***Official Houston Astros 2023-24 Offseason Thread*** [Staff Warning - OP]

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EastCoastAgNc
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11:11a, 2/19/24
AG


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Beat40
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In reply to Ag_07 • 11:12a, 2/19/24
Ag_07 said:
Ken Griffey has 18 postseason games (3 ALDS and 1 ALCS) on his resume with a postseason OPS of .947. Not sure that qualifies.

Compare that to Trout with his 3 postseason games and .600 OPS.

Digging a bit deeper in the 1995 ALDS in which SEA defeated the NYY Griffey SLUGGED 1.043 with a 1.488 OPS. He was 9-23 with 5 HRs and 7 RBIs.
To say Griffey Jr is one of the least impactful great players ever is just ridiculous.

Yeah, he didn't win a WS or even an ALCs, but that guy had more impact to the game in the 90s than arguably anyone else.

The backward hat, pretty much THE comparison for a left-handed swing, and essentially single handedly carried the HR derby in the 90s. The video games. He had shoes. Hitting 600 HR.

He was pretty much the face of "playing fun" during that time too. You mention "The Kid" in baseball and everyone knows who it is.

So yeah, didn't win a WS or get to play in a ton of post-season games, but the dude has had more impact to the game than many ever will.
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The Porkchop Express
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In reply to EastCoastAgNc • 11:17a, 2/19/24
AG
EastCoastAgNc said:
Compared to his pre-at-bat routine from last year.

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wangus12
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In reply to tjack16 • 11:19a, 2/19/24
AG
tjack16 said:


How many do y'all think are Boras clients?
We were eventually going to get to a point where teams just started saying no to giving out insane contracts.
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tjack16
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In reply to Beat40 • 11:27a, 2/19/24
AG
Beat40 said:
Ag_07 said:
Ken Griffey has 18 postseason games (3 ALDS and 1 ALCS) on his resume with a postseason OPS of .947. Not sure that qualifies.

Compare that to Trout with his 3 postseason games and .600 OPS.

Digging a bit deeper in the 1995 ALDS in which SEA defeated the NYY Griffey SLUGGED 1.043 with a 1.488 OPS. He was 9-23 with 5 HRs and 7 RBIs.
To say Griffey Jr is one of the least impactful great players ever is just ridiculous.

Yeah, he didn't win a WS or even an ALCs, but that guy had more impact to the game in the 90s than arguably anyone else.

The backward hat, pretty much THE comparison for a left-handed swing, and essentially single handedly carried the HR derby in the 90s. The video games. He had shoes. Hitting 600 HR.

He was pretty much the face of "playing fun" during that time too. You mention "The Kid" in baseball and everyone knows who it is.

So yeah, didn't win a WS or get to play in a ton of post-season games, but the dude has had more impact to the game than many ever will.


I don't think the argument was impact to the game. I think it was impact to the team's success and championship picture. At least that's how I took it
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The Porkchop Express
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In reply to wangus12 • 11:38a, 2/19/24
AG
wangus12 said:
tjack16 said:


How many do y'all think are Boras clients?
We were eventually going to get to a point where teams just started saying no to giving out insane contracts.
It might not be good for baseball players, but not sure why it's not good for baseball. When teams overpay for inferior talent they have to drive up prices on the fans somewhere along the way to stay in the black. The Cody Bellingers of the world need to learn that one nice year after 3 dog-**** seasons in a row doesn't mean you get top tier money all of a sudden.
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The Porkchop Express
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In reply to tjack16 • 11:41a, 2/19/24
AG
tjack16 said:
Beat40 said:
Ag_07 said:
Ken Griffey has 18 postseason games (3 ALDS and 1 ALCS) on his resume with a postseason OPS of .947. Not sure that qualifies.

Compare that to Trout with his 3 postseason games and .600 OPS.

Digging a bit deeper in the 1995 ALDS in which SEA defeated the NYY Griffey SLUGGED 1.043 with a 1.488 OPS. He was 9-23 with 5 HRs and 7 RBIs.
To say Griffey Jr is one of the least impactful great players ever is just ridiculous.

Yeah, he didn't win a WS or even an ALCs, but that guy had more impact to the game in the 90s than arguably anyone else.

The backward hat, pretty much THE comparison for a left-handed swing, and essentially single handedly carried the HR derby in the 90s. The video games. He had shoes. Hitting 600 HR.

He was pretty much the face of "playing fun" during that time too. You mention "The Kid" in baseball and everyone knows who it is.

So yeah, didn't win a WS or get to play in a ton of post-season games, but the dude has had more impact to the game than many ever will.


I don't think the argument was impact to the game. I think it was impact to the team's success and championship picture. At least that's how I took it
I meant it as an all-over question. Ken Griffey Jr. is iconic and a top beloved baseball player who made lots of people who weren't fans into fans. How many Mariners games did anyone watch before the year he and his dad were teammates?

Trout is a stat machine and that's it. I'm not sure I've ever even heard him talk. If I saw him walking down the street I would not recognize him. If he endorses national products, I don't know what they are.

Ernie Banks was equally popular in his day as Griffey was. . Trout just seems like an empty shell of stats.
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Farmer1906
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11:42a, 2/19/24
AG
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W
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In reply to EastCoastAgNc • 12:07p, 2/19/24
AG
EastCoastAgNc said:

This should go over well with their fans
this may be the least surprising quote of spring training so far

it would be neat if Rendon retires before the end of his mega-contract (2026)

but somehow I don't think he will
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EastCoastAgNc
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12:18p, 2/19/24
AG
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W
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In reply to tjack16 • 12:18p, 2/19/24
AG
tjack16 said:
Ted Williams
Griffey Jr
Gwynn
Bonds
Sosa
Ichiro
Trout
Judge
Ohtani (early yes)

Zero rings on that list and 2 combined WS appearances
and this is understandable for players that played when only 1 or 2 teams from each league made the playoffs in a given season --- up to 1993

but once the playoffs expanded to 4 teams per league, then 5 teams per league, and now 6 teams per league...

it should be a ding on their career (to some extent)

one note on Aaron Judge...he's played in 44 postseason games...and had several huge series at the plate
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bigjag19
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In reply to The Porkchop Express • 12:18p, 2/19/24
AG
The Porkchop Express said:
You could argue that Griffey Jr's extreme popularity helped keep the game afloat after the strike. Even as mcgwire and Sosa and bonds chased the hr mark, Griffen was easily the most popular player and the most marketable.


What if Constanza had gotten Jr and Bonds in that proposal?
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All I do is Nguyen
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12:29p, 2/19/24
What say you??

No matter what!
Epstein didn't do, you know, the thing...
I'm the rare Astros/Cowboys/Spurs fan. We do exist
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linkdude
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In reply to All I do is Nguyen • 12:36p, 2/19/24
AG
Rangers >> Nats >>>>>>>>> Braves IMO
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The Porkchop Express
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In reply to linkdude • 12:47p, 2/19/24
AG
linkdude said:
Rangers >> Nats >>>>>>>>> Braves IMO
Is anyone from the 2019 Nats still on the team?
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spadilly
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In reply to All I do is Nguyen • 12:48p, 2/19/24
S
Forget those, I want to beat the Dodgers again.

Edit: okay, let's beat the Rangers and then the Dodgers.
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linkdude
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In reply to The Porkchop Express • 12:49p, 2/19/24
AG
I think it's just the 4 home losses in both series that we collectively won't get over until we get back to the WS. ATL just beat us fair and square.
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Farmer1906
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In reply to The Porkchop Express • 12:52p, 2/19/24
AG
The Porkchop Express said:
linkdude said:
Rangers >> Nats >>>>>>>>> Braves IMO
Is anyone from the 2019 Nats still on the team?
Exactly. I would feel more revenge from beating the Yankees (Soto) or Rangers in Aug (Scherzer) than actually beating the Nats.

The Braves are one of our oldest rivals. I would feel very accomplished beating them and, obviously, it would mean we win the WS.

Rangers are the nugget in the toilet you flush. Last year they just spun around and stayed in the bowl after hitting the lever a few times. Don't be shocked if we bury them by midseason.
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Farmer1906
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In reply to spadilly • 12:53p, 2/19/24
AG
spadilly said:
Forget those, I want to beat the Dodgers again.

Edit: okay, let's beat the Rangers and then the Dodgers.
Bingo. I want the Dodgers and their super team. If we play spoiler on an Ohtani / Yamamoto WS run, it would cement us as the villains for the entire country of Japan. It would be so so sweet.
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docb
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In reply to Sea Speed • 12:58p, 2/19/24
AG
Sea Speed said:
Someone on texags has done literally everything. My goodness.
That's been quite a few years ago now. Even saw a few WW1 vets come through the VA hospital in
Gainesville back then.
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The Porkchop Express
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1:19p, 2/19/24
AG
I still need my '86 Mets revenge. Unfortunately, they suck ass.
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Beat40
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In reply to EastCoastAgNc • 1:21p, 2/19/24
EastCoastAgNc said:
I like to hear this!

I think flexibility plays in to longevity for professional athletes. I think it could really help him this season.
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SpaceCityAg05
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 1:32p, 2/19/24
AG
It is hard to say. If he is simply trying to say that his faith and his family are more important than baseball (or anything else for that matter), then that IS the mindset he should have.

However, it reads a lot like baseball is what pays the bills and not much more for him. If so, that is concerning since sports are one of those things that need to involve a hunger for performance - if not, you will never be excellent at your job. Your heart has to be in your sport, not just your body.

You might at peak perform well, but someone who doesn't WANT it won't push through injuries or difficult rehabs or dig deep to perfect their craft - they will just show up, perform off natural ability, succeed or fail, collect a paycheck and go home.

Those kind of players exist and can help a team as mercenaries, but cannot be a foundation stone/leader of a franchise (and he is being paid like one). But it also makes sense because the Angels are the epitome of a franchise with a losing culture.
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TarponChaser
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In reply to EastCoastAgNc • 1:37p, 2/19/24
EastCoastAgNc said:



Man, y'all gonna make me follow Romes on Twitter even though I don't want to.
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FrioAg 00
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In reply to EastCoastAgNc • 1:39p, 2/19/24
AG
Breggy goes down on a full count.

Optimist: Pressly looking sharp!

Pessimist: Breggy still chasing

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The Porkchop Express
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2:33p, 2/19/24
AG
It's 38 days until Opening Day so let's take a look back at the Astros' 38th season - 1999.

With a 97-65 record, the Astros put up their 2nd best record (at the time) ever and won the NL Central for a third straight time time, doing so on the last day of the regular season.

On April 9 of that year, the Astros signed a 30-year, $100 million deal with Enron for the rights of the name of the new ballpark. That deal lasted about 45 minutes before Enron went under. Intresting side note, Minute Maid's current deal ends in 2030.

Individual accolades included Jeff Bagwell taking over from Jimmy Wynn as the team's all-time home run leader. Bagwell became the first player to have 3-homer games in both Wrigley and Comiskey Parks in the same year, and also set an MLB record by drawing 6 walks in a 16-inning game.

Opening Day was a home game vs. the Cubs with 51,668 (including me) in attendance. Your starting 9 that day was: Biggo 2B, Bell RF, Bagwell 1B, Caminiti 3B, Everett CF, Hidalgo LF, Eusebio C, Gutierrez SS, Reynolds P.

The Cubs countered with a lineup that included, among others, 35-year old Lance Johnson, 34-year-old Benito Santigo, and 78-year-old Gary Gaetti. Shockingly, the Cubs finished last. The good guys won 4-2 with solo shots by Dinosaur Everett and Doggy, and 6 solid innings by Shaner. Non-Hall of Famer Billy Wagner got the save.

The team had a winning record in every month, highlighted by a 19-9 July. They had a winning record against almost every team, except one, you know who. Those mothertrucking racists with their Tomahawk Chop.

The Central was a 2-horse race between the Astros and the Reds, who had an amazing combination of All-Stars like Sean Casey and Barry Larkin combined with guys I forgot ever played, like Pokey Reese. Their ace was Pete Harnisch.

In mid-July, the Astros ran off 8 wins in a row, including three walk-offs in four nights, to open up a 3-1/2 game lead over the Reds. They tried to blow it late in the year, with the Reds taking a 1-game lead on August 28th when Harnisch beat Lima Time 4-1. The next day, Mike Hampton went 8 innings allowing 1 run and Daryle Ward actually showed up and hit a 2-run bomb in the 8th to tie the Reds and Astros atop the division.

Both teams lost their 160th game of the year to remain tied at 95-65. In Game 161, the Brewers beat the **** out of the REds 10-6 while the Astros got the performance of a lifetime from LIma Time, 7 innings, no runs, 8 strikeouts. Non Hall of Famer Billy Wagner saved his 39th game to lower his ERA to 1.57 on the season. The Astros were up 1 game with 1 game to go.

On Sunday, the last game in the Astrodome's history, the team started 1-1/2 hours ahead of the Reds and dropped 4 runs on whoever the hell Robinson Checo is in the bottom of the first inning. The Reds watched in delight as Checo walked Astro legend Stan Javier, Bagwell, Everett and Caminiti in succession, then gave up a bases-loaded double to Ward to make it 4-0. Hampton won his 22nd game vs. only 4 losses and Bagwell joined the elite 30-30 club with his 30th stolen base.

Bagwell was a monster truck in 1999, 1.045 OPS, 143 runs scored, 42 HR, 126 RBI, 30 steals. Biggio had 56 doubles, scored 123 runs, stole 28 bases and drove in 73 runs. Carl Everett, had one of the best seasons ever by a crazy person, hitting .325 with 25 HR and 108 RBI (.969 OPS).

It was the first season of Berkman, Ward, and Mitch Meluskey, and an incredible performance by super-sub Bill Spiers, who at age 33 hit .288. Lima (21-10), Hampton (22-4), and Shaner (16-14) combined to go 59-28.

Game 1 of the NLDS was as good as it gets for the 1990 Astros, Shaner beating Greg Maddux in Atlanta 6-1. Eusebio had an RBI single in the 2nd off Maddux and Ward took him deep in the 6th, then the Astros blew up for 4 in the top of the ninth thanks largely to a 3-run bomb by Caminiti.
And that was the last game of the season, IIRC.

Well actually there was the Kevin Milwood near-no hitter, Cammy hitting a HR to make it respectable. Then the extra-inning choke job in which Jay Powell was allowed to pitch for some reason. That's the one where we had the bases loaded with nobody out in the 10th inning and Everett, Eusebio, and Gutierrez combined for 2 groundouts and a strikeout. And then Game 4, where we got down 7-0 and almost rallied, but didn't rally.

Ken caminiti had the greatest playoff series by a Stro until the days of Beltran in that series, hitting .471 with a 1.526 OPS and 3 HR and 8 RBi in 4 games. Meanwhile ... Bagwell .154, Biggio .105. Everett .133. Shane Reynolds hit better than any of them (.250).









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docb
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In reply to The Porkchop Express • 2:40p, 2/19/24
AG
Bagwell and Caminiti were on the steroid train back then IMO.
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EastCoastAgNc
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2:41p, 2/19/24
AG

No one tell him about the Astros front office model
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Farmer1906
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2:52p, 2/19/24
AG
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Red Five
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In reply to docb • 2:55p, 2/19/24
AG
docb said:
Bagwell and Caminiti were on the steroid train back then IMO.
Caminiti openly admitted it, it's not just an opinion. Bagwell I prefer not to think about.
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The Porkchop Express
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In reply to docb • 2:57p, 2/19/24
AG
docb said:
Bagwell and Caminiti were on the steroid train back then IMO.
Other than the fact that it probably led to Caminiti's early death, I don't really care anymore. After seeing Brian Cushing on steroids vs Brian Cushing not on steroids, as a fan of the teams, I'm all for whatever ensures maximum performance.
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Farmer1906
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 2:59p, 2/19/24
AG
Best two quotes have nothing to do with an extension.

1. Defense. 2. Always confident in his team.



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redline248
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 3:10p, 2/19/24
AG
I'd love to hear his true feeling on why his defense dipped last year, or if he even thinks it did
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Farmer1906
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In reply to redline248 • 3:14p, 2/19/24
AG
redline248 said:
I'd love to hear his true feeling on why his defense dipped last year, or if he even thinks it did
I would assume so, but he was named a Gold Glove finalist. Who the hell knows? I know defensive metrics can be kind of wonky, but the ones of savant are based on distance & time. I believe them. And my eyes matched what the #s showed. It seemed like he was making business decisions too often.
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Farmer1906
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3:19p, 2/19/24
AG
That's my shortstop. Break out season coming.

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