Since we are talking trades…. apparently Betts is going to play SS for Dodgers when he returns from leave…. Chris Young should call the Dodgers up and offer Luisangel Acuna # 4 Rangers prospect for Dodgers #6 OF Andy Pages and target Pages and Evan Carter for the Arlington outfield in 24
*****Official Texas Rangers 2023 Season Thread***** [Staff Warning]
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More recently, we traded Adrian Gonzalez and a performing Chris Young for Adam Eaton (we did get a solid season from Akinori Otsuka). We also dealt Jon Daniels for Brandon McCarthy. We made that one because McCarthy was more major league ready (Danks debuted that season with the White Sox).
The yu Darvish trade to the dodgers was terrible. We gave them a solid #2 pitcher in their rotation that they felt good enough to start 3x in the World Series and we got nothing good out of it.
All of our recent deals with the cubs have been terrible. Giving up prospects for Matt Garza. Getting ****ty prospects back for Cole Hamels and the worst one of all….. we traded Kyle Hendricks and other prospects for Ryan dempster, who was awful.
All of our recent deals with the cubs have been terrible. Giving up prospects for Matt Garza. Getting ****ty prospects back for Cole Hamels and the worst one of all….. we traded Kyle Hendricks and other prospects for Ryan dempster, who was awful.
Don't forget the Kevin Brown trade.
Jimtim1216 said:
Don't forget the Kevin Brown trade.
We let him walk in free agency. Might be one of the worst decisions we ever made though.
The Prince Fielder trade didn't work out very well. We had to eat a lot of money for one good season from that guy.
So our division mates are finally gonna pull the trigger. So happy - can now add Vegas to places I've seen the Rangers play.
Cities where I have seen the Rangers play
Arlington
Surprise, AZ
Houston
Kansas City
Seattle
Toronto
Anaheim
Denver
Cities where I have seen the Rangers play
Arlington
Surprise, AZ
Houston
Kansas City
Seattle
Toronto
Anaheim
Denver
BREAKING: Sources confirmed to @TheNVIndy that The Oakland A’s and Red Rock Resorts are closing in on an agreement to construct a $1 billion baseball stadium north of Allegiant Stadium with the support of Gov. Joe Lombardohttps://t.co/tcVmBQeSDt
— Nevada Independent (@TheNVIndy) April 20, 2023
The downside to this move (potentially) is that the A's will finally be able to compete financially with other MLB teams, at least on some level. Given their ability to develop talent, if they can all of a sudden start keeping their stud players, the western division will get really, really tough top to bottom.
Jimbo Franchione
rbtexan said:
The downside to this move (potentially) is that the A's will finally be able to compete financially with other MLB teams, at least on some level. Given their ability to develop talent, if they can all of a sudden start keeping their stud players, the western division will get really, really tough top to bottom.
I don't think money has been the issue with the A's. Surprisingly, they've been one of the most profitable teams in baseball.
Money has absolutely been an issue with the A's. Sure, they're profitable. They also consistently have one of the lowest payrolls in MLB. They make money, but only because they don't spend a lot.
*edit* their payroll in '23 is $60 million, lowest in MLB. Not hard to make a profit if that's all you're spending.
*edit* their payroll in '23 is $60 million, lowest in MLB. Not hard to make a profit if that's all you're spending.
Jimbo Franchione
The Gonzalez trade has to be the worst, imagine him at first in the WS runs instead of Moreland/Smoak. Gonazlez was a top 10 MVP candidate in both 2010 and 2011, it's not unreasonable to say that he would have been the piece to push us over the top. And he was still in arbitration so it wouldn't have cost us the ability to sign Beltre.
I don't know...giving up an all-star pitcher (Alvarez) and a border line HOFer in Sammy Sosa (not to mention our starting SS Scott Fletcher) for a guy who was nothing but a DH and didn't even last a full year is pretty damn bad.TheNotoriousP.I.P. said:
The Gonzalez trade has to be the worst, imagine him at first in the WS runs instead of Moreland/Smoak. Gonazlez was a top 10 MVP candidate in both 2010 and 2011, it's not unreasonable to say that he would have been the piece to push us over the top. And he was still in arbitration so it wouldn't have cost us the ability to sign Beltre.
Jimbo Franchione
What's going to incentivize them to spend though? I knew stadium is great because they no longer look like a poverty franchise, but they still act like one. They still give away good players like they're Oprah at a Christmas special. What's stopping them from continuing to do that even with a new stadium in a new city?rbtexan said:
Money has absolutely been an issue with the A's. Sure, they're profitable. They also consistently have one of the lowest payrolls in MLB. They make money, but only because they don't spend a lot.
*edit* their payroll in '23 is $60 million, lowest in MLB. Not hard to make a profit if that's all you're spending.
Nothing is going to stop them, but they will have the ability to actually make a LOT of money, for the first time practically in franchise history. If they were content being the poorest team in baseball, why move to Las Vegas in the first place? I don't think they'll jump up to the top 10 in spending, but I can't imagine a scenario where they wouldn't jump up into the 11-20 range. Also, being the first MLB team in Vegas will create a lot of local pressure for them to be competitive...they never really had that kind of pressure in Oakland.Tksymm7 said:What's going to incentivize them to spend though? I knew stadium is great because they no longer look like a poverty franchise, but they still act like one. They still give away good players like they're Oprah at a Christmas special. What's stopping them from continuing to do that even with a new stadium in a new city?rbtexan said:
Money has absolutely been an issue with the A's. Sure, they're profitable. They also consistently have one of the lowest payrolls in MLB. They make money, but only because they don't spend a lot.
*edit* their payroll in '23 is $60 million, lowest in MLB. Not hard to make a profit if that's all you're spending.
Jimbo Franchione
Keep in mind the Rangers had no idea Sosa was gonna juice himself into this.rbtexan said:I don't know...giving up an all-star pitcher (Alvarez) and a border line HOFer in Sammy Sosa (not to mention our starting SS Scott Fletcher) for a guy who was nothing but a DH and didn't even last a full year is pretty damn bad.TheNotoriousP.I.P. said:
The Gonzalez trade has to be the worst, imagine him at first in the WS runs instead of Moreland/Smoak. Gonazlez was a top 10 MVP candidate in both 2010 and 2011, it's not unreasonable to say that he would have been the piece to push us over the top. And he was still in arbitration so it wouldn't have cost us the ability to sign Beltre.
I hope the A's take this opportunity to go back to the Athletic's color scheme they had up until 70's. They won't, but it was such a good clean look.
Interesting that a lot of people seem to be up in arms about the A's going to Vegas. I understand A's fans being upset - but it is interesting that so many non-A's fans are upset.
From my perspective, I completely understand the move. As far back as attendance data goes, they have never been in the top half of attendance in the league. Not one time. Since 2006, they have finished in the bottom 5 in attendance in 14/17 seasons. In the 3 seasons they weren't in the bottom 5 in attendance, they were never higher than 23rd. This would be somewhat understandable if they were terrible every year - but they made the playoffs 7 times in this stretch. They won 97 games in back to back seasons in 2018 and 2019 and still finished 27th and 24th in attendance. That is just completely unacceptable. I get the stadium plays a role in that, but when your team is winning 97 games, the stadium should not matter all that much. Any team winning that many games should, at the very least, be top 10-15 in attendance. Not 27th. The team desperately needs a new stadium, the city is not cooperating, and nobody is going to the games. It is a terrible situation that the franchise needs to remove itself from.
From my perspective, I completely understand the move. As far back as attendance data goes, they have never been in the top half of attendance in the league. Not one time. Since 2006, they have finished in the bottom 5 in attendance in 14/17 seasons. In the 3 seasons they weren't in the bottom 5 in attendance, they were never higher than 23rd. This would be somewhat understandable if they were terrible every year - but they made the playoffs 7 times in this stretch. They won 97 games in back to back seasons in 2018 and 2019 and still finished 27th and 24th in attendance. That is just completely unacceptable. I get the stadium plays a role in that, but when your team is winning 97 games, the stadium should not matter all that much. Any team winning that many games should, at the very least, be top 10-15 in attendance. Not 27th. The team desperately needs a new stadium, the city is not cooperating, and nobody is going to the games. It is a terrible situation that the franchise needs to remove itself from.
rocky_ag said:
Interesting that a lot of people seem to be up in arms about the A's going to Vegas. I understand A's fans being upset - but it is interesting that so many non-A's fans are upset.
From my perspective, I completely understand the move. As far back as attendance data goes, they have never been in the top half of attendance in the league. Not one time. Since 2006, they have finished in the bottom 5 in attendance in 14/17 seasons. In the 3 seasons they weren't in the bottom 5 in attendance, they were never higher than 23rd. This would be somewhat understandable if they were terrible every year - but they made the playoffs 7 times in this stretch. They won 97 games in back to back seasons in 2018 and 2019 and still finished 27th and 24th in attendance. That is just completely unacceptable. I get the stadium plays a role in that, but when your team is winning 97 games, the stadium should not matter all that much. Any team winning that many games should, at the very least, be top 10-15 in attendance. Not 27th. The team desperately needs a new stadium, the city is not cooperating, and nobody is going to the games. It is a terrible situation that the franchise needs to remove itself from.
I'm good with it. It'll put them one time zone closer to us, so games won't be quite as late.
And they've needed a stadium for years and years. That place was a dump back in the late 90's when we went to a game out there. But I also understand cities wanting to stand up for themselves and not get fleeced by ownership on a stadium deal too, but it's been too long. If Oakland wasn't willing to come up with a deal, the A's should have left a long time ago.
I could see the A's adopting the Las Vegas Knights color scheme. Really, they should. I'm there quite a bit and the fan base is pretty bought in, you see those colors a lot around the city. (The early franchise success definitely helps that.)
I believe Vegas is on Pac time.
Las Vegas is on PT
I agree, but that probably won't last for long. Manfred has said once the A's and Rays get their stadium situations figured out, the league will take a strong look at expanding to 32 teams. This seems like a good indication the A's are well on their way to having this situation resolved and Tampa Bay doesn't seem far behind (likely staying in St. Pete).KT 90 said:rocky_ag said:
Interesting that a lot of people seem to be up in arms about the A's going to Vegas. I understand A's fans being upset - but it is interesting that so many non-A's fans are upset.
From my perspective, I completely understand the move. As far back as attendance data goes, they have never been in the top half of attendance in the league. Not one time. Since 2006, they have finished in the bottom 5 in attendance in 14/17 seasons. In the 3 seasons they weren't in the bottom 5 in attendance, they were never higher than 23rd. This would be somewhat understandable if they were terrible every year - but they made the playoffs 7 times in this stretch. They won 97 games in back to back seasons in 2018 and 2019 and still finished 27th and 24th in attendance. That is just completely unacceptable. I get the stadium plays a role in that, but when your team is winning 97 games, the stadium should not matter all that much. Any team winning that many games should, at the very least, be top 10-15 in attendance. Not 27th. The team desperately needs a new stadium, the city is not cooperating, and nobody is going to the games. It is a terrible situation that the franchise needs to remove itself from.
I'm good with it. It'll put them one time zone closer to us, so games won't be quite as late.
And they've needed a stadium for years and years. That place was a dump back in the late 90's when we went to a game out there. But I also understand cities wanting to stand up for themselves and not get fleeced by ownership on a stadium deal too, but it's been too long. If Oakland wasn't willing to come up with a deal, the A's should have left a long time ago.
Given this, the MLB probably pursues 2 expansion teams in the next 5-8 years or so. I would bet a lot of money on the two expansion cities being one of Salt Lake City/Portland and one of Nashville/Charlotte to have one new team out west and one new team out south and east. SLC, Portland, and Nashville all have organized efforts to get an MLB team. Charlotte does not, at least publicly, but is still widely considered one of the favorites. Once the league expands, the divisional alignment will have to change and there is a good chance we aren't in a division with the A's, Mariners, or Angels anymore. Probably will be two 16 team leagues with 4 divisions of 4 teams each.
My guess at the divisions would be:
AL West
Seattle Mariners
Las Vegas A's
Los Angeles Angels
Portland (close battle with SLC, but Portland puts a team close to Seattle for travel)
AL South
Texas Rangers
Houston Astros
Kansas City Royals
Colorado Rockies (switch from NL)
AL East
New York Yankees
Boston Red Sox
Toronto Blue Jays
Baltimore Orioles
AL North
Detroit Tigers
Minnesota Twins
Chicago White Sox
Cleveland Indians
NL West
San Francisco Giants
Los Angeles Dodgers
San Diego Padres
Arizona Diamondbacks
NL South
Atlanta Braves
Miami Marlins
Tampa Bay Rays (switch from AL)
Nashville (seems to be THE expansion favorite)
NL East
New York Mets
Philadelphia Phillies
Washington Nationals
Pittsburgh Pirates
NL North
St. Louis Cardinals
Chicago Cubs
Cincinnati Reds
Milwaukee Brewers
Chipotlemonger said:
Las Vegas is on PT
Love that set up. I'll take it one step further and move the Rays to Charlotte as well. No one pays attention or goes to the games there. Still fits the south demographic too.
I agree that Portland would make more send than Salt Lake.
I agree that Portland would make more send than Salt Lake.
I actually think there are a good number of Rays fans, as they have been very successful for a bit now and have really really good players. Their stadium is just such a dump that I don't think anyone cares to go to the games.
I do really like reorganizing the divisions though. The AL West makes zero geographic sense to include Texas with Cali and Washington. There's tons of good arguments for adding two new teams, and this is one of them. That being said, there's also some good arguments against it as well. Would be super curious to sit in on owners meetings about adding teams and listening to the pros and cons.
I do really like reorganizing the divisions though. The AL West makes zero geographic sense to include Texas with Cali and Washington. There's tons of good arguments for adding two new teams, and this is one of them. That being said, there's also some good arguments against it as well. Would be super curious to sit in on owners meetings about adding teams and listening to the pros and cons.
Yeah, I would be fine if they moved to Charlotte, but sounds like they will be getting a new ballpark in St. Pete most likely.
Charlotte is certainly an MLB city. I lived there for a bit and it is such an underrated place that is growing like crazy. It is a shame they don't have a team yet, despite being about 4 hours from any current MLB team. If they fall short to Nashville for this round of expansion, I would have to think they are first in line for any future re-locations or expansion.
If you are unfamiliar, the Charlotte Knights are the AAA affiliate of the White Sox. They may have the best minor league stadium in the country.
Charlotte is certainly an MLB city. I lived there for a bit and it is such an underrated place that is growing like crazy. It is a shame they don't have a team yet, despite being about 4 hours from any current MLB team. If they fall short to Nashville for this round of expansion, I would have to think they are first in line for any future re-locations or expansion.
If you are unfamiliar, the Charlotte Knights are the AAA affiliate of the White Sox. They may have the best minor league stadium in the country.
MLB teams seem to be concentrated in a smaller area than some of the other professional leagues, besides maybe the NHL. This leaves so many parts of the country that have so few MLB teams, that I think the league is a in a good position to expand.
For example, the MLB currently has 4 metro areas with two teams - New York, LA, Chicago, and the Bay Area. The NFL and NBA only have 2 markets with two teams (New York and LA). The MLB also only has 8 teams that are not in the north-east, mid-west, or California, compared to 13 for the NFL and 14 for the NBA.
There are many markets that have a well-supported NBA or NFL team that do not have an MLB team. Las Vegas, New Orleans, Nashville, Charlotte, Indianapolis, Portland, Salt Lake City, San Antonio, Buffalo, Oklahoma City... plus markets like Montreal and Vancouver that could be viable options as well. I think the MLB is missing a massive opportunity if they do not expand.
For example, the MLB currently has 4 metro areas with two teams - New York, LA, Chicago, and the Bay Area. The NFL and NBA only have 2 markets with two teams (New York and LA). The MLB also only has 8 teams that are not in the north-east, mid-west, or California, compared to 13 for the NFL and 14 for the NBA.
There are many markets that have a well-supported NBA or NFL team that do not have an MLB team. Las Vegas, New Orleans, Nashville, Charlotte, Indianapolis, Portland, Salt Lake City, San Antonio, Buffalo, Oklahoma City... plus markets like Montreal and Vancouver that could be viable options as well. I think the MLB is missing a massive opportunity if they do not expand.
Encouraging starts from non-playoff teams
https://www.mlb.com/news/encouraging-2023-starts-mlb-non-playoff-teams?partnerID=mlbapp-android_article-share
https://www.mlb.com/news/encouraging-2023-starts-mlb-non-playoff-teams?partnerID=mlbapp-android_article-share
Quote:
2. Texas Rangers (12-6, 1st in AL West)
What's different: The Rangers centered their offseason around upgrading their pitching staff, and that group currently owns a top-10 ERA (3.49) and a 9.6 K/9, which would crush the single-season franchise record (8.6). Although much money was spent on the starting rotation, Texas' bullpen has been even better. That group is tied for third in ERA (2.71) and second in opponents' batting average (.190).
Challenge ahead: Jacob deGrom has been outstanding since his rocky Opening Day start. But on Monday, he provided yet another reason why you must hold your breath every time he takes the mound. It's imperative for the Rangers to keep their high-priced ace healthy, especially if they want to stay competitive in a division that features the reigning World Series champion Astros, a strong Mariners squad and the improved Angels.
Why it can stick: The Rangers complement that mound success with an offense that features some potent veteran bats in Marcus Semien, Nathaniel Lowe and the currently injured Corey Seager. Plus, rookie third baseman Josh Jung is off to a good start. In short, the Rangers haven't had a team this complete in about a decade.
-- Brian Murphy
World's worst proofreader
Not sure that he has much left in the tank, but ran across this and found it interesting. Our current pitching staff has been pretty good so far (see post above for more on that)
If the Diamondbacks do move on from Bumgarner and eat the rest of his contract, it'd make sense that he'd try to steer himself to the Rangers. There is a ton of trust shared with new Texas Manager Bruce Bochy, built on three championships.
— Buster Olney (@Buster_ESPN) April 20, 2023
The good thing is with the rotation depth there isn't an absolute need to take a flier on him right now. I'm curious if he'd be interested in taking a stint to RR to work on a few things. Idk, maybe he'd value his relationship with Bochy above joining a staff right away
I've tried to express this in the past.
The beauty of a FA signing like deGrom (3.48), Heaney (4.97), & Eovaldi (5.40), is that you push the other talent back.
Dunning (15.1 IP, 0.00), Ragans (9.0 IP, 2.00), and Otto (IL) were the next 3 SPs.
I don't think those 3 SP are fully performing, but we now have 3 RPs that can perform and grow into starting roles. AND we have 3 other guys that would have plugged into the Bullpen that get more minor league time.
ALL will be hungry to succeed.
The beauty of a FA signing like deGrom (3.48), Heaney (4.97), & Eovaldi (5.40), is that you push the other talent back.
Dunning (15.1 IP, 0.00), Ragans (9.0 IP, 2.00), and Otto (IL) were the next 3 SPs.
I don't think those 3 SP are fully performing, but we now have 3 RPs that can perform and grow into starting roles. AND we have 3 other guys that would have plugged into the Bullpen that get more minor league time.
ALL will be hungry to succeed.
If you could get him for 2023 and 2024 for league minimum... Yowzers. He is 33 almost 34.KT 90 said:
Not sure that he has much left in the tank, but ran across this and found it interesting. Our current pitching staff has been pretty good so far (see post above for more on that)If the Diamondbacks do move on from Bumgarner and eat the rest of his contract, it'd make sense that he'd try to steer himself to the Rangers. There is a ton of trust shared with new Texas Manager Bruce Bochy, built on three championships.
— Buster Olney (@Buster_ESPN) April 20, 2023
I could see him going to Frisco over Round Rock. Just the proximity to Arlington would likely be of value. That way he could work with Maddux, as well. He might help Leiter, as well.TexAg1822 said:
The good thing is with the rotation depth there isn't an absolute need to take a flier on him right now. I'm curious if he'd be interested in taking a stint to RR to work on a few things. Idk, maybe he'd value his relationship with Bochy above joining a staff right away
At the current pace the Rangers are on pace to post a 108-54 record.
Legal Custodian said:
Love that set up. I'll take it one step further and move the Rays to Charlotte as well. No one pays attention or goes to the games there. Still fits the south demographic too.
I agree that Portland would make more send than Salt Lake.
The real issue that hopefully MLB solves this time around in expansion is giving teams to cities before the stadium situation is resolved. The Trop was a dump when the Rays moved in 25 years ago and it should have been obvious to everyone that a stadium that requires special rules because the ball hits the roof girders so often is not a MLB quality stadium. The Diamondbacks had their stadium ready to go for opening day, and the Rockies had a good plan to build Coors after playing 2 seasons in Mile High, but with both the Marlins and the Rays MLB **** the bed and screwed over any chance of building a strong fan base right from day one.
Also, when it comes to these stadium deals, I lived in the bay area for a while, and the politics of a new stadium for Oakland were very complex. The A's and the city both wanted to make it happen, but under very different conditions. The city was looking for the A's to invest in the kind of stadium area that would revitalize Oakland, but of course the A's don't have any kind of responsibility to save a **** hole city.
So because the A's and the city couldn't agree on an area/price in Oakland, the A's explored a small move out of Oakland, closer to an area that would likely support baseball better and keep what little of a fan base they have intact, so the Fremont/San Jose area, but then there were complications with how MLBs markets are set up and how that would affect the Giants. The Giants have been able to keep this mostly quiet, but they are a big part of the issue here, essentially screwing over the A's by not being willing to compromise on their territory.
So basically, no matter the belly aching of Oakland, or any actual A's fans, the situation was a lose lose one for the franchise. Either give in to the extortion of the city and build your new park where you don't want it and be forced to subsidize affordable housing and infrastructure for Oakland, or move the team.
Again, hopefully, MLB has all of these problems sorted well in advance of any further expansion. Also, the league needs to attract more owners like Steve Cohen who just want to spend and win. These narratives of "small market" BS need to stop. Tampa Bay has the 18th largest metro population in the country and yet they draw only 10k per game. Pittsburgh has a metro of 2.4 million, and they run themselves like they are located in Bismarck.
If you put an entertaining and winning product on the field, and give the fans a fun and convenient experience, then the fans will come. If you bellyache and whine about your market all the time, sell off your good players, and always start the next round of the 5 year rebuilding plan, of course your fans won't come to your games. Even the Rays method of winning is super alienating to fans. By the time you have a favorite player, the team is exploring shipping them off. To build fans, you need Biggios, Bagwells, Berkmans, Oswalts, Kinslers, Michael Youngs etc. that fans can grow up with and cheer for through the years. San Diego gets this, and has decided that if you're a Padres fan, you're going to cheer for Cronenworth, Tatis, Machado, Boegarts, Darvish for the next 7 years. The team is going to have continuity, and that is good for fans.
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