At this point not resigning Correa would be a huge organizational mistake. That demand is not ridiculous.
I just hope he stays healthy.
I just hope he stays healthy.
*****Official Houston Astros 2020-2021 Offseason Thread*****
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agproducer said:I find this conversation funny. I suggested in January that the Astros should offer an 8/226 contract for Correa and many scoffed, saying Correa would never sign it because it was too low.Farmer1906 said:If that is the # then I would really hope we do it or negotiate something close to it.The Milkman said:
Granato says that Correa asked for 8/200. If that's where he's at then I think we'll get it done by this weekend
We'd be paying for ages 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, & 34.
Maybe change it up and give 7 year, 185.5 M. A little better yearly for 1 fewer year.
That's why the reaction everyone, including me, is do the damn deal because it's less than everyone expected. Lindor is rumored to get 300 M. Machado, Tatis, Harper, etc all recently got 300 or more. Correa is close to that level. I would expect him to ask for that. But 200 M and fewer years than those guys make so much more sense. It just seemed unrealistic by comparison.
Opening day with a signed Correa will make for a much more fun *official season* thread.
I'm not saying to not take that deal. It's reasonable, relatively.
It's 25 per. It's a Springer deal with a few additional years.
It's 25 per. It's a Springer deal with a few additional years.
One thing to keep in mind. We know what Carlos wants. If we don't extend him then start free agency with his #, then whats to stop him from signing it? No negotiation. Just give him what he asked for in March. That was Crane and co avoid the penalties from the luxury tax. The only risk is what Carlos takes on this year playing without a long-term deal. Or, I guess, someone coming way over the top of what he asked for.
The risk is that he gets to entertain and see offers from others and his price could and most likely will go up.
Right now there's no market for him. Come free agency there will be.
Right now there's no market for him. Come free agency there will be.
If that's truly what Carlos is asking, and we don't do that deal by Apr1, come the end of next season if he stays healthy all year, his price is going way up and we'll be out of the market for him.
unless he has another below average regular season like he did last year, or get hurt, AGAINAg_07 said:
The risk is that he gets to entertain and see offers from others and his price could and most likely will go up.
Right now there's no market for him. Come free agency there will be.
Absolutely agreed as long as he's really asking that. If it's just the public posturing, then that's a different situation. Regardless, the 6/120 was ridiculous.Frok said:
At this point not resigning Correa would be a huge organizational mistake. That demand is not ridiculous.
I just hope he stays healthy.
I wager we get an official extension announcement on the 30th or 31st when the guys get home after that last ST game on the 29th
I disagree.Bulldog73 said:Absolutely agreed as long as he's really asking that. If it's just the public posturing, then that's a different situation. Regardless, the 6/120 was ridiculous.Frok said:
At this point not resigning Correa would be a huge organizational mistake. That demand is not ridiculous.
I just hope he stays healthy.
It's all easy when it's not my money I'm throwing around
lol I got you....Bulldog73 said:
It's all easy when it's not my money I'm throwing around
Just looking at the contract that is what Xander signed two years ago. Comparing his stats to Correa, arguably Xander is the better player.
the 6yr/120 is a fair offer if you also consider CC's injury history IMO.....granted I agree with him for not signing it and holding out for more money.
The Astros shouldn't pay him anymore than 25mil/yr IMO...If he wants more he can hit the road.
Moving on from Carlos for a second. Let's assume JV doesn't make it back for the postseason. We could still have some really good starting pitching for a short series.
Look at the piggyback options:
Framber
Greinke / Javier
McCullers / Garcia
Odorizzi / Urqudy
Then you shut the door or play match-ups with Smith, Baez, & Pressly. Mix in Taylor or Raley if you need to get lefties out.
No one needs to see the 3rd time through the lineup unless you're just on fire.
Look at the piggyback options:
Framber
Greinke / Javier
McCullers / Garcia
Odorizzi / Urqudy
Then you shut the door or play match-ups with Smith, Baez, & Pressly. Mix in Taylor or Raley if you need to get lefties out.
No one needs to see the 3rd time through the lineup unless you're just on fire.
6/120 is kinda lowball, but not insulting.
8/160 at the same AAV I think would actually be considered a strong offer. Despite the injury history, there is no way Correa would get only 6 years guaranteed in FA.
8/160 at the same AAV I think would actually be considered a strong offer. Despite the injury history, there is no way Correa would get only 6 years guaranteed in FA.
I think 8/190 may be the sweet spot.JJxvi said:
6/120 is kinda lowball, but not insulting.
8/160 at the same AAV I think would actually be considered a strong offer. Despite the injury history, there is no way Correa would get only 6 years guaranteed in FA.
This speaks to just how bad the position is. Straw and a bunch of nobodies are in the middle third for CFers.
Now describe the impact he has on defense, the outs a first he makes with his cannon, the runs he stops from even trying to go home on a cut, the runs he throws out who try....Harry Dunne said:I know everyone is on the Carlos bandwagon after the playoffs and he has won me over with his development as a leader, but I'm still on the "made of glass" side.Farmer1906 said:
This is such a true statement for most of y'all on here.
He's fluctuated between great and just OK. We attribute that to playing with injury and that might be the case, but nonetheless he's either great, just OK because he's playing with an injury...Or flat out injured.
Carlos is a better overall player for reasons we all know and don't need to get into, but just food for thought and perspective: he has the same exact career OPS and SLG (and injury issues) as Trae Turner. Like all of you, I hope he wins the MVP this year, but I also understand why you can't offer more than that to a guy who has only ever stayed healthy one full (real) season of major league baseball.
I expect Carlos to get over $200M if he hits free agency. We may simply just not be a club that will offer that kind of contract to anyone. Unless you are a team committed to a top 3 payroll in perpetuity, it's difficult to allocate that kind of cash. You simply can't afford to miss.
Correa has the ability to be the best player in the AL, but part of being the best player is not being hurt, and another part is consistency for 6 months, not for 3 playoff rounds.
When he's healthy and invested, he's a top 5 player in the entire MLB. But we've all seen him hurt and we've seen him lose the killer instinct for stretches in years past. I've never seen Altuve look like he's not giving 100% on every play and every swing, ditto AB, and ditto George Springer, who I still can't believe doesn't play here anymore.
If Correa thinks $120 million for 6 years is an insult, he needs to check out his own baseball reference page. Since becoming a regular in 2016, he's been missed 30% of the games he was eligible for. If he wants to be paid like a perennial all-star, he should be out there 150 times a year hitting .300 - 30 - 100 like clockwork.
When he's healthy and invested, he's a top 5 player in the entire MLB. But we've all seen him hurt and we've seen him lose the killer instinct for stretches in years past. I've never seen Altuve look like he's not giving 100% on every play and every swing, ditto AB, and ditto George Springer, who I still can't believe doesn't play here anymore.
If Correa thinks $120 million for 6 years is an insult, he needs to check out his own baseball reference page. Since becoming a regular in 2016, he's been missed 30% of the games he was eligible for. If he wants to be paid like a perennial all-star, he should be out there 150 times a year hitting .300 - 30 - 100 like clockwork.
Don't see this at all.Quote:
When he's healthy and invested, he's a top 5 player in the entire MLB.
I largely agree with you, but how many games did Trout miss in '19 when he won the MVP?Quote:
Correa has the ability to be the best player in the AL, but part of being the best player is not being hurt, and another part is consistency for 6 months, not for 3 playoff rounds.
Also, based on those clips of his interview yesterday, I don't think he was insulted by the offer. Maybe privately he is, but so far it doesn't appear to be a grudge type of situation like George apparently had.
So he would accept 8/200 but you want to give 7...for more than 200???07ag said:agreed, something like 7/210 sounds doableFrok said:07ag said:
If that's where correa is at i bet they get it done
but correa has talked several times about spending his whole career in houston. which i take to mean hes looking for, like, a 12-14 year deal. which i bet means north of 300million. and the astros aren't going to do that
I would pay more per year to avoid any 12-14 year contract. That's a guaranteed bad deal at the end of the contract.
regardless, i hope they find a middle ground and he doesn't walk,, best astros ss since pre-injury dickie thon, if not ever
Since 2015
WAR - 19.4
27th overall
5th for SS
wRC+ 127 (min 2000 PA)
25th Overall
2nd for SS
132nd in GP
Since 2017
WAR - 10.8
48th overall
13th for SS
wRC+ 126 (min 1000 PA)
37th Overall
1st for SS
184th in GP
Since 2019
WAR - 4.1
70th overall
15th for SS
wRC+ 125 (min 500 PA)
46th Overall
7th for SS
245th in GP
In general, when Correa is on the field he's effective. He's near the top at this position and very respectable overall. When you look at how much he's stayed on the field, he drops from a top 20-30 type to 50-75 type and clearly in the 2nd or 3rd tier at his position. The more I look into it. The more I think somewhere between what the Astros offered and the lowest Carlos would take is probably a fair deal for him.
WAR - 19.4
27th overall
5th for SS
wRC+ 127 (min 2000 PA)
25th Overall
2nd for SS
132nd in GP
Since 2017
WAR - 10.8
48th overall
13th for SS
wRC+ 126 (min 1000 PA)
37th Overall
1st for SS
184th in GP
Since 2019
WAR - 4.1
70th overall
15th for SS
wRC+ 125 (min 500 PA)
46th Overall
7th for SS
245th in GP
In general, when Correa is on the field he's effective. He's near the top at this position and very respectable overall. When you look at how much he's stayed on the field, he drops from a top 20-30 type to 50-75 type and clearly in the 2nd or 3rd tier at his position. The more I look into it. The more I think somewhere between what the Astros offered and the lowest Carlos would take is probably a fair deal for him.
IF the 8/200 rumor is true, i think the astros and correa get a deal done easyLonestar_Ag09 said:So he would accept 8/200 but you want to give 7...for more than 200???07ag said:agreed, something like 7/210 sounds doableFrok said:07ag said:
If that's where correa is at i bet they get it done
but correa has talked several times about spending his whole career in houston. which i take to mean hes looking for, like, a 12-14 year deal. which i bet means north of 300million. and the astros aren't going to do that
I would pay more per year to avoid any 12-14 year contract. That's a guaranteed bad deal at the end of the contract.
regardless, i hope they find a middle ground and he doesn't walk,, best astros ss since pre-injury dickie thon, if not ever
but i don't think it is
my opinion is that correa is actually looking for a 12+ year mega deal, based on his comments of wanting to be an astro for life
Frok replied to my post, suggesting pay more per year, and i agreed, suggesting 7/210 as something the astros could bear
https://ts.la/eric59704
who do you think could afford him at that ? With the holdout looming, and the uncertainty of next season even happening, I dont see it unless an 8 or 9 year deal.....thats tough with his injury historyMaxPower said:
I expect Carlos to get over $200M if he hits free agency. We may simply just not be a club that will offer that kind of contract to anyone. Unless you are a team committed to a top 3 payroll in perpetuity, it's difficult to allocate that kind of cash. You simply can't afford to miss.
Agree 100%. He has evolved from a very good to an amazing defensive SS and when he's hot he's an MVP offensive force. I don't think anyone is disputing that.Lonestar_Ag09 said:Now describe the impact he has on defense, the outs a first he makes with his cannon, the runs he stops from even trying to go home on a cut, the runs he throws out who try....Harry Dunne said:I know everyone is on the Carlos bandwagon after the playoffs and he has won me over with his development as a leader, but I'm still on the "made of glass" side.Farmer1906 said:
This is such a true statement for most of y'all on here.
He's fluctuated between great and just OK. We attribute that to playing with injury and that might be the case, but nonetheless he's either great, just OK because he's playing with an injury...Or flat out injured.
Carlos is a better overall player for reasons we all know and don't need to get into, but just food for thought and perspective: he has the same exact career OPS and SLG (and injury issues) as Trae Turner. Like all of you, I hope he wins the MVP this year, but I also understand why you can't offer more than that to a guy who has only ever stayed healthy one full (real) season of major league baseball.
The problem is, and this isn't my opinion, this is a fact: HE HAS ONLY BEEN HEALTHY AND GREAT ONE SEASON IN HIS ENTIRE CAREER. People are getting emotional and trying to make it about other stuff. If you don't think he's great, you're an idiot...but IMO you might be an even bigger idiot to gamble on him staying healthy for 6 years.
Some people are saying he's worth 6/$120 even if he plays 100 games a year because of his October prowess. I agree with that. The Astros agree with that, obviously. Is he worth more than that for 100 games a year? I don't think so. Obviously the Astros don't think so either. He might have an MVP season and drive the price up. Every Astros fan should hope for that to happen. But nothing that has happened over his career indicates that is more likely than not.
People get emotional and make straw man arguments. Like if you don't want to pay the man big you're anti-Correa. That's garbage! No one is against Correa. Not even the Astros front office. Certainly none of us die-hard fans. But being pro-Correa and being logical about his injury issues don't have to me mutually exclusive.
And remember, half this board wanted to, what was the saying "make his ass walk back to the hotel?" when he was having a .709 OPS season last year. If we don't make the playoffs half of you are still not giving him a ride on the bus. Now everyone wants to treat him like Mike Trout. The truth is somewhere in the middle, which is what I think the offer reflected.
Giants make a lot of sense. Big market and Correa is young enough to be around when they are good again in 2-3 years. Orioles and Detroit are smaller market but have more than enough money to make a splash and, once again, may see him as young enough to still be in his prime when they are good again (like Pads with Machado). Hell even the Rangers have to give their fans something to get excited about at some point. I wouldn't underestimate the market on this.