So I have invented something that I know without a doubt will sell. I would like to file a patent, but I have no idea where to start. I have two prototypes, but I am still trying to figure the cheapest and easiest way to assemble these things. So do I have to have precise measurements and diagrams to file a patent? Or can I have something that is of the "spirit" of the design? Should I hire a lawyer? I just have no idea where to begin. Any advice would be very much sincerely appreciated.

Speak to a lawyer or a patent agent. There is much more to patent law than just filing the application, and a professional will explain this all to you. Whatever you do, don't publicly disclose your invention or offer it for sale before you get an application on file with the USPTO.

If it's not worth more than $1 million, consider just making it and getting it on the market before anybody can copy it. This is especially true if you plan to apply for any foreign patents. The prosecution, filing, translation, and maintenance fees will cost you ~$300K to maintain it for the full length, and if the patent office decides that you have multiple inventions, it will cost you even more.

If you want to prevent others from keeping you from making/selling it, you can disclose it in a well-timed release. This is known as defensive publication, and it's a cheap way to protect your rights to your own invention, but others could still make it. IP.com is a publication that specializes in defensive publication.

In a patent you are required to disclose best mode. If you think there are some improvements yet to be made, you can leverage this to your advantage if you can get claims granted that are broader than the working prototype. However, in Europe the claims are generally more narrowly limited to the working prototype. In addition, best mode may be obvious in your case by looking at the commercial object, so my point may be moot.

A professional can look for prior art, but you can also do your own search at uspto.

Thank you so much! Basically speak to a lawyer that specializes in this stuff, it sounds like...?

NSTN8 said:

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Thank you so much! Basically speak to a lawyer that specializes in this stuff, it sounds like...?

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Having been through the process, yes. This is beyond having a message board point you in the right direction and then you figure it out.

FarmerJohn said:

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NSTN8 said:

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Thank you so much! Basically speak to a lawyer that specializes in this stuff, it sounds like...?

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Having been through the process, yes. This is beyond having a message board point you in the right direction and then you figure it out.

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No doubt. However, you did get info from a patent agent and a holder of 50 US patents. So, not a bad fishing expedition to get you started.

General advice is what I came for. You gave me that and more. I sincerely appreciate it!

NSTN8 said:

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Thank you so much! Basically speak to a lawyer that specializes in this stuff, it sounds like...?

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You don't have to use an attorney. You can work with a patent agent, many of whom are just as qualified to do patent preparation and prosecution. Their hourly rate is just less. A good one should objectively evaluate your invention and give you a professional opinion on patentability before taking thousands or tens of thousands of dollars.

Also, depending on your invention, a design patent might suffice. These are a lot cheaper and easier to obtain than utility patents. But a design patent is exactly what it sounds like, and utility patents offer a lot more detail and protection.

Harkrider 93 said:

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After it is protected and selling, please update on what you invented by bumping this thread.

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I will. You may roll your eyes because it is so simple, it's ridiculous, but it is very useful. I am baffled that I have searched high and low and no one sells such a thing.

I am just sort of at a loss about my next step. I have to be able to get my materials cheap enough to be able to make money on an item that I think I can charge about $40 for. I watch enough shark tank to know that being able to manufacture for a low cost is one of the most important parts of selling an invention. I don't know whether or not to keep trying different materials until I know I can make the thing for a reasonable amount. If I can't find a cheap way to manufacture the thing, is it worth my time seeking a patent? I believe in my item so much, but I am just lost so far as manufacturing on a big scale. I can make one easy enough, but not 1,000 of them or however many I would need to start selling them.

NSTN8 said:

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I am just sort of at a loss about my next step. I have to be able to get my materials cheap enough to be able to make money on an item that I think I can charge about $40 for. I watch enough shark tank to know that being able to manufacture for a low cost is one of the most important parts of selling an invention. I don't know whether or not to keep trying different materials until I know I can make the thing for a reasonable amount. If I can't find a cheap way to manufacture the thing, is it worth my time seeking a patent? I believe in my item so much, but I am just lost so far as manufacturing on a big scale. I can make one easy enough, but not 1,000 of them or however many I would need to start selling them.

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What is your background? It sounds like you've got a physical product but you're not familiar with manufacturing.

My general advice is that you need a partner that represents all the knowledge you don't have. That knowledge might be worth more than the design itself (it usually is). If you don't want to bring on a partner at least find a mentor you buy dinner for their thoughts. I would definitely make a 40 page business plan and really think about how you're going to get it to market, formally define who your customers are, your expected costs. Doing a business plan doubles the 5 year success rate of a startup business (a paltry 1/50 down from 1/100). It also will be a requirement to have on hand if you need a loan or any investor beyond family and friends.

Secondly, because you're making a physical product your competition is not some other tinkerer, its a massive manufacturing industry in china. They have the machines already ready making everything under the sun. They just need to get their hands on your product to reverse engineer it. You've basically got an 9-18 month head start the second the product hits the shelf to be able to compete with those groups. Depending on how easily it is to manufacture it could be even shorter. Can you establish a brand and loyal customers before you see your idea pop up on Etsy, Alibaba, or Amazon from a competitor?

If you're still stuck, I would recommend reaching out to Startup Aggieland. It helps Aggies refine a business plan and get you in touch with capital.

one MEEN Ag said:

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NSTN8 said:

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I am just sort of at a loss about my next step. I have to be able to get my materials cheap enough to be able to make money on an item that I think I can charge about $40 for. I watch enough shark tank to know that being able to manufacture for a low cost is one of the most important parts of selling an invention. I don't know whether or not to keep trying different materials until I know I can make the thing for a reasonable amount. If I can't find a cheap way to manufacture the thing, is it worth my time seeking a patent? I believe in my item so much, but I am just lost so far as manufacturing on a big scale. I can make one easy enough, but not 1,000 of them or however many I would need to start selling them.

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What is your background? It sounds like you've got a physical product but you're not familiar with manufacturing.

My general advice is that you need a partner that represents all the knowledge you don't have. That knowledge might be worth more than the design itself (it usually is). If you don't want to bring on a partner at least find a mentor you buy dinner for their thoughts. I would definitely make a 40 page business plan and really think about how you're going to get it to market, formally define who your customers are, your expected costs. Doing a business plan doubles the 5 year success rate of a startup business (a paltry 1/50 down from 1/100). It also will be a requirement to have on hand if you need a loan or any investor beyond family and friends.

Secondly, because you're making a physical product your competition is not some other tinkerer, its a massive manufacturing industry in china. They have the machines already ready making everything under the sun. They just need to get their hands on your product to reverse engineer it. You've basically got an 9-18 month head start the second the product hits the shelf to be able to compete with those groups. Depending on how easily it is to manufacture it could be even shorter. Can you establish a brand and loyal customers before you see your idea pop up on Etsy, Alibaba, or Amazon from a competitor?

If you're still stuck, I would recommend reaching out to Startup Aggieland. It helps Aggies refine a business plan and get you in touch with capital.

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Wow! More great information! This is why I love being any Aggie! Thank you all again!

Advice

Oops! Dang.. I feel dumb for that one.. oh well.

TXTransplant said:

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NSTN8 said:

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Thank you so much! Basically speak to a lawyer that specializes in this stuff, it sounds like...?

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You don't have to use an attorney. You can work with a patent agent, many of whom are just as qualified to do patent preparation and prosecution. Their hourly rate is just less. A good one should objectively evaluate your invention and give you a professional opinion on patentability before taking thousands or tens of thousands of dollars.

Also, depending on your invention, a design patent might suffice. These are a lot cheaper and easier to obtain than utility patents. But a design patent is exactly what it sounds like, and utility patents offer a lot more detail and protection.

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A design patent covers the way something looks, like a Coca Cola bottle. It's more in line with a trademark and wouldn't cover an actual invention.

Need to get a pool going on what this thing is. Keep updating us OP!

torrid said:

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TXTransplant said:

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NSTN8 said:

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Thank you so much! Basically speak to a lawyer that specializes in this stuff, it sounds like...?

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You don't have to use an attorney. You can work with a patent agent, many of whom are just as qualified to do patent preparation and prosecution. Their hourly rate is just less. A good one should objectively evaluate your invention and give you a professional opinion on patentability before taking thousands or tens of thousands of dollars.

Also, depending on your invention, a design patent might suffice. These are a lot cheaper and easier to obtain than utility patents. But a design patent is exactly what it sounds like, and utility patents offer a lot more detail and protection.

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A design patent covers the way something looks, like a Coca Cola bottle. It's more in line with a trademark and wouldn't cover an actual invention.

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No, they are not in line with trademarks. A trademark is a brand name - a word, name, symbol, etc. used to identify and distinguish the goods/services of one seller from another. Trademarks aren't manufactured and sold like the invention covered by a design patent would be.

A design patent protects exactly what it says it protects - an ornamental design of an ARTICLE. An invention can be protected by both a utility and a design patent, or just a design patent.

The Nike swoosh symbol is a trademark. The unique design of their latest shoe would be covered by a design patent.

Design patents don't cover the function of an invention, but those those two characteristics (design and function) may not be separable. If an article with a specific functionality lacks a novel ornamental design, then it's not eligible for a design patent.

Based on the very little information given by the OP here, I mentioned it as something to ask a patent agent or attorney about.

I've been writing/prosecuting patents for 7 years and have been a registered patent agent for 5 years. I've never written a design patent. That's mostly because they are rare in my particular field of technical expertise, and utility patents do offer better protection. But the OP should be sure to ask about them, if the professional he speaks to doesn't mention it (and they may not, depending on their experience).

If the OP has an invention that functions because of its specific design, a design patent would prevent anyone else from making and selling an article with that specific design. The downside to that is, if the competitor can alter the design without altering the function, they would not be infringing the design patent. There would have to be a utility patent covering the Invention's function for there to be infringement.

I said trademark because is seems, at least to me, that a design patent is most useful in protecting marketing and brand identity. Lots of people make something that does the same thing, but yours has a certain well-known look. You want to protect that.

torrid said:

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I said trademark because is seems, at least to me, that a design patent is most useful in protecting marketing and brand identity. Lots of people make something that does the same thing, but yours has a certain well-known look. You want to protect that.

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That is true. A lot of design patents are related to an article that is associated with a a specific brand - like the shape of a bottle or design of a shoe.

But, design patents can also be used to protect the specific design of something like a chemical reactor. Now, my advice would be to ALSO file a utility patent on something like that because the design likely gives the reactor a specific function. But design patents aren't necessarily just for brand identity. If the design is complicated/specific enough, a design patent could deter a competitor (at least until they figure out a work around).

94chem said:

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Omg.. lol! I'm not going to try to sell time machines online!... hahahaha

Ok, to tell you a little about what I made without being specific, this is a very simple farm tool made for people that use electric fence. It consists of a few pipes and some cement. The dumbest of monkeys (even the ones that spell advice "advise") could use it. But it is functional and the market keeps growing, the more people move to the country to start a homestead "farm". When I tell you what it is at some point, you are going to just roll your eyes. However, if you have ever built fence of any kind west of I-35, you will appreciate it and see its value.