So the message I got from everyone about Perez is that he isn't worth 8 million to start as a pitcher for us. Well do we have any ideas on who is worth that money and can start for us day 1? Lot of injuries and question marks on our pitching staff. I think with half our rotation out to start the year we need to sign/trade for someone who can start and provide depth for when someone goes down.

fc2112 said:

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Man, too many people are willing to spend Mr. Davis' money to "keep the band together" and assure a quick descent to mediocrity as these guys age.

Perez isn't worth $8 MM except as a SP, and he won't get that chance here. Good luck to him.

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I don't think signing a player for $8 million is going to have even the tiniest effect on our trajectory.

I'm not upset we didn't resign him though. He wants to start and that's not likely to be his role here.

And to add on to that, we currently have the guy that can start on day 1 and provide depth as starters come back and pitch out of the bullpen as needed in Cody Bradford. We have exactly what we would want Perez to be (that he doesn't really want to do) with a younger, much cheaper player.

Quincey P. Morris said:

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fc2112 said:

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Man, too many people are willing to spend Mr. Davis' money to "keep the band together" and assure a quick descent to mediocrity as these guys age.

Perez isn't worth $8 MM except as a SP, and he won't get that chance here. Good luck to him.

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I don't think signing a player for $8 million is going to have even the tiniest effect on our trajectory.

I'm not upset we didn't resign him though. He wants to start and that's not likely to be his role here.

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Yeah I definitely don't think it's the money. He wants to be guaranteed a spot in a MLB rotation and can't get it in Texas. I don't blame him one bit for wanting a starter job.

If Perez said "I will not sign a contract unless I am guaranteed a starting role for the entire season" then I'm fine with letting him walk. If he was willing to compete we should have signed him back.

Maybe things will change soon but right now it seems like we are just going to roll the dice with what we got for 24 and make a few trades if we need too and really just get ready for 25.

I don't think it's about competing for a spot. It's about finding the best opportunity to land a starting spot for the season. Right now, we have Eovaldi, Gray, Dunning and Heaney in the rotation with Scherzer, Mahle and DeGrom on their way back at some point. All three of those guys take a rotation spot when/if they get healthy.

If I am a starting pitcher that is going to have to compete for a spot, I'm not going to Texas. There are much better opportunities out there to make a rotation.

Water Boy said:

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Maybe things will change soon but right now it seems like we are just going to roll the dice with what we got for 24 and make a few trades if we need too and really just get ready for 25.

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Roll the dice on a team that just won the World Series and has the entire lineup and most of the pitching staff back this year?

The post season is much different than the regular season. Sure it wouldn't matter if we won 105 games last year and we know for a fact we will be in the playoffs. In the post season you can win with just relying on 2-3 starters and 2 guys in the bullpen. In the regular reason all the depth matters. What are we going to do if Eovaldi goes down or dunning isn't close to the same as last year? When I say "rolling the dice" I'm talking about us expecting everyone that played excellent in 23 to play the exact same way in 24 and for guys to stay relatively healthy. If you kept up with the regular season then you know that pretty much everything worked out perfectly for us in the post season. If we somehow perform the exact same way next year then yeah we are fine but what are the odds that happens?

If not spending $8M now means we have that available at the trade deadline, I think it would be better served then.

As mentioned, I don't think Perez is a good fit, and I'm as big an advocate for Perez as there is. Also, don't forget he is a Lefty, which we seemed to have had interchangeable Lefties in Heaney/Perez/Bradford

We know 4 SPs:
Eovaldi (33-R): 25GS, 3.63 ERA, 144.0 IP, 132 SO, 1.139 WHIP
Dunning (28-R): 26GS, 3.70 ERA, 172.2 IP, 140 SO, 1.263 WHIP
Jo Gray (31-R): 29GS, 4.12 ERA, 157.1 IP, 142 SO, 1.290 WHIP
AHeaney (32-L): 28GS, 4.15 ERA, 147.1 IP, 151 SO, 1.378 WHIP, 34G

Bradfor (25-L): 8 GS, 5.30 ERA, 56.0 IP, 51 SO, 1.214 WHIP, 20G
M Perez (32-L): 20GS, 4.45 ERA, 141.2 IP, 93 SO, 1.405 WHIP, 35G

We have 3 60IL: Scherzer, deGrom, Mahle

We have 4 hopes: Bradford, White, Leiter, Porter

Eovaldi was 18.0 IP from Qualifying.
Dunning was 12th in Qualifed ERA in the AL.
Gray would have been T15th, if he had 4.2 IPs more than he did.
Heaney would have been next (16th or 17th if Gray Qualified) if he had 14.2 more IP.

We have 4 SPs that are capable of pitching in the T15 of SPs in the AL... out of 15 teams.

We need one of the "hopefuls" to carry us until one of the HoF'ers returns, or Mahle. Depending on how the return goes from our Surgery guys, we could end up in 2024 moving a bunch of SPs to the bullpen again (or trading them). Perez would have been the 1st traded, IMO.

Not sure what you are expecting them to do. If you re-sign Jordan Montgomery that gives you another frontline starter and shifts everyone down a notch. Not sure what other top of the rotation type starters are out there that the Rangers would be in on.

If you're looking at the playoffs, then you need to add Scherzer, DeGrom and Mahle to the equation. Plus Bradford, White and Leiter. Then there will be non-roster invites to camp for a few starters to allow them to compete.

I expect that on opening day, the Rangers will have ten starters between Arlington and AAA/AA that they feel comfortable starting a game for them. Like you said, it will all be geared towards setting it up for the playoffs and I think the Rangers have a lot of options for that right now.

At this point I just want depth. I'm fine with us picking up a starter who isn't great but can eat up innings and can add depth and also need to sign 2-3 guys for the bullpen. Again they don't have to be top end guys but we need someone.

Oh I think they will have plenty of that type of guys at spring training. CY has said as much.

That would be great for us if those guys can come from our farm. We've been needing that from our farm for a while. If one of those guys can even become average then that's a big bonus.

No kidding. It's pretty remarkable how badly the Rangers have developed starting pitching on the farm. Need that to improve dramatically.

I would remind everyone that the signing period for players is different now than in the past. For example, both Grossman and Will Smith were signed after spring training began. Just because we haven't signed a pitcher or player yet doesn't mean we won't - and I would maintain that depth pieces are the easiest to obtain, and so they should be prioritized last.

There's also a distinct possibility that the Rangers trade for a TOR pitcher. They certainly have the prospects to do it, and I don't think deals like that will happen until after the first of the year.

TLR version is, it's way too early for hand wringing or concern.

Lt. Joe Bookman said:

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A huge thank you to Rangers fans and the Texas @Rangers organization for an amazing 7 seasons.

This was a really difficult decision, but one based on family. pic.twitter.com/0PeaamY1lA

— CJ (@CJNitkowski) December 18, 2023

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Derek Holland!! What could go wrong?

DallasAg 94 said:

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We have 4 SPs that are capable of pitching in the T15 of SPs in the AL... out of 15 teams.

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Seriously, we are probably in the best shape in the AL with starting pitching and people keep acting like we're gonna be throwing road kill out on the mound.

fc2112 said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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We have 4 SPs that are capable of pitching in the T15 of SPs in the AL... out of 15 teams.

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Seriously, we are probably in the best shape in the AL with starting pitching and people keep acting like we're gonna be throwing road kill out on the mound.

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I posted this about a month ago.

I was waiting to see where some of the big name FAs landed before finishing the other AL divisions. I felt the ALWest probably wouldn't change much. I knew Tampa was shopping some Ps and NYYs were overhauling their rotation.

Seattle and Toronto are probably the most concerning rotations in the AL, so far. NYY with Cole and whomever they pick up will be in the Top3.

Quote:

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Seattle:
Castillo (31-R): 33GS, 3.34, 197.0 IP, 219 SO \ $24M
Gilbert ( 27-R): 32GS, 3.73, 190.2 IP, 189 SO \ $4.2M
Kirby ( 26-R ) : 31GS, 3.35, 190.2 IP, 172 SO \ Serf
Miller ( 25-R ): 25GS, 4.32, 131.1 IP, 119 SO \ Serf
Gonzales (32-L): 10GS, 5.22, 50.0 IP, 34 SO \ $12.2M <_ Could be Bryan Woo?

Robbie Ray (32) went TJ after 1GS in 2023 ($23M)

Houston:
Verland (41-R): 11GS, 3.31, 68.0 IP, 63 SO \ $18.3
Valdez ( 30-L): 31GS, 3.45, 198.0 IP, 200 SO \ 12.5
Javier ( 27-R): 31GS, 4.56, 162.0 IP, 159 SO \ 7.4
Brown ( 25-R ): 29GS, 5.09, 155.2 IP, 178 SO \ Serf
France ( 29-R): 23GS, 3.83, 136.1 IP, 101 SO \ Serf

McCullers of note.

Anaheim:
Detmers ( 25-L): 28GS, 4.48, 148.2, 168 \ Serf
Canning ( 28-R): 22GS, 4.32, 127.0, 139 \ $2.7M
Sandoval (27-L): 28GS, 4.11, 144.2, 128 \ $4.2M
Anderson (34-L): 25GS, 5.43, 141.0, 119 \ $13.0M
Silseth ( 24-R): 8GS, 3.96, 52.1, 56 \ Serf

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Once Yamamoto, Snell, and Monty drop somewhere it will be worth more comparison. What the Rangers also have is some depth... had depth (minus Max, now).

Glasnow just said on foul territory that Texas was interested in a trade for him. Interesting.

So we went after Mahle, instead? LoL.

I'm glad we missed out on Glasnow. May regret saying that...

If we're not going to get Monty then go get Bauer at a discount. This rotation would be nasty come 2nd half.

Bauer on a one or two year deal would be excellent.

I would love Bauer from a talent perspective but with how much effort CY has put into our locker room with good character guys essentially everywhere, I've got to wonder if they would even consider him

Seager and he overlapped with the Dodgers before Bauer was suspended. I'm sure CY would get his thoughts.

gigem1223 said:

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bmac_aggie18 said:

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I would love Bauer from a talent perspective but with how much effort CY has put into our locker room with good character guys essentially everywhere, I've got to wonder if they would even consider him

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Yea Chapman was a real beacon of integrity

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I think he was talking locker room.

Chapman, AFAIK, was fine in the locker room. On the mound, it was hit-or-miss... literally. Off the field, he was probably more hit than miss. And certainly not consensual. He may or may not be a bad teammate. I'm open to perspective.

Bauer, AFAIK, was considered a locker room cancer. In HS. At UCLA. Professionally. Whatever he was into personally, **seemed** consensual, AFAIK. From the courts, it would appear that way. My concern with Bauer would be...
95% chance he'll be one of the best SPs in MLB.
80% chance he'll have an off-field distraction to the team.
50-50 on having a conflict with a teammate that may or may not be his to own.

100% chance I'd like to see Hedges catch Bauer in a MLB game.


ETA: And yes, Seager would likely have an opinion. I would also expect Bauer to be a bit different having "grown up" after all of this. Maybe. Maybe not.

I think he's likely referencing Chapman beating up his wife.

I can't wrap my head around a mindset in which the term "good character guys" wouldn't apply equally to a player's behavior in the team setting and also personal life. If either component is missing, the label doesn't apply. JMO

Proposition Joe said:

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I think he's likely referencing Chapman beating up his wife.

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I figured that was what he was referencing. You know, aside from beating his wife, AFAIK, Chapman was a pretty good teammate and locker room guy?!

What got Bauer in trouble was less the fact he was a dick around his teammates and centered around the fact he liked to choke a women out "consensually." But, then him being a bad teammate became an issue.

It is just a weird issue and conflicting.

Take Urias, another LAD... former LAD. He is going through a domestic violence case. Will he be back in MLB before Bauer? My guess is teams would be more willing to look past Urias illegally beating a woman if he is a "good teammate" than Bauer who seemingly "legally" (If that is possible) beat a woman.