***Official Houston Astros 2021-22 Offseason Thread***

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jopatura
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In reply to Memphis 7 • 11:45p, 3/20/22
AG
The Twins can use Correa as trade-bait if their season goes belly up. Correa will play on a contending team in October one way or another. They are basically paying $35 mil to either make the playoffs or get a bunch of prospects back. For a team like the Twins, not a bad deal.

The Astros didn't really have that luxury since it's expected we'll contend and we certainly shouldn't be out of it by the trade deadline. So at that point, you're paying $35 mil to be jerked around every year.
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Frok
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7:14a, 3/21/22
AG
Or you would pay $35 million to return last years World Series lineup for another year.
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JDUB08AG
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In reply to Frok • 7:34a, 3/21/22
AG
Frok said:
Or you would pay $35 million to return last years World Series lineup for another year.


The thing is our window isn't closed after this year. We have to still be thinking about the long haul and locking up guys like Tucker and Yordan. At some point too we are going to have to spend on more pitching.

Correa wanted complete and total control to the point where if he went completely downhill, we'd be kinda ****ed and our longevity would absolutely be in jeopardy.

Either way is a gamble but I'd rather retain our ability to be agile than attach ourselves to a guy who really only cares about how much money he makes.
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Ag_07
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7:45a, 3/21/22
AG
CC and Boras just wanted to use someone for a year to get Carlos his big payday.

Glad it won't be us.

I'm done with Carlos and am moving on.
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Proudag06
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In reply to JDUB08AG • 7:46a, 3/21/22
AG
WelchAg said:
Frok said:
Or you would pay $35 million to return last years World Series lineup for another year.


The thing is our window isn't closed after this year. We have to still be thinking about the long haul and locking up guys like Tucker and Yordan. At some point too we are going to have to spend on more pitching.

Correa wanted complete and total control to the point where if he went completely downhill, we'd be kinda ****ed and our longevity would absolutely be in jeopardy.

Either way is a gamble but I'd rather retain our ability to be agile than attach ourselves to a guy who really only cares about how much money he makes.


Exactly, this is not a 1 year 35 mil contract. Astros would have loved that sort of flexibility. It is only a potential 1 year contract but the Astros don't know if that will be the case, hindering their ability to negotiate with guys like Tucker and Alvarez due to financial uncertainty. Too many people are acting like this was simply a 1 year (or even simply a 3 year) contract.
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Farmer1906
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8:15a, 3/21/22
AG


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EastCoastAgNc
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 8:22a, 3/21/22
AG
If they can somehow incorporate the Houston Chronicle tombstone from 2005 into it, that'd be awesome
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Deluxe
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In reply to Lonestar_Ag09 • 8:22a, 3/21/22
AG
Lonestar_Ag09 said:
I know it's not the right way to think of it but there is a part of me as an Astros fan that really likes watching young guys come up and start figuring it out, with that mindset I'm really excited to see what Peña can do.

This mindset also really excites me for when Lee gets his shot.

I can still remember when Castro first got called up and the excitement that came from that. And then again when it was Springer and Bregman and Correa and Tucker and Yordan. Just something exciting about youth and prospects.
I don't think that's the wrong way to look at it. If anything, I feel like more of our fanbase needs to embrace that mindset.

I get that most fans are traditional fans who want the Astros to win all the games and spend all the money and sign all the players. And that's great.

But I think viewing our offseason decision-making through that apparatus inevitably leads to feeling disappointed in our front office. Our front office deserves every last ounce of benefit of the doubt right now. I've never rooted for a team that's run this well, that develops talent at this rate and gets so much out of it.

Most fanbases dream of the run we've had the last five years: WS win, ALCS, AL champs, ALCS, AL champs. During that timespan, we recycled 35 of the 40 players from the 2017 World Series roster. 35! We know how to reload.

Altuve is the lifer who will always be paid. Bregman and LMJ were willing to take discounts to stay. JV/Yuli are old and willing to stay on team friendly short term deals. Everyone else... replaced. And we still win. And we're still projected to win. It's insane how competent our front office is.

We're not going to be the team that pays "market value" to our stars to stay. As much as it hurts to see guys like Springer, Cole and Correa playing for other teams, that's not how you build a sustainable winner. Being a sustainable winner requires tough, unemotional decision-making.

Doing fractional rebuilds every year ensures we don't have to do gigantic rebuilds at some point in the future. This year, we're going to see what Pena and Meyers can bring to the table. And I'm really excited to see it.

TLDR: Not signing Correa and giving Pena a shot is perfectly in line with an organizational philosophy that has netted us an insanely successful run. Enjoy watching the young guys develop. Trust Crane/Click and our front office until they give us a reason not to.
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Farmer1906
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In reply to Deluxe • 8:48a, 3/21/22
AG
We currently sit @ #10 in baseball for payroll at 206 M. If we had signed Cole we'd be at 242, Springer 272, Correa 307. Not even the Mets are spending like that.

We have around 33 M to play with. That seems like just enough to fit in an extension of a current player and handle a couple of new contracts at the deadline.
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Deluxe
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 8:58a, 3/21/22
AG
Farmer1906 said:
We currently sit @ #10 in baseball for payroll at 206 M. If we had signed Cole we'd be at 242, Springer 272, Correa 307. Not even the Mets are spending like that.

We have around 33 M to play with. That seems like just enough to fit in an extension of a current player and handle a couple of new contracts at the deadline.
Yep. Crane is more than willing to spend. We do a good job balancing spending and retaining flexibility. Obviously our ability to be flexible is greatly enhanced by our player development system.
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MaxPower
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 9:00a, 3/21/22
Look this team as is is good enough to win 90+ games and the division. I'm not quite as optimistic as you on the long term. The farm isn't good and we have a ton of players hitting free agency the next 2 years. Yordan and Tucker are great but we are going to need much more. At this point I'd be fine with trading a big league starter for some upper level hitting prospects at positions of long term need.
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3 Toed Pete
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9:08a, 3/21/22
AG
Posters on here really believe Boras was ghosted and just passively sat back and accepted it without making any other effort?

Anyone that has followed sports knows Boras sets the narrative, he doesn't passively accept the narrative.

And the mother in law retweets don't add credibility.
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EastCoastAgNc
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9:12a, 3/21/22
AG
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Lonestar_Ag09
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In reply to Deluxe • 9:16a, 3/21/22
AG
Deluxe said:
Lonestar_Ag09 said:
I know it's not the right way to think of it but there is a part of me as an Astros fan that really likes watching young guys come up and start figuring it out, with that mindset I'm really excited to see what Peña can do.

This mindset also really excites me for when Lee gets his shot.

I can still remember when Castro first got called up and the excitement that came from that. And then again when it was Springer and Bregman and Correa and Tucker and Yordan. Just something exciting about youth and prospects.
I don't think that's the wrong way to look at it. If anything, I feel like more of our fanbase needs to embrace that mindset.

I get that most fans are traditional fans who want the Astros to win all the games and spend all the money and sign all the players. And that's great.

But I think viewing our offseason decision-making through that apparatus inevitably leads to feeling disappointed in our front office. Our front office deserves every last ounce of benefit of the doubt right now. I've never rooted for a team that's run this well, that develops talent at this rate and gets so much out of it.

Most fanbases dream of the run we've had the last five years: WS win, ALCS, AL champs, ALCS, AL champs. During that timespan, we recycled 35 of the 40 players from the 2017 World Series roster. 35! We know how to reload.

Altuve is the lifer who will always be paid. Bregman and LMJ were willing to take discounts to stay. JV/Yuli are old and willing to stay on team friendly short term deals. Everyone else... replaced. And we still win. And we're still projected to win. It's insane how competent our front office is.

We're not going to be the team that pays "market value" to our stars to stay. As much as it hurts to see guys like Springer, Cole and Correa playing for other teams, that's not how you build a sustainable winner. Being a sustainable winner requires tough, unemotional decision-making.

Doing fractional rebuilds every year ensures we don't have to do gigantic rebuilds at some point in the future. This year, we're going to see what Pena and Meyers can bring to the table. And I'm really excited to see it.

TLDR: Not signing Correa and giving Pena a shot is perfectly in line with an organizational philosophy that has netted us an insanely successful run. Enjoy watching the young guys develop. Trust Crane/Click and our front office until they give us a reason not to.
Well, Im ready to go run through a brick wall...to the couch to watch the home town 9! Anyone else?
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Farmer1906
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In reply to MaxPower • 9:36a, 3/21/22
AG
There will definitely be a ton to replace:

After 2022: (current age) - 2021 Salary
  • Michael Brantley (35) - 16 M
  • Ryan Pressly (33) - 10 M
  • Yuli Gurriel (38) - 8 M
  • Martin Maldonado (35) - 5 M
  • Jason Castro (35) - 4.25 M
  • Aledmys Diaz (31) - ~4 M
  • Possibly Justin Verlander (39) - 25 M

~72 M off the books

After 2023:
  • Ryan Stanek (30) - ~2.5 M
  • Phil Maton (29) - ~2.0 M

~4.5 M off the books

Plus more because I didn't name the less important guys like Baez, Goodrum, etc.

But there is a reason some of us keep saying the window is wide open. This core will be around for a minimum of 3 more years.
  • Jose Altuve
  • Lance McCullers (5 years)
  • Alex Bregman
  • Hector Neris (club option for 2024)
  • Yordan Alvarez (4 years)
  • Luis Garcia (5 years)
  • Christian Javier (5 years)
  • Chas McCormick (5 years)
  • Jake Meyers (6 years)
  • Jeremy Pena (6 years)
  • Kyle Tucker (4 years)
  • Jose Urquidy (4 years)
  • Framber Valdez (4 years)

That core plus 100 M to blow means extensions, trades, and free agents. Why wouldn't we stay contenders for the next 4-5 years?
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Deluxe
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In reply to MaxPower • 9:37a, 3/21/22
AG
MaxPower said:
Look this team as is is good enough to win 90+ games and the division. I'm not quite as optimistic as you on the long term. The farm isn't good and we have a ton of players hitting free agency the next 2 years. Yordan and Tucker are great but we are going to need much more. At this point I'd be fine with trading a big league starter for some upper level hitting prospects at positions of long term need.
It is interesting to look at our five year forecast right now. I'd be willing to grant that it's not quite as good as it was a couple years ago. I still think the future is bright / window wide ass open though.

I'd argue that our top five prospects right now is up there with our better top fives in recent memory. Lee, Leon, Pena, H Brown and Whitley. All of those guys will be big leaguers (how successful? we'll see).

We appear to lack the depth we had when we were atop all the MLB farm rankings. But at the same time, when guys like Meyers, McCormick, De La Garza, Toro, L Garcia, Javier, etc are seemingly popping up out of no where, it makes me feel like we have a better handle on things than the rankings would have us believe.

I do think the next couple of drafts will be big for us. The brunt of losing our first/second rounders in 20/21 will be felt in a couple years. It's important that we hit on a couple guys to supplement our top tier prospects when our big five prospects are in the show.
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Farmer1906
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In reply to EastCoastAgNc • 9:41a, 3/21/22
AG
EastCoastAgNc said:
The first thing that jumps off the page is 95% curveball spin.
The second thing is that he only throws is 10% of the time. So either so much for that or its an opportunity.

He also has a very spinny slider which he throws most of all.

Righties absolutely crush him. He's good vs lefties but not great. Might be a nice little project for Strom... nevermind.
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bigjag19
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 9:49a, 3/21/22
AG
Farmer1906 said:
EastCoastAgNc said:
The first thing that jumps off the page is 95% curveball spin.
The second thing is that he only throws is 10% of the time. So either so much for that or its an opportunity.

He also has a very spinny slider which he throws most of all.

Righties absolutely crush him. He's good vs lefties but not great. Might be a nice little project for Strom... nevermind.


I need a hug.
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Deluxe
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 9:49a, 3/21/22
AG
Farmer1906 said:
EastCoastAgNc said:
The first thing that jumps off the page is 95% curveball spin.
The second thing is that he only throws is 10% of the time. So either so much for that or its an opportunity.

He also has a very spinny slider which he throws most of all.

Righties absolutely crush him. He's good vs lefties but not great. Might be a nice little project for Strom... nevermind.
This year we get to see that the magic wasn't with Strom. It was with the nerds all along. Strom was the just the face of it.
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agproducer
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10:08a, 3/21/22
AG
Unseal the letter!

https://www.nj.com/yankees/2022/03/appeals-court-rules-letter-that-allegedly-shows-mlb-hid-yankees-sign-stealing-should-be-unsealed.html
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EastCoastAgNc
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10:14a, 3/21/22
AG

Don't forget they have Kenny-G this year coming off of tommy john.
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Deluxe
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In reply to agproducer • 10:20a, 3/21/22
AG
agproducer said:
Unseal the letter!

https://www.nj.com/yankees/2022/03/appeals-court-rules-letter-that-allegedly-shows-mlb-hid-yankees-sign-stealing-should-be-unsealed.html
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3B Paul 97
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In reply to agproducer • 10:42a, 3/21/22
AG
agproducer said:
Unseal the letter!

https://www.nj.com/yankees/2022/03/appeals-court-rules-letter-that-allegedly-shows-mlb-hid-yankees-sign-stealing-should-be-unsealed.html


Interested to see if this letter puts Ol Rob in an even worse light.
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Farmer1906
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In reply to 3B Paul 97 • 10:51a, 3/21/22
AG
If that happens and the Yankees had something similar to us then I want the same energy from the media and fans. I want them fined and lose draft picks. Manfred would need to be removed immediately for the cover-up.
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Mathguy64
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 10:55a, 3/21/22
AG
Farmer1906 said:
If that happens and the Yankees had something similar to us then I want the same energy from the media and fans. I want them fined and lose draft picks. Manfred would need to be removed immediately for the cover-up.
I'll step out on a limb and say it was different but the same level, nothing will happen and Rob keeps his job. In addition fans everywhere including Yankees fans will yell at Altuve again all season calling him a cheater.
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Deluxe
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In reply to Mathguy64 • 11:20a, 3/21/22
AG
Mathguy64 said:
Farmer1906 said:
If that happens and the Yankees had something similar to us then I want the same energy from the media and fans. I want them fined and lose draft picks. Manfred would need to be removed immediately for the cover-up.
I'll step out on a limb and say it was different but the same level, nothing will happen and Rob keeps his job. In addition fans everywhere including Yankees fans will yell at Altuve again all season calling him a cheater.
Yea, I'm not getting my hopes up. Regardless of what it says, there will be a huge PR push from LA/NY media/fans to assert that it's not as bad as what the Astros did. They need the Astros as a scapegoat for the shortcomings of their organizations.
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bearkatag15
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11:30a, 3/21/22
AG
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tjack16
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11:51a, 3/21/22
AG


I'd say Braves, Mets, Dodgers, Phillies, Blue Jays, Twins and Rangers all made good moves.
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The Porkchop Express
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12:34p, 3/21/22
AG
If nothing else, the Boston media will go through that letter like it's the treasure map in National Treasure and light up every detail as a 4th of July firework, even if the bootlickers try to bury it.
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agproducer
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12:40p, 3/21/22
AG
The question is: when will the letter be unsealed?

Also, are there any other appeals left?
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bearkatag15
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 1:05p, 3/21/22
AG
Farmer1906 said:






I'd buy one
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CFTXAG10
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1:11p, 3/21/22
AG
10% off w/ code Tuve10
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Farmer1906
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1:18p, 3/21/22
AG
Tomorrow's game is finally going to have some of the starters in. We have a match-up elite starting pitcher: DeGrom vs ODORIZZI.

A reminder of what happened the last time we saw DeGrom in Spring.

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EastCoastAgNc
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 1:23p, 3/21/22
AG
I think dusty changed his mind and said Wednesday
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EastCoastAgNc
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1:23p, 3/21/22
AG
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