I completely agree with you on this, but, when you also factor in Heaney being basically the same type of pitcher as Perez, and that we're having to scratch together a fifth and sixth guy from what really is/should be bullpen pitchers, it puts us in a tough spot. You are now walking a tight rope hoping like hell to get solid outings from guys who either shouldn't be in that spot at all, or guys who you need to put up 4-5 runs to get a win.

Random, but am I the only one that thinks Jankowski is a spitting image of Josh Hamilton?

vette said:

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Random, but am I the only one that thinks Jankowski is a spitting image of Josh Hamilton?

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Maybe, I think he's more a spitting image of virtually any pro surfer

There are some guys on here who are very negative all the time. When you see a negative post, click on his name, go to his history, ane look through his posts on this thread. Typically, they are 100% negative on every single post.

They either are closet Astros fans, here to sow discontent, of just very sad, negative people.

I see Momo when he's at the plate.

rbtexan said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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rbtexan said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Or it's very simply that he's an average pitcher that had an anomaly year last season.

Even with the career year last season, he has a career ERA+ of 100.

He's a 4.5ish ERA, back of the rotation pitcher. There's value in that, but there's no magic approach Maddux can teach him or the like.

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Perez has the stuff to be a 2/3. His issue was always falling apart when he got negativity rolling. An error, or a bad pitch for a HR would become 5+ runs in a game. I think we all saw his ability to limit the damage last year and there were comments about it (if only by me. )

I think 2022 was more along the lines of what he is capable. You look at those 3 games in 2023 and that's 19ER in 11.2 IP. The other 10 games he is 18ER in 59.2 IP which is a 2.72 ERA. 77% of his outings (10/13) were really good.

We'll see where he is tonight and how he does. If his splits continue, maybe you look at him as a Home SP.

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I'm actually more in agreement with Proposition Joe on this.

Years & years ago, I bought a giant book (probably 4 inches thick or better) that had the stats of every player who ever made the major leagues...Baseball Almanac I think it was called. At any rate, I went through the entire book and discovered players I had never heard of who had either really great seasons or careers. Hal Trosky for example looked like he was going to be a superstar and then faded - I found out later it was because of severe migraine headaches.

In looking at the historical stats, you'd be amazed how many players you never heard of who had one great season, maybe two - usually either their first couple of seasons, or later in their career. But almost everyone of them slid back to their statistical norms. A couple of Rangers examples are George Wright and Kevin Elster. Wright started out like gangbusters and faded quickly. Elster came over late in his career and had one magical season that he never replicated.

What I did NOT find was many players who put up mediocre stats for the majority of their career, and then somehow found themselves in their 30s and elevated their game substantially. There are, of course, exceptions - knuckleball pitchers for one, and former Ranger Jamie Moyer was another. But for the most part, historically speaking, what a player does is what he is.

That's why I'm inclined to believe last season was an anomaly and the Perez we're seeing this year is who he is. Hopefully he'll prove me wrong, but the preponderance of historical stats lead me to think otherwise.

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I disagree.

You can't compare Hal Trosky... a guy with 2 appearances and 3.0 IP with a 6.00 ERA. He was 44-30 in the minors and played in the '50s. The height of the mound changed in the '70s so, comparing pitchers before and after is very difficult.

When it comes to modern day SPs... there are hundreds of SPs that don't make their MLB debut until they are 25-26.

Consider Colby Lewis who failed in MLB with the Rangers from age 22-27 with a 6.71 ERA. Went 3.93 from age 30-32.

Verlander @32 had a career 3.52 ERA. He is a 2.87 since with 136 GS and over 876 IP. He was 23 when he had his 1st full season.

Owen White at 23, just had a cup of coffee. By his age, Martin had already 213 IP with a 4.13 ERA in MLB. Leiter, Rocker, et al are still struggling in the Minors.

If Owen White were to remain in Arlington.... he likely improves over his 1st G, but he may be 2 years away from making the rotation. Think about what his ERA would be.

Modern day pitching, it isn't unusual, IMO, for a SP to be 30... 31 years old before he puts everything together.

I agree Perez' season last year may have been an anomaly... we'll see, I guess.

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Yeah, so...you looked up the wrong Hal Trosky. You found Hal Trosky Jr., I was talking about his father, who was a first baseman for Cleveland and had a solid career with one magical season.

How's this for a stat line. As a 23 yr old in 1936...


In addition to looking up the wrong guy, you also incorrectly assumed that I was comparing players. I wasn't comparing anybody. I was making the point that if you look at the history of baseball, you will find dozens and dozens of players who had one great season that far eclipsed any other season in their career. Guys like Ripper Collins, Wayne Garland, Joe Charboneau, Cito Gaston, and going way way back, Bill James (the pitcher, not the stat guy).

Perez has thrown nearly 1400 innings in the majors. His record is 81-80 with a 4.44 ERA. That's who he is, and that's not bad. He's a really really good bottom of the rotation starter, you can win championships with guys like that at the bottom of your rotation. But he's never going to consistently be the top of the rotation pitcher he was last season IMO.

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I originally pulled up his father, but I was like... "We're talking about pitchers, so he must mean Jr. Why would he talk about a career .302 hitter that had a disruption in his career based on WWII?" I didn't want to spend the time researching the impact on him from WWII and assumed you meant the Jr who started in MLB and then disappeared.

Since we were talking about pitchers and the difference between expectations vs what they delivered... it never occurred to me you were just making a point that there are tons of players we've never heard of. I think there are over 800 MLB active at any time in the season... I'll be honest, Juan Soto was a new name for me, at the trade deadline. ROFLMAO. Point taken.

Tksymm7 said:

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Tomorrow

This next month or so is critical and crazy. The rotation is super stressed right now. Not only because deGrom isn't there to fill and eat innings at the top, but because that's forced guys who just can't go deep in games to pitch, and that has really eaten into the bullpen. Because of this, the Rangers are considering doing a six man rotation, with Bradford likely getting the bulk of that work and in the long reliever role. Ragans and Otto are also being stretched out at RR to hopefully alleviate some stress.

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I think Dunning is the only person really impacted. I think he was in the mix for the rotation until Perez was finally added, but moving to the rotation has pulled a guy out of the BP, for sure. Combined, Heaney and Gray have missed 3 GS.

This from Nov 18, 2022:

Quote:

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To recap. We have 22 P on the 40. 8 I consider SPs
SP (L): Perez, Hearn, Ragans
SP (R): Gray, Odorizzi, Dunning, Otto, Howard

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I think we were looking at: Gray, Dunning, Odorizzi, Otto

The rotation is all about remaining healthy and grinding. That is why Innings Eaters are so important. I'm fine calling Perez a 4/5 or innings eater.

I'm not opposed to the Rangers using a 6 man rotation, although in years past I'd likely been opposed.

Where we are at:
Eovaldi: 14GS, 93.2 IP, 2.59 ERA
- Avg 6.2 IP/GS
- 109.1 ('22), 182.1 ('21). Pitched 3 seasons over 150 IP.
Gray: 12GS, 73.2 IP, 2.32 ERA
- Avg 6.0 IP/GS
- 127.1 ('22), 149.0 ('21). Pitched 4 seasons over 149 IP.
Heaney: 13GS, 66.2 IP, 4.05 ERA
- Avg 5.1 IP/GS
- 72.2 ('22), 129.2 IP ('21). 1 season over 150 IP.
Perez: 14GS, 77.1 IP, 4.54 ERA
- Avg 5.2 IP/GS
- 196.1 ('22), 114.0 ('21). 4 seasons over 150 IP.
Dunning: 7 GS, 15G, 58.2 IP, 2.76
- 153.1 ('22), 117.2 ('21). 1 season over 150 IP.
Bradford: 3GS, 14.1 IP, 5.65
- 118.2 ('22, minors), 96.1 ('21, minors). Currently 73.2 w/minors

The extra players allows more options on P. Tampa rotates players, and in doing so, we go:
Eovaldi, Gray, Heaney, Perez in a 6 man rotation and service the 2 spots with
Dunning, Bradford, White, Otto, Hearn, Howard...

JD played with the idea of using pairings... say Dunning+White as a pair for #5.

Fuzzy Dunlop said:

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I'm sacrificing today and won't watch. I've watched almost every game these past few weeks and we just don't seem to be doing well. To be fair, I ve watched almost every game this season. I went to the game last night riding a 5 game win streak for games I've attended, dating back to last season.

Maybe it's me. If we win today I'll stop watching until we lose again.

Gotta try something. Maybe this is it. Cross your fingers and put on a brisket Mr Gigem.

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I'm taking a break as well. Seen probably 55 games or so this year, but I think I'm going to pick it back up when we face the white Sox. A new opponent on the road who gives up lots of runs should wake this team up. I hope they wake up before than tho. I'll still watch the YouTube highlights of the jays series.

Garcia has to make that catch

They still haven't learned, you don't run on 53

Jung!

Heim! Back to back!

Had a couch nap going and forgot to tune in. First pitch I saw was Adolis drawing the walk. Guess I can't sleep anymore.

Jung raking!

I've never noticed that the pole is set off of the line. Man that is close. It's right if the pole but over the line.

Wtf was that? Bases loaded and that's how you end the inning.

Did something weird happen? I checked the score a little while ago and then got home and I swear it went from 5-2 to 3-2.

Nice play by Garcia. Dunning is hanging in there. Looked oddly familiar to another play from 2011, but it was caught.

Quincey P. Morris said:

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Did something weird happen? I checked the score a little while ago and then got home and I swear it went from 5-2 to 3-2.

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Jung had a hit initially ruled a 2 run Homer, but it was foul.

If there ever was a microcosm of the past few days that last inning was it

this last week of umping at the plate has been some of the worst I've ever seen

Going on 10 games of this lineup completely snake snakebit, and unable to string anything together. I thought that 2nd inning would help gain some confidence to get some runs across today.

Another great snag by Garcia.

NukeAg10 said:

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Going on 10 games of this lineup completely snake snakebit, and unable to string anything together. I thought that 2nd inning would help gain some confidence to get some runs across today.

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Yep. They're just missing big hits. The 2nd homer by Jung that was just foul and then the double by Lowe that was just foul. Can't get them to fall. It's got to happen sooner or later.

DallasAg 94 said:

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Grape can be pretty negative but has posted as a Rangers fan for years. Unless it is a sock, he posts on the Politics, as well. He is consistent and predictable. We've bantered about Odor for years.

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I agree about Grape. But

gigem1223 said:

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NukeAg10 said:

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Going on 10 games of this lineup completely snake snakebit, and unable to string anything together. I thought that 2nd inning would help gain some confidence to get some runs across today.

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Yep. They're just missing big hits. The 2nd homer by Jung that was just foul and then the double by Lowe that was just foul. Can't get them to fall. It's got to happen sooner or later.

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Yep, those took 3 runs away and they had a bases loaded situation and couldn't plate anyone. Very frustrating.

2 out rally here, let's go.

NukeAg10 said:

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Quincey P. Morris said:

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Did something weird happen? I checked the score a little while ago and then got home and I swear it went from 5-2 to 3-2.

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Jung had a hit initially ruled a 2 run Homer, but it was foul.

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Same thing happened to me. Got an update while driving that it was 5-2 after a Jung 2 run shot.

Aaaaand the funk continues….

What are the rangers hitting with RISP since game 1 of the angels series? It has to be really bad.