this sounds risky, but it's moving that way.
You can also pay for private school now with a 529 plan.
YouBet said:
I was fling to add....You had me until Wichita Falls.
I would consider other options.
And Wichita Falls is not a small town. A small city maybe but not a small town.
I want to move home so bad. Wouldnt necessarily be cheaper but certainly better quality. Wife doesn't like the idea though.
Ragoo said:
I want to move home so bad. Wouldnt necessarily be cheaper but certainly better quality. Wife doesn't like the idea though.
I find that a woman giving their experience does 10000x more to persuade my wife than me begging for years. I would find a female to share her experience with your wife. I have had a friend come stay with us specifically so my wife would talk it up to his wife over the weekend.
I'll give you my story, purely from the financial side--maybe it is cautionary, maybe not. I will say that we love living in a small town, and don't regret it.
We moved from San Antonio in 2010 to the rural Midwest. We have purchased two different houses, outgrowing our first one a few years after we moved into it. While we certainly didn't lose money, we had nowhere near the appreciation we would have had, if we'd moved to another home in SA or any other big city in TX. Conversely, our retirement accounts are healthy, we have 'lots of house for the money', and our kids college funds are doing very well. However, moving back to Texas at this point would be a complete economic shock--we would downsize drastically, increase our property taxes by 3-400% and probably live much further from big city amenities than we currently do.
Where some people downsize out of a house to fund retirement/lifestyle, you'll effectively be doing this now. I would say its much more difficult to move back into the city than you are making it out to be, because you won't have the near the appreciation in a rural community. Second, those fat retirement and college accounts won't be available to you to use for anything for years to come. We love where we are, but 14 years in, the idea of moving back to TX seems less and less reasonable.
We moved from San Antonio in 2010 to the rural Midwest. We have purchased two different houses, outgrowing our first one a few years after we moved into it. While we certainly didn't lose money, we had nowhere near the appreciation we would have had, if we'd moved to another home in SA or any other big city in TX. Conversely, our retirement accounts are healthy, we have 'lots of house for the money', and our kids college funds are doing very well. However, moving back to Texas at this point would be a complete economic shock--we would downsize drastically, increase our property taxes by 3-400% and probably live much further from big city amenities than we currently do.
Where some people downsize out of a house to fund retirement/lifestyle, you'll effectively be doing this now. I would say its much more difficult to move back into the city than you are making it out to be, because you won't have the near the appreciation in a rural community. Second, those fat retirement and college accounts won't be available to you to use for anything for years to come. We love where we are, but 14 years in, the idea of moving back to TX seems less and less reasonable.
Ridin' 'cross the desert. . .
I grew up in a small town part of my life (around 5K) and have zero desire to go back to that lifestyle, I do miss the community as many have mentioned but would be bored out of my mind. I also lived in New Braunfels back when its population was around 20K in the 80s and 90s (now it's just a burb) and that seemed to be the sweet spot; town was self-sustaining to a large extent and SA was less than 30 minutes away..
lived in NB 1988-2004 and yes I want to move backAg CPA said:
I grew up in a small town part of my life (around 5K) and have zero desire to go back to that lifestyle, I do miss the community as many have mentioned but would be bored out of my mind. I also lived in New Braunfels back when its population was around 20K in the 80s and 90s (now it's just a burb) and that seemed to be the sweet spot; town was self-sustaining to a large extent and SA was less than 30 minutes away..
Sea Speed said:Ragoo said:
I want to move home so bad. Wouldnt necessarily be cheaper but certainly better quality. Wife doesn't like the idea though.
I find that a woman giving their experience does 10000x more to persuade my wife than me begging for years. I would find a female to share her experience with your wife. I have had a friend come stay with us specifically so my wife would talk it up to his wife over the weekend.
Fact of life. My buddy and I joke about this all the damn time. I can tell my wife something 10 times and she thinks I'm an idiot. A rando will tell her the 11th time and it's an incredible revelation.
Buddy and I have gone so far as to switch off and tell opposing wives something that our own wives blow off when we say it. I've shared something with his wife that she blew off when he said it and it was a revelation when I say it and vice versa.
Dude it is wild. Like I will present something in a thoughtful manner and lay out why it is a good idea and makes sense etc etc and really sell it FOR MONTHS. Meh, she says. one female mentions it and its like the thought was delivered by the lips of God directly to her ears.
Thank you for your perspective. Yes, this is a good reminder. Might not be as easy to buy back into the city if we end up needing to.
I need the next chip and jojo to take of wichita falls to pump the market.
I need the next chip and jojo to take of wichita falls to pump the market.
I've got a buddy that did this in 2020 and several other acquaintances that did as well. My buddy is now experiencing what many on here are predicting and he was warned about when he shared his plans with myself and others.
He was fully remote in tech pre covid with only quarterly meetings at the office. Had been at the company for 10 years. His company, like many others, went fully remote in 2020 and said you can live anywhere. He sold his house in a dfw suburb for over 100% appreciation, bought about 30 acres 2 hours away from dfw in a small town and built a place. Has one of the nicest places in town because his income was so high relative to the others in the town. Got a custom home for pennies on the dollar compared to dfw. Over the past 3ish years he has had a great quality of life. Bought a bunch of toys and said that all of us in dfw are suckers.
In 2021, he jumped to another fully remote company for more money. In 2022, that company said return to the office or get laid off. He got laid off and was unable to find a fully remote full time job. He got a contracting gig that was remote but that ended a couple of months ago. He hasn't been able to find anything contract or full time that is remote or even hybrid.
Now he is in a bad spot. He may have to take an in office position in dfw, get an apartment, and only see his family on weekends. He can't sell his place without losing his ass. He's burned through a bunch of savings since he went contract because he couldn't find a contract that paid enough to pay for equivalent benefits.
I have an acquaintance that lives on a boat in South America, another that lives in a small town in flyover country, and another that lives in rural Texas, hours from a major city. I imagine that they will all have similar reckonings at some point. They all assumed fully remote was the way of the future and they'd never have to set foot in an office again. While we'll definitely have more remote work going forward, I can tell you that the commute into the office (dfw) now has more traffic than 2019. Companies are continuing to layoff remote workers at higher rates than those that come into the office.
Make sure you have a backup plan if you lose your job and can't find another remote role with similar pay before you make the move.
He was fully remote in tech pre covid with only quarterly meetings at the office. Had been at the company for 10 years. His company, like many others, went fully remote in 2020 and said you can live anywhere. He sold his house in a dfw suburb for over 100% appreciation, bought about 30 acres 2 hours away from dfw in a small town and built a place. Has one of the nicest places in town because his income was so high relative to the others in the town. Got a custom home for pennies on the dollar compared to dfw. Over the past 3ish years he has had a great quality of life. Bought a bunch of toys and said that all of us in dfw are suckers.
In 2021, he jumped to another fully remote company for more money. In 2022, that company said return to the office or get laid off. He got laid off and was unable to find a fully remote full time job. He got a contracting gig that was remote but that ended a couple of months ago. He hasn't been able to find anything contract or full time that is remote or even hybrid.
Now he is in a bad spot. He may have to take an in office position in dfw, get an apartment, and only see his family on weekends. He can't sell his place without losing his ass. He's burned through a bunch of savings since he went contract because he couldn't find a contract that paid enough to pay for equivalent benefits.
I have an acquaintance that lives on a boat in South America, another that lives in a small town in flyover country, and another that lives in rural Texas, hours from a major city. I imagine that they will all have similar reckonings at some point. They all assumed fully remote was the way of the future and they'd never have to set foot in an office again. While we'll definitely have more remote work going forward, I can tell you that the commute into the office (dfw) now has more traffic than 2019. Companies are continuing to layoff remote workers at higher rates than those that come into the office.
Make sure you have a backup plan if you lose your job and can't find another remote role with similar pay before you make the move.
Good story to retract from everyone on here just blindly saying "yeah do it, it's great!"
I think the only way you do this is TRULY do it to be debt free and not just upgrade to your Yellowstone way of life.
That way if **** does hit the fan, you can pivot and try something else. Side gigs, start a business or get to enjoy the rewards of small town living… no good jobs.
I think the only way you do this is TRULY do it to be debt free and not just upgrade to your Yellowstone way of life.
That way if **** does hit the fan, you can pivot and try something else. Side gigs, start a business or get to enjoy the rewards of small town living… no good jobs.
I love the idea. Both in tech in the current environment is the scary part. Much easier decision if jobs are relatively safe.
I don't like the "bigger house" comment. Yes it is in cash but focus on the reason you are really doing this.
I don't like the "bigger house" comment. Yes it is in cash but focus on the reason you are really doing this.
I know what you mean. I am old and have learned my lesson, at least pretty much. We are about to build a new house. I knew better, but every time I mentioned something about it, she would shoot it down. Finally, I told her that I want her to choose everything, colors, rooms, and just leave me out of it. My only requirement was it had to have a front porch large enough for me to sit in a chair with my feet propped up and there be enough room beyond my feet for two grown men to carry an ice chest between them and me not have to get my fat ass up.Sea Speed said:
Dude it is wild. Like I will present something in a thoughtful manner and lay out why it is a good idea and makes sense etc etc and really sell it FOR MONTHS. Meh, she says. one female mentions it and its like the thought was derived by the lips of God directly to her ears.
Yep, this is why I said you need a good financial backstop before you do something like this or if you do it don't go buy a bunch of crap that negates moving out of city in first place.
Thank you for this perspective.
CuriousAg said:
We have talked about moving to the mountains (would be first choice, but that will solve one thing which is scenery). We need community and a smaller town seems to be the place to find it.
Finding community in a small town can be hit or miss. You'll want to move somewhere that has other families moving in. If there's not many newcomers, you may have a hard time breaking into established social circles.
Sounds like your friend made a whole bunch of bad decisions.
Buying a more modest place, that could have been sold if needed, would have solved a lot of his issues.
Building a palace In a market that doesn't support them is stupid no matter the scenario.
Buying a more modest place, that could have been sold if needed, would have solved a lot of his issues.
Building a palace In a market that doesn't support them is stupid no matter the scenario.
Why not love to the other suburbs of DFW that you plan to be in 5 years anyways?
If it's going to appreciate like you think...move now and refinance when rates drop in a couple years
If it's going to appreciate like you think...move now and refinance when rates drop in a couple years
trip98 said:
Why not love to the other suburbs of DFW that you plan to be in 5 years anyways?
If it's going to appreciate like you think...move now and refinance when rates drop in a couple years
This is the right plan. Move to an exurb that will grow up around you. Will you be able to fish in your own pond and drive a mule around your 10 acres ? No. But you get about everything else.
Then in 10 years when it's doubled in value (or more), reassess.
We built in Prosper in early 2020. Our builder was worried the house wouldn't appraise because we did so many upgrades and crap… now it's appreciated 60% above what we paid.
ChoppinDs40 said:
This is the right plan. Move to an exurb that will grow up around you. Will you be able to fish in your own pond and drive a mule around your 10 acres ? No. But you get about everything else.
Then in 10 years when it's doubled in value (or more), reassess.
We built in Prosper in early 2020. Our builder was worried the house wouldn't appraise because we did so many upgrades and crap… now it's appreciated 60% above what we paid.
We built in Prosper in 2014… it's been a ride up in value faster than we could have predicted.
Diggity said:
Sounds like your friend made a whole bunch of bad decisions.
Buying a more modest place, that could have been sold if needed, would have solved a lot of his issues.
Building a palace In a market that doesn't support them is stupid no matter the scenario.
I don't disagree that he made bad decisions. I warned him as he was making them.
But keep in mind that his motivation was different than the OP's. He wasn't trying to move to lower cost of living to reduce debt, he moved for the lifestyle. In his mind, remote work was the future and he'd never have to go into an office again. This was going to be the property that he lived at forever and passed down to his kids. If he ever decided to sell it, he'd have the luxury of time to find the right buyer. He never fathomed a scenario where he would have to drive to an office and couldn't work from his house. He was betting on all these companies continuing to allow remote work forever.
ChoppinDs40 said:trip98 said:
Why not love to the other suburbs of DFW that you plan to be in 5 years anyways?
If it's going to appreciate like you think...move now and refinance when rates drop in a couple years
This is the right plan. Move to an exurb that will grow up around you. Will you be able to fish in your own pond and drive a mule around your 10 acres ? No. But you get about everything else.
Then in 10 years when it's doubled in value (or more), reassess.
We built in Prosper in early 2020. Our builder was worried the house wouldn't appraise because we did so many upgrades and crap… now it's appreciated 60% above what we paid.
House sat an acquaintance's place way back in 2004 that was a freaking mansion on about 2 acres (in Prosper). I can't imagine how much that house is worth now. Had never even heard of Prosper back then and the DNT still stopped at Legacy.
2 acre lot is prolly $1mm right now with nothing on it.
If it was in a neighborhood, then likely in gentle creek estates or a handful of other smaller neighborhoods. I had buddies growing up that lived out there. Probably $600k houses then. Now? Those things are pushing $2mm or more depending on home updates.
If it was in a neighborhood, then likely in gentle creek estates or a handful of other smaller neighborhoods. I had buddies growing up that lived out there. Probably $600k houses then. Now? Those things are pushing $2mm or more depending on home updates.
CuriousAg said:
...
Cons:
- Family in Dallas 2 hour drive
...
This is actually a "Pros." Two hours is a very good distance. No one just pops in unannounced, but when you take the time to visit, or they come to see you, the quality of the time together is enhanced. Hard to visualize, given you current situation, but in the long run, this is a real benefit of moving to a small town.
I grew up in a town of around 7k and it was/is a nice place, but I've got no desire to go back to that either. It's hard to explain, but I like walking around and being surrounded by people I don't know.Ag CPA said:
I grew up in a small town part of my life (around 5K) and have zero desire to go back to that lifestyle, I do miss the community as many have mentioned but would be bored out of my mind. I also lived in New Braunfels back when its population was around 20K in the 80s and 90s (now it's just a burb) and that seemed to be the sweet spot; town was self-sustaining to a large extent and SA was less than 30 minutes away..
Witchita Falls is blahhhh. If you REALLY wanna move to a small town, move to Holliday. It's about 10 minutes from WF and has a population of 1800. It's a pretty neat town.
I'm from a small town (Italy, TX) and Witchita Falls is big to people like me. You could always move to Waxahachie, Ennis, Midlothian, etc. They're relatively small towns and all within 30-40 minute drive to Dallas.
I'm from a small town (Italy, TX) and Witchita Falls is big to people like me. You could always move to Waxahachie, Ennis, Midlothian, etc. They're relatively small towns and all within 30-40 minute drive to Dallas.
What town did y'all move to?
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