***Official Houston Astros 2022-23 Offseason Thread***

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FrioAg 00
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9:32a, 11/30/22
AG
I honestly just think he wants to win, and he appropriately realizes the priority for 2 improvements to our bats rank higher than retaining JV.

He's got 1, he's working on 2, and he will still do his best to keep JV as well. But if he lands the second bat upgrade at a good value, the JV decision is less critical overall.
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Gordo14
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In reply to gigemJTH12 • 9:34a, 11/30/22
gigemJTH12 said:
Harry Dunne said:
irish pete ag06 said:
It would be a great signing, I don't give a damn about the past.
I'm with you 100%.

I was watching a thing about the USMNT '98 collapse (spoiler alert: Team captain John Harkes was boning best friend and teammate Eric Wynalda's wife). The coach booted Harkes even after Wynalda told him not to and the team turned against the coach for doing so.
where is this available to watch?


There's a really good podcast about that 1998 team called "American Fiasco" by Roger Bennett. While that is definitely the peak of the chaos in the documentary, there are so many self-destructive stories for the '98 World Cup team that I cannot recommend it enough.
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ChAg1799
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In reply to Agmaniacmike12 • 9:47a, 11/30/22
AG
Agmaniacmike12 said:
Bellinger is obviously a fit from a versatility standpoint. I'm just curious what a rumored deal for him would be?


Piss on him! AND piss on you for even considering it. FFFFF that d0uche. I hope he rots on a crap team or is forced to retire and work at a DBat like his buddy Trevor.
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Beat40
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 10:09a, 11/30/22
Farmer1906 said:
Wabs said:
gigemJTH12 said:
I would rather sign Vazquez than contreras. probably much cheaper. spend the money elsewhere
Maybe sign Vazquez and Benintendi?
I don't think Vazquez is interested in a backup job.
Agreed. Part of the reason it's a shame Castro got hurt and we couldn't keep Maldy from vesting for the additional contract year.
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EastCoastAgNc
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10:19a, 11/30/22
AG

That's good right?
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Panama Red
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10:20a, 11/30/22
AG
Harkes was the team captain, a very good player, that the team wanted around.

Bellinger is not good and I highly doubt anyone on the Astros wants him around. The situations are not remotely similar.
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gigemJTH12
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10:24a, 11/30/22
AG
I will never understand the thought process behind someone like JV taking and extra $10 million to leave.

That family has to be worth like half a billion.

why not stay with your bros and win titles?


easy for me to say...but given my current net worth, on a relative basis, I would pass up that extra $ to work with my friends.


but its not me deciding on extra millions so I wont pretend to get it.
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McInnis
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In reply to gigemJTH12 • 10:31a, 11/30/22
AG
gigemJTH12 said:
I will never understand the thought process behind someone like JV taking and extra $10 million to leave.

That family has to be worth like half a billion.

why not stay with your bros and win titles?


easy for me to say...but given my current net worth, on a relative basis, I would pass up that extra $ to work with my friends.


but its not me deciding on extra millions so I wont pretend to get it.
I really don't get it either, I have to just assume it's a lot more about ego than money.
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n_touch
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In reply to gigemJTH12 • 10:31a, 11/30/22
When you are that level, the only way that you can measure yourself against your peers is who has the biggest contract. Plus keep in mind the more money he takes, the better the market is for those that come behind him. That is important to him.
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gigemJTH12
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In reply to n_touch • 10:32a, 11/30/22
AG
I really doubt one guy taking a discount at the end of his career to stay on the WS champion team would have much impact on the market but I get it
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Kashchei
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10:39a, 11/30/22
AG
Plus, assuming JV gets $40 million he'll still be a few mil behind Scherzer's $43.3 (i.e., not the biggest)

I guess I get it too, but I would chase the hardware! His great grandchildren will never be able to spend all the money he and Kate have!
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Nino Brown
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10:40a, 11/30/22
JV represents the players association as much as anyone active in baseball.

Perhaps he wants to run the association one day. Who knows, but guys like JV do not benefit from not exploring all options in order to help the MLBPA.
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Ag_07
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In reply to gigemJTH12 • 10:42a, 11/30/22
AG
gigemJTH12 said:
I really doubt one guy taking a discount at the end of his career to stay on the WS champion team would have much impact on the market but I get it


It absolutely does.

Whoever the best pitcher on the FA market is after him is gonna get a deal using his as a starting point. Just like he's using Scherzer's deal.

If he doesn't take the max offer on the table then he's costing the next guy money.

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Panama Red
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10:52a, 11/30/22
AG
The "I did it for the Union and others" is just something they say to stave off criticism of being greedy.

JV wants the most money. Nothing wrong with that. Why should he give any team a discount? Its not his fault the owners put in a soft cap with the tax.

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Prosperdick
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10:54a, 11/30/22
AG
I'm starting to look at JV like Correa. Correa left for the money and we got a rookie who did one helluva impersonation of Carlos.

We just so happen to have a rookie who also does one helluva impersonation of JV named Hunter Brown.

Who knows, maybe lightning in a bottle twice but the good news is we don't need the lightning, we just need a glowstick.
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Ragnar Danneskjoldd
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In reply to Prosperdick • 10:56a, 11/30/22
AG
Prosperdick said:
I'm starting to look at JV like Correa. Correa left for the money and we got a rookie who did one helluva impersonation of Carlos.

We just so happen to have a rookie who also does one helluva impersonation of JV named Hunter Brown.

Who knows, maybe lightning in a bottle twice but the good news is we don't need the lightning, we just need a glowstick.
Fact of the matter, pitching isnt a huge need. We are better with JV, but maybe not better than we could be if we invested the money elsewhere.

Its win win for the astros assuming the money saved on JV would be reinvested into a catcher/CF.
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texasaggie2015
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In reply to gigemJTH12 • 11:30a, 11/30/22
AG
gigemJTH12 said:
I would rather sign Vazquez than contreras. probably much cheaper. spend the money elsewhere
FWIW- I've heard Vasquez told the Astros he wants to go somewhere where he's starting. Don't see him coming back.

Backup catcher is a priority. They aren't keen on Lee/Diaz being the backup at least to start the year.
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AggiEE
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11:35a, 11/30/22
Aren't the Dodgers going to be a radically different team next year? No guarantee they are still competitive

At least with the Astros you know we added a huge piece with Abreu, and maybe more.

That increases the chance is JV stacking up wins for his legacy

Can't imagine why you'd care too deeply about signing for 36M/yr vs 43M/yr….these player deals are not always static. Just because Scherzer got overpaid doesn't mean that's average market value. Some guys just get stupid offers from stupid teams

Hope JV realizes Crane's offer will be close enough all considered (tax savings, championship odds, etc) to stay

Just because it's lower than Scherzer doesn't mean it's a slight
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bearkatag15
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In reply to AggiEE • 11:41a, 11/30/22
AG
Scherzer's 1st year of his current contract, he was 37. JV will be 40 in the 1st year of his deal. That's an enough of a difference to justify paying less AAV. I doubt Scherzer gets the same AAV in his next contract at 40
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AggiEE
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In reply to bearkatag15 • 11:47a, 11/30/22
bearkatag15 said:
Scherzer's 1st year of his current contract, he was 37. JV will be 40 in the 1st year of his deal. That's an enough of a difference to justify paying less AAV. I doubt Scherzer gets the same AAV in his next contract at 40


Which is another good point, it's an apples to oranges comparison.

Some guys pitch to 45, and I hope JV does, but statistically it becomes less likely

So either JV accepts a huge discount to AAV due to more years (3/95), or goes with a larger AAV and less years (70/2).

That seems pretty fair to me, I'm curious who would even think about doing 3/120, but if he gets that and the extra 25M means that much to him… let him walk knowing you have a fair offer
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W
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11:47a, 11/30/22
AG
regarding Mancini...

he had a chance to make himself some money in the offseason, but unfortunately he struggled in his 2 months with the Astros
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Farmer1906
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11:49a, 11/30/22
AG
I don't see the JV deal happening. Even if we don't sign another big name, the few pieces to fill out the roster will cost enough to eat up 15-25 M. That's going to put us at 212-222 which is not far from the 233 tax. Crane may dip his toe into the tax, but I a doubt he'll be willing to go 20-30 over it.
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bearkatag15
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11:53a, 11/30/22
AG
$37.5 per year. Strong offer
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OKCAg2002
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In reply to bearkatag15 • 11:56a, 11/30/22
AG
All of those postseason Ks don't come cheap.
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Farmer1906
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In reply to bearkatag15 • 12:12p, 11/30/22
AG
Before last year he rejected 7/213 and since he was under control, it was more like a 6/196 extension. At a minimum, he's upped his AAV from 32.7 to 37.5 & gotten 2 years added ages 37 & 38. Its obvious after the season he had, but what a smart move it turned out to be.
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W
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12:16p, 11/30/22
AG
one problem for the Yankees in running back the Cole-Judge-Giancarlo trio...

it can't beat the Astros.

having those 3 players as your 3 highest paid is a losing hand
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AggiEE
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 12:22p, 11/30/22
Farmer1906 said:
I don't see the JV deal happening. Even if we don't sign another big name, the few pieces to fill out the roster will cost enough to eat up 15-25 M. That's going to put us at 212-222 which is not far from the 233 tax. Crane may dip his toe into the tax, but I a doubt he'll be willing to go 20-30 over it.


I think he will if it's JV and it's just a short term situation
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bearkatag15
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12:22p, 11/30/22
AG


Speaking of AAVs… my gosh soccer is in a different stratosphere
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Beat40
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In reply to bearkatag15 • 12:30p, 11/30/22
bearkatag15 said:


Speaking of AAVs… my gosh soccer is in a different stratosphere
Global image.
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Beat40
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 12:32p, 11/30/22
I'm really curious to see how he performs after singing a big contract.

Obviously, he's going to take a step back, just curious how much it will be. Still think he'll hit over 40 HRs.
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shano0603
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In reply to gigemJTH12 • 12:45p, 11/30/22
AG
gigemJTH12 said:
I would rather sign Vazquez than contreras. probably much cheaper. spend the money elsewhere

Contreras will probably need too much money. For a catcher who hits like him sure. For him at LF/DH, not as much.

If we are talking specifically about catchers. I would be kicking the tires with the blue jays. Not sure which one they would trade or how much they would want. But i would take any of them.
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Ag_07
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In reply to bearkatag15 • 12:48p, 11/30/22
AG
bearkatag15 said:


Speaking of AAVs… my gosh Saudi Arabians are in a different stratosphere


FIFY
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Ag_07
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In reply to shano0603 • 12:49p, 11/30/22
AG
Doubt they'd do it because it's in the same division but I love Sean Murphy and be curious what it would take to pry him out of OAK.
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AggiEE
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In reply to shano0603 • 1:01p, 11/30/22
shano0603 said:
gigemJTH12 said:
I would rather sign Vazquez than contreras. probably much cheaper. spend the money elsewhere

Contreras will probably need too much money. For a catcher who hits like him sure. For him at LF/DH, not as much.

If we are talking specifically about catchers. I would be kicking the tires with the blue jays. Not sure which one they would trade or how much they would want. But i would take any of them.


Contreras would be a massive upgrade at Catcher

From what I understand is that his performance suffers if he plays too many games. A platoon role makes sense to split regular season starts

Where he matters most will be in the playoff lineup as your primary guy

If we can get him on 3/45 that would be pretty good imho. I wouldn't go much beyond 4/60 though
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MAROON
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In reply to Beat40 • 1:06p, 11/30/22
AG
Pulisic makes 7mil pounds a year at Chelsea and doesn't even start
What do you boys want for breakfast BBQ ?.....OK Chili.
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